TheManaDrain.com
September 15, 2025, 04:09:46 pm *
Welcome, Guest. Please login or register.

Login with username, password and session length
News:
 
   Home   Help Search Calendar Login Register  
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
Author Topic: Academy Rector/Show and Tell Omniscience Combo Deck  (Read 53046 times)
FernBurger
Basic User
**
Posts: 4


View Profile Email
« on: June 16, 2013, 10:57:16 am »

I have been playing an Academy Rector/Show and Tell based Omniscience combo deck for several months.  I spent many hours scouring the internet for any related decks I could find and I did find a few but nothing really worth mentioning (although if anyone has any suggesions I'm all ears!). 

The idea for this deck began when a friend tried brewing an Opalescence vintage deck.  He slammed some random enchantments into his deck hoping for eventually casting Replenish into an Omniscience.  After some serious playtesting I convinced him that this idea wasn't competitive enough but that the idea of playing Omniscience and Acdemy Rector was worth exploring.  I took to my methods of research to try and come up with some cards to help streamline this into something relevant.  These were some of the cards I found:

1)  Perilous Research -  {1} {U} Draw two cards, then sacrifice a permanent. Instant
2)  Diabolic Intent -  {1} {B} As an additional cost to cast Diabolic Intent, sacrifice a creature. Search your library for a card and put that card into your hand. Then shuffle your library. Sorcery
3)  Read the Runes -  {X} {U} Draw X cards. For each card drawn this way, discard a card unless you sacrifice a permanent. Instant
4) Cabal Therapy -  {B} Name a nonland card. Target player reveals his or her hand and discards all cards with that name. Flashback—Sacrifice a creature. (You may cast this card from your graveyard for its flashback cost. Then exile it.) Sorcery

Now I have to interrupt my thought stream for a little background information on me.  I started playing vintage in September of 2011 and was a relatively inexperienced Magic player prior to this, so although I know many of these cards have been tested in some context prior to myself trying it, I figured it would be best to post any and all ideas I had prior to my eventual decklist.

Some of the above cards really piqued my interest.  I really wanted the ability to sacrifice an Academy Rector at instant speed, but the idea of Diabolic Intent was too good to pass up.  Casting that spell with Rector in play is very nearly winning the game.  When I initially began playing the deck I included singleton copies of Perilous Research and Diabolic Intent.  The inherent problem here though is that most of these spells require you to have previously resolved an Academy Rector, which at  {3} {W} is no easy task.  It's slow, and even slower to require spending mana and another turn to try and convert him into Omniscience, all the while hoping to dodge instant-speed graveyard interaction (Surgical Extraction, Extirpate, Rakdos Charm...) 

With all of this in mind the natural movement is towards Cabal Therapy for 2 reasons.  Firstly, it is a disruptive spell that is good by itself.  Secondly, you can maintain priority after resolving Academy Rector and flashback Cabal Therapy and hopefully achieve the desired effect without spending more mana and another turn. 

The next problem was trying to incorporate Show and Tell into the deck.  While Academy Rector is a great enabler, it isn't enough by itself.  Show and Tell fits nicely into the deck as an alternate way of cheating Omniscience into play, or cheating one of your other win conditions into play as a last resort.  I found that it was difficult to strike that delicate balance between relevant spells and redundant do-nothing cards in your hand. 

I though that drawing cards might have been the issue and I tested Mystic Remora as well as Preordain.  My findings were that Mystic Remora was too slow and very easy to play around.  Preordain was ok, might actually be just fine but it wasn't what I wanted.  I guess the best way I can put it was I felt the best way to build the deck was to be as efficent at top-decking as possible.  I'm sure that is completely wrong and probably destroys any hope of credibility I have, but I just kind of hoped that slamming as many tutors and relevant game-winning spells together as I could would prove dividends. 

Without further introduction here is the decklist:

"Show Flash Photography"

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Tolarian Academy
2 Island
1 Swamp
3 Underground Sea
2 Tundra
2 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta

4 Force of Will
3 Flusterstorm
4 Academy Rector
3 Show and Tell
2 Omniscience
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
4 Cabal Therapy
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Brainstorm
1 Thirst for Knowledge
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Flash
1 Tinker
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Echoing Truth
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Yawgmoth's Will

Sideboard

4 Leyline of Sanctity
4 Energy Flux
3 Annul
4 Ravenous Trap

There are many card inclusions worth discussing.  I'll start with Flash.  Even though it's restricted I think Flash merits inclusion for 2 reasons: the deck plays 4 copies of Academy Rector, and you can Merchant Scroll for Flash.  Giving your Merchant Scroll a high-impact, game-changing target to tutor for has been very relevant.  I'll recount a game for me that occured in a game 3 of a top 4 match at Xtreme Games.  On the play I kept a hand of: Force of Will, Force of Will, Merchant Scroll, Academy Rector, Black Lotus, Mana Crypt, Polluted Delta.  I'm rolling the dice that Jaco doesn't have turn 0 Leyline of the Void (even though I saw it in game 2).  He keeps his 7, and alas, no turn 0 plays.  I lead with Delta, Crypt, crack Delta for Tundra, tap Tundra and Crypt for Merchant Scroll  {1} floating.  I scroll for Flash, cast Black Lotus, crack Lotus for  {U} {U} {U}, use  {1} {U} for Flash on Rector.  Remove Rector and put Yawgmoth's Bargain into play.  Draw 7 off Bargain, use  {U} {U} to cast Time Walk.  Go to cleanup step, discard Cabal Therapy.  Untap, play Flooded Strand, crack Strand for Underground, tap Crypt, Undeground, and Tundra for Rector, flashback Cabal Therapy naming Force of Will, meanwhile puting Omniscience into play, then casting Demonic Tutor for Emrakul, the Aeons Torn...The playability of that hand was predicated on having Flash in the deck as a tutorable target for my otherwise less-useful Merchant Scroll.

The next card worth discussing is Yawgmoth's Bargain.  Although this deck began with the idea of Omniscience, the deck actually seems to be centered around Bargain.  Unless I have a tutor or a win  condition in hand, I always Rector for Bargain.  I've lost very few games with Bargain in play, lots of games with Omniscience in play. 

The inclusion of Tinker/Blightsteel is worth mentioning.  The deck functions just fine without it (actually opens up a few slots for hand disruption/card-drawing), but I like having it as a fall-back plan.  When facing a Leyline or Rest in Peace it's really nice to just tutor up Tinker and go for it.

I wonder if the inclusion of more hand disruption is necessary (Thoughtseize?). 

I'm comfortable with the amount of counterspells.  I didn't want to dilute the fabric of what the deck is trying to accomplish, and I feel I do that when I try to control the game too long.  Although the card disadvantage of top-deck tutors can be frustrating when you don't win battles on the stack, I've found the resiliency of the deck to be quite formidable. 

The sideboard is definitely a work-in-progress! Very Happy  My matchup with Prison-style Workshop decks is atrocious.  I've found that after boarding the matchup is a little better with Annul and Energy Flux.  I chose Annul for its splashability in the Burning Oath matchup (not sure if that's correct). 

Initially I ran a Hurkyl's Recall in place of the Echoing Truth, but I needed an answer to resolved Leyline/RiP. 

Griselbrand probably fits into this deck somewhere, I'm not sure where, I also then believe that the 4th Show and Tell is probably necessary. 

The artifact mana for acceleration seems appropriate.  Speeding out an early Show and Tell or hardcast Academy Rector is crucial.  It's also not bad when you have Bargain in hand. 

Gifts Ungiven is so much fun!!!!  I really love that spell in this deck.  It has so many uses and applications, and I love Merchant Scrolling for it.  It gives you a lot of versatility when trying to shape and enable your combo while almost always resulting in winning the game with Omniscience in play. 

I like the surprise factor of Ravenous Trap over Leyline of the Void, but that's a personal preference. 

Racing an opposing Dark Confidant can be difficult, which has led me to bounce back and forth about running Swords to Plowshares.

It's important to note that a hardcast Academy Rector can buy you a lot of time against creature-based beatdown strategies, even Blightseel!  Nobody wants to enable your combo for you. 

At this point I think I've said all that I can think of about this deck.  I have enjoyed playing it and would absolutely love to hear some feedback about it.  I heard that a similar version of this deck with Burning Wish and Anicent Tomb was being played.  I approve of both of those card choices, especially the latter.  If I played this deck today I would most certainly fit 2 Ancient Tombs into it.  I would imagine Enter the Infinite would be a powerful tool in the wishboard then.  This is my first major post on this forum, so I hope I followed all the regulations and put the deck in the appropriate thread.  I'm sorry if I didn't!  Hopefully this thread will inspire some discussion that I would love to be a part of.  I will check back often!
Logged
Mith
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 206



View Profile
« Reply #1 on: June 17, 2013, 09:40:10 am »

I played a similar list at NYSE on Saturday, and just missed the top 8. Your build needs more gas, whether it be mana acceleration or card draw. This will help the shops matchup, which is VERY favorable for this deck.
Logged

"Never let your sense of morals keep you from doing what's right."
                                             -Salvor Hardin
JACO
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1215


Don't be a meatball.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #2 on: June 17, 2013, 10:58:21 am »

Richard, welcome to TMD and great post! After losing to you a few months ago in I immediately went home that night and built what I felt was a more tuned version, then T4'd the next Xtreme Games Vintage tourney with it while you were gone. As Mith said below, the deck just wants more gas. I cut some of the looser cards for stuff like Jaces and it was fantastic. Mith and I have been working on it for the last month and a half in preparation for NYSE this month, and the deck is very very strong. Our lists are relatively close.

You are right that Flash is insane in this deck. As I've said to a couple of people if Flash were unrestricted I feel like this would immediately become the best deck in the format, because you'd get so many free wins, and you have so many other paths to victory.

Another thing for you to marinate on is Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors. I've added them to the deck and they've been very very good at accelerating out Show and Tell, Rector, and Jaces, as well as combating Sphere effects from Workshops. Not too many, but a few are pretty good if you are careful with the manabase.
Logged

Want to write about Vintage, Legacy, Modern, Type 4, or Commander/EDH? Eternal Central is looking for writers! Contact me. Follow me on Twitter @JMJACO. Follow Eternal Central on Twitter @EternalCentral.
Stormanimagus
Basic User
**
Posts: 1290


maestrosmith55
View Profile WWW
« Reply #3 on: June 17, 2013, 11:33:42 am »

Richard, welcome to TMD and great post! After losing to you a few months ago in I immediately went home that night and built what I felt was a more tuned version, then T4'd the next Xtreme Games Vintage tourney with it while you were gone. As Mith said below, the deck just wants more gas. I cut some of the looser cards for stuff like Jaces and it was fantastic. Mith and I have been working on it for the last month and a half in preparation for NYSE this month, and the deck is very very strong. Our lists are relatively close.

You are right that Flash is insane in this deck. As I've said to a couple of people if Flash were unrestricted I feel like this would immediately become the best deck in the format, because you'd get so many free wins, and you have so many other paths to victory.

Another thing for you to marinate on is Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors. I've added them to the deck and they've been very very good at accelerating out Show and Tell, Rector, and Jaces, as well as combating Sphere effects from Workshops. Not too many, but a few are pretty good if you are careful with the manabase.


Wouldn't Flash also be great with Griselbrand as you'd be able to put 1-2 draw triggers on the stack in response to the sac trigger?

Logged

"To light a candle is to cast a shadow. . ."

—Ursula K. Leguin
psyburat
Adepts
Basic User
****
Posts: 463


Mike Noble


View Profile
« Reply #4 on: June 17, 2013, 01:10:56 pm »

Wouldn't Flash also be great with Griselbrand as you'd be able to put 1-2 draw triggers on the stack in response to the sac trigger?

You don't get priority during Flash's resolution to activate Griselbrand's ability.
Logged

How very me of you.
FernBurger
Basic User
**
Posts: 4


View Profile Email
« Reply #5 on: June 18, 2013, 06:07:17 am »

"Your build needs more gas, whether it be mana acceleration or card draw. This will help the shops matchup, which is VERY favorable for this deck."

I agree with these statements.  I don't want to dilute the deck's win conditions, but I know that drawing cards is at a premium. 

"I cut some of the looser cards for stuff like Jaces and it was fantastic."

How many Jaces are you playing?  Also, what do you mean by 'looser' cards?  I felt like I trimmed most of the fat, am I wrong about that?  Is Echoing Truth unnecessary?  Is it better to just play around Leyline/RiP by going for the Show and Tell win?

"Another thing for you to marinate on is Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors. I've added them to the deck and they've been very very good at accelerating out Show and Tell, Rector, and Jaces, as well as combating Sphere effects from Workshops. Not too many, but a few are pretty good if you are careful with the manabase."

I really like the idea of Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors!  Is it worth fitting them at the expense of weakening our manabase to Wasteland (meaning cutting basics)?  How many mana sources are you running?  What does your mana base look like?  Are you playing Burning Wish?  Actually, any chance you could post a list?
Logged
JACO
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1215


Don't be a meatball.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #6 on: June 18, 2013, 09:32:23 pm »

Richard, I don't really want to share any lists at the moment as I may be playing this again soon, but can answer a few questions about my tournament and testing experience with the deck. I'm not saying my list is perfect, but rather just what I've enjoyed in the deck. Your mileage may vary.

"Your build needs more gas, whether it be mana acceleration or card draw. This will help the shops matchup, which is VERY favorable for this deck."

I agree with these statements.  I don't want to dilute the deck's win conditions, but I know that drawing cards is at a premium. 

"I cut some of the looser cards for stuff like Jaces and it was fantastic."

How many Jaces are you playing?  Also, what do you mean by 'looser' cards?  I felt like I trimmed most of the fat, am I wrong about that?  Is Echoing Truth unnecessary?  Is it better to just play around Leyline/RiP by going for the Show and Tell win?
I don't think Truth is necessary main deck, as no one plays Leyline main, and you still have Show and Tell to obviate that hate plan. In regards to what to cut, what are the weakest non-combo or disruption cards remaining that you can afford to cut?

"Another thing for you to marinate on is Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors. I've added them to the deck and they've been very very good at accelerating out Show and Tell, Rector, and Jaces, as well as combating Sphere effects from Workshops. Not too many, but a few are pretty good if you are careful with the manabase."

I really like the idea of Ancient Tomb and City of Traitors!  Is it worth fitting them at the expense of weakening our manabase to Wasteland (meaning cutting basics)?  How many mana sources are you running?  What does your mana base look like?  Are you playing Burning Wish?  Actually, any chance you could post a list?
I think I'm playing 24 mana sources, but you really only need 1 Island and 1 Swamp or 1 Plains as your basics, depending on what your full 75 looks like. Think about how many Undergrounds or Tundras or whatever specific lands you often fetch during the course of a game, and then you an figure out what you'd prefer to trim to fit in any of the sol-lands.

I don't think there's a perfect 75 for this deck, as it can go in a number of directions. It's like UR Landstill, where you should configure it each week to combat what you expect to face that day, constantly tweaking to keep opponents off balance.
Logged

Want to write about Vintage, Legacy, Modern, Type 4, or Commander/EDH? Eternal Central is looking for writers! Contact me. Follow me on Twitter @JMJACO. Follow Eternal Central on Twitter @EternalCentral.
Purple Hat
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1100



View Profile
« Reply #7 on: June 27, 2013, 12:30:42 pm »

hey, cool list.  reminds me of rector trix, one of my favorite decks ever.  Is there a reason you're not playing a single tendrils main?  with either bargain or omniscience it seems like it'd be pretty easy to just shortcut to the tendrils kill in a lot of situations.
Logged

"it's brainstorm...how can you not play brainstorm?  You've cast that card right?  and it resolved?" -Pat Chapin

Just moved - Looking for players/groups in North Jersey to sling some cardboard.
Mr. Type 4
Creator of Type 4
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 814


Creator of Type 4 - Discoverer of Steve Menendian


View Profile WWW
« Reply #8 on: June 27, 2013, 01:54:35 pm »

I played against Mith at NYSE and he definitly had at least one Griselbrand in there. 

I keep thinking that getting some Thoughtseizes would be good to power up your Therapies. It's also good to know what they have when you play Show and Tell. Maybe over some counter magics. 
Logged

2008 VINTAGE CHAMPION
2013 NYSE OPEN I CHAMPION
Team Meandeck

Mastriano's the only person I know who can pick up chicks and win magic tournaments at the same time.
Samoht
Adepts
Basic User
****
Posts: 1392


Team RST


View Profile Email
« Reply #9 on: June 27, 2013, 01:56:12 pm »

I played against Mith at NYSE and he definitly had at least one Griselbrand in there. 

I keep thinking that getting some Thoughtseizes would be good to power up your Therapies. It's also good to know what they have when you play Show and Tell. Maybe over some counter magics. 


Probe seems fine for this as well.
Logged

Char? Char you! I like the play.
-Randy Bueller

I swear I'll burn the city down to show you the light.

The best part of believe is the lie
Purple Hat
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1100



View Profile
« Reply #10 on: July 02, 2013, 12:36:26 am »

Form of the dragon seems like it beats the hell out of a few things if you get it with rector or show it into play.  Specifcally any kind of aggro and dredge seem like they would have a rough tike with it.  Its also possible I just like being a dragon.
Logged

"it's brainstorm...how can you not play brainstorm?  You've cast that card right?  and it resolved?" -Pat Chapin

Just moved - Looking for players/groups in North Jersey to sling some cardboard.
FernBurger
Basic User
**
Posts: 4


View Profile Email
« Reply #11 on: July 11, 2013, 10:00:50 am »

Jaco, thanks for the reply!  I agree with your point about Echoing Truth.  I will continue toying around with the disruption package and see what underperforms. 

Purple Hat, thanks for the comment!  As far as the Tendrils goes I guess I never felt like I need it.  Once I assemble Omniscience/Bargain I can usually draw and tutor my way to victory through Emrakul, but if that were ever disrupted then I see where Tendrils might be strong.

Mr. Type 4, I 100% agree about Thoughtseize.  The extra information is undeniably valuable, and allows the deck to be more proactive instead of reactive.  I've been testing Griselbrand and I don't know how I wasn't playing him before!

Samoht, Gitaxian Probe does seem pretty good here...!  I never though of that, lol!  Now only to figure out where it goes.  I will test it with Thoughtseize and then with Probe and see which I like.  The Probe does seem beneficial for replacing itself in my hand while I try to setup my Cabal Therapies.  Especially given the lack of effective early card draw in this list.

Purple Hat, that definitely seems fun!  I don't know if I would maindeck that, but I do see where it has utility in certain creature-based matchups.  I almost always want to be drawing cards or casting spells for free though, would be hard to choose anything other than Bargain or Omniscience when resolving a Rector trigger.
Logged
2ndMain
Basic User
**
Posts: 11



View Profile Email
« Reply #12 on: August 19, 2013, 11:27:10 am »

I saw this deck at GenCon this weekend (JACO or Mith maybe?) and it looked really fun.  I had never seen this strategy in vintage before... so cool!  I was wondering if anyone is still playing this and if so would you please share your current decklists?  Thanks!
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 05:36:46 pm by 2ndMain » Logged
Twaun007
Adepts
Basic User
****
Posts: 1527


For eight hundred years have I trained Jedi.

Twaun007
View Profile
« Reply #13 on: August 19, 2013, 02:09:43 pm »

I saw this deck at GenCon this weekend (JACO or Mith maybe?) and it looked really fun.  I had never seen this strategy in vintage... so cool!  I was wondering if anyone is still playing this and if so would you please share you current decklists?  Thanks!

With Vintage Champs around the corner I'd imagine that Technology is going to remain secret about the deck until then.

She is quite a beast though.
« Last Edit: August 19, 2013, 02:27:00 pm by Twaun007 » Logged

This... Right here... Is my new Lambo...

Carpe Librum

You can't ask a bird not to fly!
You can't ask a fish not to swim!
You can't ask a Chinese guy not to turn back into a tiger at midnight!
It's who I am.

Cleveland
2ndMain
Basic User
**
Posts: 11



View Profile Email
« Reply #14 on: August 22, 2013, 06:05:26 am »

I decided to throw this pile together and so far I've been happy with the gold-fishing.  I should be able to get some games in this week so I'll post any significant findings.  In the meantime, if you guys that have played the deck see any glaring issues, let me know.  Thanks!

4 Academy Rector
2 Griselbrand
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Black Lotus
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
3 Cabal Therapy
2 Flusterstorm
2 Gitaxian Probe
1 Mana Vault
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Sol Ring
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Flash
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Time Walk
3 Show and Tell
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Gifts Ungiven
2 Jace, the Mind Sculptor
4 Force of Will
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
2 Omniscience
2 Ancient Tomb
2 Flooded Strand
1 Island
4 Polluted Delta
1 Swamp
2 Tundra
3 Underground Sea
Logged
Thegreatgonzo
Basic User
**
Posts: 89


View Profile Email
« Reply #15 on: August 23, 2013, 12:19:15 am »

Here is the list i'm testing right now :

Force of will 4
Flusterstorm 2
Cabal therapy 4
Academy rector 4
Show and tell 4
Blightsteel colossus 1
Tinker 1 (show and tell n°5 for not-so-big-fatty ; A.K.A. « Plan B »)
Griselbrand 1 (No explanations needed, it's not Bargain n°2, Bargain is Griselbrand n°2^^)
Emrakul, the aeons thorn 1 (better kill than tendrils of agony)
Yawgmoth's bargain 1 (No explanations needed,)
Omniscience 1 (see above)
Flash 1 (awesome tutor target)
Demonic tutor 1 (spells « you just die » better than in a tendrils deck)
Vampiric tutor 1 (see above)
Imperial seal 1 (see above)
Mystical tutor 1 (see above, kinda)
Merchant scroll 1 (see above, because we also play...)
Gifts ungiven 1 (spells « you just die » better than... no wait, it's That card, it spells doom no matter what Very Happy )
Yawgmoth's will 1 (see just above)
Time walk 1
Ancestral recall 1 (restricted filler)
Brainstorm 1 (restricted filler)
Thirst for knowledge 1 (restricted filler)
Moxes 5
Black lotus 1
Mana crypt 1
Lotus petal 1
Mana crypt 1
Ancient tomb 2
Tolarian academy 1
Polluted delta 4
Flooded strand 1
Underground sea 3
Tundra 2
Island 1
Swamp 1

Side board

Leyline of sanctity 4
Leyline of the void 4
Planar void 3
Ancient tomb 1
Hurkyl's recall 1
Silence 1
Form of the dragon 1

I really think you want to minimize dead cards, so -> only one  omniscience, only one griselbrand.
I think you DO need the full play-set of Show and Tell.
Ancient tombs are just complete nuts, but trading them with chrome mox/ mox opal might be worth a try.
Once the manabase began to work, I never dared to touch it again.
The deck could use 1 more mana source, and a few counterspells more, but I don't want to dilute the "engine" too much.
Sideboard is a rough draft.

I choosed to play lots of enchantment because :

Rector can fetch them
Since dredge « anti-hate » package is ready for everything, waiting for various kinds of hate, focusing on one type of permanent means you have as hate (if not more) as they have removal. And you have counters, and a combo finish, it should be enough, altough I never tested the match-up seriously.

Form of the dragon is kind of a nostalgic call, but I expect it to be useful in lots of « lethal damage on board » situations

Ancient tomb n°3 and hurkyl's recall are obviously there for the Workshop match-up. Not much siding power here, but you already have a decent shot game 1.

Silence could be anything, really.
I like silence because it helps with 2 hard-to-cope-with match-ups : control and pure combo.

So all in all, it's quite a streamlined version of this deck, and while it might be improved, I'm quite happy with it.



Logged

He who makes a beast of himself gets rid of the pain of being a man
Samoht
Adepts
Basic User
****
Posts: 1392


Team RST


View Profile Email
« Reply #16 on: August 23, 2013, 02:18:49 am »

Any reason you are playing Silence over Orim's Chant?
Logged

Char? Char you! I like the play.
-Randy Bueller

I swear I'll burn the city down to show you the light.

The best part of believe is the lie
Vennie
Basic User
**
Posts: 60


View Profile
« Reply #17 on: August 23, 2013, 11:15:01 am »

I don't know if this is the reason but Misdirection works against Chant but not against Silence
Logged

MaximumCDawg
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 2172


View Profile
« Reply #18 on: July 08, 2014, 12:34:36 pm »

I messed around with this style of deck in Legacy.  While you're going in a different direction here -- Rector + Bargain + Show and Tell -- I wanted to point out the other angle for this combo.

Altar of Bone / Diabolic Intent on a Rector is game over.  You get Omniscience and Emrakul typically.  For style points, however, you can win with Sparkcaster (cast for free, bounce, repeat).  Going this route, you can slot the Rector win into a Naya or even straight GW beats deck.  The Caster even has the advantage of being quite playable on its own as a Juggernaut if you have creatures with ETB effects.
« Last Edit: July 13, 2014, 06:38:02 pm by Meddling Mike » Logged
Meddling Mike
Master of Divination
Administrator
Basic User
*****
Posts: 1616


Not Chris Pikula

micker01 Micker1985 micker1985
View Profile
« Reply #19 on: July 13, 2014, 06:40:02 pm »

Due to the recent rules change regarding thread necromancy the verbal warning has been rescinded and the thread has been reopened.
Logged

Meddling Mike posts so loudly that nobody can get a post in edgewise.

Team TMD - If you feel that team secrecy is bad for Vintage put this in your signature
Methuselahn
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1051


View Profile
« Reply #20 on: October 04, 2014, 07:14:17 pm »

I'm going to take advantage of the recent rules change regarding thread necromancy here.  This thread will now move from the fourth post down to the first.  WOO!

I'm not sure that this concept is viable at all, even if fully tuned.  That said, the deck presented is a fine example of 'too many combo cards'.  

OP desires to create a Rector/Show and Tell combo when really it should just be a Rector OR Show and Tell combo deck idea.  Really now, think about it. When was the last time you used Show and Tell to get a Rector on the table?  Razz  It's one mana.

Quote
3 Show and Tell
2 Omniscience
1 Tinker
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
You don't need any of these cards.  

When I took the following Academy Rector deck to the Vintage Champs in 2007 it won mostly off Flash, sure, but finished the opponent off by first getting Yawgmoth's Bargain.  Once you have a Bargain, you should not lose.  At this point, you Rector up a Form of the Dragon to protect yourself, kill your opponent, and to draw 3 cards a turn for free!
http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/deck.asp?deck_id=151427

Once you've dominated the board state with Bargain, just hold it.  Bargain into a hand with multiple Forces and removal. Slow roll another Rector into Form of the Dragon.  Or just cast tendrils.  Every turn your life goes back to 5. Bargain up to 3 cards every turn, being careful with FoW life payment, and you're set.

One thing to note is that this deck avoids much of the hate that's present today.  No one plays Leyline of the Void and Swords to Plowshares like they used to.  Now, it's replaced with Graf cages (useless against rector) and Lightning Bolts (for Jace).

Ultimately, the Rector plan is clunky and unreliable with Brainstorm restricted.  If you happen to draw cards like Bargain into your opening grip, you really want a way to return them to your library.  I don't think Jace is a playable replacement, unfortunately.

Quote
Altar of Bone / Diabolic Intent on a Rector is game over.
In Vintage, we can use cards like The Tabernacle at Pendrell vale to go off while completely hosing Dredge. Smile

tldr: remove fluff cards. dominate any board state with a yawg bargain fueled blue hand.
« Last Edit: October 12, 2014, 04:51:09 pm by Methuselahn » Logged
MaximumCDawg
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 2172


View Profile
« Reply #21 on: November 06, 2014, 05:47:10 pm »

The thing about Altar of Bone / Diabolic Intent is that it really is game over instantly with a Rector.  Rector trigger goes on the stack over your search effect.  Since they probably don't stifle rector, you get Omniscience and then you just win with Emrakul or Sparkcaster.  And, as I said before, Sparkcaster gets you around the problem of having totally worthless cards stuck in your hand because he's a fine Juggernaut off a mana dork anyway.

Bargain isn't really a thing because Rector is too slow for Vintage, and Bargain is banned from Legacy.  Plus, it's just as clunky as Emrakul in the opening grip.
Logged
Demagoguery
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 227



View Profile Email
« Reply #22 on: November 06, 2014, 07:26:36 pm »

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Phyrexian Tower, it's a pretty good card that works as a land and a sac outlet. It also has various interesting interactions.
Logged
JACO
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1215


Don't be a meatball.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #23 on: November 06, 2014, 11:19:44 pm »

The thing about Altar of Bone / Diabolic Intent is that it really is game over instantly with a Rector.  Rector trigger goes on the stack over your search effect.  Since they probably don't stifle rector, you get Omniscience and then you just win with Emrakul or Sparkcaster.  And, as I said before, Sparkcaster gets you around the problem of having totally worthless cards stuck in your hand because he's a fine Juggernaut off a mana dork anyway.

Bargain isn't really a thing because Rector is too slow for Vintage, and Bargain is banned from Legacy.  Plus, it's just as clunky as Emrakul in the opening grip.
Diabolic Intent certainly is powerful with Rector, but the deck already has a lot of clunky cards, and it's terrible without Rector. Something like Dig Through Time (which will find a home in here) is probably just as powerful, and less situational.

Rector isn't that slow if you're playing stuff like Ancient Tombs and full SoLoMoxenCryptVault. I won a match in a Vintage Champs grinder Top 4 last year, in game 3 on a mulligan to 4 with this deck. It's fast (enough), has a super high raw power level, and is the most fun deck I've played in Vintage since TNT. It's just inconsistent, which is why I've been playing other stuff more since then. It also has a mediocre matchup against BUG Tempo, which was very prevalent at the time. I guess it's probably better positioned right now in the current metagame with how many non-Deathrite Shaman creatures are being played, and the big dropoff BUG Tempo since GenCon.

I'm surprised no one has mentioned Phyrexian Tower, it's a pretty good card that works as a land and a sac outlet. It also has various interesting interactions.
Fernburger was trying this in his initial versions I believe. I cut it from mine because it doesn't cast any of your spells, and if you're going to have a colorless land I would MUCH rather have Ancient Tomb (which I played 2-3 of), as it powers out everything faster, and is awesome against any Workshop or combo deck. Sac outlets are not an issue really, as you can reliably find and draw Therapy pretty easily.
Logged

Want to write about Vintage, Legacy, Modern, Type 4, or Commander/EDH? Eternal Central is looking for writers! Contact me. Follow me on Twitter @JMJACO. Follow Eternal Central on Twitter @EternalCentral.
Ozymandias
Basic User
**
Posts: 117


View Profile
« Reply #24 on: November 07, 2014, 10:43:52 am »

I think this deck should probably have a Sensei's divining top or two, with all the spare colorless mana lying around.
Logged
JACO
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1215


Don't be a meatball.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #25 on: November 07, 2014, 02:20:24 pm »

I think this deck should probably have a Sensei's divining top or two, with all the spare colorless mana lying around.
I concur. All of my lists had 1-2, but probably just 1 for now. Going to test Dig Through Time in some of the spare slots.
Logged

Want to write about Vintage, Legacy, Modern, Type 4, or Commander/EDH? Eternal Central is looking for writers! Contact me. Follow me on Twitter @JMJACO. Follow Eternal Central on Twitter @EternalCentral.
Methuselahn
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1051


View Profile
« Reply #26 on: November 07, 2014, 03:38:26 pm »

It's fast (enough), has a super high raw power level, and is the most fun deck I've played in Vintage since TNT. 

Which enchantment are you rectoring into play?  Which enchantments are in your deck?  What is your gameplan when you draw your enchantment off the top of your library on the first/second turn?
Logged
TheWhiteDragon
Basic User
**
Posts: 1644


ericdm69@hotmail.com MrMiller2033 ericdm696969
View Profile WWW
« Reply #27 on: November 07, 2014, 07:31:48 pm »

I just can't get this deck to work.  When it goes off, it's REALLY hard to stop...but getting to that point is just rough.  Too many cards that are just clunky.  I even tried a version that combined dark depths + hexmage + lost auramancers to get extra rector effects....it was just much worse than strait DD, and the rector plan again was clunky.  Nature's claim against me sucked hard too.
Logged

"I know to whom I owe the most loyalty, and I see him in the mirror every day." - Starke of Rath
JACO
Full Members
Basic User
***
Posts: 1215


Don't be a meatball.


View Profile WWW
« Reply #28 on: November 08, 2014, 07:44:04 am »

It's fast (enough), has a super high raw power level, and is the most fun deck I've played in Vintage since TNT. 

Which enchantment are you rectoring into play?  Which enchantments are in your deck?  What is your gameplan when you draw your enchantment off the top of your library on the first/second turn?
Bargain and Omniscience. If you draw either you cast Show and Tell to put them in play and usually win the game.
Logged

Want to write about Vintage, Legacy, Modern, Type 4, or Commander/EDH? Eternal Central is looking for writers! Contact me. Follow me on Twitter @JMJACO. Follow Eternal Central on Twitter @EternalCentral.
WhiteLotus
Basic User
**
Posts: 282


View Profile
« Reply #29 on: November 08, 2014, 01:15:17 pm »

I just can't get this deck to work.  When it goes off, it's REALLY hard to stop...but getting to that point is just rough.  Too many cards that are just clunky.  I even tried a version that combined dark depths + hexmage + lost auramancers to get extra rector effects....it was just much worse than strait DD, and the rector plan again was clunky.  Nature's claim against me sucked hard too.

I Was wondering what the common consensus on the deck's win con was, I think the deck is far better off if your wincons are 2 griselbrand + 1 tendrils instead of 1x tinker, 1 Emrakul, 1 Bsc and 1 Griselbrand. You basically almost always win on the spot once you rector up Bargain or omniscience this way.

As far this deck being clunky, I don't think it's any clunkier than oath, it's less vulnerable to commonly played hate and has more Raw power. And you can always add more manipulation, you should play cards like jace, dig, gifts, ponder, it helps the consistency a lot.
Logged

"Your first mistake was thinking I would let you live long enough to make a second."
Pages: [1] 2
  Print  
 
Jump to:  

Powered by MySQL Powered by PHP Powered by SMF 1.1.21 | SMF © 2015, Simple Machines Valid XHTML 1.0! Valid CSS!
Page created in 0.326 seconds with 21 queries.