|
fsecco
|
 |
« Reply #60 on: September 19, 2014, 12:54:38 am » |
|
This looks fun! Who wants to play this format in mtgo? Too bad I live in a place where playing paper magic is not an option  I wanted to play on MTGO, but there's a long list of cards that don't exist online... Chaos Orb, obviously one of them. We could try anyway, though - but not playing with the actual cards would probably cut the fun in half...  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
LotusHead
Full Members
Basic User
Posts: 2785
Team Vacaville
|
|
« Reply #61 on: September 19, 2014, 06:38:53 am » |
|
I don't agree with Jaco that unrestrictions open up more things. I think the format is relatively under explored right now, and think that Strip Mine unrestricted limits, rather than expands, ultimately, the range of total decks. This is a multiple equilibria format rather than one in which there is a 'correct' B&R list, so I think it's a good thing that different areas have different lists.
Also, this thread is the wrong place to have this continuing convo.
4x Strip Mine is ridiculous... so is 4x Maze of Ith. Otherwize, feel free to shake things up with restrictions. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
nedleeds
Tournament Organizers
Basic User
Posts: 399
|
|
« Reply #62 on: September 19, 2014, 11:44:02 am » |
|
4x Strip Mine is ridiculous...
so is 4x Maze of Ith.
Otherwize, feel free to shake things up with restrictions.
I just don't see much tangible difference (besides the ones I listed) between 4 Wasteland and 4 Strip Mine. I guess the other argument is the card basic Island i splayed in modern vintage as a 'safe' land. With Strip Mine there are no safe lands, but there's Land Tax, Consecrate and more lands. Without Strip Mine you are pretty much wiping out any prison archetype (or just Winter Orb depending on whether you've kept its original design) and also burying any low curve aggro deck (or forcing them to run counterspells). It's a choice I guess, I just can't justify playing anything other than blue cards if I don't have Strip Mine or Vise ... and then you've got the oops I have Library and you don't have your gentlemans Strip Mine games, made even worse with no Vise to punish control. Anyway, is there an Old School General Strategy / Discussion / Fight thread? |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
Samoht
Adepts
Basic User
Posts: 1392
Team RST
|
|
« Reply #63 on: September 19, 2014, 12:16:09 pm » |
|
4x Strip Mine is ridiculous...
so is 4x Maze of Ith.
Otherwize, feel free to shake things up with restrictions.
I just don't see much tangible difference (besides the ones I listed) between 4 Wasteland and 4 Strip Mine. I guess the other argument is the card basic Island i splayed in modern vintage as a 'safe' land. With Strip Mine there are no safe lands, but there's Land Tax, Consecrate and more lands. Without Strip Mine you are pretty much wiping out any prison archetype (or just Winter Orb depending on whether you've kept its original design) and also burying any low curve aggro deck (or forcing them to run counterspells). It's a choice I guess, I just can't justify playing anything other than blue cards if I don't have Strip Mine or Vise ... and then you've got the oops I have Library and you don't have your gentlemans Strip Mine games, made even worse with no Vise to punish control. Anyway, is there an Old School General Strategy / Discussion / Fight thread? I think Wasteland and Strip Mine are vastly different, especially as 4x cards. Guaranteed targets with no way to play around them is something that can be built around. You can avoid Wasteland by properly using your Basic Lands to stay afloat. In regular Vintage, you can use Fetch lands which are Waste Immune to get up to the relevant threat and then the damage is done by the time they are open to Waste. There isn't a similar effect in the older game. A silly BR deck with Sinkhole, Stone Rain, and Strip Mine can cause problems if you build around a few more things as well. I don't care enough about the format to donate anymore time to it, but I definitely thank that it's incorrect to liken SM and WL here. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
Char? Char you! I like the play.
-Randy Bueller
I swear I'll burn the city down to show you the light.
The best part of believe is the lie
|
|
|
|
heiner
|
|
« Reply #64 on: September 22, 2014, 10:43:04 am » |
|
I agree with Samoth that Strip Mine is completely different then 4 Wastelands, Fetchies and basics make all the difference. Also, in oldschool there already are more games as in Vintage that are won/lost due to mana screw/flood as without fetchies and cheap card draw/manipulation (brainstorm, preordain,..). 4 Strip Mines would just make this worse.
If you're afraid of LoA there are enough other ways to stop it. Steven transmute/CiaB is a great example of a strategy born because of the restriction of Strip Mine.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
nedleeds
Tournament Organizers
Basic User
Posts: 399
|
|
« Reply #65 on: September 22, 2014, 08:21:10 pm » |
|
CiaB is miserable ... all my beautiful djinns.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Smmenen
|
|
« Reply #66 on: September 22, 2014, 08:22:23 pm » |
|
CiaB is miserable ... all my beautiful djinns.
The best answer to it is Artifact Blast. I wanted to play with Djinns so I build a deck that could sb 3 Artifact Blasts at my last event  |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
mg
|
|
« Reply #67 on: September 23, 2014, 05:39:46 am » |
|
Without Strip Mine you are pretty much wiping out any prison archetype (or just Winter Orb depending on whether you've kept its original design) and also burying any low curve aggro deck (or forcing them to run counterspells).
Parfait is very, very good in the nordic meta, even though it is only rarely played. Nether Void prison haven't really showed its power yet, but i think that it has potential (in particular if Mana Vault is unrestricted). As an example of a working prison deck, this one won the 34-person n00bcon 4 tournament (before restriction of mana drain even though the deck only plays one, and with current errata on winter orb, i.e. it still works while tapped): ENCHANTMENTS (2) 1 Underworld Dreams 1 The Abyss SORCERIES (6) 1 Braingeyser 1 Time Walk 1 Recall 1 Balance 1 Demonic Tutor 1 Mind Twist INSTANTS (10) 2 Divine Offering 1 Ancestral Recall 2 Disenchant 1 Mana Drain 4 Swords to Plowshares ARTIFACTS (24) 4 Howling Mine 4 Relic Barrier 3 Icy Manipulator 1 Jade Statue 2 Winter Orb 3 Fellwar Stone 1 Black Lotus 1 Sol Ring 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Mox Emerald 1 Mox Jet 1 Mox Ruby 1 Mox Pearl LANDS (19) 1 Strip Mine 4 Mishra’s Factory 1 Mishra’s Workshop 4 Scrubland 2 Tundra 3 City of Brass 2 Underground Sea 1 Maze of Ith 1 Library of Alexandria SIDEBOARD 1 Power Sink 1 Disrupting Scepter 2 Disenchant 2 Underworld Dreams 3 Wrath of God 2 Circle of Protection: Red 1 Jayemdae Tome 3 Blue Elemental Blast |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
nedleeds
Tournament Organizers
Basic User
Posts: 399
|
|
« Reply #68 on: September 23, 2014, 08:22:39 am » |
|
A fixed Winter Orb is helpful I guess, though some other cards don't work as intended that made Winter Orb a tactic in 1995 .... most notably Power Sink.
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
Max Power
|
|
« Reply #69 on: September 24, 2014, 11:37:28 pm » |
|
Any idea when the next Nor Cal old school will be? Also, I was accused of making a "durdle" deck at a sanctioned Vintage tourney a while back. How annoyed will you guys be if my deck is based off a Shandalar deck from the old video game? (seriously too, because I could make something more competitive but it wouldn't be as pimp)
|
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
yugular
|
|
« Reply #70 on: October 14, 2014, 07:34:56 am » |
|
This looks fun! Who wants to play this format in mtgo? Too bad I live in a place where playing paper magic is not an option I wanted to play on MTGO, but there's a long list of cards that don't exist online... Chaos Orb, obviously one of them. We could try anyway, though - but not playing with the actual cards would probably cut the fun in half... Yeah... Still it should be fun to try one or two times.. |
|
|
|
|
Logged
|
|
|
|
|
