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Author Topic: MTGO Holiday Special Vintage Tournament  (Read 9398 times)
MoonDark
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« on: November 12, 2014, 12:50:55 pm »

Ok, this is actually amazing.

http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online-holiday-festival-2014-11-12

They are even awarding a non-foil Vintage Masters set to the top 3 players who participate in the tournament and don't use any P9. Meaning, you can play without any power, and if you end up 20th (meaning 19th and above all use P9) , you will earn a non-foil Vintage Masters Set.

Wizards is taking a step to improve the format here, and there are Vintage and Legacy qualifiers to the Event.

Quote
Of course, Vintage needs a Constructed focus too. That's where the Holiday Festival Vintage Championship comes in. This championship has a different qualification system: You can qualify for this December 20 event by going 4-0 or 3-1 in any of the Vintage Daily Events from Wednesday, December 10, through Friday, December 19. Even if you don’t have a robust Vintage collection, you’ll have a shot at qualifying for the championship. You can qualify through Legacy Daily Events during the same time period—but it’s a bit harder; you’ll have to go 4-0 in a Legacy Daily Events to get in that way.

If you qualified through Legacy, you might be asking yourself, “Why should I bother playing in a Vintage championship event if I don’t have all the Vintage cards I want for my deck?” Well, good news! In addition to the prizes listed in the tables below, we will award a nonfoil set of Vintage Masters to each of the top three finishing players in the Vintage Championship who don't have any of the Vintage Masters special rarity, or Power Nine, cards in their deck! Note, that's not the top three finishing players over all, but the top three who are not playing any of the Power Nine. Theoretically, you could come in 20th place and, as long as 1st through 19th all had at least one the Power Nine in their decks (including sideboards), you would be the first of three to receive a nonfoil Vintage Masters set. This set will be in addition to any prizes those players win based on their final standing in the event. If you win one of these sets, we hope it will help you to join the ranks of the Magic Online Vintage community! (Note: These sets will be granted by Wizards of the Coast within a few days of the championship’s completion.)

I encourage everyone to participate Smile
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Chubby Rain
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« Reply #1 on: November 12, 2014, 12:59:22 pm »

An improvement on the qualification tournaments that they had before. 4-1 and 5-0 in relatively small events limited the number of participants. That said, I would have liked to see some sort of long term incentive to play Vintage over other, cheaper formats.
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MoonDark
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« Reply #2 on: November 12, 2014, 01:41:27 pm »

They also enabled 'Vintage Gold Queues' which are 2 player games but they cost 10 tix to enter, the prize is of 5 boosters (which could easily be sold for 3+ tix a piece, so you get a 3x I guess?)

http://magic.wizards.com/en/MTGO/articles/archive/magic-online-holiday-festival-2014-11-12#vintagegold

It's a temporary thing though, I agree that I would like to see the prizes of a format like Vintage a bit boosted up since the cost of entry to the format is much higher than standard.
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enderfall
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« Reply #3 on: November 12, 2014, 02:31:24 pm »

An improvement on the qualification tournaments that they had before. 4-1 and 5-0 in relatively small events limited the number of participants.

Not to mention, $30 a pop, which deters people from playing several if they fail to qualify on the 1st or 2nd try. I know I stopped after 2 tries because I was done giving them tix.
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ErtaiAdept
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« Reply #4 on: November 12, 2014, 03:17:39 pm »

My only problem with the qualifiers this time, is that they changed the Daily structure, so there are only 3 Vintage dailies in a week.  Which means for the qualifier window, you have a grand total of 6 chances to play for a qualification.  And that's if you play in both event all three days.
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« Reply #5 on: November 12, 2014, 04:38:56 pm »

They should have just made some high EV 8 man events and used those as the qualifiers, but it appears they are pretty much done with offering high EV anything at this point.

Pretty much no chance I will be able to chisel out time to try and qualify.  Oh well.
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Smmenen
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« Reply #6 on: November 12, 2014, 05:56:40 pm »

This is awesome.  I hope we get more of these.
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WotC_Ethan
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« Reply #7 on: November 12, 2014, 06:41:19 pm »

We're trying to do what we can to help the format achieve critical mass. I'm pretty excited about it!
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enderfall
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« Reply #8 on: November 12, 2014, 06:53:19 pm »

My only problem with the qualifiers this time, is that they changed the Daily structure, so there are only 3 Vintage dailies in a week.  Which means for the qualifier window, you have a grand total of 6 chances to play for a qualification.  And that's if you play in both event all three days.

It's possible to qualify by playing Legacy which has multiple events each day throughout the qualifying period, but that might not be feasible for some people if you haven't played that format is a while...
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diophan
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« Reply #9 on: November 12, 2014, 07:03:35 pm »

We're trying to do what we can to help the format achieve critical mass. I'm pretty excited about it!

Can WotC consider making the vintage dailies fire more frequently during the qualification week? I really don't want to have to play legacy to make sure I qualify for the vintage tournament...
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thecrav
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« Reply #10 on: November 12, 2014, 07:56:56 pm »

First thought, actually said out loud in a bar when I saw the tweet:

Hrm. Well that's one way to get the dailies to fire.

My only problem with the qualifiers this time, is that they changed the Daily structure, so there are only 3 Vintage dailies in a week.  Which means for the qualifier window, you have a grand total of 6 chances to play for a qualification.  And that's if you play in both event all three days.
We're trying to do what we can to help the format achieve critical mass. I'm pretty excited about it!

Can WotC consider making the vintage dailies fire more frequently during the qualification week? I really don't want to have to play legacy to make sure I qualify for the vintage tournament...

This was my second thought. Walking around the office pondering how cool this tournament seems, it occurs to me that the big tournament is not designed for us. Rather than being a way to get existing vintage players excited, this tournament is a way to get more non-vintage players to play vintage.

While I'd like to qualify for this event, the portion of this where we're getting new people into the format seems to be the most important part of it. If all goes well, perhaps we'll even get enough people into the format to get dailies to fire. From there, who knows? Dailies every day? The return of premiere events? Getting more people to play vintage can only be good for the format.

My only problem with the qualifiers this time, is that they changed the Daily structure, so there are only 3 Vintage dailies in a week.  Which means for the qualifier window, you have a grand total of 6 chances to play for a qualification.  And that's if you play in both event all three days.

It's possible to qualify by playing Legacy which has multiple events each day throughout the qualifying period, but that might not be feasible for some people if you haven't played that format is a while...
The distance between most vintage and legacy decks means that some vintage players would need to buy full decks or close to it. However, given how little most of the major cards in legacy cost, I don't think this will pose that much of a problem. I'll probably be playing daze-less UR Delver in legacy because I already have almost the entire deck from legacy.

Also of note, Vintage online is fairly cheap to get into right now. A full set of power on GoatBots costs only about 25% more than a playset of Tarmogoyfs - oh how I wish this were true in paper!

Edit: For those interested, I'll likely be streaming both of the 13 December dailies!
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jcb193
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« Reply #11 on: November 13, 2014, 08:27:08 am »

So only 12 "vintage only" players can qualify for this tourney? Is this tourney more for getting legacy players to switch/try vintage than getting vintage tourneys more visibility?
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enderfall
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« Reply #12 on: November 13, 2014, 09:13:22 am »

So only 12 "vintage only" players can qualify for this tourney?

That's not entirely true. The # of players that can qualify through Vintage DE's is proportional to how many players enter each tournament. There is roughly 4 players for each 16 that participate in a single DE. It will be interesting to see how many people play in these DE's compared to normal.

As for the second point you made, yes, there is likely some desire on WotC's part to convert Legacy players over to Vintage. This only makes sense. You aren't likely to convince some standard player to play Vintage over the long haul just because they borrowed a Vintage deck from someone, spikes the tournament somehow, and wins Power (the secondary prize of 3 highest people to place with non-Power cards gets a set of VMA really only means: 3 highest placing Dredge players). Legacy players already have most of the cards necessary to play Vintage except the Power 9. The other stuff they need (Yawg Will, Sol Ring, Academy, etc.) are dirt cheap thanks to VMA. That said, you still need to go 4-0 in a Legacy DE, thus only a handful of players will qualify via that route.
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diophan
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« Reply #13 on: November 13, 2014, 10:22:54 am »

I hope I'm not going too far off topic, but CalebD posted a legacy UR delver deck (http://www.channelfireball.com/articles/legacy-weapon-the-best-deck-in-legacy-and-modern/) which doesn't run daze so should cost very little to someone who already has blue duals/fetches, although I suppose the Eidolons/submerge in the board cost a bit. Obviously having to play legacy isn't optimal, but it's a cheap option if people are willing to go that route.
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Montolio
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« Reply #14 on: November 13, 2014, 10:31:08 am »

We're trying to do what we can to help the format achieve critical mass. I'm pretty excited about it!

Ethan, can we get more Vintage DE's (perhaps the original dates and times preceding the changes) during the qualifying dates to increase the number of people that can qualify for the Champs?
I think these DE's will fire during the week with the added incentive of being able to play in the Champs.
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jcb193
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« Reply #15 on: November 13, 2014, 04:45:34 pm »

How do they handle software bugs in tournaments?  Like right now you can cast a Chalice of the Void with one counter for two mana under a trinisphere.  Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?
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« Reply #16 on: November 13, 2014, 05:17:01 pm »

Update: Bazaar basically counts as Power for the purposes of the "unpowered bonus prizes." http://bit.ly/1yAEH7F

I'll ask around about whether we're planning to schedule more DEs during the qualifiers.
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Chubby Rain
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« Reply #17 on: November 13, 2014, 06:18:52 pm »

How do they handle software bugs in tournaments?  Like right now you can cast a Chalice of the Void with one counter for two mana under a trinisphere.  Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?

After they decided to "fix" Tangle Wire by having it tap half as many permanents, it's only fair that Shops gets a marginal boost.
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diophan
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« Reply #18 on: November 13, 2014, 07:07:21 pm »

How do they handle software bugs in tournaments?  Like right now you can cast a Chalice of the Void with one counter for two mana under a trinisphere.  Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?

If this happensyou can file for reimbursement and it will almost assuredly be granted. If you're playing for stakes much higher than the entry fee though that's not very satisfying.
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The Atog Lord
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« Reply #19 on: November 13, 2014, 07:09:40 pm »

How do they handle software bugs in tournaments?  Like right now you can cast a Chalice of the Void with one counter for two mana under a trinisphere.  Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?

If this happensyou can file for reimbursement and it will almost assuredly be granted. If you're playing for stakes much higher than the entry fee though that's not very satisfying.

Be careful with this. A friend of mine filed for reimbursement every time he lost a game after his Tangle Wire malfunctioned. They ended up suspending his account, stating that he should have known better than to think his card would have worked.

On the bright side, Ethan, I think that is a very good change. Thank you.
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jcb193
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« Reply #20 on: November 13, 2014, 07:14:18 pm »

Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?

So what is the normal etiquette in tournament play?  Just don't cast it for less than 3?  Or play the advantage?  What do opponents expect?  Most vintage players are pretty cool and relaxed, but I've had plenty of people chastise me for not playing the edge too-
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Coopes
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« Reply #21 on: November 13, 2014, 07:33:17 pm »

All of those great things about the paper Vintage community should not be applied online :p. You will experience people that just want to win, and sure, you will hit a guy like Rich once in a while and it makes it all worth it, but for the most part...it's the internet. I'd say gloves are off in terms of "etiquette" on mtgo--people will grind your clock etc-- but not sure if that was what you were talking about.
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« Reply #22 on: November 13, 2014, 07:34:01 pm »

x cant find how to delete this
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diophan
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« Reply #23 on: November 13, 2014, 07:42:08 pm »

Is it gentleman's honor, or play all the angles available to you?

So what is the normal etiquette in tournament play?  Just don't cast it for less than 3?  Or play the advantage?  What do opponents expect?  Most vintage players are pretty cool and relaxed, but I've had plenty of people chastise me for not playing the edge too-

If you knowingly play 2 for a chalice when it's supposed to cost 3, you are exploiting a bug, which can result in a (temp) ban. If I suspected my opponent did this on purpose, I would report him and hope he got banned. Where Wizards draws the line is something I can't answer, but knowingly exploiting a bug is against the TOS.

How to handle the previous tangle wire bug seems a bit hairier. I expect you wouldn't have gotten in trouble if you refused to "pretend like more things are tapped", but philosophically I don't think there's a difference.

Obviously the ideal situation is that Wizards fixes the bugs more quickly...
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MisterFoote
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« Reply #24 on: November 21, 2014, 09:49:07 am »

Heard it hear.  Playing workshops makes you a cheater. 
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Smmenen
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« Reply #25 on: December 11, 2014, 11:55:14 pm »

well, I'm qualified now, got in on my first and probably only shot to qualify.  So I'll be playing in this.

Should be fun.  Great to have some "real" online Vintage tournaments.  

The best part about this tournament is that I don't even have to get out of bed to play in it.
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thecrav
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« Reply #26 on: December 12, 2014, 05:30:07 pm »

Randy tweeted that he's in as well as "half the VSL" so I'm hoping some of them stream this!
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diophan
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« Reply #27 on: December 13, 2014, 04:46:11 pm »

I've never done a tournament where there's qualification before. Do I need to do something special before I join next Saturday after I've qualified?
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enderfall
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« Reply #28 on: December 13, 2014, 05:49:35 pm »

I've never done a tournament where there's qualification before. Do I need to do something special before I join next Saturday after I've qualified?

I don't suspect you'll need to do anything. Only those that are qualified will be able to access the tournament, IIRC. I asked Lee Sharpe via Twitter if there would be a way to confirm that we are qualified, but he didn't respond.
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jcb193
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« Reply #29 on: December 13, 2014, 08:47:19 pm »

How many qualifier tournaments are left?  When are they firing?
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