[C15] Mizzix's Mastery

[Protoaddict]

I think this has potential.


Putting overload aside since that is probably a pipe dream for every game and not why you play this card. 4 Mana to regrowth and cast any sorcery or instant from your graveyard is not a bad deal. If the spell is 3cmc or more this is actually cheating you mana a bit. Being in red means it is on color for many existing decks and 3R is color-wise easy to cast for most lists that would want this.

Now that Dig and Treasure Cruise are on the restricted list, this can give them a second go much for much less than a snapcaster, and can even work well with tinker or Show and tell.

I'm trying to remember if there are similar cards in red to this but I am drawing a blank.
Added pic.
-MM

[coldcrow]

Sins of the Past is functionally identical and costs 4BB. So this is a real upgrade.

[fsecco]

Since Thirst for Knowledge is unrestricted now, and Baby Jace is the real deal, I wonder if a deck could be built that was able to put an expensive-game-ending spell on your graveyard and play with this. Since Baby Jace can even flashback this.

I can't think of the best spell for this right now, but there's bound to be something. Enter the Infinite is the first that comes to mind.

I mean, it would be like Dragon, I guess. Is costs more, but doesn't have the creature removal vulnerabilities of Dragon...

EDIT: Maybe Praetor's Counsel could work too?

[vaughnbros]

This is the first efficient Reanimator spell for Instants/Sorceries.  It also happens avoids Grafdigger's cage, and has an alt cost that should be game ending.  I think this card will be worth testing as both an option for being built around and as another snapcaster/vryn's prodigy.  I get the feeling that legacy will probably break it before we do (given their larger player base).

[Khahan]

This one excites me.   Out of all the previewed cards so far this is the only one I see getting T1 consideration. And I think it will do better than just get consideration.

[Protoaddict]

It also makes a ton of sense in gifts piles, if gifts starts to see play again. May just be a fine card on its own anyway since it plays real nice with Flip Jace, basically making any card he could normally hit free.

[Meddling Mike]

So it's sort of like a Recoup where it's  instead of  + the casting cost of the spell and instead of Flashback for  it's got overload for  ? I think the ability of Recoup to allow you force the issue after a Gifts pile makes it better there. I suppose this could be a way to cheat the cost on a super expensive instant or sorcery, so there's certainly potential here. Maybe with Time Stretch or Enter the Infinite or something like that?

[Aaron Patten]

[fsecco]

Nah, I think Praetor's Counsel and Enter the Infinite are your best bets.

Mind's Desire is in that deck too, probably, but it's castable so making a "Mizzix's Mastery.dec" wouldn't be required to use it. Cruel Ultimatum puts you ahead, but it's not that good actually... all that for those effects is not exactly awesome. Warp World is random and bad. Dragonstorm requires dragons, which are dead slots.

I just think Mastery is a better way to resolve Enter the Infinite than Show and Tell into Omniscience, which requires 3 combo pieces.

[Protoaddict]

Enter the Infinite is going to be the go to if you decide to build the deck as having otherwise uncastable cards, because let's be real when you cast it in a game of vintage I cannot think of too many situations where it does not read "you win the game". You'll likely have minds desire as well because YOLO and that is what the deck does.

In both cases they are pitchable to force, so that alone puts them over Dragonstorm and Warp World.

[brianpk80]

Nah, I think Praetor's Counsel and Enter the Infinite are your best bets.

Mind's Desire is in that deck too, probably, but it's castable so making a "Mizzix's Mastery.dec" wouldn't be required to use it. Cruel Ultimatum puts you ahead, but it's not that good actually... all that for those effects is not exactly awesome. Warp World is random and bad. Dragonstorm requires dragons, which are dead slots.

I just think Mastery is a better way to resolve Enter the Infinite than Show and Tell into Omniscience, which requires 3 combo pieces.

I agree with this entire post except the part about Dragons being dead slots.  

[fsecco]

Nah, I think Praetor's Counsel and Enter the Infinite are your best bets.

Mind's Desire is in that deck too, probably, but it's castable so making a "Mizzix's Mastery.dec" wouldn't be required to use it. Cruel Ultimatum puts you ahead, but it's not that good actually... all that for those effects is not exactly awesome. Warp World is random and bad. Dragonstorm requires dragons, which are dead slots.

I just think Mastery is a better way to resolve Enter the Infinite than Show and Tell into Omniscience, which requires 3 combo pieces.

I agree with this entire post except the part about Dragons being dead slots.  

Hahahahahahahhahahahahahahha <3

[MaximumCDawg]

I didn't really like this card at first, but I'm warming up to it.  It has a lot of similarities to Show and Tell and Sneak Attack; the only difference is that you need the spell in your yard before you can start cheat cheat cheat'n.  4 mana seems dangerously cheap for something like this, and I'm thinking this is very possibly a role-player in Vintage or a new archetype / variation of storm / variation of belcher in Legacy.

This might actually be the most powerful card in C15 because it does that time-honored, abusive thing: cheating mana costs.  I like it.

[Hrishi]

If only we have 4 copies of Mind's Desire to abuse this card with 

[mmcgeach]

I'm thinking this is very possibly a role-player in Vintage or a new archetype / variation of storm / variation of belcher in Legacy.

Maybe like: red rituals, blue counters, gifts, jaces, this, restricted cards, tendrils?

[Aaron Patten]

Wasn't there a mind's desire storm deck that performed well using 4 Sins of the Past post restriction of Mind's Desire?  Now it costs 2 less mana and only one mana is coloured.

[Hrishi]

Wasn't there a mind's desire storm deck that performed well using 4 Sins of the Past post restriction of Mind's Desire?  Now it costs 2 mana and only one mana is coloured.

Oh my god, if this is true you just made my day! If you remember anything about that decklist, please share. 

[Aaron Patten]

Wasn't there a mind's desire storm deck that performed well using 4 Sins of the Past post restriction of Mind's Desire?  Now it costs 2 mana and only one mana is coloured.

Oh my god, if this is true you just made my day! If you remember anything about that decklist, please share.  

I couldn't find a list, I may be misremembering

[vaughnbros]

Wasn't there a mind's desire storm deck that performed well using 4 Sins of the Past post restriction of Mind's Desire?  Now it costs 2 mana and only one mana is coloured.

Oh my god, if this is true you just made my day! If you remember anything about that decklist, please share. 

I couldn't find a list, I maybe be misremembering

"Poor Hrishi and his blue (or black) balls..." -Unnamed sympathetic bystander

[brianpk80]

In the same manner that many Vintage decks are built around an early game 4x like Standstill, Gush, Trinket Mage, or Thirst, this may enable something comparable for Burning Wish.  In a 5C shell with very expensive sorceries, Channel is probably a really good Wish target as well.  It's an exciting card. 

[JarofFortune]

This card plays very well with entomb, a card that itself opens up a lot of possibilities for deckbuilding.

[gkraigher]

This card seems like the only card in the set truely worthy of consideration. 

I'm pretty let down by this, but at least they recently gave us Dragons of Tarkir and Magic Orgins. 

[Chubby Rain]

"Poor Hrishi and his blue (or black) balls..." -Unnamed sympathetic bystander

What? I was hardly sympathetic...

I'm not incredibly high on this card. If you are trying to flashback cheap, economical spells, I feel Jace and Snapcaster Mage are better. If you are trying to flashback more expensive spells, I think you are going to have a tough time navigating the current Flusterstorm and Pyroblast heavy field.

A good starting point for a deck based on this might be Andy Probasco's Bombs of Baghdad.

[dangerlinto]

"Poor Hrishi and his blue (or black) balls..." -Unnamed sympathetic bystander

What? I was hardly sympathetic...

I'm not incredibly high on this card. If you are trying to flashback cheap, economical spells, I feel Jace and Snapcaster Mage are better. If you are trying to flashback more expensive spells, I think you are going to have a tough time navigating the current Flusterstorm and Pyroblast heavy field.

A good starting point for a deck based on this might be Andy Probasco's Bombs of Baghdad.

Except you aren't flashbacking spells.  That implies you are paying some cost.

But as to navigating flusterstorm and pyroblast, I think this would appear in decks that try to negate those cards with probe and duresseize

[fsecco]

And if you're using Mizzix's Mastery to play Praetor's Counsel (as a Yawg Will on steroids), Pyroblast isn't even an answer.

[Chubby Rain]

Except you aren't flashbacking spells.  That implies you are paying some cost.

But as to navigating flusterstorm and pyroblast, I think this would appear in decks that try to negate those cards with probe and duresseize

Sorry, I used "flashback" instead of "Exile target card that's an instant or sorcery from your graveyard. For each card exiled this way, copy it, and you may cast the copy without paying its mana cost." Yes, they are functionally different, but I am lazy and my meaning was That is so easy to discover that it suggests conspicuousness or little need for perspicacity in the observer.

If you are playing Mizzix's Mastery for value, there are cheaper options. If you are trying to use it as the basis for combo, then you are going to run into the problems Gift decks have had since Gifts unrestriction.

And, yes, these decks would have the same tools available that Storm decks have had. It's not like that has solved Storm's matchups against other blue decks and you also run into all the incidental graveyard hate.

And if you're using Mizzix's Mastery to play Praetor's Counsel (as a Yawg Will on steroids), Pyroblast isn't even an answer.

How are we getting Praetor's Counsel into the graveyard (ignoring for a second, why we are trying to get Praetor's Counsel into the graveyard)? Gifts, Intuition, JVP? If we are talking about Entomb, that card was pretty terrible for me in Dragon. The card disadvantage was real if it resolved and it had to get past Misstep for that.

I think that deck's based on Mizzix's Mastery will prove functionally worse than current Storm decks. I'm more than happy to be proven wrong, but that is my opinion on the card right now. However, if you were inclined to pursue this deck, I think Bazaar of Baghdad could be a powerful card to include as an uncounterable discard outlet and source of filtering similar to it's role in Dragon.

[fsecco]

How are we getting Praetor's Counsel into the graveyard (ignoring for a second, why we are trying to get Praetor's Counsel into the graveyard)? Gifts, Intuition, JVP? If we are talking about Entomb, that card was pretty terrible for me in Dragon. The card disadvantage was real if it resolved and it had to get past Misstep for that.

Entomb seems bad, I don't like it. I said earlier on this post I thought the way to go is a Dragonish deck:

I mean, it would be like Dragon, I guess. Is costs more, but doesn't have the creature removal vulnerabilities of Dragon...

So if you could built a more controlish-comboish deck that consistently resolved either Praetor's Counsel or Enter the Infinite for the kill, maybe that could be something? Gifts, Intuition, Thirst, Bazaar and Jace all seem good cards to dump things in the grave.

[vaughnbros]

Mizzix's Mastey seems better than Snapcaster or Baby Jace for storm decks, and potentially also for drain decks.  The cost reduction is real in storm, and the alternative cost is relevant in both real espeically if we are playing drain or rituals.  The ability to skirt grafdigger's cage is also real.  I think this card has legitimate strengths in these regards as an option over some already existing great options.  

Building around it is honestly just an area to get a little more discussion going.  Is cheating the cost of an enter the the infinite, dragonstorm, ect. good enough?  Who knows, but it's fun to think about and to try out.

[Chubby Rain]

Building around it is honestly just an area to get a little more discussion going.  Is cheating the cost of an enter the the infinite, dragonstorm, ect. good enough?  Who knows, but it's fun to think about and to try out.

I know. The Timmy in me wants it to work. Or is that the Johnny? Whichever.

[portland]

Precautionary preorder of playset at discount rate. Could be $10 wasted, or could be a bargain.