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Author Topic: Dredge in 2016  (Read 7853 times)
desolutionist
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« Reply #30 on: February 09, 2016, 09:39:59 pm »

For whatever reason I've been unable to "quote" people on here. Not on a MacBook, iPhone, iPad, or PC. Are you manually doing it?

I have similar experience, winning with the alternative strategy, but obviously if they don't have any graveyard hate, the dredge plan is just faster than a turn 5 kill.  For that reason I always leave some dredge plan in with the alternative plan and more often than not it leads to a faster win. The disruption is nice, especially Sanctity, but with a slower plan you're giving the opponent more opportunity to beat it.
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vaughnbros
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« Reply #31 on: February 09, 2016, 09:54:19 pm »

Well I'm certainly not disagreeing that the dredge plan is faster when you have Bazaar in your opener, and you don't need to answer a hate piece, but the latter is extremely unlikely... You can't aggressively mulligan to bazaar game 2/3 or you will cost yourself a lot of games.
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UndeadBus
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« Reply #32 on: February 10, 2016, 12:07:09 am »

Well I'm certainly not disagreeing that the dredge plan is faster when you have Bazaar in your opener, and you don't need to answer a hate piece, but the latter is extremely unlikely... You can't aggressively mulligan to bazaar game 2/3 or you will cost yourself a lot of games.

i have the opposite experience as this. in my experience when i have mulligand down to 4 cards in hand the bazaar, even if my opponent goes turn 1 RIP, is better as it allows me to start syphoning through my deck. the games that ive kept a 6 or 7 with multiple pieces of anti hate i have been punished as when my opponent sees i have no bazaar they just go on their merry way of doing what they want to do instead of trying to interact with me. the bazaar provides a huge psychology advantage as your opponent essentially is trying to answer a land, which unless they are on landstill or shops is going to be very difficult. if they are trying to answer a golgari thug and 2 bloodghasts without a bazaar they have more options and also less to worry about. i very much advocate an aggressive mulligan even in the later games, that being said there are some matches where going down to 3 cards in hand is just unreasonable.
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vaughnbros
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« Reply #33 on: February 10, 2016, 08:22:54 pm »

The different opinions on mulligan is interesting.  Over three years ago I wrote a long post covering my approach to piloting the deck game 2/3, http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=44964.0 , and honestly while my lists have changed, my approach has not.  As a direct quote from that primer:

Quote

Mulliganing

The only big thing you have in your control is what opener to keep.  If you don't have one of these two major things you should most likely be mulliganing...

1. If you have Bazaar of Baghdad.  You can almost always dig for whatever you need in a particular game if you have this card.  Not to mention if your opponent keeps a hand without hate you should be able to get an easy win.
    
2. If you have a decent number of cast able cards in your hand and the mana to cast them.

I'd be interested in hearing what other people think is a keepable hand.
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ajfirecracker
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« Reply #34 on: February 10, 2016, 09:09:12 pm »

I think I fall pretty close to you VB, I keep a Bazaar/Library pretty freely in Game 2/3, and I will keep a complete or practically complete Marit Lage combo (my version of "things to cast") in most situations.
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"I fully believe that if Dredge could play a transformational sideboard it would just win all the tournaments yet it just doesn’t have one because there is just nothing that it can play. It’d be awesome to completely ignore all those very specific hate cards people bring against you but how are you going to do that?" - Paulo Vitor Damo da Rosa
UndeadBus
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« Reply #35 on: February 15, 2016, 11:53:48 am »

Id like to ask you guys how you feel about using Unmask vs leyline of the void in the current meta. I like Unmask a lot against the blue decks and it can be useful game 3 vs shops but I'm just looking to see what other people think about it. Thoughts?
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msg67183
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« Reply #36 on: February 15, 2016, 12:16:04 pm »

Id like to ask you guys how you feel about using Unmask vs leyline of the void in the current meta. I like Unmask a lot against the blue decks and it can be useful game 3 vs shops but I'm just looking to see what other people think about it. Thoughts?

I would use them both together. After playing against the mirror in the last two events I've played, I'd say it's very much needed. Unmask is great.
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UndeadBus
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« Reply #37 on: February 15, 2016, 12:53:14 pm »

Id like to ask you guys how you feel about using Unmask vs leyline of the void in the current meta. I like Unmask a lot against the blue decks and it can be useful game 3 vs shops but I'm just looking to see what other people think about it. Thoughts?

I would use them both together. After playing against the mirror in the last two events I've played, I'd say it's very much needed. Unmask is great.

As a full 8 or with a smaller split?
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Ozymandias
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« Reply #38 on: February 15, 2016, 01:27:36 pm »

I really like Unmask whenever I'm on the play. Leyline is trash when you bazaar into it, and in my neck of the woods I'm the only dredge player.
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msg67183
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« Reply #39 on: February 15, 2016, 01:46:21 pm »

Id like to ask you guys how you feel about using Unmask vs leyline of the void in the current meta. I like Unmask a lot against the blue decks and it can be useful game 3 vs shops but I'm just looking to see what other people think about it. Thoughts?

I would use them both together. After playing against the mirror in the last two events I've played, I'd say it's very much needed. Unmask is great.

Sullivan has never played it. I played it as a four of with Leyline of the Void as well as Mental Misstep. I love the card. If I played Unmask in my current build it would be a 3 of as that is the only room I have.

As a full 8 or with a smaller split?
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Bloomsburg Tournaments:

1 Win
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2 Top 4
2 Top 8

Outside Bloomsburg:

Winter Grudge Match lV Top 4

Creator of The Mana Drain Vintage League.

Website for The League:

http://tmdvl.github.io

Zombies ate your brains!
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