I´d totally agree with you on that. During testing against Meandeck-Gifts I realized that I could win most of the games only if I had been able to resolve an early bomb - and Necro is definitely one of these. Once I can resolve an early Necro it will most likely win me the game - Meandeck Gifts is no exception for that. Thus, I can absolutely find no reason why Necro should leave the MB in this match.
Whereas DSC is just horrible to have MB against Gifts. In one of the first games that I played against Gifts, I made the mistake of tinkering for DSC instead of Jar. Since Gifts runs 4 Merchant Scroll, 3 Tutor + Gifts+ Fact+ Brainstorm, they will always find their Echoing Truth or Rebuild and bounce your Colossus back to hand. So unless I can go Tinker+Walk, I´d always go the Jar route.

@Phele: Thanks for your quick reply! - I´ll surely be trying your SB plan during this week and see how it works for me. So far, I´m only worried about having access to just one Tendrils ( because Burning Wish would leave the mainboard for Cunning Wish #2, as would Tendrils #2 in the SB for Tog).
Since fast Combo is TPS`worst Match-Up I personally feel that the second Tendrils is desperately needed in these matches (since an early Tendrils will make it much harder for them to win, the more life you have). Also, I sometimes find myself in trouble finding a Tendrils when I go off; Burning Wish saved my a** a lot of times in those cases since it works as Tendrils#2 with additional flexibilty if you need it. Having two Cunning Wishes mainboard means that you will more often be forced to use Brainfreeze as your win condition when you can´t find a Tendrils - which will require a much higher storm count and, even worse, with Oath still being a strong contender in the current metagame, Brain Freeze doesn´t appear to be a very sufficient kill...

Did you have any similar issues with your current SB plan or did you make other experiences? Maybe I´m totally wrong, since all thoughts on the "Tog-Plan" I can give for now are based on theory. But I´ll do some testing to see if there´s anything to it...

What about you, Koen and Justin, which experience did you make with having a transformational SB plan? Did that work for you, too? Would you recommend it? I mean Justin stated his thoughts already in his first post (since his SB also shows 2 Psychatogs) but maybe you could give some more detailed thoughts on that - and what about you, Koen? Did you try anything like that?

I know that there was a list (played by Marco C. Kiewit I think) that featured a SB which included the Oath-Engine with Akroma and SotN. What are your thoughts about that?
Personally, I don´t like this idea as it wether means running orchards main or sacrificing about 10-11 SB slots to succesfullly support the engine. But obviously it worked fine for Marco, since he T8 -ed with it...

Thoughts?

@Phele: I like the idea of having a transformational SB and I´ll definitely give it a shot. The possibility of getting an advantage because of an opponent sideboarding the wrong cards, can actually be very huge (especially if you´ve already won the first game)
The question simply is: does it make the deck better than it would be with just sideboarding more solutions games 2-3 and stick to your initial gameplan? Maybe you can post your current sideboard so that we can discuss it?! I´m really curious to see which slots one has to "sacrifice" to successfully support the "tog-engine"; is it just 1tog+1fling or are there any additional changes?

@Lupo: As BigMac already stated having 3 Rebuild + 1 Echoing Truth + 1 Cunning Wish mainboard is way to much bounce. With a figuration like that it will often occur that you draw into multiple Rebuilds when you just don´t want/need them. Just imagine playing against Oath and holding double Rebuild in your starting hand - that´s just awful!
Also, if you want to play with Gifts I highly recommend a red splash; at least for Recoup. Since you fit in one Cabal Ritual the Recoup plan makes even more sense to me. (Gifting for Recoup / Will / Lotus / Cabal Ritual with already five cards in grave is a nice play) And please, don´t leave Vampiric Tutor and Tinker from your list...

Thus, I suggest the following changes to your list:

-1 Sea / +1 Volcanic , Badlands
-2 Rebuild / +1 Vampiric +1 Tinker
-1 Fact / + 1 Recoup


-venice-

First off, nice primer Justin!!
Since I´m a very passionate TPS player myself, I was very glad to see someone opening a new thread on my favorite deck..., so thank you!

Let me just shortly introduce myself: my name is Christopher Wilhelm and I´m a Vintage player from Germany. I started to play TPS in Dec. 2004 and took the deck to several tournaments since then. Although I´m playing the deck for about seven months now, I definitely wouldn´t call me the perfect TPS player. I still make a few mistakes from time to time. Though, my worst tournament finish was a 5-2.
I think that just shows the incredible consitency and strength of TPS. It´s very forgiving sometimes and can turn the game around with a single topdecked (and of course also resolved) bomb. The deck has treated me so good in this regard and I just love to play it.

In the area where I´m playing ( a town called Iserlohn) there are a lot more TPS-r variants rather than the "traditional" U/B variant.  These support Recoup / Wheel and Burning Wish as red cards and also one Gifts Ungiven to make full use of Recoup.

My own current list looks like this:


Mana::

7 SoLoMoxen
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
1 Lotus Petal
4 Dark Ritual

3 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Flooded Strand
4 Polluted Delta
2 Swamp
2 Island
1 Tolarian Academy

Protection::

4 Duress
4 Force of Will

Draw / Search:

4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor

Solutions:

1 Burning Wish
1 Cunning Wish
1 Hurkyl´s Recall

Bombs:

1 Yawgmoth´s Will
1 Yawgmoth´s Bargain
1 Necropotence
1 Mind´s Desire
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 Timetwister
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Memory Jar
1 Tinker
1 Time Walk

Win Condition:

1 Darksteel Colossus
1 Tendrils of Agony

Others:

1 Recoup


SB:

1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Brain Freeze
1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl´s Recall
2 Echoing Truth
1 Pyroclasm
1 Massacre
1 Engineered Plague
1 Claws of Gix
1 Coffin Purge
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Gifts Ungiven
1 REB
1 BEB


As you can see the deck manages to be three colored without losing its resistant mana base - there are still four basics in the deck. Thus, you´ll still be safe against wastelands most of the time and also have access to a third color (and therefore to more possibilities).

The SB may seem a bit strange at first glance - especially Pyroclasm and Massacre - but those depend a little on our meta, at least the Pyroclasm. Since there are quite a few FCG around, Pyroclasm has proven its stregth in the board.
Same goes for Massacre. I totally love this card; its just so good against U/W Fish and BirdSh*t since you can play it for free and get rid of multiple Meddling Mages for the cost of 1R (Burning Wish).

The red- splash is really worth its slots imo since it:

1.makes "Plan B" (Tinker / Colossus) even better than it already is because of possible Time Walk recursion with Recoup / Burning Wish and

2. offers another strong Draw7 card (Wheel of Fortune)


I hope that gives this thread a few new ideas to discuss.

So far,...

venice