C&J's Tournament Report 7/15 Control Slaver Unstoppable!

[TheLegendOfMagic]

Greetings vintage addicts, this weeks report consists of the usual stuff, strong players, tier 1 decks, a good turn out with the usual people who are regulars at C&J's. This week in attendance were: TheLegendOfMagic, Brent, Christiaan, Ken and a newcomer Lotushead. This week I played Control Slaver.

Decklist:

Spells:
4 manadrains
4 force of wills
3 brainstorms
4 thirst for knowledge
2 cunning wish
1 demonic tutor
1 yawgmoths will
2 fire/ice
1 memory jar
1 tinker
1 ancestral recall
1 time walk

Win Conditions:
4 goblin welders
1 triskelion
1 pentavus
1 platinum angel
2 Mindslavers

Mana Sources:
7 SoLoMo
1 mana crypt
1 mana vault
1 Library of Alexandria
6 islands
4 volcanic islands
2 underground seas
4 polluted deltas

Sideboard:
2 REB
2 FTK
1 BEB
3 Bloodmoons
3 Tormods crypts
1 Stifle
1 mystical tutor
1 rack and ruin
1 chain of vapor

Round 1 Control Slaver vs. 10 Land Stompy

Game 1: I lose the dice roll he plays a first turn rogue elephant with a land grant to follow. A few turns pass as I have welder but no good targets in the yard, while he is constantly beating my head in with big green men. I eventually thirst into the doulbe welder pentavus lock with mindslaver , after I point out that this is an inifinite lock with slaver he concedes, I end the game with 2 Life!!!

Game 2: -2 Mindslavers +2 FTK, I get owned this game as he plays a early Hidden Ancients which got activated since I needed to play a mox as my land for turn to thirst into some more land, I draw into FTK but his had full of +3+3 instants were too much for my welder and FTK to handle and I go on to lose.

Game 3: I establish early control as I counter a crucial land grant that bought me enough time to get the pentavus token beat down lock on him and loses shortly after.

2-1

Round 2: Control Slaver vs. Duct-Tape(variant?) Christiaan

Game 1: I lose the dice roll and must mulligan down to 6. Chritiaan plays first and drops a first turn trinisphere. I look at my hand, if I had palyed first I could have dropped my lotus and island with two manadrains in my hand that I could have  casted, however I played second and the trinisphere prove to be too much as Christiaan win turn two as he drops a smoke stack , I save us both trouble and I concede game 1.

Game 2: -2 cunning wish, +1 rack and ruin +1 chain of vapor.
I play first, I lay a land and mox and pass, Christiaan goes insane and drops a tangle wire, this hurt alot. So a few turns pass as I am thirsting during my draw step because I am forced to float mana to my draw step because of the tangle wires. I eventually draw into yawgmoth's will which broke the stalemate.

Game 3: Christiaan commented after this game that his hand was questionable, but during the match he kept this hand, he starts off with workshop and passes the turn, I am relieved since I feared trinisphere. Turn two he continues with a darksteel ingot and drops a tangle wire. I tap out play a land and say go. He plays a second tanglewire and casts meditate. I somehow managed to get out of that lock, but was not able to pressure him until I topdeck yawgmoths will and once again winning by topdeck.
2-1

Round 3: Control Slaver vs. U/R Fish (Gim)

Game 1: I win the dice roll, and keep a god hand that allowed me to play mana crypt , island and tinker with force of will and blue card to back up my first turn platinum angel. He loses 5 turns later.

Game 2: -2 mindslavers-2cunning wish-1demonic tutor,+2 REB +3Bloodmoons. This game was pretty bad for Gim, as I resolved a bloodmoon and him with no islands, but he did have a grim lavamancer that got me down to 2 life, then I draw yawgmoths will and the rest is history since he cannot challange my islands and manadrains with bloodmoon in play.
2-0

Round 4: Control Slaver vs. Mono Black Void with crucibles (Riz)

Game 1: I lose the dice roll, Riz plays a mishra's factory, mox jet and plays a powder keg. I play land , jet and demonic to put Ancestral into my hand. He duresses me and takes the ancestral, and rituals out a hypnotic spector. Next turn I topdeck fire/ice and fire the hypnotic. Riz swings with his mishra's factory and passes. I draw, play a land and pass the turn. riz top deck nether void which, I mana drain. My turn, I play a land and drop memory jar and cracking it I play thirt, ruby and welder and pass the turn.He kegs for 1 killing my welder, drops another hypnotic and passes. Im in trouble now since I do not have anything in hand and his hypnotic is going to destroy my hand. He does that, for the next few turns he contiunes to rip my hand apart with the spector while hitting me with a factory. I am down to 2 life , everything looks grim and behold I top deck yawgmoths will for the win!!!

Game 2: -2 mindslavers, +2 FTK ,He plays firsts and duress a jar out of my hand and passes. I play jet, sol ring and welder , thinking I can stablize. Next turn he diabolic eddicts me and I lose the welder and the game.

Game 3: I crush him with 3 ancestral recalls, thanks to yawgmoths will and cunning wish and Riz was never really was in the game.
2-1

Round 5 Control Slaver vs. Hulksmash (Dennis)

Game 1: I lose the dice roll and allowing Dennis to duress my brainstorm out of my hand, this really hurt as now I am stuck with a angel in my hand with no way in getting rid of it. I hold for a while, but Dennis eventually out draws me and comes in with a psychatog for lethal.

Game 2: -2 cunning wish -2fire/ice -1 triskelion,+3 bloodmoons +2 REB
I play first and my hand is amazing, all I have in had is a REB like two lands and the rest are threats. I bait with ancestral and welder to eventually resolve a blood moon and winning as he cannot cast any of his spells.

Game3 : This was an equal fight as both were trying to kill each other fast as time in the round was running out. In the end I got him down to 5 with 5 pentavite tokens , I needed another turn but it was not to be.

1-1-1

Lotushead won the tournament with 5 points, I finished 2nd undefeated with 4-0-1, due to tiebreaks I had to have played and beaten Lotushead to win, so even if I was able to beat Dennis in the final round I would had still finished second to Lotushead because his tiebreaks were better than mine due to an early bye for him. I feel 4-0-1 in this weeks strong tournament proves that control slaver is a juggernaut in the type 1 arena.

In hindsight: The 2 flametongue Kavu's will be duplicants now, since its better synergy with the deck. Finally Good Game to all my opponents that I played this week and congradulations to Lotushead for winning....

[LotusHead]

Thanks for the congratulations.  I did win because of my bye and your draw (I think you were to win that game vs Dennis's Hulk Smash).

I feel I had a good chance against your deck only because Garth One-Eye's Control Slaver (minus your Kavus) is the only deck that I have had plenty of practice against. He, however, doesn't have Ancestral Recall. Neither do I. And he has only two Mana Drains (as do I).

I'll be back whenever possible!

[Mixing Mike]

Sideboard:
1 BEB
3 Tormods crypts
1 Stifle
1 mystical tutor
1 rack and ruin
1 chain of vapor

Why not just run Vampiric Tutor over Mystical if you're going to play that?  Your decklist is missing a VERY important card, Fact or Fiction.  Also, without some kind of draw in the board, why did you run 2 Wishes, or any at all?  You need draw in the board to justify Wishes.  On a diffrent note, I personally feel 2 Rack and Ruins are absoultly nessecary.

The only thing I question is no card draw artifact slot.  You put in Trisk.  You can run Jar or Mind's Eye, but I can see why you would cut it.

Round 1 vs. 10 Land Stompy:
Game 2: -2 Mindslavers +2 FTK

Round 3 vs. U/R Fish (Gim):
Game 2: -2 Mindslavers, -2 Cunning wish, -1 Demonic Tutor, +2 REB, +3 Bloodmoons.

Round 4 vs. Mono Black Void with crucibles (Riz):
Game 2: -2 Mindslavers, +2 FTK

Why on earth are you siding out Mindslavers?  Vs. Fish they let you get Standstill off the table, and kill their own stuff with their Lavamancers/Wastelands, and allows you to counter their own Null Rods sometimes.  Vs. Mono Black you can have them burn out their Dark Rituals, Hymn themselves, and let a Void hit, so you make them counter all their stuff, even Wasteland their own Factories with Crucible.  There's ALWAYS something that goes in your favor when you Slave them.

In hindsight: The 2 Flametongue Kavu's will be Duplicants now, since its better synergy with the deck.

Why?  The only time FTK didn't come through for you was vs. 10 Land Stompy, and that's because they made their stuff bigger in response.  Wht's good to Duplicate vs. Prison decks?  Karn, a.k.a. a 1-of?  The only Duplicant target vs. Gay/R tat's worth your time are Lavamancers.  And what's good to copy vs. Void?  Shades, Negators?

[Matt]

Why on earth are you siding out Mindslavers? Vs. Fish they let you get Standstill off the table, and kill their own stuff with their Lavamancers/Wastelands, and allows you to counter their own Null Rods sometimes. Vs. Mono Black you can have them burn out their Dark Rituals, Hymn themselves, and let a Void hit, so you make them counter all their stuff, even Wasteland their own Factories with Crucible. There's ALWAYS something that goes in your favor when you Slave them.

The Way of the Sideboard

Just because a card has some use means nothing. Is the card useful enough? By taking out Mindslavers for FTKs in the suicide matchup, he's maximizing his delta P.

[Mixing Mike]

I guess it's just a play call then.  I would never ever ever side out slavers, excluding the really bad aggro deck matchups (sligh, 10 land stompy, etc...).

[BreathWeapon]

How can you justify not using Mind Twist in a deck with that much Mana at it's disposal? The card would "have" to improve some of your aggro match ups.

Anyway, good job on representing with Slaver Lock PWNage.

[Mixing Mike]

Go look here, right there about half way on page 1 if you want to know about Mind Twist.

That reasoning right there makes me confused as to why he'd be boarding out Slavers.

[BreathWeapon]

Synergy is an irrelevant argument for cutting Mind Twist, Blood Moon has absolutely no synergy with Slaver either ... yet you SB 3 because it WINS games. Who cares if Mind Twist removes cards that Slavery could have abused, you've already got the game in the back of your pocket if Twist resolves.

I don't know, I have several disagreements about Drain/Slaver with the Primer. Fire/Ice and Cunning Wish simply aren't that good, and Mean Deck's Gorilla Shamans are such a metagame call. MD Trisk is also a must, IMO.

The manabase is also sort of funky, 4 Volcanics just aren't necessary to support Red and 3 Undergrouns Seas should be included for Tutor/Twist/Will. A 5th Fetch couldn't hurt either, with Stifle coming out of Vogue.

Edit: I also think Mystical Tutor is a "No Duh" card. Even if you have to go 3 for 1 via, Mystical->Tinker->Platinum Angel for Sligh/Suicide it's worth it. I even SB the Colossus, to set up the 2 Turn Clock vs the "Bad Decks" that give Control Slaver so many problems.

[Mixing Mike]

...you've already got the game in the back of your pocket if Twist resolves.

Same thing with a Mindslaver.  So why waste time setting up a Twist with back up, when you can just weld in a Slaver, and activate it?

Also, Blood Moon isn't even needed right now.  Anything you'd side it in for, you should be beating anyways, except for Fish.  Seriously.

Fire/Ice is the only thing that lets you beat Gay/r or Fish (well, outside of Platinum Angel), Slavers hardest matchups.  With Fire/Ice, you can still win if they have Null Rod on the table, rather than looking at a worthless Triskelion.  Cunning Wish is kinda iffy, and it's only justifiable with draw in the board.

[BreathWeapon]

Because, Mind Twist is significantly easier to resolve than Mindslaver by not requiring a Goblin Welder to circumvent its casting cost. Why not play it, is the better question IMO. It effectively differentiates your Control elements, and I already use 3xMindslavers as it is.

Fire/Ice is not how you win vs Fish, it may result in our three favorite numbers 241, but it by no meens solves any problems. The Deck is simply too pressed for space to incorporate Fire/Ice, 3xSlavers are necessary to avoid losing to Coffin Purge and Mind Twist and Mystical Tutor belong in the deck. If nothing else, Mystical Tutor for Tinker into Pentavus is more promising vs Fish than resolving a Fire/Ice could ever hope to be.

I don't know what metagame your playing in, but Blood Moon is insanely good, IMO. It is a total HOUSE vs Fish and 4cc, which are both seeing immense popularity and are extremely difficult match ups, ATM. It's also very strong vs HULK and Dragon. I can't see removing my 3 from the SB, because I bring them in for FAT and Mindslavers a lot.

[TheLegendOfMagic]

First off, the deck only splashes black for DT and Will, Mindtwist is a busted card, however it does work with the decks synergy since I want to slaver them eventually. Drawing Mindtwist is this deck is often a dead draw most of the time. The match up versus Fish, slavers are horrible in that match up, the key to winning that match is triskelion and angel, the slavers are easily hosed with null rods. Game 1 versus fish is revolved around having a active trike,pentavus or angel(and protecting them). You have absolutely no right to criticize my board since it is apparent you do not know the metagame at C&J's. Mystical is better than vampiric, because of the light black mana source in the deck. The point of the wishes is not to get a card drawing card from board but rather, the wishes are to help me deal with certain cards, for example chain of vapor or rack and ruin to remove null rods or to mystical for tinker or ancestral.

Blood moons not neccessary? Blood moons are key to winning tough match ups and unfavorable match ups, for example Fish and Hulk Smash , perhaps even 4cControl. The moons can help against dragon as well depending on the dragon variant.

And finally, Mixing Mike, until you have over 1000 matches in vintage tournament play, please leave your outburst for the newbie forum, it is apparent through my many strong placings in tournaments that I indeed know what I am doing.....

[Moxlotus]

...you've already got the game in the back of your pocket if Twist resolves.

Same thing with a Mindslaver.  So why waste time setting up a Twist with back up, when you can just weld in a Slaver, and activate it?

Also, Blood Moon isn't even needed right now.  Anything you'd side it in for, you should be beating anyways, except for Fish.  Seriously.

Fire/Ice is the only thing that lets you beat Gay/r or Fish (well, outside of Platinum Angel), Slavers hardest matchups.  With Fire/Ice, you can still win if they have Null Rod on the table, rather than looking at a worthless Triskelion.  Cunning Wish is kinda iffy, and it's only justifiable with draw in the board.

If any time you get a big creature out against Fish you have a chance.  If you get 2 big creatures out you are looking pretty good, whether or not they have any abilities.

[GTOduck]

We all know of his extreme arrogance, it exsist every week, in every match, and every single game.  I wont say his name but we all know who I'm talking about.  Yes this past thursday he did get the best of me with his two ridiculous draws, but next week I have a little surprise for good old "McSausage".  Bring it on, because if we play next week I promise you wont get the best of me.  As for the rest of last thursday it went pretty good. With my newly created account here at the mana drain, I will try to voice my opinion here weekly, right after we hear McSausage's liitle banter about how he is the "GREATEST"!!! :lol: [/code]

[TheLegendOfMagic]

First off, of arragance you asked me to concede before our match began , talking about how Fish owns control slaver , and saying something about how I have no chance. That sounds like you were being arrogant. Plus you chose not to concede game 1 when you had nothing, during my report I was just reporting what happened and nothing more. Game 2 happened exactly the way I described it you lost to blood moon and my islands and mana drains oeverpowered you. Game 2 you kept a horrible hand knowing that more than likely my board wrecks yours more than yours does mine. You were ranting about your 15 card side board against me, obviously you are not experienced enough to realize if you did side in 15 cards game 2 , your deck will become diluted with crap thus making your deck even more worse than in game 1. It's sad that you are immature and a bad sport, and please if you decide to "bash" please do it in the newbie forum and do not dilude thus thread with your pointless personal attacks for your short comings, since you were outplayed and outskilled....

[Mixing Mike]

I am in no way telling you what to play in your deck.  I am in no way trying to put a personal attack on you.  All I'm doing is giving you my suggestions with your deck list.  If you must know, Richard Shay (The Atog Lord) and I have had many discussions over this deck, and agree an many things on different levels.  I also have been playing this deck since I first saw it here on TMD, and have had great success with it, including beating fish mutiple times in tournament play.  All I am doing is sharing MY personal view and thoughts on this archtype with you, and the community.

In the fish matchup, I've found that slaving them can be game swinging.  Killing off their army with their own Spiketails going suicudal, breaking their own Standstills, and Lavamancers killing Curious fish-type critters.  More ofthen than not, a single Slave has earned me up to 5 cards on my opponent.  These reasons are the reasons why I do not board out Slavers vs. Fish, becasue the delta P of an activated Mindslaver can be greater than the effect of FTK.  Espically when your opponent has Lavamancers out and active.  Also, I hardly feel that having a Turn 1 Tinker-> Angel with FoW backup is considered to be 'skillful', nor is playing a BLood Moon when your opponents have no Islands, then still having to draw Yawg Will to win the game.

I'm not forcing you to play Vampiric Tutor, it was just a suggesting.  IMO, if one is to run Mystical Tutor in the board, why not just take the 2 life and get ANY card you need.  But again, this is MY personal feelings on this one specific card selection.  As is my feelings towards Wishes.  My feeling for Fact or Fiction is shared with the rest of the community.  Please look at how many Slaver decks in this recent Top 8 did NOT play Fact or Fiction.  Also note that all 4 out of 4 Salver decks made Top 8 that came to play that day.  And on a final note, look for how many people played Mystical Tutor over Vampiric Tutor, if they played either at all.  

Now can we please get back to a dicussion?

Game 1 versus fish is revolved around having a active trike, pentavus or angel

Ah, but having a Trike out looking down the throat of a Null Rod is the SAME reason why you say Slavers are horrible in this matchup, as is having a Pentavus out.

[BreathWeapon]

I don't see how risking 3 dead cards in the face of Null Rod is any more skillful than dropping a Blood Moon or using Tinker, but I guess that's a matter of perception.

I do agree that Fact or Fiction is an overrated card in Drain Slaver. I find that you rarely want to use Drain Mana to power out your Draw Spells over your Slavers and FAT. With that in mind, Fact has a harder time resolving.

Concerning the SB, would you say that FTK>Trisks? I haven't been entirely impressed with FTK or Fire/Ice vs Fish. Sure both of them are strong cards, but neither of them say "game over" like a Trisk vs Fish. Sure, Trisk is more expensive and "Loves the Rod," but you pay for what you get. 241 just isn't that impressive vs Fish, because they have so much time to mass cards on you with Curiousity and Standstill it feels like your barely braking even. Razormane Masticore is also a strong consideration, IMO.

Also, has anybody tried cutting Black entirey for MD Blood Moons instead? I find the only reason I use Black at all is for Will/Tutor/Twist, and most players only use the first two. While I like the "Random Win" of Will and Tutoring for Tinker as much as the next guy, Blood Moons win games just as often and free up SB space. Black also offers nothing to the SB, Crypt being significantly better than Purge with Welders.

[The Atog Lord]

I do agree that Fact or Fiction is an overrated card in Drain Slaver.

I disagree on so many levels...Fact or Fiction is quite good in Control Slaver.

I could see a case for sideboarding the FoF, but not running it at all has to be a mistaKe. The card is quite powerful on its own; combined with Welder, it becomes ridiculous.

On the matter of cutting Mindslaver, I never cut all of them. Against some decks, cutting one of the two is a good idea. Still, leaving one Slaver in the deck for the chance to combo out is worthwhile, I believe.

As for cutting black. Black's inclusion in the deck is justified by Yawgmoth's Will alone. If you have read any of my tournament reports, you will see how many games just end by that card's resolution.

Beyond Will and Tutor, I'm currently running Duress. My current list and some explaination are in the thread in the Open forum.

[Meddling Mike]

As for cutting black. Black's inclusion in the deck is justified by Yawgmoth's Will alone.

Seriously, will just wins you so many games that you really shouldn't. So many times I'm getting really close to getting the slaver lock, but I'm short the pentavus I need, I welder away all my artifacts, slavering each time, then cast yawg will and draw the cards I need from recurring the ancestral/walk/tinker/brainstorm and typically it makes the lock permanent, or at least prolongs the pain until it becomes permanent. I've also found that many times vampiric tutor or coffin purge can find their way into the sideboard from time to time, so I wouldn't say that black is incapable of powering up the sideboard. In my opinion the vamp is fine in sideboard, there's really not much need for that or mystical main deck. I prefer to run vamp as a wish target if at all. If you're missing a very important piece of the puzzle it's good to have that option open to you I think, but not warranting of a MD spot.

[GTOduck]

I love your last reply's subject, but if i remember correctly the last time we played before this past thursday i took the backside of my leather belt to your hind parts.  I remember a quick 2-0 victory over your "UNSTOPPABLE" control deck with my friend Cornbread's build of slaver.  WOW, that must mean that since im the worst magic player ever you should just quit overall.  I just love the way you put yourself out there for this kind of stuff.  Oh yeah, and you should probably get good at magic before you call yourself the best.  Thats all i have to say.  Reply as you may but come next week we'll play and youll be quite sad to see my main deck. :lol:

[LotusHead]

Why? Why would you side out not one, but ALL of your Mind Slavers? I could understand one, and given your performance at the tourny, you obviously know what you were doing. (TheLegendOfMagic had an MUCH tougher route than me...)

I was simply stunned when I read about that particular sideboarding strategy.  Was it to throw the opponent off guard? Why ALL of your Mind Slavers?

You DID smash face on all of your opponents, but why why why side out BOTH Mind Slavers? I just have to know!

What is Null Rod Phobia? MetaChoice/PersonalKnowledgeOfYourOpponent?

[TheLegendOfMagic]

Well, 2 of the games where people have said boarding out slaver was incorrect was probably the Fish and Void match ups, here are my reasons for boarding out slavers:

1) Versus Fish, slavers can be good, however the effectiveness of slaver is to situational as a null rod would ruin the entire set up. However, that is not why I boarded out the slavers. The main reason is because, despite for it being difficult to see, the match up with fish is really revolved around  the Platinum angel and removing the lavamancers before they become a threat. Thats my first priority in that matchup, the second priority is to have an active triskelion and pentavus thus thwarting any offence the fish deck may have. No offence to anyone, leaving slavers in against fish is INCORRECT, for instance true a null rod will shut down my other artifact creatures, however having a 5/5 body and a 4/4 body is much better than a stagnant slaver that is utterly useless with null rod in play. Game 2 no matter what, against fish you must board in removing, i.e a duplicant(I did not own 1 prior to thursday) to recurse or maybe a secondary triskelion (my board had room for both once the FTK's were replaced). Also bloodmoons are a must if the "real" metagame is control/multi color control decks, like hulk or even fish hosing manlands is just as good as killing them. Remember slavers are good, but against Fish, you much rather have one of your artifact creatures, the game revolves around whether or not you can get to your men before you get nickel and dimed to death by weenies. Game 2 vs fish is a toss up, most of the time the null rods stay in the deck, however there occasional cases where the opponent attempts to call my bluff that I indeed boarded out slavers. In any case I could go on with more reasons why slavers are not great vs fish, but all I can prove is that Ive played this deck at least 50 tournament games with 15 of them being vs fish, so I experienced that match enough times to know what you MUST do in that match in order to win.

Versus Mono-black Void, The slavers are not great here either, remember Void has many creature and can sometimes just go all aggro i.e, ritual hypnotic or negator. Again, this match up was once again decided on whether or not I can get to my men before I either get hosed from void or get run over by his horde of black creatures. Unless your opponent has refilled his hand, when you slaver them it usually late in the game and most of the time it accomplishes fogging your opponent for one turn from attacking you. Especially in control slaver, you only get late game slavers, at that point I would much rather drop a angel or a triskelion and clear his board while swinging at him. Once again its a toss up, some decks run null rods main, while other run them in the board, regardless of the variant Game 2 IS ALWAYS -2 SLAVERS +2 REMOVAL CARDS, the optimal board in now is triskelion and a duplicant. Slaver is a powerful card, however it take correct play to determine whether to keep them in or not. Ive played every tier1 -tier3 deck that has made its way to the C&J's metagame, I've come to be very alert on what to do versus which match up , again I am only speaking through my own experiences, if anyone disagrees with my reasoning about slaver, you can try to prove me wrong and tell me how you decisions worked out....

[raziel]

Welcome to the boards ducky. Quack!

Brian - You must agree that leaving 1 Mindslaver in could be a good idea. Granted it's your decision and playstyle, but you can see where people are coming from.

[BreathWeapon]

I completely agree that Will wins a retarded number of games all by itself, but so does Blood Moon. BM is also a much faster "screw" than Will vs your Opponent, and should improve the Fish match up. I guess what I'm trying to say is, would a Blood Moon have won you the game just as easily as Will in the games you mentioned? Granted BM isn't as good as Will/Tutor/Twist vs Madness/FCG/Sligh/Suicide, but that's something I can live with.

[The Atog Lord]

I can say with certainty that Moon would not have been as powerful as Will in those games. Will is a three casting cost sorcery which ends the game if resolved after the early part of the game.

I'm not saying that Blood Moon is a bad card at all. In fact, I've boarded it myself in the past. The problem with maindecking it is that it isn't useful against a number of decks. Also, it has no synergy with the rest of the deck. It becomes just a random card which can sometimes work well.

Moreover, in my current build (posted in another thread on this forum), I only have three basic land.

[TheIneffable]

Basically playing Blood Moon in the main means that you expect to play versus "good" decks the entire time. You expect to see man-lands, duals, Shops, Bazaars, but the problem with this philosophy is that there are the inevitable matchups that you don't want this card. Matchups that your deck already has a problem with, Sui Black, 10L Stompy, Sligh, etc. I don't see this card justifying its own spot in the MD.

Versus Fish, only an exceptional Slaver can do more than what your SB cards can. You have to catch Fish at a really bad time for Slaver to be much of a threat. Post board you basically hope that BM can shut them down and then steam roll them with a really crappy version of TNT's men. The correct call is to board out Slavers versus Fish, its basically that simple. Let's see the plays you talked about:

1. Wasteland, it must be drawn off the top or tapped for mana in a previous turn which is quite unlikely when they are usually trying to threaten your mana base. So if you get lucky your Slaver is two LD spells in one. For 10 mana you could have just double Stone Rain'ed and saved that extra 4.

2. Fetch for nothing, it also must be drawn off the top and this turns your Slaver into a  pseudo-Strip.

3. Lavamancer, hoping that they have enough cards in the yard. Why not just play Fire/Ice.

4. Spiketail suicide, again, F/I is just superior here.

5. Playing Standstill, this is usually awful. Unless you already have some big man in play, there is no point to playing this card. Yes you can break it for them, but that is a lot of mana to play Standstill and something to pop it.


So you hope to topdeck a Wasteland for them, with an active Lavamancer, that being your most likely best case scenario. Woohoo... You might just wanna play those kinda odds in Vegas.

draw into yawgmoth's will which broke the stalemate.

until I topdeck yawgmoths will and once again winning by topdeck.

I top deck yawgmoths will
 
then I draw yawgmoths will

island and tinker with force of will and blue card to back up my first turn

you were outplayed and outskilled

I indeed know what I am doing

Any monkey can TD Yawg Win. I guess if it requires all you playskill just to win after topdecking Yawg Will then you are some kind of "Legend".

[Jacob Orlove]

Okay, that's enough. No more personal attacks in this thread, or you people will start getting real warnings.