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Author Topic: Mogg Fanatic Nostalgia?  (Read 4970 times)
FlyFlySideOfFry
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« on: January 25, 2010, 10:44:10 pm »

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1

This would probably be printed as a rare, but in terms of power I don't see this being much stronger than other current one casting cost creatures. It would undeniably become an instant staple though. Other option:

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Haste
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
0/1

This would probably be a common. Option three would likely be:

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Haste
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1

I'm not sure if the attacking each turn clause balances out the Haste, but it definitely fits more with the reckless theme of Goblins. Thoughts? Comments? Suggestions?
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jro
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« Reply #1 on: January 25, 2010, 11:04:30 pm »

He would be hilariously reckless if it wasn't a "may" ability and could only target creatures, i.e. "Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks, it deals 1 damage to target creature."
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #2 on: January 26, 2010, 11:11:01 am »

He would be hilariously reckless if it wasn't a "may" ability and could only target creatures, i.e. "Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks, it deals 1 damage to target creature."

I was thinking that but the problem is that it becomes far too narrow in that you need to face an opponent with early game creatures or else he is esentially a 1/1 wall. At that point it becomes complicated to try and balance out his power and abilities. I would be strongly leaning towards a 2/1 if it had to attack each turn and deal 1 damage to a creature. Maybe if coin flipping was a part of the set:

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks flip a coin. If you win, you may have Goblin Firecracker deal one damage to target creature or player. If you lose, Goblin Firecracker deals one damage to target creature you control.
You can't miss if you don't know what you're aiming at.
2/1
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« Reply #3 on: January 27, 2010, 11:10:08 am »

He would be hilariously reckless if it wasn't a "may" ability and could only target creatures, i.e. "Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks, it deals 1 damage to target creature."

I was thinking that but the problem is that it becomes far too narrow in that you need to face an opponent with early game creatures or else he is esentially a 1/1 wall. At that point it becomes complicated to try and balance out his power and abilities. I would be strongly leaning towards a 2/1 if it had to attack each turn and deal 1 damage to a creature. Maybe if coin flipping was a part of the set:

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks flip a coin. If you win, you may have Goblin Firecracker deal one damage to target creature or player. If you lose, Goblin Firecracker deals one damage to target creature you control.
You can't miss if you don't know what you're aiming at.
2/1

Love this. Auto 4-off in RDW for standard. balanced but wicked good. love it!
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jro
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« Reply #4 on: January 27, 2010, 05:17:40 pm »

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks flip a coin. If you win, you may have Goblin Firecracker deal one damage to target creature or player. If you lose, Goblin Firecracker deals one damage to target creature you control.
You can't miss if you don't know what you're aiming at.
2/1
This would make a good rare.  It's got good flavor, the mechanic ties in well, and it's powerful but needs a lot of planning to use effectively.  How does the current templating work under the rules?  I guess you have to pick targets for both when the ability is put onto the stack?  What happens if there are no valid targets for one side of the ability? 
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #5 on: January 27, 2010, 07:33:27 pm »

Firecracker Commander -  {R}
Creature - Goblin
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks flip a coin. If you win, you may have Goblin Firecracker deal one damage to target creature or player. If you lose, Goblin Firecracker deals one damage to target creature you control.
You can't miss if you don't know what you're aiming at.
2/1
This would make a good rare.  It's got good flavor, the mechanic ties in well, and it's powerful but needs a lot of planning to use effectively.  How does the current templating work under the rules?  I guess you have to pick targets for both when the ability is put onto the stack?  What happens if there are no valid targets for one side of the ability? 

Ideally it would trigger->responses/etc.->begin resolving->flip coin->chose target based on flip->deal damage->finish resolving. However, other rulings don't seem to confirm this:

http://gatherer.wizards.com/Pages/Card/Details.aspx?multiverseid=19752

Quote
10/4/2004 You choose both targets on activation, so you can only activate this when you can legally choose both targets.

I'm also not sure what exactly would happen if say, your opponent had True Believer with Alexi's Cloak on it as their only creature or Ivory Mask as their only permanent or if your only creature was Firecracker Commander and it had Alexi's Cloak on it. I hope this isn't a rules nightmare. :S
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« Reply #6 on: January 28, 2010, 06:11:36 am »

How about this

Firecracker Commander -  {R} (Rare)
Creature - Goblin Soldier
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander is put into the graveyard from play, you may have it deal 1 damage to target creature or player.

You can't miss if you don't know what you're aiming at.

1/1

Sounds like Mogg Fanatic to me. He is a commander isn't he? Plus imagine all the possibilities with him being a soldier!
« Last Edit: January 28, 2010, 07:55:34 am by kooaznboi1088 » Logged

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« Reply #7 on: January 28, 2010, 10:12:09 am »

I don't know, I still think the inital idea was better. I personally liek this one:

Firecracker Commander -   {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1
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Cyberpunker
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« Reply #8 on: January 28, 2010, 11:05:49 am »

Sure the original was great too!

I would run 4 of in my Legacy Zoo in a heartbeat. Amazing against Merfolk. You get to kill them before they kill you! Its like a better Double Strike.
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #9 on: January 28, 2010, 06:28:39 pm »

I don't know, I still think the inital idea was better. I personally liek this one:

Firecracker Commander -   {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1


Yeah it was my top pick, I just decided to post other options in case others liked them better. XD
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jro
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« Reply #10 on: January 29, 2010, 11:25:09 am »

I don't know, I still think the inital idea was better. I personally liek this one:
Firecracker Commander -   {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1
Yeah it was my top pick, I just decided to post other options in case others liked them better. XD
That's definitely the "best card" in the sense of being most powerful, but since it's pushing the power level it's hard to say if it would be printable.  I could definitely see that being printed for 1R.  Maybe even 1R as "Whenever ~this~ attacks or blocks".  If you wanted it to be a common, a "1R, attacks or blocks" version would almost certainly be printable as a sort of Prodigal Pyromancer variant.

These fantasy card creations are a funny sort of thing.  There's a lot of different approaches to consider when asked to comment on them.  I know for my part I always try to consider not just a card, but the context you'd find it in.  The original version of this might be printable in some environment despite pushing the curve pretty hard, the same way that Great Sable Stag was printable in a Faeries dominated metagame.  In a vacuum, I'd say that the original version needs something to justify it being above the curve.  There are many ways to implement the original idea that would be "good designs"; after that it's up to you to decide which version best fits your vision.
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2010, 09:02:20 am »

I don't know, I still think the inital idea was better. I personally liek this one:
Firecracker Commander -   {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1
Yeah it was my top pick, I just decided to post other options in case others liked them better. XD
That's definitely the "best card" in the sense of being most powerful, but since it's pushing the power level it's hard to say if it would be printable.  I could definitely see that being printed for 1R.  Maybe even 1R as "Whenever ~this~ attacks or blocks".  If you wanted it to be a common, a "1R, attacks or blocks" version would almost certainly be printable as a sort of Prodigal Pyromancer variant.

These fantasy card creations are a funny sort of thing.  There's a lot of different approaches to consider when asked to comment on them.  I know for my part I always try to consider not just a card, but the context you'd find it in.  The original version of this might be printable in some environment despite pushing the curve pretty hard, the same way that Great Sable Stag was printable in a Faeries dominated metagame.  In a vacuum, I'd say that the original version needs something to justify it being above the curve.  There are many ways to implement the original idea that would be "good designs"; after that it's up to you to decide which version best fits your vision.

Well I think cards like Wild Nacatl, Savannah Lion, Elite Vanguard, and Vampire Lacerator set the standard that one casting cost creatures are only getting stronger and more common. My personal favorite is still:

Firecracker Commander - {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
1/1

I think it would be printable as a rare.
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Cyberpunker
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« Reply #12 on: February 02, 2010, 11:46:14 am »

I have another idea! What about some sort of evasion?

Firecracker Commander - {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Firecracker Commander is unblockable
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
0/1
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« Reply #13 on: February 02, 2010, 10:35:11 pm »

I have another idea! What about some sort of evasion?

Firecracker Commander - {R}
Creature - Goblin Trickster
Firecracker Commander is unblockable
Whenever Firecracker Commander attacks you may have it deal one damage to target creature or player.
Goblins are not known for their intelligence, but man can they throw a firecracker.
0/1

I don't think that 0 power and unblockability is really in keeping with Red or Goblins. Still, I love that this is spawning discussion and getting creativity flowing. Smile
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« Reply #14 on: February 02, 2010, 11:50:15 pm »


I don't think that 0 power and unblockability is really in keeping with Red or Goblins. Still, I love that this is spawning discussion and getting creativity flowing. Smile

Cunning Sparkmage
Kobolds hahah
Vithian Stinger
Blazing Effigy
Cinder Pyromancer
Fortune Thief

 Wink Red has a lot of 0 power creatures who sneak unavoidable damage to the enemy.

The fact that your goblin is as Goblin Trickster should make the evasion and 0/1 power make more sense.  Very Happy
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« Reply #15 on: February 08, 2010, 10:25:17 am »

I feel bad because with power creep being the way it is, I sort of want that guy to be a 2/2.  O_o

I mean, shit.  They reprinted Kird Ape in White, and people are saying it's not even good enough for Type 2.  A 2/1 for R would have been cool, like, four years ago?  Sigh.
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #16 on: February 08, 2010, 01:35:45 pm »


I don't think that 0 power and unblockability is really in keeping with Red or Goblins. Still, I love that this is spawning discussion and getting creativity flowing. Smile

Cunning Sparkmage
Kobolds hahah
Vithian Stinger
Blazing Effigy
Cinder Pyromancer
Fortune Thief

 Wink Red has a lot of 0 power creatures who sneak unavoidable damage to the enemy.

The fact that your goblin is as Goblin Trickster should make the evasion and 0/1 power make more sense.  Very Happy

None of those cards are meant to attack but more importantly none of those are Goblins. In fact the only 0 power Goblin that doesn't have some powerful way to increase its power directly is Goblin Chirurgeon. Also there are only 2 red creatures in all of Magic that are straight up "unblockable" and they're both conditional effects from Portal 3 Kingdoms creatures. Razz

I feel bad because with power creep being the way it is, I sort of want that guy to be a 2/2.  O_o

I mean, shit.  They reprinted Kird Ape in White, and people are saying it's not even good enough for Type 2.  A 2/1 for R would have been cool, like, four years ago?  Sigh.

Yeah, I see what you mean. Unfortunately the power level is only going to get higher I mean even as a 2/1 for R that pings on attack it still barely trades with other 1-drops like Wild Nacatl and Loam Lion. Sad

The problem is that we can't just ignore Limited and Block where these conditional early beaters likely get significantly worse and a card like Goblin Trickster becomes a true bomb, even as a 1/1 for R that pings when it attacks. :S
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« Reply #17 on: February 08, 2010, 11:39:14 pm »

I feel bad because with power creep being the way it is, I sort of want that guy to be a 2/2.  O_o

I mean, shit.  They reprinted Kird Ape in White, and people are saying it's not even good enough for Type 2.  A 2/1 for R would have been cool, like, four years ago?  Sigh.

I'm so glad someone else sees things the way I do...

So Flyflysideoffry:

I think its time to ramp up this guys power:

Firecracker Commander -  {R} (Rare)
Creature - Goblin Soldier
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander is put into the graveyard from play, you may have it deal 1 damage to target creature or player.
2/1
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FlyFlySideOfFry
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« Reply #18 on: February 08, 2010, 11:53:25 pm »

I feel bad because with power creep being the way it is, I sort of want that guy to be a 2/2.  O_o

I mean, shit.  They reprinted Kird Ape in White, and people are saying it's not even good enough for Type 2.  A 2/1 for R would have been cool, like, four years ago?  Sigh.

I'm so glad someone else sees things the way I do...

So Flyflysideoffry:

I think its time to ramp up this guys power:

Firecracker Commander -  {R} (Rare)
Creature - Goblin Soldier
Firecracker Commander attacks each turn if able.
Whenever Firecracker Commander is put into the graveyard from play, you may have it deal 1 damage to target creature or player.
2/1


Wow I like that even better than the original. :O
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« Reply #19 on: February 09, 2010, 01:05:05 am »

You and me too man Wink
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