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Author Topic: The End  (Read 6191 times)
Anusien
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« Reply #30 on: April 26, 2010, 10:01:44 pm »

Yes, let's make a card that is waaay better than Snuff Out. And also it should have an ability that resides in silver-border land, and also let's destroy the color pie while we're at it.
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« Reply #31 on: April 26, 2010, 10:12:26 pm »

Since when has snuff out been the template for anything...and silver bordered??? Please at least read the prior posts.

Color pie- I can understand this comment.  This seems more like a white ability to me as well.  But I think blue can have this ability as well, it is not a hard destroy effect and blue is the color of cunning and wizardry:  polymorphing a permanent into something much less menacing is already in the blue color pie.

Making the alternate cost "remove the top 10 cards of your library" or "lose 7 life" is prohibitive.  A goyf would nor need to hit you too many times before this card would suck.  PS-  if remove 10 cards is too bad if the benefit is "draw 7 cards" nailing 1 opposing card is not altogether problematic.
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Anusien
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« Reply #32 on: April 26, 2010, 11:04:41 pm »

Removing text is basically the worst idea ever. It's 100% more simple to just make something like Vindicate or Oblivion Ring than to deal with the rules nightmares that can arise from this.

We get it. You want blue removal. Blue doesn't really get removal like this though.
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Delha
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« Reply #33 on: April 27, 2010, 01:48:09 pm »

So what you guys really want, is for this ability never to be playable in any format other than standard...
No, but you are simply failing to recognize that for any card to be printable, it must not break Standard. Part of the challenge is making an idea that is useful to us, without wrecking the biggest format in the game.

Since when has snuff out been the template for anything...and silver bordered??? Please at least read the prior posts.
The point is the same one stated by many people, many times before. You are suggesting a much better version of CARD X. More often than not, it means the new card is too strong. It is you who needs to read back, because you have repeatedly violated this rule, despite it being pointed out ad nauseum.

Color pie- I can understand this comment.  This seems more like a white ability to me as well.  But I think blue can have this ability as well, it is not a hard destroy effect and blue is the color of cunning and wizardry:  polymorphing a permanent into something much less menacing is already in the blue color pie.
This is, as stated before, even better than a hard destroy effect (which you at least seem to recognize as being out of color for blue). Compare Ovinize/Humility, like we said. It does something similar, but only to creatures, and only temporary. If you want a more powerful effect, you need to justify it with a comparable drawback, such as high mana cost.

Making the alternate cost "remove the top 10 cards of your library" or "lose 7 life" is prohibitive.  A goyf would nor need to hit you too many times before this card would suck.  PS-  if remove 10 cards is too bad if the benefit is "draw 7 cards" nailing 1 opposing card is not altogether problematic.
You a simply wrong here. Tezz would cry tears of joy to have FoW 5-8, even at the cost of RFG 10 or 7 life. Either drawback is painful, but preferable to your opponent resolving the second half of Key/Vault. Your last sentence in the post simply did not make sense. If that was meant to be a Diminishing Returns reference, you absolutely fail at making parallels.

suggestions would help instead of skepticism, and removing power level of the ability is a no go as it would make the card completely unrecognizable.
Translation: "I want to make something broken, why won't you let me?"

We've been trying to tell you for two pages now why your card is completely unreasonable.  If you would actually address the concerns presented instead of just making newer and dumber versions that are equally unprintable and still violate the same card creation principles, maybe you'd see some progress here instead of continually bashing your head into a brick wall. You need to either do that or accept that your idea is a failure and let it go.
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I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
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« Reply #34 on: April 27, 2010, 02:24:40 pm »

I posted here and then deleted because I should not have gotten as wrapped up in this.

I have come to believe that this should be a white spell and am willing to switch it depending on he feedback.  With every iteration of the card I am making an attempt to fix the issues.(go back and read the thread if you disagree)

A few things:

1). Blue can and should have a permanent polymorph effect.  Polymorphing a single permanent is not dangerous, I will definitely drop the spell part so that this does not become an additinal force of will.  However, permanency is not going to change on the card.
Edit: for simplicity sake, home about just removing specific abilities instead of replacing the target with something, removing all text...etc
2). There must be an alternate cost, because I want it to be playable in all formats and not just chaff
3). Split second is a must for me because the intent of the original was to gum up he abilities(not power and toughness, name,type...) of a card permanently.
4) I want this to hit static abilities on cards as well:
examples of things I want to remove:
A) mana abilities
B) indestructible
C) regular activated abilities
D) regular triggered abilities

I do not know how to get A and B on there without a disaster so-

Suggestion:

UU4

The End

Instant
Split Second

Remove all activated abilities and triggered abilities
from target permanent.


Any suggestions on the alternate cost?
« Last Edit: April 27, 2010, 03:03:33 pm by TheShop » Logged
Delha
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« Reply #35 on: April 27, 2010, 03:16:33 pm »

Edit: Content deleted.
« Last Edit: April 27, 2010, 04:23:17 pm by Delha » Logged

I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
Delha
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« Reply #36 on: April 27, 2010, 03:56:18 pm »

UU4

The End

Instant
Split Second

Remove all activated abilities and triggered abilitiesfrom target permanent.
Having split second isn't necessary to mess with the abilities of a permanent. For anything with a tap effect, they would just get one last use out of the ability before it's gone. Also, note that even with split-second, if the ability is already on the stack, this won't stop it from resolving.

If you make that cut, I think {1} {W} {U} would be a fair cost (might be fair even keeping split-second). I agree that the flavor of the spell is white, and UW strikes me as even more fitting. At this reduced cost, do you still feel it needs an alternate?

We could take the templating from Humble/Ovinize and say "Target permanent loses all abilities".

Might need to add something to prevent it from hitting basic lands. Alternately, make it not affect mana abilities?

Feels like a blue flavored Vindicate to me. It trades the ability to outright kill creatures for instant speed. I like it.
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I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
TheShop
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« Reply #37 on: April 27, 2010, 04:12:13 pm »

Let me make the apology for post he is quoting public.

Also, I really really really like(except the terrible name I gave it):

The End

Instant

UW1

Target permanent loses all abilities.

I like the fact that it hits basic land.  After all, at UU Boomerang takes away a land drop(even if you relay the land, you are 1 short).

Sorry it took so long to get to this point guys-this was pretty much the intent of the period card the whole time and I was just being hardheaded.  I like it at UU1 as well.
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