[Free Podcast] SMIP # 33: Born of the Gods Review

[MaximumCDawg]

I agree that Courser, Follower, and Bile Blight are possibilities for decks that want to abuse those particular abilities.  Unravel is also fine as a Deglamer supplement -- not that anyone needs 5 of them.  However, in Vintage I see strong competition from Future Sight, Aphetto Alchemist, and Toxic Deluge, respectively.

The rest of your suggestions... I can't see them being serious Vintage players. 

Brimaz is great and all, but he seems to be about as powerful as Hero of Bladehold.  And Hero saw no play.  Is one mana difference enough to fill the gap?  I'm sure people will try, and I'll cheer them on, but I can't see it. In a world where 4/5s cost 2 mana and are named Tarmogoyf, I can't see how an effective 4/5 for 3 can compete.

Eidolon similarly seems to fail the goyf test.  Yes, early in the match he might be a 2/2 or 3/3 for 3.  But Goyf will be bigger, faster, and not suck on an empty board. 

Drown in Sorrow seems just worse that Toxic Deluge.  How many times is Infest actually showing up in top 8s as is...?

Aspect of Hydra - This is a terrible card.  It takes three Elves to make it into a Giant Growth.  Once you have three Elves, you should be doing things more powerful than casting Giant Growth.  Also, Elves does not want to pump a single dude as a finisher -- he'll just get chumped.  It wants to cast Craterhoof so you are attacking with a whole bunch of huge dudes.

[Protoaddict]

I think you may be way off base on Brimaz. I mean I only realistically see him being a 1-2 of in Mono white simplicity because they do not have access to goyf, but I think that is enough to at least call him a vintage role player. I mean if a card is only a 1 of in 1 deck, is it a vintage playable card? I think a lot of of the reserve list says yes.

When you consider how much of a boost that deck gets with Spirit of the labyrinth, combined with the fact that Brimaz shares Tribes with a great many other cards in the list for Cavern, and that the deck tends to need a finisher now and then to get over big speed bumps without throwing their bears into blockers, this guy delivers. You would be hard pressed to find a more efficient wincon at the same mana cost or cheaper in white that does not get screwed by your own hate bears.

History also tells us that the new deglamer is relevant as well, since deglamer does see play in a non trivial amount, if only as a sideboard card against blightsteel. Just the fact that you can have 2 differently named cards with identical effects is relevant against Meddling mage and for Gifts ungiven.

I'm not saying that list of cards is the end all be all, but to dismiss them from discussion in the episode seems a little near sighted, even if we are just theory crafting future potential. I wonder when we look at results come the next review show how many cards from this list will be played in top 8 decks that were not discussed at all?

[sylverfyre]

Eidolon of Countless Battles only counts Auras, not all enchantments.  I am on the fence of whether it's going to make an impact on Standard let alone Eternal formats.

Bile Blight has issues because it falls short on mana vs. most creature kill (Swords, Bolt, even Doom Blade/Ult Price.) and also is massively less versatile than Detention Sphere which I've seen as a miser in some UW Angels control lists (which also has the 'target ALL of that card' effect.)

Courser is no Oracle of Mul Daya - not giving you the additional land drops to abuse makes it a worse engine.  Yes, you can fastbond.  But then you're looking at a 2 card combo that isn't really doing anything more broken than what fastbond does on a daily basis.

I do think Brimaz can break in and see play at all - Goyf has serious issues when he's staring down a Deathrite Shaman, and he isn't White.  The clock on Brimaz is also a turn faster than on a 4-power Goyf when goldfishing.  He also does a better job of pushing damage past chumps.

Kiora's follower I want to dork around with in a UG merfolk list running Thada so I can play either my own or my enemy's time vault, but I'm pretty sure it's an awful idea.