Rector Trix, by Westerdale

[theorigamist]

My list is slightly different, but I find that with so many cards that set the top of the deck, Demonic Consultation is an exceptional tutor.

I want to know what people think of High Market.  I play 1 Market and 1 Phyrexian Tower in addition to the 4 Therapies.  Tower is okay, but I'll probably either drop it or change it to another High Market.  The life gain has good synergy with Bargain/Necropotence.  Also, it does something on it's own, as opposed to something like Despotic Scepter.

[Rico Suave]

I don't use Consult because there are too many crucial 1-of's.  Consulting Bargain away really hurts, and losing Donate or Illusions can be bad--especially if you've pitched them to FoW earlier.  

High Market/Phyrexian Tower both kill Rector fine, but I'd use Diabolic Intent first.  Even then, Balance kills Rector a lot, and that is certainly a much better candidate than any of the above.

I prefer Rushing River because Meddling Mage and True Believer have killed me several times, it bounces Tog/Dryad (not as big a worry now though), it hits 2 hosers if necessary, and it's blue for FoW's sake.  Seal isn't bad, but neither is River.  I try to use that slot as a catch-all, and Seal doesn't really catch-all like River does.  

I noticed your SB was very interesting, Fishhead:
2 Hurkyl's
1 Seal of Cleansing
2 BeB
2 Powder Keg
1 Defense Grid
1 Balance
1 TimeTwister
1 Mind Twist
2 Smother
1 Abeyance
1 Ebony Charm

Powder Keg?  Ebony Charm?  Any special reason for those?

Also, Smother isn't terribly hot.  Innocent Blood is better in my opinion, because not only does it kill threats but it kills Rector as well.  It's cheaper too.  But even then I haven't really liked straight creature kill that much at all.  Abyss is an exception since it's a total bomb, especially against black-based decks like suicide.  Additionally, more Seals help against artifact-based creatures.  Those + Rector cover about all the ground you'll need.

[Fishhead]

Quote Powder Keg?  Ebony Charm?  Any special reason for those?

Keg is the catchall against Aggro.  

Ebony Charm is the one shot solution against things using the graveyard; Hulk's AKs, TnT's Squee or Reanimator.  Tormod's Crypt is more thorough, but people see it on the table and play around it; Charm is more tricky and I like having tricks.  Personal preference between the two I think.

Quote Also, Smother isn't terribly hot.  Innocent Blood is better in my opinion, because not only does it kill threats but it kills Rector as well.  It's cheaper too.  

This is a good suggestion.  

I took out the Negators that day because I didn't think they were pulling their weight and went hunting through my card-desk for replacements.  I expected to meet some GAT (an expectation met - 60% of my matches that day feature the 'Tog!) and remembered how Smother can be good in the GAT mirror.  Didn't really think it through beyond that.

Quote Additionally, more Seals help against artifact-based creatures.  

I liked the 2CC of Seal when I MD'd it; I also liked the fact that I can fetch it with Rector in an emergency.  I did expect to see TnT, MUD or Mask that day, but felt True Believer or Meddling Mage was much less likely.  I do agree though that the slot is supposed to be a "catchall" and that Seal doesn't really "catch all".   I still don't like the 3CC of River though.  Perhaps I will try Hoodwink.

Quote Demonic Consultation is an exceptional tutor.

As Rico said, I think the deck runs too many vital 1-ofs to risk the Consult.  You really can only think seriously about Consulting for your handful of 4-ofs.  That's Rituals, Duress, Therapy, Brainstorm, Fetchland, FoW, Rector, right?  Of those, as a practical matter, you'd really only search for Therapy or Rector.  FoW in a do-or-die emergency and Fetchy if you are screwed; but neither of those are advancing the goals of the deck.

Quote I want to know what people think of High Market.  

The mana-base is a bit tight, but I can see this working.  One or two life isn't a big deal, I'd personally prefer the Tower.  Mana is always good when you are going off.

[theorigamist]

My point was that Consult is not nearly as much of a risk because of the deck-setting cards.  But I agree it's still risky.

Quote The mana-base is a bit tight, but I can see this working.  One or two life isn't a big deal, I'd personally prefer the Tower.  Mana is always good when you are going off.

I prefer an extra card to an extra BB when you need blue.

[theorigamist]

Just a thought: if Consult is too risky, and there are so many 1-ofs, why not Tainted Pact?  It's similar to Consult, but without the risk, and it's much more effective in this type of a deck.  I've had very good times with Consult, personally, but my list has some other oddities that make it work better.  For this list, Pact would be very nice.

By the way, if somebody asks, I'll post my list.  But I won't otherwise cause I don't want to highjack the thread.

[Rico Suave]

The biggest thing isn't finding a good search card, it's finding room to fit it in.

As for posting a decklist, just say how yours is different and why it would be more advantageous than the current ones, no need to type the whole thing out.  Simple enough.

Anyway, I guess I'd rather just not SB anything at all against aggro aside from things to prevent hosing.  I figure if I ever would, I'd SB in more search or something to help get Rector out quicker and combo-out faster.

I did run Hoodwink for a while, but River is just a lot more appealing.  Either way, you can't go wrong with Seal if you think it'll handle everything.

[theorigamist]

If mine were advantageous, I'd start my own thread.  I'm basically just testing a bunch of unorthodox cards, including Consult/Tainted Pact, Soothsaying, High Market/Phyrexian Tower, and 2/3 IoG/Donate ratio, among other things.  Consultation has been amazing for me, but basically because of Soothsaying and Lim-Dul's Vault.  I also dropped Duress at one point.  If I had more time to test it, I would start my own thread.  But finals suck.

[suicide_slushy]

Dropping duress would be one of the last things I'd do.  It's the amount of disruption that makes rector trix a combo deck that doesn't roll over to control.  It's also good is other matchups grabbing survivals, bloodmoons, B2B, smokestack, seal of clensing, REBs, and whatever else troubles you, not to mention it's obvious synergy with therapy.

[Fishhead]

Quote ...if Consult is too risky, and there are so many 1-ofs, why not Tainted Pact?  

I did test 1 Impulse last time, its certainly Tainted Pact's more consistent big brother.  

My thoughts on Brainstorm-Fetchy were that you don't want the game to go too long on the Trix side of the table, so you have more trouble putting that mini "combo" together in a reasonable time.  So I wanted to see if Impulse was better.  I did a handful of goldfishes with 3 Impulse + 1 Brainstorm before I left for the tournament, but didn't come to any conclusions.  Therefore I was very conservative and went 1 Impulse + 3 Brainstorms.

I wanted to test something like 3 Impulse + 3 Brainstorm, but that involves reconfiguring the deck.  

There may be some room for reconfiguration - Van de Logt seemed to get by with 3 Duress, 3 Brainstorm and a very light land-base.  Squeezing 3 cards in isn't impossible, but they better do a good job if you make the effort.

[theorigamist]

Duress is one of the first things I would drop.  You're going to use Therapies twice anyways.  So you've already got 8 pseudo-Duress there, plus 4 Force of Will.  And your most important card comes out uncounterable.  I know Duress has synergy with Therapy, but Therapy has that same synergy with itself.  Besides, you'll always get to a certain point where you have to put consistency or speed over protection.  I question whether or not having a third of your spells as protection is necessary.

[Akuma (gio)]

Quote So you've already got 8 pseudo-Duress there, plus 4 Force of Will.

Not quite. If you are flashing back Cabal Therapy, then you are probably winning. Duress is an integral part in the control matchup. I can see it being dropped if you are not going to face a good amount of control decks. Cabal Therapy is not a Duress.

[Radagast]

Here's a nice idea: Intuition. It's Cabal Therapy 5-8 (or however many you choose to run), which I feel is something the deck definitely needs. (For people who don't tend to think about what they read, and for whom it may not be immediately obvious: Even if you only search out one Therapy, you will still get to sacrifice the Rector.) Other than that, it can get you Rector, disruption, Illusions, and Donate if you run 3+; or you can choose to run things like Deep Analysis or AK to maximize its usefulness, but that probably isn't a good idea.

To give credit where it is due, this was actually an idea suggested to me for my Rector/Sight deck (which is completely different - I don't want to get into it, but all it has in common with Rector Trix is Therapy and Rector) - I was splashing green for Acorn Harvest so I could use Quiet Speculation, which is pretty bad.

[Fishhead]

Quote Here's a nice idea: Intuition.

The deck is very tight as is.  What would you cut for 3 Intuition?

[Radagast]

I don't know the deck nearly well enough to decide that. The point is they should probably be in there somewhere, because there is no way four ways to sacrifice Rector can possibly be enough, and this is the next best thing after Therapy, and it's even fairly good (unlike the other options).

[Crater Hellion]

I run 1 Tabernacle at Pendrell Vale for an additional way to sac rector. This works especially well in my metagame due to the large amounts of aggro.

[Rico Suave]

Tabernacle may kill Rector, but on it's own it provides very little to the deck's purpose.  Even then, the best aggro decks will gladly tap a single Mox to attack with a 12/12.  

The reason I don't include Intuition is two-fold:
1) It's expensive.  3 mana for a search card, when the best thing to find is Cabal Therapy, isn't exactly hot.  
2) What do you cut?

I'd rather run a set of Impulses before Intuition, if only to help with the mana aspect.  And Mystical Tutor is more appealing than Impulse.

[Fishhead]

Since you've played this deck a lot Rico, perhaps you have some thoughts on the question of what to cut; which is more importantly the question of what goes out when you sideboard.

It seems to me that the deck is so jam-packed that its hard to wedge stuff in from the sideboard.  

So, can you give an example of how you might SB against Keeper, against URPhid and against MonoB?

[Rico Suave]

My SB changes depending on things in general.  And I'm trying out new things all the time anyway.

Here's a rough outline of what I would take to a tourney today.  SB:
2 Hurkyl's Recall
1 Balance
1 Timetwister
1 Mind Twist
2 Abeyance
3 Seal of Cleansing
3 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Island
1 Abyss

Things I side out from time to time:
-Necropotence
-Duress
-Force of Will
-Rushing River
-Brainstorm

Keeper:
-4 Force of Will
+2 Abeyance
+1 Mind Twist
+1 Balance

Mono-black:
-4 Force of Will
-1 Duress
+1 Abyss
+2 Abeyance
+1 Timetwister
+1 Balance

UrPhid:
-1 Vampiric Tutor
-3 Brainstorm
-1 Rushing River
-1 Tolarian Academy
+1 Island
+3 Blue Elemental Blast (for Blood Moon)
+1 Mind Twist
+1 Balance

That's a rough outline.  Everything needs to be adjusted to the deck though.  If you see Null Rods in mono-black, then by all means forget about Abeyance and board in Seals.  

Other things are hairier.  In general, when in doubt I side out Duress/Force, depending on the match.  I just have to make sure what I side in is better.

[mrieff]

If you were to add balance Main, You'll have an addition way to kill your own Rector against creatureless decks.
Against decks with creatures, Balance main isn't quite dead

[MoreFling]

Actually, I like Diabolic Intent better.

I leave Mystical and Balance in the side to side in against creature decks.

I think Diabolic intent is just that 5th way you need to get rid of the rector, and is a nice tutor to boot, to make sure you go off right then and there.

[suicide_slushy]

I've had no problems killing rector with only 4 cabal therapy an balance md.  I beleive this might have been mentioned before but she typically acts as a moat vs aggro until you can find a cabal therapy.  If I were going to make room for something else in the deck I think I'd add more tutors before another way to kill rector, but as is I don't even have the slots for that.

and BTW Rico, Around the Fur is an amazing album.

[Fishhead]

Quote  In general, when in doubt I side out Duress/Force, depending on the match.  

Interesting; I wouldn't have considered siding out FoW.  (Maybe thats the Keeper player in me speaking though.)  What's the theory on doing this?

Personally, I like to have a way to slam the door shut on the one trick that my opponent topdecks; but I can see the idea of just driving for the goal as fast as possible.

[Rico Suave]

Force of Will seemed odd at first too.  The first thing that made me think of it was trying to keep the blue card count up for FoW.  In sideboarding, the deck oftentimes sides out blue cards for non-blue cards, and that drops the threshold of blue cards to support Force of Will.  So ditching FoW is simply easier.  Additionally, I usually side in a more specific answers against the deck I'm facing, like BEB or Seal, so the inability to stop topdecked solutions isn't as felt.  Finally, some people like to board in things like REB and Defense Grid, so losing the Force of Will is actually a benefit.

Either way, just don't board out Bargain, Rectors, or Therapy and you'll be fine.

As has been mentioned, I'd rather use Mystical Tutor before another way to kill Rector.  It's flexible, so that if you have Therapy already you can grab Time Walk, Ancestral, or Will.  

I've been trying Balance maindeck over either a lone Duress/FoW, but Duress and FoW help in the hardest matches more than Balance does so I'm inclined to keep the maindeck stronger against the tough matches.

And yes, I love Around the Fur.

[guineapigbr]

I have a n00b question, what is the Rushing River good agianst, whats the point?

[Kheoinn]

It stops weird things like Meddling Mage and Ivory Mask.

[suicide_slushy]

Quote (Rico Suave @ June 30 2003,09:50)I've been trying Balance maindeck over either a lone Duress/FoW, but Duress and FoW help in the hardest matches more than Balance does so I'm inclined to keep the maindeck stronger against the tough matches.

I'd cut a brainstorm for balance over Protection.  I've been running this.

//NAME: Sexy Rector
        1 Tolarian Academy
        3 Scrubland
        4 Underground Sea
        4 Polluted Delta
        3 Gemstone Mine
        1 Mox Sapphire
        1 Mox Ruby
        1 Mox Pearl
        1 Mox Jet
        1 Mox Emerald
        1 Black Lotus
        1 Sol Ring
        1 Mana Vault
        4 Dark Ritual
        1 Yawgmoth's Will
        1 Demonic Tutor
        1 Vampiric Tutor
        1 Time Walk
        1 Ancestral Recall
        1 Balance
        3 Brainstorm
        4 Force of Will
        4 Cabal Therapy
        4 Duress
        1 Rushing River
        2 Donate
        3 Illusions of Grandeur
        4 Academy Rector
        1 Necropotence
        1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
SB:  3 Misdirection
SB:  1 Island
SB:  2 Innocent Blood
SB:  1 Abeyance
SB:  3 Seal of Cleansing
SB:  1 Mind Twist
SB:  3 Blue Elemental Blast
SB:  1 The Abyss

I typing don't do a drastic amount of SBing.  Seals are excellent in so many matches that I feel comfortable with 3, but could easily go to 2 if i had anything better.  Misdirections, also, are there in 3 for lack of anything else.  I like the inoocent bloods and am definately going to keep them there for the time being. Really there aren't too many cards I can think of to SB because the deck is so tight.  Typical cards I Side out are:

Time Walk, Vamp, Rushing River, and maybe a Duress or a Ritual depending on the match up.  

I have never thought to side out the FoWs, but I guess I never side REBs vs trix so I never thought about the advantage you brought up of reducing the number of REB targets.  I will test this to see how it works out, but as it is there aren't really too many cards in my SB that are so vital to a matchup that I'd consider cutting the FoWs for.

[David Hernandez]

hey all,

i remember playing a Rector-Bargain deck way back in 2001 and i'm curious if it was the first incarnation or if someone else had it earlier.

the following deck was designed and played by Tony Soto and Joe Chavez of Southern California earlier than February of 2001, and i played it in sanctioned tournament (and submitted a decklist) on March 9th 2001 where i took 2nd place.

they called it "Bargain":

3 Illusions of Grandeur
2 Donate
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Timetwister
1 Time Walk
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Time Spiral
1 Mind Over Matter
1 Stroke of Genius
1 Arcane Denial

4 Academy Rector
1 Disenchant

3 Dark Ritual
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Yawgmoths Bargain
1 Yawgmoths Will
1 Necropotence

1 Regrowth

1 Wheel of Fortune

1 Mirror Universe
1 Claws of Gix
1 Memory Jar

1 Mox Diamond
5 Moxen
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mana Vault
1 Tolarian Academy
4 City of Brass
3 Phyrexian Tower
4 Underground Sea
4 Gemstone Mine
1 Undiscovered Paradise

this is just a historical question, because I cant find any earlier references to this deck and i would like to see them get credit if theirs was the first.

--Dave.

[MolotDET]

Rule #10 - No resurrecting month old topics. Its generally ok to start a new discussion, but lets keep the material fresh here people.

Mo.