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Bastian
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« on: June 26, 2003, 12:05:20 pm » |
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Blue was one of the favourite colors to splash in WW. It isn't the best one now since it won't make WW a more aggressive deck and it makes it more reactive. But now, given the changes that the format has been undergoing with aggro artifact decks, combo, aggro control, I think that splashing blue can be a better answer than red.
The following is made and tested with the July restrictions in mind.
//NAME: The Smurfs v2.5
6 Plains 4 Tundra 4 Flooded Strand 2 Undiscovered Paradise 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Mox Pearl 1 Black Lotus
3 Devout Witness 3 Exalted Angel 4 Meddling Mage 4 Savannah Lions 4 Silver Knight 4 Soltari Priest 4 White Knight
1 Balance 1 Ancestral Recall 1 Time Walk 4 Brainstorm 4 Swords to Plowshares 4 Null Rod
SB: 4 Energy Flux SB: 4 True Believer SB: 4 Seal of Cleansing SB: 3 Reprisal
So, how good is it? This deck was built to adapt WW to the growing trend to play combo decks. Usually aggro scoops to combo, but WW has the tools it needs to fight combo. Witnesses, Meddling Mages and Null Rods maindeck make it harder for combo to go off, and even more when True Believer is sided in.
The deck doesn't sport many mana slots, but so far the mana sources have been enough to play the angels and the witnesses.
I'm not a big fan of playing six third turn drops, but both Devout Witness and Exalted Angel have been proving to be great vs TNT. Exalted Angel is probably the best white creature that there is. Devout Witness is a reusable disenchant able to kill survival and tubbies.
Vs TNT: the deck already has angels and witnesses. If you manage to play either one and start attacking/use its abilites you will have a much fairer chance vs the deck. Meddling Mage naming Survival of the Fittest and Goblin Welder After. Swords to remove the annoying goblin from play, followed by Masticore if necessary. Exalted Angels are soooooooooo good vs TNT. You get a 4/5 flyer on turn 4. (where the TNT opponent can get a 5/3 creature on turn 1… ) but even coming as late as it comes the angel is a near guaranteed life saving lady.
SB changes: Out In 1 Brainstorm 3 Reprisal 1 Balance 1 White Knight
Vs Duct Tape: This is a tough match since they manage to keep you tapped until they lock you up under a smokestack lock and beat you with it. After seeing the decklist I didn’t thought the deck was as good as it turned out to be. Devout Witness is second to Null Rod in this match. Get either as fast as you can and kill any of the locking/stalling artefacts- smokestack and tangle wire and make sure that you plow any goblin from play. Meddling Mage naming Goblin Welder, Smokestack, Tangle Wire.
SB changes: Out In 3 Exalted Angel 4 Energy Flux 1 Brainstorm
Having a 4/5 spirit linked flyer in play won’t be any good if it’s a TAPPED 4/5 spirit linked flyer which can’t attack. You’re better off siding in Energy Flux which can hand over Duct Tape’s player his (or her) ass delivered.
Vs Academy: Playing vs combo isn’t easy at all since it mostly comes to luck and getting something that prevents the opponent from going out before you can stop him. Meddling Mage naming Mind Over Matter, Candelabra of Tawnos...
SB changes: Out In 4 StP 4 True Believer
Vs Rector Trix:
SB changes: Out In 4 StP 4 True Believer
You’d think that I’d need the swords to remove the rectors from play, but you won’t always have them when they hit play, so you’re better off replacing them with the believers, which prevent the trix player from targeting you with Donate. Meddling Mage naming Academy Rector, Donate. Illusions can always be gotten with a rector if necessary so naming Donate is more important.
Vs Keeper: Control matches are usually the most difficult to fight against with WW. The biggest problem vs Keeper is Morphling. They drop it and you’re suddenly on a clock. The only way to beat keeper is to win the damage race, although Meddling naming Morphling can be a good start. Either the mage or the rod will slow down keeper enough. Slowing down since the mage won’t survive long before it gets killed, but as long as it slows down the keeper player enough time to deal some more damage, it will be ok.
Once again Exalted Angel proves how great it is. It’s the only creature able to go against morphling and survive. It flies and makes you able to live longer while going for the damage race. Remember that if a Mana Drain hits an angel that’s being played face down the Mana Drain player gets 0 mana since you were playing a 0cc spell.
SB: Out In 3 Devout Witness 3 Seal of Cleansing
You’d think that you would want Devout Witness in this match, but besides being easier to kill than the seals, the keeper player will probably counter it faster then it will seal of cleansing. Seal is better in this match.
Vs Hulk: I’ve always stood up WW and said it could win just about any match with any deck (even it would take a lot of skill and luck into doing so), even those that nobody believes it can win. Well… beating a tog deck with a WW is more like a leap of faith. I’d rather play vs keeper or TNT or combo rather than fight a tog deck. Since they’ll probably go off before you have even won the damage race you’ll have to try to StP or Meddling Mage the tog which is hard, but not impossible.
SB: Out In 3 Devout Witness 3 Reprisal
Reprisal can kill a berserked tog. So you’ll have to try and hit it after it has been Berserked, which is pretty risky.
Vs Sligh: If you don’t win this match then either you’re pretty dumb or they were very lucky. WW has always been meant to shine vs red and black decks. Between the addition of Silver Knight, the already existing Soltari Priest and Exalted Angel, you already have more than enough creatures go give red headaches.
Vs Suicide Black: Black is a bit different from red, since it’s somewhat better. Not playing with Land Tax means you lose your best anti-LD anti-discard card you have vs suicide Black. White Knights and Angels should be your best creatures for the match, although Silver Knights can stop 2/2 zombies as well. If they’re siding in either kegs or cores you already have StP and Null Rod. True Believer can protect you from targeted discard and Diabolic Edicts, which is good. I’ve been testing and it hasn’t been far better than the mage. Sometimes you’ll wish you had the mage, some others the believer…
SB: Out In 3 Devout Witness 3 Reprisal 4 Meddling Mage 4 True Believer.
Nether Void: Void decks are somewhat similar to the Suicide Black match. They pack the same disruption and creatures as suicide black (well, nearly the same creatures as sui black), and they have a lock card: Nether Void. The first game should be a fairly easy one. Meddling mage naming Nether Void, Hypnotic Specter. White Knights and Angels can deal with just about any creature. If you play a witness before the void hits play you should win. Mishra’s Factories are hard to deal with since you’re not packing strips/wastelands, but you can stop them from using their abilities with Null Rod and disenchant them with the Witness.
SB: Out In 4 Soltari Priest 4 True Believer 3 Devout Witness 4 Seal of Cleansing 1 Brainstorm
In the second game you should see Masticores and kegs. Null Rods should take care of them although you should name Masticore before Nether Void when using Mage. Void is a dangerous card but a rather harmless one if they can’t attack you. Masticore is by far the worse threat a weenie deck can face. The witnesses go out. They cost 2W where the seals cost just 1W. They can also be played before Void hits play and destroy it after.
There have been some posts about a new nether void deck splashing green for Pernicious Deed and Naturalize. I haven’t played vs the deck, but I suppose that if you don’t overextend yourself you can, perhaps, outplay them. Remember than a morphed angel costs 4WW and therefore it takes six mana for the deed to kill it.
Mask: Negators aren’t a problem, as long as you have an answer for them. For those versions packing Hippies just get an angel in play, and if not, plow them. Meddling Mage naming Illusionary Mask. Dreadnoughts can be disenchanted and Null Rods stop the mask.
Vengeur Masqué: I feel that this match should be pointed since this is a solid deck which has been underplayed. Props to Carl Devos for such a fine deck!
The main problem in this match isn’t the Dreadnought. You’re better off playing vs a 12/12 trampler than a Shapeshifter (and I’m not talking about Volrath’s Shapeshifter either). Morphling can be a pain in the ass and win you the game alone so you should try to win the damage race no matter what if it gets dropped in play. Pray for an angel.
The WW has more than enough answers vs the other threats.
Devout Witness vs Null Rod vs Meddling Mage vs Survival of the Fittest Illusionary Mask Survival of the Fittest Illusionary Mask artifact mana Volrath’s Shapeshifter Phyrexian Dreadnought Morphling Illusionary Mask
Meddling Mage is your best card vs Vengeur Masqué. Name Survival of the Fittest first. If you fail to name it before it hits play name Volrath’s Shapeshifter.
Deck Parfait: Parfait can become a nuisance if the game gets too long, so go for their throat before they start pumping out Pegasus tokens.
The second game should be easier after the SB changes.
SB: Out In 4 Null Rod 4 Seal of Cleansing
Getting a Devout Witness in play can be game, if they don’t remove it with StP. If not you always have Seals of Cleansing. The problem here is that they also have Argivian Finds and that means they can pull out their enchantments back from the grave. Not so long ago I used to play Erases in the SB just because of how annoying the parfait match was. Since Parfait matches are unusual I don’t think I have to worry about it that much. Meddling Mage naming Sacred Mesa, Eternal Dragon (note: naming Eternal Dragon doesn’t prevent the opponent from cycling it and getting it back in hand).
Hope you like the deck as much as I have been enjoying it. If I left out any archetype worth mentioning please tell me so although I think I’ve covered just about every major match I could.
Edit: -added the Nether Void and Mask matches. -corrected that tiny little mistake about the academy match.\n\n
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Hyperion
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« Reply #1 on: June 26, 2003, 02:27:16 pm » |
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I have some questions about your deck. Quote Vs Academy: Playing vs combo isn’t easy at all since it mostly comes to luck and getting something that prevents the opponent from going out before you can stop him. Meddling Mage naming Academy, Mind Over Matter, Meddling Mage can only name nonland cards, so that doesn't work right? Questions about the deck itself: Why do you use Undiscovered Paradise over 2 additional fetchlands, for additional shuffling effects to go with Brainstorm? Why do you maindeck Balance, and why is it kept in (post-SB) against every deck but TnT?
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Bastian
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« Reply #2 on: June 26, 2003, 02:53:29 pm » |
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If you take into account Balance is good nearly just about ANY deck that it can play against, except Academy. If you see both my mistakes were about the match I play the least: Academy. I suppose now that I have something to post on those dumb quotes/mistakes I saw somewhere in another forum. Can someone point me to it? 
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Fever
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« Reply #3 on: June 26, 2003, 03:03:56 pm » |
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I really do not understand the Balance at all. When exactly will it be beneficial for you to cast it, after Keeper has killed all your dudes and you are facing a Morphling? I cant think of another scenerio where you would want it, and even then its not amazing.
Also, as mentioned, an additional two fetch lands would be far superior to UP, so i would definetly make that change.
Finally, i think you should play 4 Angels. Its an awesome card, and you dont even need to fear Mana Drain, i dont see why you wouldnt want to draw multiples as it is just game-ending.
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Bastian
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« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2003, 03:23:53 pm » |
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Now for the answers...
Balance is a good reset button if things are turning bad on you. If you suddenly find yourself creatureless it can take out the opponents creatures. It's not as good as it can be in a control deck, but it's not bad either.
UP has been there because I'd rather have a land that actually gives mana. Fetchlands don't give you mana, the paradise does. Fetchlands can get you a tundra at a time, but how much is that worth it if they get destroyed?
Pack them if you will. I'll test two more fetchlands but I'm not keen on it.
The fourth angel: playing four angels seemed a bit overkill because I'm already playing three witnesses. But it might come in the place of Balance.
Oh, and before anyone asks... I play White Knights instead of Orders simply because the extra point of toughness. I rarely find myself pumping the orders with this deck. The extra 1-toughness the knights have can make a difference between a masticore/trike/fire and ice killing a creature or two at once, which makes a difference. At least for me it has been so.
Thanks for the suggestions:)\n\n
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Deletehead
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« Reply #5 on: June 27, 2003, 02:50:00 pm » |
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I think true beleiver should be main in place of Devout Witness since it's good vs. combo and also shuts down edict and duress/therapy. I don't like exalted angel that much either. I'd use Empyrrial Armor in the three slot even though angel isn't entirely hopeless as an option game two vs. Aggro...
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Bastian
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« Reply #6 on: June 29, 2003, 07:28:25 pm » |
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I said it over and over again, and i'll say it once more: empyrial armor isnt as good as it was some time ago. You're spending cards to try to have a fattie in play, because either your creature or the armor are serious candidates to be destroyed/countered and then you're left with anything.
Saying that the angel isnt good is BS!! Its probably the best white creature that ever saw print. Its a 4/5 spiritlinked flyer that can start swinging on turn 4. It's far better than a creature with armor and it can keep you alive and hand you the game.
Believers are not maindeck because you dont always expect burn/discard/combo and since artifact decks have been so popular lately having the witnesses maindeck is a much wiser choice.
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pernicious dude
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« Reply #7 on: June 30, 2003, 12:10:55 pm » |
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re Duct Tape Quote Devout Witness is second to Null Rod in this match. Get either as fast as you can and kill any of the locking/stalling artefacts- smokestack and tangle wire Second to Null Rod? I didn't think the Rod was particularly good against Tape, since it doesn't affect Smokestack or Tangle Wire. True, it'll stop their Time Vault, Trisk, Karn and Masticore if present, but by the time those are killing you you're locked down anyway.
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Bastian
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« Reply #8 on: June 30, 2003, 06:09:48 pm » |
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And hasn't it happened to you to face a trisk or masticore if they don't get their lock as quickly as they should? Good as it can be the deck is not invicible and doesn't always get good draws just as any other deck. Meaning that I've already faced tape players that threw me trisks and cores to stop my creatures just because... tadaaaa... they didn't get the lock out as soon as they wanted to.
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Deletehead
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« Reply #9 on: July 01, 2003, 03:42:36 pm » |
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Angel actually costs 7 mana if you play it in the above fashion but if it works then more power to you. I think it just gives the opponent time they wouldn't have if you'd simply Empyrial Armor a two Drop. I do think Devout Witness is excellent tech though, so it should definitely stay. I'd replace one Witness and the Angels with True Beleiver if I were playing it...
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Sylvester
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« Reply #10 on: July 01, 2003, 04:02:13 pm » |
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??
Put in play on T3, flip over for 4(cmc) on T4, not summon sick since it's the same creature as the one that you had when you entered the turn.
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Bastian
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« Reply #11 on: July 01, 2003, 04:27:17 pm » |
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An armor can be mana drained for 3 mana. An angel can be mana drained for 0 mana.
Killing or having the creature killed while trying to play the armor results in losing two cards. Countering or killing the angel before it morphs costs you one card.
An angel can give you life, which although it is one of the least important resources of the game, the angel can give you enough life to survive and swing the game to your advantage.
An armored creature, while good, won't have the same game swinging effect. The angel flies. Except for protection from red or black other nonflying weenies don't have any kind of evasive ability.
Please convince us how is the angel any less good than an armored creature.
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Deletehead
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« Reply #12 on: July 01, 2003, 04:54:44 pm » |
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I'm just imagining turns 3 & 4 vs. anything w/removal main (like your deck) when you flip your angel and they off it. Spending 2 turns on a relatively small creature that's easily killed doesn't strike me as a very good deal. By the time you hit them with your Angel you could have wiped out half of their life total w/The Armor or cast two or three more spells if they did kill the Enchanted creature in response. Angel is a solid creature, it just doesn't match up against what I would expect to face like morphling or Negator. Also the life gain would only be good vs. Sligh and they'll bolt it 9/10 of you try to play it for it's Morph cost. I'm not saying it sucks just that there are better cards available for this deck (My build uses more blue with Daze) ...
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Matt The Great
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« Reply #13 on: July 01, 2003, 05:39:57 pm » |
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I love Exalted Angel. I have no doubts in my mind that, pound for pound, it is the best white creature ever printed. It's SO much better than anything else against every non-control deck, and isn't bad against those either.
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Deletehead
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« Reply #14 on: July 01, 2003, 06:17:13 pm » |
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Okay, then I'll try it but I still think ya'll are overhyping it a bit. It's basically just an Ernham with echo. WW already owns Aggro anyway and the angel is sub-optimal versus combo and control, maybe it's a good card but if WW doesn't run Armageddon in type one what makes this any better (I'm really curious as I can get them rather easily and love playing WW)???
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