Parfait: streamlining and redundancy

[Anonymous]

There is a post in other vintage forum on why parfait sucks.  The only solid argument I hear is that the deck is slow.  There were no other solid arguments against it.  Klown came to the decks defense strongly and I cannot put in my 2 cents there so I will place it here.

This will not be a Dark Parfait build, this will be an attempt to make a more streamlined Cherry Parfait.

Engine (9)
 
4 Land Tax
3 Scroll Rack
2 Claws of Gix

Crowd Control  (9)

4 Swords to Plowshares
2 Humility
2 Wrath of God
1 Balance

Goodies (11)

4 Orim's Chant
2 Story Circle
3 Seal of Cleansing
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Bloodmoon

Recur (6)

4 Argivian Find
2 Replenish

Eventually Kill Them (2)

2 Sacred Mesa

Mana  (23)

3 Wasteland
1 Stripmine
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Diamond
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Black Lotus
1 Mountain
13 Plains

SB
3 Scald
4 Tormod's Crypt
1 Seal of Cleansing
3 Bloodmoon
2 Replenish
2 Ivory Tower

Ok this is the start

I know that Aura of silence is better in the long run, it is often too slow.  Seal is quicker to cast and easier to recast after argivian finding it.

This is a muc more traditional parfait, but with a little fat trimmed.  

any thoughts? suggestions?

I don't like not having the ivory mask in, but Academy is the only match were I think it would really be required. Its is great against TNT running caps in the board.

[Anonymous]

That's a nice list, but I personally would make some changes.  I would definetly up the Wrath of God/Humility count to at least three on one of them.  Crowd control as you call it is one of parfait's biggest srengths--it is what makes win vs. TNT or Mask, and more of it would be almost necessary in your build.  

Also there is the argument over whether Moat or Humility is better in Parfait, and I would go with the Moat in almost any metagame.  The only reason why not everyone runs Moats is...

1. Expense-Contrary to popular belief, moats ARE hard to aquire.  I got my 2 on eBay for $32 and $35 each, and they are both italian.

2. Morphling-I can't really say anything about these since in the tournaments that I play in there aren't hardly any morphlings at all, so I don't have to worry about this.

Tormod's Crypts are good against many archetypes, and there should be one in the deck.

All three Wastelands are unecessary for parfait because they just basically keep the game stuck with low numbers of lands, replicating the early parts of the game, which parfait can't deal with very well.  They still are very good cards, but I live in mortal fear of drawing two in an opening hand.  

Here is my list:

Engine (7)
4 Land Tax
3 Scroll Rack
1 Zuran Orb

Creature Stall (13)
4 Swords to Plowshares
1 Kirtar's Desire
3 Story Circle
2 Moat
3 Wrath of God

Defense (16)
1 Tormod's Crypt
3 Orim's Chant
2 Aura of Silence
2 Seal of Cleansing
2 Null Broach
1 Balance
1 Enlightened Tutor
1 Blood Moon

Finisher (3)
3 Sacred Mesa

Mana (20)
1 Sol Ring
1 Mountain
1 Strip Mine
1 Wasteland
16 Plains

The sideboard is completely dependent upon the metagame, but almost always has 3 Blood Moons.

I realize that my version is unpowered--I am working on it...

[Anonymous]

Just as a suggestion, but wouldn't Wild Research be an excellant addition to Cherry Parfait?  It gives Parfait tutoring ability,  And even if the enchantment is discarded, you can always Replånish it into play.  I'm not a Parfait player but it makes sense to me.

[Anonymous]

White-Trash, You could run Solitary Confinement over Ivory Mask if you're worried about the 4 mana being too much. Also, I think both of you are running to much anti-aggro. White-Trash, you should probably lose a Wrath, and aboltz, I don't think the Kitar's Desire is neccesary, and you could probably also lose a Wrath or two. Maybe it's just my metagame, but I've never seen Parfait have problems with aggro. Also aboltz, why Null Brooch? Doesn't that kill your Scroll Rack's effectivness? I've never tried it, so I can't speak from first hand experience, but it doesn't look to have synergy with the Rack ability.

[Anonymous]

In my dark parfait I don't even run wastelands and I run 4 seals main.  

I think that 3 wrath, 3 humility, and 3 mesa is too many.  Definately too many mesas.  2 humility has worked fine for most people.  If you think you need that many wraths, why not run 2 main and 2 in the board.  

The story circles are also creature control since they are COPX.  

I my self had trouble dropping the crypt, but I also had a hard time find matches that I really needed it against game one.  Waste, seal, STP, chant these all help you vs dragon, and that is the only uber fast graveyard deck I would worry about.  Humility, story circle, and stp can handle reanimator.  

I really don't think there is any argument about moat.vs humility

to quote klown

Quote I never even bothered buying a real Moat for my deck as Humility is far greater a card. You have to think of it in terms of the philosphy behind Type 1: every single creature in Type 1 needs to do something extraordinary to warrant inclusion in a deck. Whatever the creatures in your opponents deck do, Humility takes it away from them and turns them into Mons's Goblin Raiders that most often cannot even be sacced to Goblin Grenade. Who don't people play with Mons's Goblin Raiders in Type 1? Because they suck. Humility makes all creatures suck. Moat sits there and stalls the ground-pounders until their controller can draw some sort of disenchant effect (most often a creature with an ability ie: Elvish Lyrist) to remove the Moat and continue the assault or your opponent just casts Morphling and flips you off as he leaves to get lunch after pummelling you like a little girl.

Some creatures that still function fine under Moat and are commonly played in Type 1:

Morphling
Gorilla Shaman
Hypnotic Specter
Elvish Lyrist
Druid Lyrist
Serendib Efreet
Anything in TNT

Creatures that function fine under Humility:

Absolutely nothing.

The purpose here is to shut down creatures. Moat shuts down some creatures. Humility shuts down every single card with a power and toughness. Granted you can still be attacked by 1/1s, but for the sake of Pete, you can trade forever with your Mesa tokens. I prefer to trade a 1/1 token for a Morphling, than to have said Morhling kill me.

read the "primer" in the extreme vintage format.  
http://www.themanadrain.com/cgi-bin....;t=2058

like I said, I run Dark Parfait which is a little different.

[Anonymous]

Actually, the only deck that moat is better than humility is white weenie... hopefully you don't have much of a problem with white weenie... if you do, then you should run moats in the board. Just my 2 cents...
 I have been trying to get a good deck together that runs Solitary Confinement, but I can't find a card that lets me draw... If anybody has any idea on a good draw card that I could use, that would be great! Bazaar of Baghdad is the best I could find, and it sucks... Please help, cause I think solitary confinement is awsome... but with a huge drawback... It acts like a Story Circle on steroids mixed with an Ivory Mask, and caosts less to bring out than either of those(story circle makes you pay to use it)!

[j_orlove]

Quote I have been trying to get a good deck together that runs Solitary Confinement, but I can't find a card that lets me draw...

Most people use Squee.  

[Anonymous]

I actually like the idea of solitary confinement.  the problem is you need to have the rack/tax goin or else you cannot draw anymore.  I think a solitary confinement deck would have to be black/white since you would need the extra tutors.  urza_insane may just be onto something.

I'll post later after, but I am working on a solitary confinement deck now.  Here are some of the elements I am trying to work in.  
Solitary Confinement-removes you from the equation, you are immue to almost everything.
Squee-4 so you can keep the confinement going.
Rack and Tax-so you can draw under the confinement
Undiscovered Paradise-synergy with rack and gives you mana you need.
Abyss-creature sweeper extraordinare.
Enlightened Tutor
Demonic Tutor
Vampiric Tutor

oh well, off to work I will post when I get home.

[Anonymous]

If you wanted to go into a different direction with Solitary Confinement, then you could add blue for Sterling Grove... its a tutor AND helps prevent your Confinement from dying! An old idea was anvil (helped with Spirit Cairn) but if you have Confinement out, then it only effects your opponent... what do you think?

thanks

[j_orlove]

Sterling Grove costs WG, not WU.

[Anonymous]

Well building a deck aroung solitary confinement could be done, you might need to change the kill.  Basically you need to stay alive long enough to drop out a solitary confinement with a squee and some way of getting more cards, ie rack.  This is going to look really janky, but this is the refined attempt.  This is an attempt at a mono white version, I think it will be better as G/W with sterling groves, but we'll cross that bridge when we get to it.

Turbo Confinement

Force field (4)
4 Solitary Confinement

Discard Fodder (6)
4 Squee
3 Serra Avatar (also your kill)

Creature Control (9)
2 Cursed Totem
4 STP
1 Balance
2 Ivory Tower (also pumps the avatar)

Reccur (4)
4 Argivian Find

Protect (4)
4 Orim's Chant

Draw me cards (10)
4 Land Tax
4 Scroll Rack
2 Claws of Gix

Find (1)
1 Enlightened Tutor

Mana (21)
7 SolLoMoxen
14 Plains

SB
4 Seal of Cleansing
4 Abeyance
4 Tormod's Crypt
3 Replenish

There you go urza_insane turbo confinement with avatar as a kill.

[Anonymous]

Solitary Confinment is the shiznat.

Sorry, I just had to say that.

Actually, I just wish this were a little more competitive. Man, Solitary Confinment would def be great for Parfait if it wasn't so conditional without Squee.

[Anonymous]

That's the problem with confinement, you have to build the deck around it.  I think something like jaymede tome or maybe even go the exploration/horn of greed route might be better.

4 Solitary Confinement
4 Squee
2 Serra Avatar

4 Sterling Grove
4 Argivian Find
2 Replenish
4 Ivory Tower

4 STP
4 Chant

4 Exploration
4 Horn of Greed

4 Savannah
4 Brushland
4 Undiscovered Paradise
4 City of Brass
4 Ancient Tombs

this is really rough but it has potential.
Unless I am mistaken the city of brass and the ancient tombs should not be a problem since the confinement will prevent their damage.