Call it Bloody Chalice or Chalice Blood, whichever sounds...

[twn_domn]

Call it Bloody Chalice or Chalice Blood, whichever sounds cool.

Idea is simple:
Blood Moon and mox monkey for workshop
Chalice for all the mox user
Disruption for all the blue players like Keeper and rector
Wretch for dragon and rector

Mana:
1 Strip Mine
4 wasteland
8 Swamp
4 Badlands
4 Bloodstained Mire
1 Sol Ring
1 Black Lotus
4 Dark Ritual

1 Demonic Consult
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Necro
1 Yawg. Will
1 Diabolic Edict

3 Nantuko Shade
3 Phyrexian Negator
3 Withered Wretch
2 Gorilla Shaman
2 Hypnotic Specter
3 Blood Moon
4 Chalice of the void
4 Duress
4 Unmask


Need SB help, comment? bash?

[twn_domn]

1 edict@  Mainly for mask.  Sometimes they are just fast, now with lightning greaves.

Creature base@ It's really a meta game call.  If workshop decks aren't that popular and ur area is filled with budget players, then adjust accordingly.  One thing to keep in mind w/ the creature is opponent's chalice.  I saw many games that people set chalice at 3 or 2.  So, might want to diversify the CCM.

No sinkhole, no hymn@ It's too slow.  Really.  If opponent taps his/her workshop, dmg is already done, u sink one turn later is meaningless.  No hymn, but we get unmask.  It's obvious that I am trying to play around chalice for 2, but it also give me the 1st turn disruption if I don't draw duress.  Yeah, 2 for 1 trade is horrible, but that's part of suicide.

4 chalice@  Yes, put 4 in the deck and drop it for 0 first turn (after u put down ur lotus, if u own one).  This deck doesn't use mox, so ur opponent should not neither.

[g0dzillA]

I'd go:

-2 Hypnotic Specter
-4 Unmask
+1 Phyrexian Negator
+1 Nantuko Shade
+4 Hymn to Tourach

The Hyppies are just too slow for the current meta - you need the clock that the Shades and Negators provide. As for Unmask, it's got some synergy with Chalice, but not enough to run it over the one of the best hand destruction spells evar. If you're looking to run more targeted hand destruction, Therapy is probably a better bet than Unmask.

As for Edict, only one seems kinda silly. It won't be consistent enough to help against Mask without running at least 3. I'd run it in the side. Oh, and while we're discussing it, Smother is a better choice these days. Great for Togs, Welders, Dreadnoughts, etc. Edict was good when Morphling was the norm. Nowadays, Superman's nowhere to be seen. Even better than Smother, I'd go with 4 Terminates in the side. It's one of the best bonuses of splashing red in a black deck.

[Methuselahn]

I think the build looks alright.  I like the Unmasks. I've been a huge promoter of them.  If you don't see any Long or Dragon you could keep the hypnotics in.  I really miss Factory + Chalice but Moon + Chalice may work end up working better.  Masticore is looking better and better again.  Contagion is almost a must have for the SB.  Do you have any suggestions for your SB?

[twn_domn]

@unmask
It's really not for Just chalice synergy, rather, it's more to "push" chalice and blood moon through.  I am trying to push the turn 1 duress/unmask then chalice for 0 business.  Hymn can't do that turn 1 but still a strong card, u are somewhat correct.  Also, to push Blood Moon through.  Need 5 mana w/ Hymn.  Only 3 mana w/ unmask.

@edict/smother/terminate
Great thoughts, I should consider.

[Tijnie]

just a small detail, where is lotus petal?? Its speed mana, both colored and your mana base can take it their are enough swamps/fetch in it already.

[twn_domn]

well..., we have to be careful with the 0 casting artifact.  Because this deck really designs to hose mox user, we don't want to put too many in to hose ourselves (once chalice for 0, mox and petal are dead cards).  However, I suppose we could exchange sol ring for lotus petal.  27 mana sources are actually plenty.  28 might be little redundant, but it's small change either way.

[BreathWeapon]

Why in the hell are you using CotV in this deck over Null Rod? CotV only functions as manadenial if you win the coin flip. Null Rod shuts down moxen that are in play, OWNZ Isochron Scepter based Control, and is a very powerful bullet vs; Slavery.dec, Deadbolt.dec, Traditional and Neo-wMUD.dec and even Landstill.

Anyone who is Main Decking CotV over Null Rod come Jan 1st should be smacked. Chalice is at best, a 3x SB inclusion to combat cheap Aggro like Goblins and Stompy.

The only deck that has any justifiable reason to MD CotV is Workshop, and thats about it.

Also, Unmask is ass over Hymn if you have Withered Wretch MD, and Lotus Petal slows you down ... not speeds you up.

The only point of real deliberation in this deck build is whether or not Hypnotic Specter is a better choice than Phyrexian Negator, which is a huge target for Fire/Ice on a Stick. I also don't think MD Shamans are necessary, but that depends on your Workshop matchups.

[twn_domn]

null rod @

1. null rod is slow.  
I don't know about u, but I much rather drop Chalice at turn 1.  Just mull until u have one and drop it 1st turn.  Why is this better than null rod?  Because by the time you wait until u have 2 mana and try to cast it, opponent has counter already.  If opponent goes first, drop mox and cast spells off it, dmg is already done, you are playing catch-up.  By the time you want to cast ur null rod, it might be too late.

2.  null rod doesn't own isochron based control.  
There's this card called Force of Will, in case you never heard of it.  Watch blue players counter your null rod when you finally have 2 mana.

3.  Diversity.  
Null rod doesn't take care of sligh/goblins does it?  Null Rod is dead in many match-ups, should be in the SB. Anyone who is Main Decking Null Rod come Jan 1st should be smacked.

MD shaman @
Yes, every1 uses mana accel. artifact, not just workshop decks.  It can kill the new isochron and even opponent's chalice.

[blue_negator]

without dissecting your deck too much i would take out the unmask for hymms.  Unmask is good in something like mono black masknought because that extra 1-2 mana is absolutely crucial.  And casting mask with land moxen after unmask first turn is so good.  Unless you are afraid of morphling maybe terminate would be better then edict? I haven't played the deck so i dunno how much problem you have getting BR.  As for the null rod vs chalice arguement i think both sides make good points.  Depending on your meta you would pick one over the other.  Neither card is clearly superior to the other imo.

[BreathWeapon]

Your on crack, Null Rod is too slow? You do play with Dark Ritual, right? FoW? I like 2 for 1 trades, don't you? Any card can be stopped by FoW, how is this an argument for CotV and against Null Rod? Did you forget to pack your Duress/Cabal Therapy and even Unmasks? Control can't counter everything and 3 Null Rod is a lot to deal with in the face of Suicides disruption. CotV only stops Moxen if you go first, thats not exactly dependable Manadenial. CotV is also already highly metagamed for, Keeper runs 2 Gorilla Shaman and so does U/r Scepter. It takes 1 to detonate a Chalice and play your Moxen, it takes 5 to get rid of Null Rod.

Chalice only hoses the poor kids playing bad Aggro, it sure does sound like it belongs in the SB to me.

As far as Gorilla Shaman, 2x isn't a bad decision just to bust Chalices ... but thats pretty much all it does for your deck. So, if you don't see a lot of Workshop they probably aren't worth using.

Ofcourse this is all in theory, and it is only my humble opinion, but exactly how many people are MDing Chalices in the absence of Long? Take a look around.\n\n

[rozetta]

One edict for mask. That's hilarious. When playing Keeper with 2 or 3 maindeck swords, plus brainstorms, impulses and tutors, I'm still lucky to see one of those quick enough to answer the dreadnaught clock. Are you planning on mulliganing into it?