Hey, Here is my Newfound Void list for the Post new restr...

[Hunted Wumpus]

Hey, Here is my Newfound Void list for the Post new restrictions Meta. I think void is highly viable now.

Updated As of Dec 3, 2003

Nether Void

7 Swamp
4 Bayou
3 Bloodstained Mire
4 Mishra's Factory
3 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mox Jet
1 Black Lotus
4 Dark Ritual
4 Sinkhole
4 Duress
4 Hymn To Tourach
3 Pernicious Deed
3 Nether Void
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Demonic Consultation
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Necropotence
4 Nantuko Shade
4 Withered Wretch

Sideboard
2 Phyrexian Negator
2 Masticore
3 Chalice of the Void
4 Naturalize
4 Hypnotic Spectre




Still looking for suggestions, any suggestions.

[Arvid]

I should change the creature base like this:

-3 Hypnotic Specter
-1 Mishra's Factory

+2 Phyrexian Negator
+2 Withered Wretch

Hypnotic Specter is a classic creature, I know, but it's a really slow clock as well as the disruption ability is not so important after Void hits play.

Phyrexian Negator is a must, play 4. They're a really fast clock and following one up with a Void often means game over.

Withered Wretch is a solid 2/2 for 2 with an amazing ability that is very useful against loads of decks. I still think you should keep 2 in the sideboard, but add 2 to the maindeck aswell! This way you can tutor for them, too!

[jazzy kat]

So...you tell me you are a void deck, but you only play 4 strips. I don't believe it   . Neo tog plays 5, no-one is paying attention to non-basic land hate, maybe the other one deserves a slot.

[BreathWeapon]

I fully agree that B/G Void will be very strong in the Jan 1st meta.

Now for some harsh criticism and insight.

U/r Scepter decks are going to flood the future meta. Do you want to play Phyrexian Negator in the face of Scepter/Fire? I don't think so. Get rid of him. Get your 4th Nantuko Shade into that deck ASAP before I beat you, its your primary win condition. The secondary creature is debatable, Negator is out and Hypnotic is still too slow ... leaving you with Withered Wretch. 4 Shade, 4 Wretch sounds like gravy come Jan 1.

Spoils Dragon, Spoils Mask and Prison.dec can't be ignored. You want to include 4xPernicious Deed in your build if you can find the room.

Lotus Petal? Mana Denial NOT THAT IMPORTANT?!? If you don't up your Waste count to 4, may Bazaar of Baghdad and Workshop eat your first born child alive! -1 Swamp for a 4th Fetch, thinning your deck by one is not significant ... 8 Green Manasources is.

What is up with that Sideboard? Pack 4 Naturalize, no questions asked ... Best Sideboard Card EVAR. What is Masticore for? This isn't Suicide, you have P.Deed to deal with Aggro. Chalice isn't necessary either, its horrible with P.Deed. Cut it. What is up with all of that creature removal? Cut it. Cards you want; Chains of Mephistophelese, Hypnotic Specter, Naturalize, Metadependant stuff.

A personal rule of thumb, never Sideboard Withered Wretch. Either play him MD or not at all. Why? Planar Void is significantly better vs Dragon. I have lost entire games by using Withered Wretch in my SB over Planar Void because the Wretch was too slow to stop my opponent. Withered Wretch = Lock, Planar Void = Win Now. Tormod's Crypt isn't wise either in Mono.B, Dragon likes to drop Chalice for 0 out of the SB a lot.

Hope that helps.

[colder]

I personally think that Nether Void still has it's roots firmly planted in Suicide.  I believe that you should take out the Nantuko Shades and throw in the remaining Negators and Hippy.  Reasons being:  (1) The Negator isn't as big of an investment as the Shades are, and (2) you want to speed through the first bit of the game playing as many disruption spells as possible.  With a Shade, you're always pumping mana into it that could be better spent on disruption.

Sure, you have to sacrifice permanents if they get hit, but you can always sacrifice them to themselves as 1 permanent, or get rid of one of your own Voids (for whatever reason).  That, or you can pop a Deed in response and maybe take down some of your opponent's permanents as well.

The Hippies are plain old speed and disruption.  They'll never go out of style.  Having 4 just increases your chances of having one on Turn 1, which is something you want.  I suggest that if you're not comfortable putting in 4, then you might not be comfortable with playing this kinda deck yet.

Also, 4 Wastelands are pretty key.  5 LD lands should be in this deck standard.

Don't be afraid of thinning your deck out with that extra Fetchland - it's a good thing with this deck, since the majority of your spells are disruption.  If you can get to them quicker by thinning with Fetchies, do it!

In my deck, I have 3 less swamps to have 1 extra Fetchland, 1 extra Wasteland, and 1 Skeletal Scrying.  I think the Skeletal Scrying can give you a nice boost into more disruption, as this deck can play out VERY fast.  I don't think that the one Necro is enough, so I checked out Skeletal Scrying and found it to be quite nice (though I wonder at times if Yawgmoth's Bargain wouldn't be a better investment).

Hope this helps!

[Hunted Wumpus]

Breathweapon:
Thank you, that is exactly what i needed. You sound like a experianced void player unlike myself who has no tourney experiance with this deck as of yet.

Colder:
I disagree with alot of your comments, but appreciate your imput.

Some General Discussion:

My creature base? so The big debate is over negators. Do they warrent placement? I wasent sure many people say 4 the rest say 0. Our country is based on comprimise so naturally being a good lil american boy i put 2. I was never really happy w/ the choice. I will work in wretch and post a updated list soon. Hippies AHHHHHHH so many choices.

A response to a comment made by Colder. The roots of Void Lay in suicide? Well, yes they run many of the same cards, but they dont play the same. Suicide, i a nut shell, is repeatedly bashing your opponent with large rocks. As i see it, and correct me if im wrong, void wants to play quasi control, with a constant aggro threat, until it can lay void and start the clock. Now if your playing keeper for instance you want to keep the land, and artifact count to a minimum. Constanltly Hymn and duress, aswell as using Void as a preventive. Your backround idea is to attack with creatures and accomplish the only win condition that the deck has.

As for chalice and Masticore, my reason for playing is Gobbo and Standard sligh. ITs ALWAYS THERE, no matter what the meta should look like, it will be there. We have several talented sligh playersi in my meta and myself as well as the others are constantly recruiting new Vintage players, many who start with sligh. Chalice for 1 is much more effective against sligh then Void. Anyone who has played alot of red knows that masticore is craps all over you, then untap's and starts doing it again.

Okay 4 Naturalize done, What about Choke and Edict.

Loook for my updated list soon. I would Appreciate more feedback yall... Thanks.

[Hunted Wumpus]

Thanks Guys, The updated deck is up now. Im still looking for any and all suggestions.

[BreathWeapon]

One thing I am not sure on is Nether Voids interaction with Isochron Scepter. It does force them to pay an additional 3 or counter the spell after Scepter is activated, correct?

I'm not sure how great Masticore is, Gobbo's SB 4 Crash now. Your walking into their SB hate. Ofcourse, they have to know your packing Masticore and Chalice in your SB. Hmm, thats a IRL call.

[Hunted Wumpus]

good point about the anit sligh board. Im not sure about the scepter thing. My guess is yes, since it is a spell on the stack.

[Phele]

As said before, the fouth wasteland is a must. It can be a time walk under void. Also when you dont play the negators main deck, don't include them in the sideboard. You'r just overfilled with creatures in the board. Hypies should stay, because I see them at least sideboard and tend to maindeck, but the negators I would exchange with chains of mephistopheles. They are great. Also remember that the wretches are often too slow and too mana-intensive for dragon. Thinking about additional crypts is not the worst idea. Masticores seem to be an overkill against weenies, but maybe you have such an weenie-filled-metagame as you said, then they can be some kind of usefull.

[colder]

Knowing what I know now about your local meta, I suppose I'd probably have second thoughts about the Negators as well.  I'm still not *entirely* swayed by the argument for Shades though, but I'm still wont to see some good cheap black fatties that work in this deck.  I suppose it's really a toss-up between those 2 creatures.

As for Void and the roots of suicide:  i'm thinking more of the tempo-style.  I agree that Void plays with more thought, but the suicide part is that it's gotta be a fast lunge out the door - disrupt, disrupt, disrupt, then creature and Void.

Truth be told though, I've been running around various forums trying to find advice on Void decks too, so finding this thread is a godsend for me, and I'd like to keep it going!

Regarding the sideboard:  I've wondered about the effectiveness of Seedtime in this deck, since it IS B/G Void after all.  I just worry about it being a wasted spell or not, in the mindset of:  what would you side out to play it?  And exactly how effective would it be?  My guess is: probably a wasted card here.  Any thoughts on that?

I would tend to think that color hosers isn't always the way to go (in any deck) - you're usually looking to find good answers to play in the face of decktypes, which again relies on your meta.  For your local meta, finding color hosers in a B/G Void deck vs. anything red would be tough (red's adjacent to both B & G on the wheel, after all).

That being said (I'll probably be laughed out of the forum now) I would suggest Gloom vs. weenie.  I've made several people cry with that card (yes, lately).  Several people tell me that Void should be good enough, but vs. White Weenie, there ain't no better.  Plus, it's a nice sideboarding option with Void, since you can rely on not being affected by them.

I don't know how much I agree with using Chains of Mephistopheles.  It's a nice card to get discard going, but I'm not sure if it's necessarily effective against keeper or dragon.  I've always imagined Chains as more of a combo enabler or odd Millstone rather than a real threat (and we know what the philosophy against Millstone is).  Sure, it forces your opponent to discard, but they still get to choose, and they still get to draw cards in a pinch that they don't have in their hand already.  Also, dragon is pretty reliant on having cards in the graveyard already, so I don't think that deck would have too many fits over this (plus, dragon's cards come back to the hand.  Ugh).  I suppose it's still a matter of disrupting an opponent, but I think there's gotta be better ways than this.  Maybe someone can clarify just how good these are to me.

I've given a few second looks at Cabal Therapy.  So long as you know what your opponent is playing (hopefully you get that feel in the first game), you should be able to make a good guess on the first hit, and if it's a really nasty hand you can get a few second hits with it too.  I'm really liking this card.  I would suggest siding out Hymns for it, as this would allow you to target cards in their hand rather than just fetch them out randomly.  You still get a 2-hit with it like Hymn, although the flashback cost shouldn't be used too often unless you feel you really have to.

I'll post other thoughts here as they come to me.  Discuss!

[Phele]

Sorry about that, but I think you didn't get, what chains really does. It's not good against Keeper and Dragon? Keeper relies on card advantage, which it can't get with a chains out. Dragon works just that quick with bazaar. With crypt or planar void out, he'll be pretty helpless (but not totally for sure). Other decks build around card drawing like fish or madness (both like keeper and dragon kinda tier one) are also hurt by the chains. So think about it. A mono-black-void just got in Duelmen top 8 with two chains sideboard, which should be one of the most challenging metagames.

To the recent deck-list: Add the fourth wasteland, there's no way around it. Creature-base ist discussable but you could go with that. My suggestion for the sideboard:

1 Pernicious Deed
4 Naturalize
2 Diabolic Edict
2 Contagion
2 Coffin Purge
2 Chains of Mephistopheles
2 Whatever

[Arvid]

Whether I like your MD Creature base or not I think it's a very unwise idea to create your sideboard out of the creatures that was left over. Withered Wretch is a creature that works in the sideboard, since it's got a very special ability, but none of the rest, according to me. I've seen some combo decks playing Negators in the sideboard against control, but I think it's quite farfetched? The sideboard should be made up by different kind of hosers, like cards against card drawing, graveyard, creatures, artifacts, enchantments ....

[eddavatar]

Hunted Wumpus: I hope you kno who i'm. Hyppies in board = nono. Either you maindeck it, or you just don't play it at all. There are NO situation where you want to board hyppie in. The absence of hyppie in ur main makes maining negator more important as you need them to gurantee a 70% win rate against control.

As of the board. It really depends on the meta. Masticore is currently kinda iffy in our meta as there's really no aggro except my GAT and Brokennut's occasional Madness, Mask, and TnT. And are there really any sligh in our meta anymore, after all, me the uber premier sligh miser in SD retired the deck already =) (RIP my scrolls and ur sacrifice in getting me mana drains)
Anti-control cards are better in our meta. You would need dystopia to beat enchantress and Chains would prob the best call against my GAT and the stupid controls lying around our meta. As of the occasional Brokennut Dragon, that means Coffin Purge or Tomod's.

I would construct the board as such:

2 Tomod's crypt
2 Diabolic edict
2 Contagion
2 Dystopia
4 Naturalize
3 Skeletal Scrying/Chains of Mephistopheles

[Haksaw]

Single comment...our local area is sees more WelderMUD and Stax...a smattering of TNT.  They all have a tendency to pack Blood Moon's as anti- Keeper, Hulk Smash, Dragon solutions...as it so happens, it disable's Nethervoid's ability to drop that Sphere of Resistance clearing Pernicious Deed...not to mention you can't use your Naturalizes...solutions?  The local metagame is trying to compensate, but the Void player's are generally frustrated by first turn Spheres preventing Dark Ritual, it's really coming down to the coin flip.  Add a Mox Emerald?  Any help?