[deck] Where have all the belchers gonnnnnnnneeeeeeeeeeeee?

Hi there,

yes that was a paula cole refrence in the title

I remember back when TMD was on the other server, that there was a version of combo that was on an even keel with Long.dec in my mind. I played it plenty of times, and found that it goldfished like a champ, and that i never had a problem consistently going off on turn 2-3.

I read a short, unintersting discussion in the newbie forum just a minute ago, however, i was wondering if maybe i could get some input from you combo masters out there on how this deck looks

That deck, ladies and genital-men, was Combo Belcher

Wwith no further adieu...

heres what ive been playtesting:
CARDS in ITALICS WILL BE DISCUSSED

BREAKING WIND.dec or .mws for kerz

Mana d00ds:

4 Land Grant
3 Taiga
7 SoLo Moxen
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal
1 Chrome Mox
1 Grim Monolith
2 Talisman of Impulse
4 Elvish Spirit Guide
1 Channel
4 Eladamri's Vineyard
4 Seething Song
2 Chromatic Sphere

Disgusting:
4 Goblin Charbelcher
4 Goblin Welder

Searching is Tech:
1 Memory Jar
1 Wheel of Fortune
4 Sylvan Library
3 Grafted Skullcap

Control Elements:
3 Naturalize
2 Artifact Mutation
3 Pyrite Spellbomb

60

Sideboard:

2 Covetous Dragon
1 Naturalize
3 Xantid Swarm
4 Red Elemental Blast
3 Ground Seal
2 Tormod's Crypt

MANA BASE
Youre SOOOOOOOOOOOOOO mana light i can feel it

4 Land Grant and 3 Taiga

Believe it or not, I used to run 2 Taiga. Mathematically, however; i felt that having 7 Chances to see one land in my opening hand is more even odds than if i have 6. I still mull alot, but isnt that what combo decks are supposed to do?

No workshops

I need mana to activate the belchers, additionally theyre not mountains, and i want to hit mountains.

Janky Janky Cards

Talisman of Impulse
Eladamri's Vineyard
Seething Song

Tailsman is better than lanowar elf/BoP because it taps first turn, and nets me red/green mana. I dont like its inclusion, but ive found it to be a necessary evil amidst a horde of anti artifact cards.

Edimarmi's Vineyard has saved my ass against a first turn null rod 4 times in 30 Fish matchups (we'll get to match analysis later). Its also a great catalyst when youre planning on going off turn 2. Set it up and combo away. Of course theres problems, like your opponent being able to take advantage of that mana first, and the fact that it sucks... but that doesnt matter when it works.

Seething Song Its like a red dark ritual, but worse. 3 mana CC stinks, but with trinisphere comin into the meta, im thinking its going to be good in my workshop infested meta.

Chromatic Sphere Nets me a card, and filters my mana, however I’m not sure that I need it at the moment. I used to run 2, which both became lumberjacks, and now they’re back to Spheres because of stoooooopid wastelands and stripmines.

…
...Onward...
…

Goblin Welder against decks like Hulk or any form of blue control, welder gives me the option of welding out a mox, in favor of the belcher. Why hes a controvertial inclusion is because there arent too many "typical" welder targets in the deck. Spellbomb is in there instead of a burn spell for its obvious synergy with welder, outside of that, its moxen, or ideally, a Mana Crypt that gets traded for a belcher.

Sylvan Library Not a very good drawing tool, however slyvan lets me see 2 more cards each turn, and if theyre what i need, i can pay the life to get them. Its a pretty obvious inclusion, however; people may argue the # of them should be lower.

Skullcaps 4 mana is a little heavy for a deck that runs 3 lands, however these are easily cast, and have very few setbacks for a deck that drops its hand so fast. Ideal at around the 3rd turn, if a Charbelcher has already been countered, or if null rod/Welder (slaver) looms on the horizon. Skullcaps can help you find a naturalize or a spellbomb with speed.

boom~!

Pyrite Spellbomb is a newly added card, mostly for its synergy with welder, and its great ability at getting rid of opposing welders. 2 Dmg isnt alot (3 would have been nice, then it could rock CotH's world as well), however; its still been a very nice inclusion. The only matchup where it doesnt shine very well is against soldier tokens, when you wish you could go 2 for 1.

Joel, youre the worst sideboard builder in existence

Yes I know I am... and this sideboard is probably not an exception. Some of the inclusions should seem obvious, others… farfetched I’m sure. If it looked good in my head and has worked out ok in match testing its in there, if not; its been cut. C. Dragon helps out alot against decks that like to smash face and disable artifact abilities (see Null rod/Damping matrix). Living wish has been thought of and may still get a nod as a good maindeck answer, however the speed of this deck might surprise some of the skeptics out there. Its realllllly quite fast.

I’d say that this deck can race with dragon, it just doesn’t seem to pack the 100% punch that dragon does with the kill. I’ve occasionally top decked a taiga (which sucks). I’ve also had problems finding all the mana I want at times.

Ground seal Normally sided in for welders, ground seal allows me some kind of anti-dragon spell. Tormod's crypt helps out a lot as well, especially when tog has a full graveyard and I top deck like a king.

Xantid is my hero however this deck still sucks against keeper... StoP pwns him

Some cards I’ve been thinking about:

Wall of Roots Nets me some much needed mana, and chumps all day…

Wall of Blossoms Nets me a card, and chumps all day as well...

Fire/Ice Has the ability to go 2 for 1 in my Workshop-heavy meta.

Mind’s Eye I don’t think I like it more than skullcap though. (5 mana is a hefty cc)

Blue This deck used to be 3 colors, and blue added a lot. Tinker, H Recall, with the new set I could use the new self Recall, Search, Draw, Twister, Intuition, Returns, Tolarian Academy , etc etc. U/G would be fun to try, but only needing 10 cards with belcher is much better than 20.

Black I also tried a wishing build, with black, Death Wish x2, Burning Wish, and some great search from black. Additionally Dark Ritual added a great mana boost, and Yawgmoth’s Win brought a 2nd win condition in Tendrils of Agony. This deck was not quite symmetrical, and ended up looking pretty bad when it was all done. So its been scrapped for now.

It looks pretty janky, but here’s some match analysis from games I’ve played mostly IRL but some on APPR/MWS.

Keeper:

The Keeper matchup sucks. Especially if the person playing Keeper has any idea at all what they’re doing. StoP owns Welder, Drain Loves to target Belcher. Force of will is there just in case mana drain isn’t. And Pulse is there along with Cunning Wish, just in case you get any bright ideas and think that you’re going to win. The few games I’ve played against Keeper have not been pretty, and because of this Xantid Swarms and REBs are in the Side. Xantids then tend to attract StoP’s and Welders get the blunt end of Fire/Ice, not exactly much better than game 1. Damping Matrix is a card from hell

You might laugh, but I also tested seedtime as a s/b choice against both Hulk and Keeper, However it normally just ended up prolonging the game one more turn, because by that time, you were out of threats/ cards in your hand. I did manage to top deck a welder once against Keeper after a seedtime, and proceed to win the next turn, however most of the draws have been Moxen or something completely non-sexy (ie sylvan)

Blue Bull Shit

BBS is a much better matchup, but why play it??? Well I don’t see a lot of BBS, but some people, for some reason or another, are attached to their blue decks and think that no matter the meta, they can adapt to win. Welder is a house pre sb and the clock from ophidian is great. Early morphlings can spell trouble, but if theyre draining into a morphling, I usually only have 1 counter to get through, which isn’t normally a problem.

Post s/b you’ve got xantid and reb, and they have beb for your welders. Xantid comes out as the difference.

Gay decks

Gay Fish and Gay/r matchups are interesting to say the least. Some people don’t value Null Rod like they should, and those people soon learn why it’s a good card to include in fish. For decks with null rod, the games are normally long, and in the balance is normally a vineyard eating away at my life, compared to me drawing into naturalize. Its an uphill battle, but surprisingly, I’ve won a lot of fish matches that I’ve played. Post S/b there’s all kinds of problems. Like not having welders because they’ve been kindly removed from the playing area by fire or Lavamancers (also a problem game 1 against gay/r). I don’t think that I have playtested this matchup enough because so far its been about 65/35 my advantage pre s/b and even a little bit better post s/b with C. dragon.

Landstill

Sometimes these decks make my eyes bleed, other times they sit there and do nothing. U/w Landstill is a bitch to play against. StoP (like in keeper) is a house, and beats from manlands suck. Not to mention the fact that everything in my deck is a spell, and im in trouble. U/r is just as bad with Lavamancer sitting there picking off welders, while Charbelchers keep getting forced. I even had a guy online daze my belcher and then mana leak it… I had the mana for the daze (esg) but the Leak was too much… Who runs both Daze and Leak??

Dragon Its all about the starting hand, baby. This match up is so much fun to watch. With all the kewl things dragon can do, Ie win… And with the first turn stuff I can occasionally pull off. The games are normally done in 2-3 turns (and about 15 min). Combo vs combo is sooooooo strange to play, and S/bing for this matchup is just as strange. Ground seal can be game on turn 1, however, many dragon players expect it, even though I run welder main to sort of try and make them think I wont run seal.

Games 2 and 3 are once again based on draw, and from the notes I have, my matches against dragon have been 6-8-0. Which is quite a high % of wins number considering how insane that deck is.

Onward still

Workshop decks.

I have had an opportunity to play against a number of different workshop decks. From old-school Legion TNT with black, to slaver, and even Trinisphere Stax. Matchups are most of the time dependant on the first 2 turns once again. As stax can throw out an early wire, and screw my idea for a 2nd turn kill, or if I hold my moxen, they can drop trinisphere and ruin my day. Vineyard is a great card, don’t get me wrong, but against slaver, its like game over for me. They love to use my extra free mana that I’m giving them to start taking my turns for me, and Pentavus is SICK… I don’t know if everyone runs it in Slavery, but they should.

Crypt, Naturalize, and Spellbomb all help, but in short… it always seems to do too little to these giants.

True aggro

R/g beats

R/g is an interesting match up. Some decks run Main Deck mutations due to the ever increasing # of artifact based decks, and those ones are the worst to play against. Combo plays well against aggro though, and beats isn’t really an exception. Post sideboard, most decks have naturalize, R&R and Mutation. In that case, Dragon usually doesn’t help, as they’re able to strip away all your artifacts and normally I’m left with a Vineyard and a couple of high cc cards in hand. (ie Skullcap and Belcher).

Big O

See R/g Beats without the sickness of mutation and R&R. Stompy is still alive. And with an active bazaar, its mainly a race to the finish.

Aggro Control

HULK and Gro

Hulk and grow are completely different matchups altogether. Mostly because around my area, most people who play Gro, play either gro-sligh, or gro-B. Both these decks have tools to deal with the welders, however, in most typical gro match ups I’ve tested against, they have been light on artifact hate, and that’s made a lot of difference. Hulk is a Fun matchup to play again… because of the proactive nature of my deck, most Hulk players drop into control mode, and then are shocked to see a welder come out and weld back in the belcher for the win. Game 2-3 though, theyre normally ready with hate, and with removal. Baiting cards to play counters is key in these matchups.

Much more testing needs to be done, and I’m sure my build is not optimal, and im bound to have made plenty of playing mistakes. Im not really sure this deck is right for the current meta, im merely hoping to start some kind of dicsussion as to why/how it might work (might not work is fine too )

Heck maybe someday I’ll get good at playing magic, and even know how to pilot it…decently

Comments please, I hope I haven’t been the only one looking at this deck, or at least a variant of this deck.