[Deck] Sligh (with blue splashed)

[Androstanolone]

I think the only other card besides ancestral and time walk that I can see splashing blue into sligh for is brainstorm.  With a fetch it is very good, without it is just good.  Sligh wants to get rid of those dead creatures later in the game and brainstorm is a way to change them out for the burn you're hunting for.  I can't see curiosity as being strong enough unless we switched to a deck of all fliers.  Fire/ice is testable as it's a very versatile card, if not always efficient.  AK is right out, twice as expensive as ancestral for far less.  For SB it's eehhhh, I think there's better SB's for tog and kper.  Opt and tef's response are out, imo.  



- androstan

[Rane]

I am not advocating them yet, but I think you all underestimate Cloud of Faeries and Curiosity.  A free 1/1 on the second turn is soooo good in Sligh.  Add to that it's 'unblockable' the whole game through and isn't a bad TD later.  It often does the damage of a Lightning Bolt if not more for 0cc which helps with Scrolling, and combined with Curiosity is just unbelievable.  On that note Curiosity is easily good enough with two creatures.

[Androstanolone]

eh, cloud of faeries is sorta ok, the tempo boost is potentially helpful.  I really disagree with curiosity though, I still contend that the burn base of sligh is fine, and that the creature base is what needs a makeover.  For this, blue is the last color we'd want to splash.  I can't see curiosity or really even brainstorm replacing any of the burn already in sligh.  The only things I can see finding slots are recall and timewalk in blue.  I can't see sligh becoming a better deck because of Cof and curiosity.  



- androstan

[Rane]

This is the deck I have currently been playtesting;

4xMogg Fanatic
4xGrim Lavamancer
4xCloud of Faeries
4xRazorfin Hunter

4xCuriosity
4xBrainstorm
1xAncestral Recall
1xTime Walk

4xLightning Bolt
4xChain Lightning
4xIncinerate
2xFireblast

3xBloodstained Mire
3xWooded Foothills
4xVolcanic Island
1xMox Ruby
1xMox Sapphire
8xMountain

SB
4xNull Rod
4xPyrostatic Pillar
4xRack and Ruin
3xMeekstone

The only bad matchups this has really had were TnT and Combo, which is what sligh does not so great anyways.  It looks a lot slower than it is apeasring as a Tim deck, but I can vouch for its speed.  Whilst it is a bit slower than normal Sligh it can easily function and operate at a high speed whilst laying down more threats.  I do want to fit Cursed Scrolls in an they may go back and replace Curiosity.  For now though this is what I have been testing.  This deck can easily wreck other aggro which was was of Slighs weakest points bar TnT, and it doesn't have such a bad matchup there either.  The added drawing and continual dmg the creatures are able to pull outeven mid game ensures you will always be doing dmg.  Brainstorm is SO good in Sligh.  It has just done so many amazing things already I can't believe people haven't been testing it.  Well I mean in Aggro.  It is so much  more than 'Fireblast now'.  I have shuffled away opening hand landfills and Blasts many a time.  I have changed TD Mountains into Bolts and Pulled Curiosity+some creature up way before their due date.  

I was once unlucky enough to draw a hand with 3 land, Mox Sapphire, Brainstorm, Bolt, Curiosity.  I didn't mulliganing (being the do-not-mulligan person that I am) in hope that I could Brainstorm shuffling away two land.  I went first, dropped Sapphire, Fetch.  Cast Brainstorm with Sapphire, drew into Mox Ruby, CoF, Grim.  Put two land on my library.  Fetch V.I. putting it into play, shuffling away my lands.  Dropped Mox Ruby, CoF, Curiosity, Grim.  Smiled and passed back the turn with only Bolt in hand.  Needless to say I go on from there with insane drawing and so much fuel for my mancer he was dead turn 3 or 4.  This obviously is not going to happen all the time but with this mana curve stuff like this does happen often.  The idea of this deck is that all cards are useful ALL THE TIME, with the only exception being Curiosity because there are so many creatures it works well with it's almost never dead and its gain, so far, seems to far outweigh its loss.

[Androstanolone]

the deck is definitely far less aggressive than R sligh, not a single 2/1 in the creature base.  I can see how this would be beneficial against aggro as you can chump block to gain turns or deal them unblockable damage via razorfin and mancer.  Against control however you have slower clocks, and the loss of price is keenly felt, whilst the loss of scroll would be felt in both matchups I'd think.  This deck could do so much with cursed scroll because of the 8 pinger creatures you have a very good chance of being able to burn fatties without taking card disadvantage.  My old red sligh, if it could do nothing else, it could beat tog and keeper, how does your new version do against the 2 premier control decks, and landstill also.  I'm leaving the testing of U/r sligh to you .  



- androstan

[Fëanor]

There are some good thoughts on matchups for this decklist. But I'm wondering, especially after apprenticing it and reading what Andro sed, is this deck too slow against combo? Like we've sed in the past, we can't focues any of our card choices on a specific archetype, but we should at least look at combo as a whole. Against breakfast, Bridges(not of any real concern), Dragon, Belcher, etc. an aggro deck has to focus on quick punches or an adequate 2nd game SB. What do you think?

Shattering Pulse and/or Pillage just awaken old memories and I suggest SP for maindeck, just because it is useful against every archetype these days. Pillage is too expensive, so I understand if you wouldn't consider it, I just enjoy watching my opponent get color screwed.

5Strip is so often a combo breaker on turn one or two. I know exactly why you don't run them, but if you need combo defense, this is where you can find it.

Peace

[Gaea]

what do you think of this version:

Mana:
4 volcanic island
4 wooded foothills
4 mountain
4 mishra's factory
4 wasteland
1 strip mine
2 moxes
1 lotus
1 sol ring
(25)
Some creatures:
4 gorilla shaman
4 jackal pup
4 mogg fanatic/cloud of fairies/...
3 grim lavamancer
(15)
Burn, baby, burn:
4 lightning bolt
4 chain lightning/incinerate
3 fire/ice
3 stifle
(14)
I'd like to draw:
3 mask of memory
1 ancestral recall
1 time walk
1 mystical tutor
(6)
SIDE:
4 blood moon
3 null rod
4 red elemental blast
2 rack and ruin
2 metagame cards

[/b]

[Rane]

I definatly want to stay away from counters or for that matter anything that is not damage or draw.  The great thing about the 'Tims' are that although they appear slower in control they manage to easily set a quick clock and when Decree hits it hurts NOWHERE near as badly.  Decree is actually like a dead card, (ok it cycles) but really is annoying when they are starting at Timmy's .  This deck also has just such a better macthup against any oth3er creature based decks.  Razorfin Hunter is by far the most controversial at the moment as a 2cc 1/1 is starting to get slower, but with the added Mox and CoF it is a lot easier.  I do want to bring Pups back in over him... further testing will tell.  Brainstorm is almost better than Bolt  :shock: (lol, the irony - the face for disbelief that follows the word 'Bolt' is 'shock').  Anywho draw is godlike in Sligh.  Will continue testing.

[wizmentor]

The next evolution in sligh will occur when someone figures out how to effectively include solomoxen.  When you can play do multiple things on turn 1, it'll be able to do the things other type 1 decks can.  This would mean a shift away from some sligh staples.  combo vs. brute efficiency.

As for the blue splash, I definitely think time walk and ancestral are worth it.

     -superdad

[I@n]

To me it was very clear that ancestral and timewalk were much more powerful then fireblast was so That is why my goblin deck plays them.

Right now though I feel we need to include green in goblins.  Food Chain needs to be seriously examined and I haven't been doing that myself so I would defer that question to others.  I will start testing it very soon though.

I personally like artifact mutation, because I think of it as mana drain for goblins.  Mana Drain allows control to cheat by going on the offensive and defensive all at once, this is exactly what artifact mutation does. You attack and defend at the same moment its brillant.
Just an idea.  Ill see if i can get more information on this though.

[lilmidget]

The next evolution in sligh will occur when someone figures out how to effectively include solomoxen.  When you can play do multiple things on turn 1, it'll be able to do the things other type 1 decks can.  This would mean a shift away from some sligh staples.  combo vs. brute efficiency.

i kno a lot of you are going to hate me for bringing this up again, but the only thing i can think of that will allow you to use the solomoxen would be [card]isochron scepter[/card]. i know many don't like it because of its card disadvantage, but it is one of the few ways sligh can spend the off color moxen and sol ring effectively every turn. wASP has shown that this works in his isosligh deck and has even piloted it to a top 4 spot.

[Rane]

Wasp's deck is not really Sligh though, but more of a lockdown type deck.  There is nothing wrong with this but this thread is about just adding blue to bring draw and superior creatures.  On that note has anyone else tried Brainstorm in Sligh, because GODDAM I LOVE THIS CARD!

On the note of Isochron Scepter it is not to great unless you use a LOT of great 2cc spells.  It would be best in a deck with PoP and Artifact Mutation.  The problem is that decks with these types of cards want to use them as instants for the surprise effects and Scepter just doesn't let you do that.  I think including SoLoMoxen will be great but until some 'better' cards for this in Sligh come out this idea will not be strong enough.

With that What creature base do you guys think works better;

1)
4xPup
4xCadets
4xMogg Fanatic
4xGrim Lavamancer

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

2)
4xPup
4xCadets/Mogg Fantic?
4xCloud of Faeries
4xGrim Lavamancer

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

3)
4xMogg Fanatic
4xGrim Lavamancer
4xRazorfin Hunter
4xCloud of Faeries

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

So give answers like '3B' or something like that.  Testing goes on.

[Androstanolone]

The creature base is quite trixie, as the deck is less aggressive than sligh but still wants to deal damage early fast, it's hard to choose between more utility via Cof and Razorfin hunters (hopefully comboed w/ curiosity) or more aggression with the classic cadets and pups.  I think that Cof and hunters have the ability to improve the aggro matchup, I just don't know how much the control matchup will suffer.  I like that we have 12 creatures to stick curiosity on, but is curiosity a fast enough way to get to what we need to win?  I donno, I'm still having doubts, I wanna see cursed scroll in here so bad because of its synergy with grim, hunter, and all the burn against fat aggros.  I dig the brainstorm/fetch combo, everyone seems to heart brainstorm atm .  The format's so fast that any way to dig through your deck is becoming valuable.  With sligh's redundancy I guess storm would be particularly good.  I just can't help thinking how I'd feel if I storm up 2 weenies and a land when I wanted more burn or a finisher :/.  

Anyway, my vote is for mancers, hunters, pupz, cadets, cursed scrolls, 12x bolt, fireblast, and brainstorm base (of course with ancestral and TW).  No curiosity yet, not sold on it.



- androstan

[Rane]

I haven't exactly sold myself on Curiosity yet but it does keep getting bettter and better.  In all matchups it is just THAT powerful when it hits.  I really do want to put Scrolls in but the deck seems to work better without TD'ing them.  With all the draw I don't really want to get a Scroll over burn.  If Scroll goes in I think it will take out Curiosity, so I believe it's left for those two to fight it out in the pit for the slots.

Brainstorm is usually used by myslef to shuffle away lands or move creatures around for a good draw.  It can also easily protect my hand against early Duress/Hymn/Unmask.  B'Storming my Pillar to the top of my library to prevent it being Duressed is so tech!  My opponents don't like Blue in Sligh .

The creature base is what I think is the hardest to decide on.  Utility vs 2/1's is not an easy contest.  With all the aggro-ish decks coming back I really am finding Pups/Cadets less and less favourable.  Even against control they now have decre to cycle early.  Whether or not I should dump all of them I don't know, but they are definatly up for review.

[Danzig]

Red Savannah Lion is Jackal Pup, no?

[Androstanolone]

not quite, since chump blocking with a R savannah lions to gain you a turn can win you the game via TDing enough burn, while chump blocking with jackal pup will often just lose you the game.

[KboT]

1)
4xPup
4xCadets
4xMogg Fanatic
4xGrim Lavamancer

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

B

2)
4xPup
4xCadets/Mogg Fantic?
4xCloud of Faeries
4xGrim Lavamancer

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

A

3)
4xMogg Fanatic
4xGrim Lavamancer
4xRazorfin Hunter
4xCloud of Faeries

A)With Curiosity
B)Without Curiosity

Without a doubt the best creature base to use with Curiosity.

[Androstanolone]

undoubtedly, obviously the creature base with the most direct/evadable damage is the best to use in conjunction with curiosity.