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Author Topic: [Deck] Politics  (Read 2716 times)
Robert the Swordsman
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RobtheSwordsman
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« on: April 04, 2004, 11:07:15 pm »

Yeah, it's back. Dunno' if that's a good or a bad thing, but we'll see.

When I took the deck apart the last time, I was in a pretty bad frame of mind, and after doing a little more Apprentice testing, I realized that it was still a cool concept. (Well, that and whenever anyone asked what happened to "that deck" and I replied "I took it apart," they were all quite disappointed. Plus, Ben Kowal was hounding me. Happy now?)


//NAME: Politics

//Artifacts (16):
    1 Zuran Orb
    1 Mox Sapphire
    1 Mox Emerald
    1 Mox Pearl
    1 Mox Jet
    1 Black Lotus
    1 Sol Ring
    1 Mana Vault
    3 Winter Orb
    3 Tangle Wire
    2 Ivory Tower

// Blue (14):
    4 Trade Routes
    4 Force of Will
    1 Fact or Fiction
    1 Mystical Tutor
    1 Gush
    1 Ancestral Recall
    1 Time Walk
    1 Timetwister

//White (7):
    4 Land Tax
    1 Swords to Plowshares
    1 Balance
    1 Enlightened Tutor

//Black (3):
    1 Demonic Tutor
    1 Mind Twist
    1 The Abyss

//Green (2):
    1 Gaea's Blessing
    1 Regrowth

//Multi (3):
    2 Iridescent Angel
    1 Vindicate

// Land (15):
    4 Flooded Strand
    4 Plains
    3 Island
    1 Swamp
    1 Forest
    1 Tundra
    1 Tolarian Academy

//Sideboard (15):
    4 Meddling Mage
    3 Tormod's Crypt
    3 Hurkyll's Recall
    2 Swords to Plowshares
    2 Seal of Cleansing
    1 Rule of Law

The deck is basically Land Tax / Trade Routes drawing engine with some artifact lock components for control and other good cards thrown in to top it off.

PLEASE NOTE: This is current list as it stands right now. I am extremely open to changes, including cutting Green and Iridescent for something else, but even as is, it still tends to play pretty well. However, when I last played this deck at tournament level, the deck 'Slaver did not exist and I had a pretty good matchup versus the popular Welder Mud.

Card choices:

Iridescent Angel: Cannot be Swordsed, cannot be Fire / Iced or Bolted and I don't have much of a problem paying the mana cost, though now, with all the artifact fat going around, it may not be the perpetual blocker that it used to be. Exalted Angel could definitely fit in this slot, but would it be too unprotected to be viable? Decree of Justice would work well too, probably, but that'd lower my blue-card count and pitching Iridescent to Force happened once out of every two games. We'll see.

Gush: Awesome with Land Tax AND Trade Routes. Float UU and drop a W'Orb, a Routes, or draw 2 more cards, and then be able to Tax again next turn.

Ivory Tower and Zuran Orb: Good in my metagame and good against aggro, I've found these to be good all-around cards. Also good for tapping with Wires, not to mention the nice Z'Orb / Tax synergy.

Winter Orb and Tangle Wire: Good cards, Winter Orb being my personal favorite, that can help me get an edge against control when dropped early. They also have good synergy with eachother, and Wire usually doesn't hinder me too much.

Swords to Plowshares: I don't like Gorilla Shaman. I don't like it at all. Welder is a problem, too. I would like to up the count of this card in light of 'Slaver to get rid of all the bloody Welders, should I cut Vindicate for it?

Vindicate: The only non-creature permanent removal. So far it's proven highly effective, and also makes it so I don't have to concede to Chalice for two.

Regrowth and Gaea's Blessing: I've always felt that Regrowth is a strong card, but I could be wrong. I feel that 1G to grab back Ancestral or Time Walk is pretty good. Blessing is cool because the library becomes very thin towards the end of the game, so the cards that are shuffled back in have a reasonable chance of showing up again.

Please excuse the sideboard, it's currently a work in progress. The Swords, Mages, and Crypts are definitely keepers, but the others I'm not so sure on (the single Rule of Law is a bit awkward). Any advice on this matter would be great.

Things I've been considering:

When I first started rebuilding the deck (today, hehe), I was trying to cut green and black altogether and just go solid U/W, however while goldfishing in Apprentice, I simply could not get the consistency that I liked do much. Strange indeed.

Cutting green is a possibility, and if I did, I'd probably add in Yawgmoth's Will and I was even considering Skeletal Scrying, however if I were to keep green, I think I might add Crop Rotation; Tolarian Academy is the card that makes the deck go. Well, that and Balance.

Iridescent Angel is getting less and less useful. Other options are Exalted Angel, Decree of Justice, and Goblin Charbelcher. My only problems are...

...Decree and Angel are not blue, therefore cannot be pitched to Force. I swear on my life that I do not exaggerate when I say that I pitched an Angel to Force of Will once every two games, but maybe that was just awkward coincidence or I just think I pitched it that often. The problem with Exalted is that it can be Swordsed all day long, but is this risk take-able? The problem with Charbelcher is that I'll always have a few Fetches floating around that could really mess things up, and the deck already has a real problem with Null Rod; I wouldn't want it to halt my win condition, too.

A cool thing about Decree is that, if I cut black like I was thinking about (see above), I could run Humility with it. I loved it when Keeper ran Humility and Decree, maybe it's something I could try in here as well.

Well, that's about the size of it. If you have any questions or wish some further card explanation, please, feel free to ask.

Thank you very much.
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Smash
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« Reply #1 on: April 04, 2004, 11:15:47 pm »

What does Iridescent Angel do that Morphling cannot do? With only 4 counters, exalted may be hard to protect, but morphling would not be. Not to mention is is abotu 6 million times better. (although both are really slow for the current meta, but you already knew that).
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Bahza
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« Reply #2 on: April 05, 2004, 12:24:38 am »

Damping Matrix seems like a good option to help in your Tog and Slaver match ups. I include two sometimes even three main board in my E.B.A build, depending on the meta game, and it is very effective.

Also I have been test Pristine angel as a sideboard option in heavy aggro environments. So far it has been... decent, but it testes better then Iridescent does. It's ability to double as an attacker and blocker, as well as deal with the large artifact creatures you said you sometimes have problems is definetly a plus. I will add though, exalted angel is by FAR better then pristine angel, jus you expressed concerns about being able to protect it.
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Kowal
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« Reply #3 on: April 05, 2004, 07:48:58 am »

Answering for Rob real quick...

Anything that doesn't pitch to Force of Will is out of the question until more blue cards are added.  It's an unfortunate truth, but it's a truth, nonetheless.  Morphling sounds like it would be optimal in that respect, but the deck really does tap itself out a lot, making him an unreasonable resource drain.  What the deck loses in "oops I win" via suicide morphling, it gains by not getting bitchslapped in the winning position.
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Rico Suave
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« Reply #4 on: April 05, 2004, 08:20:46 am »

If you want more blue cards, you can cut Ivory Tower, since you'll be gaining a lot more life from Exalted Angel.  That'll open up I.Angel, which you can use to fit in Brainstorm.
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Kowal
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« Reply #5 on: April 05, 2004, 08:40:53 am »

That would work, except Exalted has bad synergy with The Abyss.   Sad
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r_x_
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« Reply #6 on: April 05, 2004, 09:37:34 am »

Hey, this looks like bad ABM that has all synergy cards removed. Why no Mystic Enforcers, Meddling Mages on main or Devout Witnesses? The Abyss isn't that good that you couldn't drop it. Even Psychatog is better than I.Angel in this deck...
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Rico Suave
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« Reply #7 on: April 05, 2004, 09:45:08 am »

Oh yea, and you don't need Abyss when you have Exalted Angel either.

Angel really clears up a lot of slots.
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Robert the Swordsman
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« Reply #8 on: April 05, 2004, 10:04:14 pm »

Thanks for the responses.

@Smash: See Kowal's post. Even so, I must admit that I was really unfair when I first played this deck and did very little testing with Morphling before I discredited it so much. I am open to change, and will absolutely consider it.

@Bahza: Damping Matrix is indeed a possibility; a 3cc artifact that'll tap for Wire and does awesome stuff. I'll be keeping it in mind. In regards to Pristine, I don't think that I run enough little spells to be able to give it the protection it'd need. Thanks for the suggestion as it could be a good idea were one to run enough Brainstorms / AKs / Impulses or something, but Exalted would be better as you yourself said.

@Kowal: Thanks.

@Rico Suave: Ivory Tower is pretty solid, though if I did end up running Exalteds, I'd probably cut them for Matrices or something.

@r_x_: I considered Enforcers when I first added green, but at the time I quickly dismissed them as they get totaled by Swords (I have kinda' a paranoia about the card, and if I only run two win conditions and both are succeptable, I have a reason to be). I don't think Mages would really do much for the deck, especially game one, and Devout Witnesses are kinda' big and slow (even though I like the card a ton). The Abyss will probably end up leaving. Psychatog was suggested before, but it's better used in a deck that is made to kill with it.

Again, thanks for responding, and I have some more to say in response to your comments.

I had some spare time in school this morning so I did some brainstorming on possibilities of where to go with the deck. Here they are...

A few generic notes:

In the case of me cutting a color or more, Tundra would probably be dropped in favor of another basic land, probably a Plains as turn-one Land Tax is one of the most important things the deck can do.

Timetwister is probably going. It might stay, but only further testing will tell. If I keep playing green, I'll keep this in, and if I continue to play green, Crop Rotation must be played in this deck. Tolarian is just ridiculous here and it would be awesome to be able to run two (essentially, hehe).

The Abyss is almost definitely leaving; it's just not as strong as it was.

I will almost definitely add Mox Ruby to the decklist.

The maindecked Swords count will be brought up to at least two and most likely three.

Iridescent Angel is almost definitely coming out, as cool as it is. Morphling, Exalted Angel, and Decree of Justice (which is my current top choice) are all possibilities.

Regarding win conditions:

I'm cutting Angels. As cool as they were, they can't really stand up anymore. It's a damned shame to see them go, but go they must. So...

If I were to run Exalted:
I'd cut The Abyss and Ivory Towers. Morphing down for 3 colorless mana is wicked cool, and a toughness of five is very nice. If this were the case, I'd probably add Damping Matrix, as it has no interaction with a single card in the deck, is a great card overall, and it'd replace Ivory Tower as an artifact for Tolarian and something to tap for Tangle Wire.

If I were to run Morphling:
I'd run Morphling. Simple as that.

If I were to run Mystic Enforcer:
I'd be a bit worried to its being wide open to removal like Swords, but the deck builds up a graveyard fast and Enforcer is a beast. Still, this is only a possibility if I stay green.

If I were to run Decree:
This is my current favorite. Cycling Decree for a billion is wicked fun, not to mention effective. If I were to add this, I was also thinking of adding Humility in The Abyss's stead because of it's cool synergy with Decree, but I have a feeling that if I ran more than one of the card like I'd like to do, it'd end up being dead sometimes. Even so, Decree is great on its own and will probably be the one that makes it in. One problem, though, it's not blue.  Crying or Very sad

Cutting both black and green:

Lose: 12 cards (1 Swamp, 1 Forest, 1 Mind Twist, 1 Demonic Tutor, 1 The Abyss, 1 Vindicate, 1 Regrowth, 1 Gaea's Blessing, and I'd cut 'Twister, The Abyss, Tundra and two Angels)

Gain: Definitely Mox Ruby, definitely more Swords to Plowshares, definitely 1 Plains and 1 Island, possibly either two or three Damping Matrix, any of the above  win conditions, maybe (but kinda' doubtfully) Humility, maybe Seal of Cleansing (at least two, probably) to replace Vindicate as my only non-creature permanent removal effect.

Cutting just green:

Lose: 6 cards (Forest, Gaea's Blessing, Regrowth, 'Twister, Tundra, and two Angels)

Gain: Definitely Ruby and another Plains, any of the above cards and some good black stuff like Yawgmoth's Will (the reason I don't run it right now is I'd rather recur stuff slowly and not have it removed from the game so I could use the cards over and over, but I might've been going about it the wrong way) and Skeletal Scrying (which has some awesome potential).

Cutting just black:

Lose: 8 cards (Swamp, Mind Twist, Demonic Tutor, The Abyss, Tundra, 'Twister and the two Angels)

Gain: Definitely Ruby and another Plains, any of the cards in the first section, Mystic Enforcer as a win condition, Naturalize (or maybe Oxidize) as a sideboard option along with a few other green hosers, and DEFINITELY Crop Rotation. This card is just awesome and I'm tempted to keep green solely for this card if for nothing else.

Well, there you go. As you can see, I'm pretty experienced with the deck and am now open to changes. Right now, this is how I see things. If you have any comments, please feel free to state them. Thank you very much.

Thoughts?
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firebird365
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« Reply #9 on: April 05, 2004, 10:26:03 pm »

I personally think you should cut only {G}; when you think about the advantages vs. disadvantages of the colors, Black is incredible. With the extra slots, I think you should add Damping Matrix, as it will completely shut down some decks, without touching yours. It also works well with Decree (your favorite win, apparently?). The green utility cards (like Naturalize) can be replaced; IMO, Black is stronger in this deck.
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Elric
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« Reply #10 on: April 06, 2004, 12:11:08 am »

The deck looks really interesting.  You certainly know a lot more about it than I do, but have you tried brainstorms (Rico’s suggestion) before?  You have lots of shuffle effects and need more blue cards.  I am sure someone has asked you this before, but is there any way that this deck can support Mana Drain?  I can’t think of any way to do it, but it would be nice if it could.

My guess is that this deck would have some trouble against Workshop decks because they can play around Land Tax and Winter Orb/Tangle Wire don’t do much against them.  Also, did you consider Back to Basics at all (main or sideboard)?  I realize that Academy is very important for this deck, but if you cut the green (so no crop rotation) and the Tundra, then Academy is the only land that Back to Basics affects.

It seems like this deck definitely hates Gorilla Shaman.  Damping Matrix shuts off Shaman in addition to many other things, if you choose to run it.  Also, if you somehow added red to the deck, Shaman would probably be a natural inclusion as an answer to chalice, opposing moxen, and welders.  This isn’t to say that you should add red, just that one-way mass artifact kill would work well.  Last, and definitely least, for lots of style points, you can run Fastbond + Zuran Orb + Will and just add Burning Wish for a Tendrils kill.  How I miss the Shining…
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r_x_
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« Reply #11 on: April 06, 2004, 02:52:29 am »

I stil can't see that that deck is better than ABM. ABM has better card drawing engine, better creatures, and better synergy all together. Here are 2 differnd versions about ABM:

Mattdog

Beats: (8)
4 Meddling Mage
2 Mystic Enforcer
2 Devout Witness

Combo: (9)
4 Scroll Rack
4 Land Tax
1 ZOrb

Control: (10)
4 Force of Will
2 Swords To Plow.
R Mind Twist
R Balance
2 Back 2 Basics

Draw: (8)
R Ancestral Recall
R Demonic Tutor
R Regroth
1 Merchant Scroll
R Fact or Fiction
R Yag. Will
2 Cunning Wish

Land: (23)
R Sol Ring
R Lotus
5 Mox|Green|White|Black|Blue|Diamond
5 Plains
3 Islands
3 Gemstones
2 Undiscovered Paradise
2 City of Brass
R Strip Mine

Side:
1 Misdirection
1 Stifle
1 Disenchant
1 Skeletal Scrying
1 Argivian Find
1 Coffin Purge
1 Diabolic Edict
2 Back to Basis
1 Cop: Red
1 ZOrb
1 Mox Monkey
2 Swords To Plow.


NaClhv

5 Plains
3 Islands
4 Gemstone mine
2 Undiscovered paradise
1 City of traitors
1 Library of alexandria
1 Mox pearl
1 Mox sapphire
1 Mox jet
1 Mox emerald
1 Mox diamond
1 Sol ring
1 Black Lotus

4 Land Tax
4 Scroll Rack
2 Whirlpool Warrior
1 Trade Routes
1 Zuran Orb

2 Meddling Mage
1 Devout Witness
1 Gorilla Shaman
1 Psychatog

1 Cunning wish
2 Back to Basics
2 Swords to Plowshares
4 Force of Will
1 Misdirection

1 Demonic tutor
1 Vampiric tutor
1 Mystical tutor
1 Merchant scroll
1 Regrowth
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Balance
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Mnd Twist

60 cards

SB:
3 blood moon
2 swords to plowshares
1 diabolic edict
1 dismantling blow
1 abolish
2 waterfront bouncer
2 meddling mages
1 sylvan library
1 ebony charm
1 misdirection

Land Tax - Scroll Rack is more powerful than Land Tax- Trade Routes. Hell, even Whirlpool Warrior is more effective for one time drawing engine.
 And I can't see how Winter Orb or Tangle Wire are better than Meddling Mage or Back to Basics.

About creatures: Psychatog is amazing when you draw 5+ cards a turn.
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thecapn
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« Reply #12 on: April 06, 2004, 12:04:17 pm »

Quote from: Robert the Swordsman

If this were the case, I'd probably add Damping Matrix, as it has no interaction with a single card in the deck

  Except for Zuran Orb  Rolling Eyes
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« Reply #13 on: April 06, 2004, 02:06:55 pm »

I think I've seen this decklist before. You wouldn't happen to have stairs in your house would you?
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