[Report]GAT takes more New Jersey Power

[Ultima]

Contrary to other normal tournies, at this tourny my whole team managed to go (6 of us).  Of the 6 of us, 4 of us played my build of GAT which is there below.  Of the 4 of us playing GAT, 3 of us made top 8.  I also want to state that all 4 of us would have made it, had the pairings not worked out where 2 of my guys had to play for one of the top 8 spots while Seth and Myself went in with no avail.  

The List

3 Tog
4 Quirion Dryad
3 Mis-D
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
1 Time Walk
1 Yawg Will
1 Pern Deed
1 Fastbond
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Merchant Scroll
1 Gush
2 Cunning Wish
2 Deep Analysis
3 Thirst for Knowledge
4 Brainstorm
1 Lotus
1 Crypt
5 Moxen
4 Delta
4 Sea
4 Tropical
2 Island

SB

1 Berserk
1 Oxidize
1 Naturalize
1 Hurkyl's Recall
1 BEB
1 Deed
1 Smother
1 Coffin Purge
2 Stifle
2 Ground Seal
3 Duress

Round 1 - Monoblack Beatdown

Game1- I say to myself he's playing sui because to the black mana but when he drops a urborg skeleton first turn i'm very relieved.  I get out 3 dryads and just counter stuff then overrun.

Game 2- I get the nut draw and fastbond, gush, recall, yawg will, with dryad in play.  It was over turn 4 I think.

1-0

Round 2- NetherVoid

Game 1- I mis-d his hymm.  I get out a big dryad but he keeps drawing chump blockers.  I die to fucken mana crypt.

Game 2- I counter all his early stuff.  He resolves a null rod thinking its gonna slow me down.  I get out the tog and its over.

Game 3- I get out a drayd and then let his nethervoid resolve knowing he has only 2 land.  I'm low on land as well ut it doesn't matter as Dryad takes it home on beatdown.

2-0

Round 3- 4-color Hulk Smash played by Mith of TMD

Game 1- My hand just explodes with 1st turn Drayd into timewalk.  I topdeck the land i wanted and drayd gets too big, too fast and kills on turn 4-5.

Game 2- Another explosive hand, i duress, he brainstorms to hide stuff, then I play a dryad.  My dryad beats him down to 2 and i play a tog.  He's too short on mana and has nothing in hand to stop both men.

3-0

Round 4- Teammate Bob with GAT

Game 1- Bob gets out the first dryad and we start counterwars.  He beats me when he resolves the first tog and gets the gush.

Game 2- My hand was crazy as i got jet,sea, delta, 2 duress, vamp tutor, trop.  I double duress him turn 1, then vamp in upkeep for recall. I pull the will and topdeck the lotus.  Its over.

Game 3- My hand gets stupid again with first trun dryad into timewalk.  I scroll up recall and drain his men to power out DA's.  That's game.

4-0

Round 5- Food Chain Goblins- Split

At this point, I'm aware that I old just split with the FCG guy and go in as the number 1 seed.  I thought there would be 6 rounds but they cut a round(about 40 people) because of time I think.

Quarter Finals- WelderMud

I 'm well aware of how bad this matchup can be as all GAT players know prison is a nightmare, but alot of testing makes me a bit more confident.  I know that if i try to find the tog and play it liek Hulk, I win.

Game 1- He starts getting out the lock stuff, but i counter some more important stuff and get out a dryad.  Dryad gets big then i drain into deed for a boom at 1 to blow out his welder and shaman. Drayd goes to town.

Game 2- He starts with early wastes and i stifle them.  He gets out the jar but gets a crappy 7.  I find the tog and get him down.  Turn 5 I topdeck gush, and kill on straight tog damage without breaking a sweat.

Semi-Finals- Mith with Hulk Smash

Game 1- I get out the early drayd and beatdown.  Mith tries to draw an answer but doesn't find it.  I counter his yawg will and its over.  

Game 2- My busts open with a dryad into mystical, into timewalk, into recall.  Mith counters the recall.  the dryad beats home as he can't recover from my men and draw spells.  Its over by turn 4.

Finals- Seth with GAT

I'm happy to find out the Seth won his matchs as well.  So we split in the finals and go home. I let Seth choose which Mox and we split it down the middle. One good thing about the rising prices in power is when you cn sell them when you have extra.

Props- All in all it was a fun tounry and i hope more people come next time.  The TO's said they'll start it later and maybe try to find more good prizes.  

My opponents were all good guys and goodsports.

Later.

[Wudil]

Hello Ultima

I'm already working on a version with Thirst for Knowledge/DA for 1 or 2 month around when I saw the drawing engine of Stax or Slavery as we could discard 2 lands or 1 off colour moxen (for example) instead of discarding lock components.

The only things which are different from your version is the Fastbond, I will test it a bit but this can be a good (re) addition to the build in order to make a good use of Dryads + drawers faster.

Then comes the 3 Duress for the 3 MisD but here in Europe (France to be exact), it seems there are way more prison-ish decks where Duress is far better than MisD.

After that, I'm playing Regrowth which is a great card for me, you can re use Ancestral, Time Walk (really good with a BIG Dryad) and all other great drawers without speaking about make your kill come back. Did you test it in an intensive way? Do you think it's a bit slow? Tell me what do you think about it please (the reasons are different from Hulksmach where it can be a REAL Combo deck)

I play the Vamp Tutor in the side in the case the game stall, this doesn't happen that much but it always made me happy to get via a wish.

I'm also playing 1 less Tog than you which really doesn't seem needed as we kill with Dryads for around 80% of the time.

I'd like to share with you my thoughts about the nowadays GaT build. Tell me what do you think about the little differences between both builds (this depending also about our metagame)
Did you also consider playing Echoing Truth? I like it much! It could get the Hurkyl's Recall 's place.

Btw: You made a great job at the tourny, congrats to you and your team!!  

[LizardKING]

Well, nice shot again.   I am really puzzled to see how much Thirst For Knowledge improves the deck's results in tourneys. I have to write you a PM for several questions.

[Grand Inquisitor]

Dryads 4L

Congrats on another high finish.

Regarding the sideboard, it looks pretty good, except for the hurkyl's recall.  With so many other tools against prison, is this really necessary?  Games 2&3 does it stay in the board to be wished for, or is it main?

[urzas child]

where was this tourny? and what was the prize structure?

[Ineffible]

Ultima,
Great job in the tournament. I was one of the organizers, and let me tell you the guy you beat in the quarterfinals (welder/mud) was ticked off. He is working out his deck to face tog as I type this.

@urza's child- 1st was a choice of Mox, 2nd-5th was Forcefield, Abyss, Signed Morphling and a foil Nantucko Shade. The tournament was held in Perth Amboy NJ, and, we're looking to hold another one in a couple months.
Hope more TMD members show up and enjoy themselves.

[thecapn]

I thought there would be 6 rounds but they cut a round(about 40 people) because of time I think.
...
The TO's said they'll start it later and maybe try to find more good prizes.  

  What's up with rounds getting cut?  People aren't going to want to take up type 1 if shit like this keeps happening.  I'm really down with having non-sanctioned tournaments because it allows things like proxies, but if the tournaments are poorly run then it limits how competitive the format can really get.  I've been playing type 1 for less than 6 months and it amazes me how often the tournaments lack structure - inconsistency of judge calls, rounds getting cut, not much attention paid to time, etc.  Perhaps I'm spoiled by my PTQ background, but I'm going to take a $300 prize seriously and I find it ridiculous when people putting on the tournament don't respect that.  I wasn't at the tournament so correct me if the situation was different, but I really think we need to demand higher standards.  

A bit more on topic - have you tested this build much vs. either of the slaver builds?  They're prominent where I play and I was wondering if you had much success, or felt that you had a better chance vs them than 4c Tog for example.  Either way good job on your continued success.

[Ultima]

@ GI

The Hurkyl's I put in over another naturalize.  I do side it in against prison but more than that I put it in against slavery and broodstarrunner.  hurkyl's is great for giving you that one extra turn to kill or stabilize.  I don't side in as much as it may look against prison as i feel that with its absence and slavery's power, prison is inconsequential.  When Slavery is good, prison is bad so i don't worry about it as much.

PS, Steve did you get my last PM about the rimerp..aye  

@ Thecapn

Slavery (workshop) is what I feel to be GAT biggest and worst matchup.  The simple reason being that it is just as fast and has so many bombs (chalice, slaver, welder, etc.)  Right now i am devoting most of my test time to this match-up because I firmly believe that if GAT can reliably beat Slavery, It is the best deck in T1, hands down for the simple reason that there isn't any other deck which it can't wreck right now without alot of difficulty.

@ Wudil

I play mis-d because it is more aggressive and that's how I believe GAT needs to be right now to win. This buld of GAT is more aggro-combo style and can reliably kill around turn 3-4 easily.  With the nut draw, you can kill turn 1-2 , yes its possible as I have done it in both testing and tournies as GI and Hulk3rules can attest to from the double-lotus tourny in Conn.  Duress goes in against control matchs, but mis-d is only dead against workshop.  Because workshop is rare outside of a 10-proxy its not a big deal.  Mis-d is a house against Control, Scrubby aggro, and a more realistic metagame, not the ideal metagame but the realistic one.  

Regrowth i tried and thought it was too weak really.  Outside of recall there wasn't a whole lot i used it for.  I would cut Deed for it though if it I was in a heavy control metagame.  Right now though, you need that reset button just in case, with this metagame.  

Vamp tutor is a must in MD for my build.  It is necassary to use in order to ensure the deck's consistency and help find the combo.  Remember its aggro-combo not control.  Wishing is more sluggish and controlling.

I love the 3rd tog and haven't looked back, its more aggressive and that's what GAT wants.

Echoing truth is good, but I like recall more because its not as conditional.  I know that i would only really use E truth for artifacts which tells me that recall is better.  If i wanted to se e Truth for creatures, i'd use echoing decay instead, enchantments i'd put another naturalize.  Truth is nice for Control slaver but for GAT, you need a bigger sweeper really.

[eddavatar]

Ultima: I believe that playing against slaver is really coming down to playing around it. Aka avoid dropping unnecessary tog like plague and avoid targeted spells.

I'm starting to think that there's a more effective way to deal with slaver other than deed/removal: sideout tog and side in damping matrix. The fact that tog can be a burden while so many of their cards turns into dead weight under the matrix is worth contemplating.

On the whole misdirection issue, all I can say is DH is running misdirection, while I'm not, and he's winning while I'm losing. I'm starting to see the need for misdirection again. Without misD the sui/void match is a lot more 50/50. But with MisD, the match swings in GAT's favor. MisD also helps against a big chunk of the meta AKA Hulk and Control Slaver.

Another thing is, What is the fastbond doing in the deck? And is the extra tutoring needed in the form of BOTH VT AND merchant scroll?

Do you think red does not belong to the deck?

[Mith]

Ultma played a great deck...and he played it like it should be played: AGGRESSIVE.

I played 4c Hulk and breezed through the rounds (Hulk has a MUCH BETTER matchup vs. Non-slaver workshop decks) ending up with 3rd place and an Italian Abyss. My two losses the entire tournament were both to Ultima...and both times I got housed. It was a complete slaughter...Hulk just can't recover from a first turn Dryad that keeps getting bigger. Wishing for answers didn't happen...Ultima was smart about saving his counters for the real threats, as opposed to trying to play control.

Here's what I played:

Tog4L
5 Moxen
1 Lotus
1 Mana Crypt
4 Polluted Delta
4 Underground Sea
3 Tropical Island
2 Volcanic Island
1 Island
1 Library of Alexandria

4 FoW
4 Mana Drain
4 Brainstorm
4 Accumulated Knowledge
2 Intuition
3 Cunning Wish
2 Deep Anal
1 Ancestral
1 Time Walk
1 Gush
1 Merchant Scroll

3 Duress
1 Demnoic Tutor
1 Yawg's Will
1 Mindtwist

1 Gorilla Shaman

1 Pernicious Deed
3 Psychatog

SB:
1 Berserk
1 Fire/Ice
1 Vamp Tutor
1 Blue Elemental Blast
1 Oxidize
1 Aritfact Mutation
1 Rack and Ruin
1 Pernicious Deed
1 Fact or Fiction
2 Coffin Purge
2 Deep Anal
1 Red Elemental Blast
1 Firestorm

Overall, I'm VERY happy with this list...well, the maindeck at least. The board was all solid, but I didn't get a chance to wreck face with a massive Firestorm  

Slaver and GAT are just hard matchups for this deck. As far as altering it to change this, I'm not sure yet...but I'm working on it. If GAT gets a slow start, Hulk wins...but most GAT players are smart enough to mulligan into a fast hand because they know they can't compete with your late-game drawing ability.

Perhaps Perish will have to be added in...that would help vs. the Oshawa matchup (and maybe the Madness matchup, if that deck gets popular enough)

Great tournament overall...VERY friendly organizers (when's the last time YOU had a tournament organizer offer to get you some food while you played?), and the crew playing GAT were all cool guys. Congrats to Ultima for two great finishes with his well-designed deck

[FireFall26]

THis deck is soo bad vs slaver.  Ive tested many games and lost most.  It needs null rod, but with 5 mox its meh.  Also, most of the time I have thirst for knowledge I didn't discard an artifact.  I dont see how this is better than control gat.

[Ultima]

@ eddavatar

I have considered the damping matrix route as Dave is always telling me about it being a house.  I like ground seal because it cantrips and slaver cannot effectively remove it.

Fastbond is a must IMO. Dave doesn't like it but I suspect that's only because he never goes after the combo kill.  This is aggro-combo GAT, period.  You can kill 1,2,3rd turn easily with fastbond.  I play GAT aggressively and there were times when I outraced combo for the win.  Round 1 in Conn, I beat Twister game 2 by going off 2nd turn before him and making the kill.  In testing against Maddragon, i pulled off a turn 1 kill.  While these occurances aren't consistent, they are possible and easy if you look for the combo, which is the reason why you NEED all 4 tutors.  I wouldn't cut any right now for anything else.  

I want to make this point very clear, FASTBOND IS A MUST IN AGGRO-COMBO GAT AND YOU DO NOT NEED FUTURE SIGHT FOR IT TO BE COMBO. Fastbond alone still gives you the combo ability.

Red does give alot to the artifact matchs after boarding , but I don't like the inconsistency it gives as well.  There are too many times when I get first turn mox, dryad, volcanic when that could have been a tropical.  I can't make the sacrifice for bringing down the consistency for a better board

@FireFall

Slaver is a hard match up but not impossible.  There are actually alot times when I race them for the combo and win.  Thirst is not something you just instantly play.  You need to have some forethought before thirsting away.  If you have an extra artifact, keep it for thirst or a DA.  Both me and Dave stand by thirst as being amazing.  

I prefer this style GAT for several reasons.

1. You have a wider variety of roles you can play.
2. You are a hell of alot faster.
3. With the ability of having more roles, you have better matchs.
4. Control GAT doesn't have that much of a better game against workshop, but loses badly to Hulk. I have played Hulk 8 times in the last 3 power tournies and have not lost to it yet.  I only drew with it once on time, 7-0-1 is a better record against Hulk than other GAT since its restriction. (Moreover, that's a better record against Hulk than any other deck in the format.)

[Jakedasnake]

Very nice job Ultima, I love the list.

I guess nobody can argue with the results, 3 of the same build in the top 8. Sweet!

Well, I don't have much to say, as I don't know much about GAT.

Congrats!

[Hi-Val]

Your list is very, very cool. I have tried it out and it is definitely amazing. A question though: you mention second-turn kills. Could you give us a hypothetical when one would happen so I can fully see the cards/choices that go into it? A 2 turn kill is amazing to me, even more with the slower TFK draw engine over AK. I am very interested.

[Ineffible]

I thought there would be 6 rounds but they cut a round(about 40 people) because of time I think.
...
The TO's said they'll start it later and maybe try to find more good prizes.  

@ thecapn
<< What's up with rounds getting cut?  People aren't going to want to take up type 1 if shit like this keeps happening.  >>

Let me clarify as one of the TO's... IT was advertised as a 5 not 6 round tournament. I am grateful to TMD's who came and explained why there should be a 6th round, but no round was cut, and if we have 40 people the next time a 6th round WILL be added. This was also taken VERY seriously. We made sure that for our first tournament we wanted EVERYONE to be happy. Unfortunately every tournament we had ever been to was 5 rounds. I do apologize for this however, it was advertised as a 5 round swiss.

On another note, all we got was positive feedback from the tournament, from the competitors. We will make 2 big changes for next time...
1. Register deck lists (thanks Mith)
2. If we have 40 people (that seems to be the consensus) we will have 6 rounds.
Thanks.

[Grand Inquisitor]

Um, I think if you have 32+ people you should move from 5 to 6 rounds.  isn't log2(attendees) how it works?

@Ultima, its on the way.

[Ultima]

@ Hi-val

Imagine your first 7 cards are

Fastbond, mox ruby, polluted delta, tropical island, ancestral, dryad, something else.

Hands like that most often allow a kill in 1-2 turn.  Keep in mind that the deck must keep giving you cards you need but that's why i put in 4 tutors.  Just goldfish a couple of games and put fastbond in your hand and you'll see how it goes.  Just remember not to hold back and play aggressively.

[Ineffible]

@ Grand Inquisitor, and Ultima
If you guys can give me a definite number to go from 5 to 6 rounds it will be added for the next tournament. I have heard 32 and 40. Please let me know so we can make the appropriate changes for the next time.
Thanks again.

[Rico Suave]

It's 32.

2 people is one round, 4 people is two rounds, 8 is three rounds, 16 is four rounds, 32 is five rounds, etc.  

The mathematical equation for that is a logarithmic function, like Grand Inquisitor described, of log2 (number of people attending) = rounds.  Be sure to round up, so 33 people would round up to 6 rounds.

Imagine your first 7 cards are

Fastbond, mox ruby, polluted delta, tropical island, ancestral, dryad, something else.

Aren't you going to win those games anyway, even without Fastbond?

[xzero]

Fastbond was much more important when Gush was unrestricted.  Now that you can only have one Gush in your deck, Fastbond is definitely not as good.  However, it can still allow for broken plays, even without Gush.  I believe that the acceleration provided by Fastbond is worth the 1 slot it holds.

[Ineffible]

@ rico suave
so in essence it is like the NCAA tournament then? anything more than 32 gets an extra round, over 64 gets another round etc. The change has been noted and will be put into effect for the next tournament.

[Ultima]

@ Rico Suave

Without fastbond, that hand is alot less good.  At best i'd say, its decent, but not broken and fast, which is what we're looking for.

[TimeBeing]

no fact or fiction?

Was it due to thirst being faster? but Fact is the same speed as Deep?

just wondering. Like the build. going to try it out.

[MisterShark]

@Ultima & Mith
Thanks for the coverage and kind words.  Glad you could make it and I hope to see you on the next go-around.

@thecapn

I wasn't at the tournament so correct me if the situation was different, but I really think we need to demand higher standards.

 This was the first go for us and all things considered, it went off pretty well and everyone in attendance enjoyed themselves.

<Edited out needless name-calling.  - Thorme>

[Ultima]

On FOF,

Dave likes FOF in MD but i like DA more because of thirst.  I think FOF is more a SB card and DA synergy with thirst wins over for the spot in the main.

[tehmajickguy]

Congrats on another win, but I do have a couple questions for you.

1. Have the Thirsts really been that much better than AKs? I've done quite a bit of testing with the deck and it seems like the TfK drawback would be detrimental to your gameplan more often than not, unless of course you were able to pitch a mox or a DA. It also seem as though it would be weaker in matches where you need to play the control deck, instead of the beatdown.

2. I noticed that you have said that FoF belongs in the sideboard, but don't run it at all. Has this been any sort of hinderance to you? Normally, FoF would be a gamebreaker, and it seems kind of odd that you would opt not to run such a powerful card.

[Zhindel]

@Ultima - I think I saw the deck in action at Newington.  You were beating a stompy player senseless with hude dryads.  You have a custom make tog life counter, right? If so, I had talked to you about the thirst over AK choice.  You had talked about not trying to fight hulk over them.  Anyways, I've seen mention of a GAT primer floating around a couple threads and wondering what the status might be.

[Rico Suave]

@ Rico Suave

Without fastbond, that hand is alot less good.  At best i'd say, its decent, but not broken and fast, which is what we're looking for.

So is Pernicious Deed broken and fast, like you're looking for?

[Grand Inquisitor]

So is Pernicious Deed broken and fast, like you're looking for?

 

This is still an aggro-control deck.  Just because there's a utility slot doesn't mean the entire rest of the deck isn't geared towards a fast win.

Also, since you asked, yes, Deed pumps tog :lol:

[Ultima]

@ themajickguy

Thirst is much better than AK for the simple reason that it does everything Gush did but slower. There really isn't any card that was as good to GAT as gush but its the best your gonna find at the moment.  As well, running AK means that there is a good chance you won't beat Hulk because they are prepared for the ak mirror and they have the ability to make ak's draw cards now while GAT usually cycles through them which takes a while.   Like I have said before, GAT cannot beat Hulk if it runs AK and this GAT has a undefeated record against Hulk in tournament play thus far.

On FOF , i would run it in the board but there are too many slots that are taken up for artifact matchs which is where GAT is weak.  If i were playing a more controllish environment then it would definitely be in the SB.  GAT already has a real strong game aginst control so i devote more slots to workshop.

@ Zhindel

Yeah, that was me.  The primer is being worked on and i'm currently writing about match up analysis.  It should be done soon i hope as the semester is  almost over.

@ Rico Suave

I am well aware that Deed is not a combo component but that doesn't mean the whole deck has to be that way. The deck is aggro-combo-control, like how it was before.  This metagame makes that Deed necassary and i view it as more of a bomb than a control card because deed can win games alone.  There isn't a whole lot that deed isn't good against.

Like Steve said, it still has the control role as well which doesn't change the fact that the deck can do and wants to do broken things.

@ GI

Thanks for looking out buddy.