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Author Topic: [Deck] Ankh Sligh 2k4  (Read 8350 times)
Arvid
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« on: April 20, 2004, 03:38:12 am »

Please move this thread if it's more suited for the budget forum. It is very obvious that this deck would be improved with Mox Ruby and Black Lotus, but I don't own them. You don't need to comment on this. Anyway, I don't believe the deck would be improved with a blue splash for Ancestral Recall and Time Walk so they're not excluded due to reasons of a certain budget. Feel free to prove me wrong. Anyway, this post regards mono red Ankh Sligh.

Background
I wanted to make a mono red deck that could compete in todays meta, in other words: I would fill it with a lot of hate. There are a couple of card types that springs to mind, 1> non-basic land hat and 2> artefact hate. As for <1> 4 Wasteland and 1 Strip mine are almost mandatory in any deck with 2 or less colors. Price of Progress and Blood Moon are hot cards in todays meta too. Ankh of Mishra fits in well with the mana denial strategy, and can deal colorless damage. As for <2> I chose Damping Matrix. Null Rod would probably have better synergy with the mana denial strategy, although Damping Matrix stops Psychatog, and Hulk/Gro-decks are popular now. Last but not least, there is Pillage, a card that can take care of both lands and artefacts. The card choice might seem quite odd but, although lacking a lot of playtesting, I think it might prove itself worthy of the slots.

I looked a lot at the extended deck Red Deck Wins when coming up with this deck, although I had to take out cards like Grim Lavamancer to be able to play the matrix. The decklist, as for now, is something like a combination of traditional Ankh Sligh and Red Deck Wins. I don't know if it's competitive, but if it's not I hope you can help me to make it!


Decklist

15 Mountain
1 Sol Ring
1 Lotus Petal

4 Wasteland
1 Strip mine

4 Slith Firewalker
4 Jackal Pup
4 Goblin Vandal

4 Lightning Bolt
4 Price of Progress
4 Incinerate
3 Shrapnel Blast

3 Blood Moon

4 Ankh of Mishra
3 Null Rod
1 Black Vise

Sideboard (prototype)
4 Rack and Ruin/Crash?
4 Flaring Pain (Against CoP:Red?)
4 Red Elemental Blast/Scald?
3 X
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Machinus
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« Reply #1 on: April 20, 2004, 03:56:16 am »

This is actually a good base for a red deck. A month or so ago there was some discussion on the necessary disruption elements in a newer sligh/ponza creation. Personally, I think that tangle wire and blood moon are exceptional. Wasteland and pillage are also very good. The only issues I would take with the deck are the kill choices. Bolt, ok. Blast, good. PoP, however, with both wastelands and bloods is not a good choice. Slith is good but 16 sources of red may not be enough. I suggest adding fetchlands. Ankh needs to come down right away, okay no mox or lotus, but put in mana crypt, and consider the two lesser moxen. Going first, turn 1 ankh gives you a lot more damage, especially vs. fetchlands, and will allow you to do make more constructive plays on turn 2. I don't know if it is enough damage, but it is more. If you sped up the manabase, there are some design improvements that I think could be beneficial depending on your metagame. I might put in gorilla shamans. If you kill off the artifact mana, they will have to play into your ankh. You could consider burning wish also.

[EDIT| I just read the part where you said you took out mancers for matrices. Put them back in! You could get away with clamp in a 12 weenie deck. You want to stall and burn the opponent, not overpower them.
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« Reply #2 on: April 20, 2004, 04:10:08 am »

Quote from: Machinus
PoP, however, with both wastelands and bloods is not a good choice.


PoP and Blood Moon don't really interact. A Tolarian Academy under Blood Moon is a nonbasic Mountain and would still be good for 2 PoP damage.

--Sam L-L
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Arvid
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« Reply #3 on: April 20, 2004, 04:36:10 am »

@Machinus

I can't add fetchlands when I'm playing with Ankh. I'll consider Mana Crypt and Chrome Mox for more first turn Sliths/Ankhs, though I don't think Mox Diamond is good enough, especially with quite few lands.

I want to play with Damping Matrix, therefore I can't play Grim Lavamancer nor Gorilla Shaman, as you suggested. I think Damping Matrix is important because Slavery can't take infinite turns and Psychatog is a lame 1/2. In addition to this, Landstill can't disk, Charbelcher can't win, Welder can't weld, Laquatus can't deck you, opposing Grim Lavamancer/Gorilla Shaman/River Boa are weakened... If you think that playing with creatures with activated abilites will have a larger impact please motivate why!
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Gbj
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« Reply #4 on: April 20, 2004, 04:42:00 am »

Look your mana curve, it is filled of casting cost spells of 2 and 3, with only 4 first turn play: jackal pup.

You have a lot of permanent hate, but little source of permanent damage (pup, firewalker, ankh and vise) and little removal (only lightning bolt).

This mean a control player have the time to create card advantage and than find answers for your treats. Look at decklists like Keeper, LandStill, Hulk.

Combo player have the time to win his game before you can disrupt him. Usually combo without disruption win on turn 3 on average, if not faster !
(Dragon, Tendril decks, Charbelcher Combo)

Aggro player can overwhelm you because you lack of answers to deal with his horde. (Madness, Osawa Stompy, FCG, ecc..)

I suggest you to test against this deck and begin to refine your decklist.

I don't wanna give you any card advice because my list is so different from your and you should not understand some choice before a good test.
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Arvid
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« Reply #5 on: April 20, 2004, 04:52:39 am »

@Gbj

Actually, the deck has 9 first turn plays, Jackal Pup, Black Vise and Lightning Bolt (when facing anything other than Sligh/Oshawa Stompy Lightning Bolts aren't removal). Add to this 1 Sol Ring and 1 Lotus Petal (and possibly 1 Mana Crypt and/or 1 Chrome Mox if they'll go in there) and you'll get some potential 2cc first turn drops.

I agree with you that the number of permanent damage are low. I could try to fit 4 Goblin Cadets in there but what should I take out?

The ideal play against control would be to resolve a threat and then follow it up by attacking their mana base. Wasteland would be a key card in the combo matchup aswell. Remember also that Dragon needs really special conditions to be able to pull of a win with an Ankh of Mishra on the table.

Regarding the aggro matchup I think you're right. This deck is heavily meta dependant. Perhaps I should devote 4 sideboard slots for the aggro matchup, Blood Moon and Price of Progress probably aren't so good in this matchup. Any suggestions, Pyrokinesis?
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Toad
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« Reply #6 on: April 20, 2004, 05:24:43 am »

Quote from: Arvid
I want to play with Damping Matrix, therefore I can't play Grim Lavamancer nor Gorilla Shaman, as you suggested. I think Damping Matrix is important because Slavery can't take infinite turns and Psychatog is a lame 1/2. In addition to this, Landstill can't disk, Charbelcher can't win, Welder can't weld, Laquatus can't deck you, opposing Grim Lavamancer/Gorilla Shaman/River Boa are weakened... If you think that playing with creatures with activated abilites will have a larger impact please motivate why!


With Damping Matrix on the board :

* Slavery will use his lovely Moxens to pull out Pentavus or Memnarch, and you have no way to get rid of these considering they can FoW your Pillages and don't care about your Tangle Wires.

* Psychatog will laugh at it, drop Deed, blow it, and win.

* Dragon will go infinite, then start the Caller of the Claw loop.

* Charbelcher can't win, but Charbelcher doesn't care because It won like two turns ago.

Effects on your side of the board :

* You can't run Grim Lavamancer and Gorilla Shaman, which are just two of the three best red creatures in the game. They are just your best weapons. Especially when you have a big bottleneck in your mana curve at the 2cc slot.

Furthermore, with your mana base, Damping Matrix will most of the time be a turn 4 drop. Way too slow.
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Arvid
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« Reply #7 on: April 20, 2004, 07:10:49 am »

@Toad

First of all, aren't you very negative? Negative aspects can be found on every card, every deck. Why play Hulk when opponent can have StP? Or Planar Void? Or Maze of Ith? Why play Dragon when opponent can play a maindecked Gaea's Blessing? Or Stifle? Or Stp? Or Disenchant? Or Naturalize? Hope I made my point; Now I will answer your criticism.

* Slavery has something like 1 Memnarch, 1 Pentavus and 1 Platinum Angel. This is 3 creatures (+1 Tinker) that they have to draw. Meanwhile the Sligh player can keep him on a clock, right? When one of these creatures resolves the Sligh player has 4 Pillage and 3 Shrapnel blast = 7 cards (not counting the possibility of a double bolt or a Slith blocking + a bolt) vs. 4 FoW. Add to this that, unless the Slavery player has a lot of lands/moxen, he needs to have a blue pitch card aswell.

* Psychatog normally plays with 1 maindecked Pernicioud Deed and 1 Demonic tutor and 1 Vampiric tutor. This is 3 cards and the tog player needs to draw into one of them, meanwhile he's on a clock and the Psychatog is an easy victim to any bolt in the deck.

* Dragon might be able to pull off an alternative loop to go around Damping Matrix but as I stated before if an Ankh of Mishra is in play the only way Dragon can win is by playing Ancestral Recall, targeting the opponent, and replying to this by playing a Necromancy - everything on his opponents turn. Anyway I have never seen any Dragon build including CotC in either maindeck or sideboard.

* Charbelcher can win extremly fast, but it can fizzle extremly much too. Nothing much to do about it.


If you think that the mana base can't support Damping Matrix how do you think I should change that? Your criticism isn't very constructive unless you come up with a possible solution.
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Swanky
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« Reply #8 on: April 20, 2004, 07:30:51 am »

Quote from: Arvid
@Toad

First of all, aren't you very negative?


I believe the word you were looking for is "realistic."  Yes, while there are possible contingencies in which any given card is stellar, Toad just offered a few truncated versions of basic, commonly-encountered problems associated with running Damping Matrix.

Find room for more creatures.  It's been observed that your maindeck Damping Matrix more or less prevents you from using Grim Lavamancer and Gorilla Shaman; the value of those two cards far outweighs your Damping Matrices.
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« Reply #9 on: April 20, 2004, 08:28:16 am »

Quote from: Arvid
@Toad

* Slavery has something like 1 Memnarch, 1 Pentavus and 1 Platinum Angel. This is 3 creatures (+1 Tinker) that they have to draw. Meanwhile the Sligh player can keep him on a clock, right? When one of these creatures resolves the Sligh player has 4 Pillage and 3 Shrapnel blast = 7 cards (not counting the possibility of a double bolt or a Slith blocking + a bolt) vs. 4 FoW. Add to this that, unless the Slavery player has a lot of lands/moxen, he needs to have a blue pitch card aswell.

* Psychatog normally plays with 1 maindecked Pernicioud Deed and 1 Demonic tutor and 1 Vampiric tutor. This is 3 cards and the tog player needs to draw into one of them, meanwhile he's on a clock and the Psychatog is an easy victim to any bolt in the deck.


Trust me.  Having played both of these decks, it is no difficulty to find a card you need swiftly, if you know that's the card you need to find.  I've had games with slaver, in particular, where I had several of those options available to me at once.  Psychatog also has plenty of artifact destruction in the board,  so a simple Wish will mean your Matrix goes away.
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« Reply #10 on: April 20, 2004, 08:38:11 am »

I hate to break it to you, but one of the reasons that Ankh Sligh died over a year ago was because it simply could not beat Psychatog.  I'm talking games here, not matches.  Sligh has a slower clock, fewer threats, and worse disruption than Tog does, so it loses on both control and beatdown fronts.
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Gbj
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« Reply #11 on: April 20, 2004, 08:55:19 am »

As i have said just before, try to test against Tog, Slavery and C. and you will see what Toad and other are trying to explain you.

For the reference, only because i have an insane love for sligh, i will submit my list, hope can help you. But i know it is very hard, if not impossible, win a tournament with this deck in today metagame:

3   Grim Lavamancer
3   Slith Firewalker
2              Gorilla Shaman
4   Goblin Vandal
4   Jackal Pup
4   Lightning Bolt
4   Incinerate
3   Shrapnel Blast
4   Tangle Wire
4   Ankh of Mishra
1   Black Vise
1   Lotus petal
1   Sol Ring
1   Chrome Mox
4   Wasteland
1   Strip mine
4   Mishra's Factory
12   Mountain

   Sideborad:
3   Rack and Ruin
4   Pyrostatic Pillar
4   Null Rod
4   Pyrokinesis

More Vandal than Shaman is a total metagame call.
I am testing Tangle Wire, but i think that i will switch to something else, probably Shaman / Null Rod, for much artifact hate. If i main deck Null Rod i can put Tormod's Crypt in side for it.
But believe me, this is a hate deck that even can lose with this configuration against Slaver and Workshop variants.
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Nantuko Rice
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« Reply #12 on: April 20, 2004, 09:16:08 am »

You don't play null rods to stop moxes? Ok, but you also don't run any Gorilla Shamans. I would run Gorilla Shamans if you're not running Null Rod.

Also, in my testing (I have a deck similar to yours). It sucks to have Tangle Wire out but few permamemememements of your own to tap. Gorilla shaman is that extra permament. I also like Null Rod > Damping Matrix because you can play it turn 2 and turn 3 play the wire. Thus more permaments.

Ideally you'll want a Tangle Wire and an untapped firewalker out.
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dicemanx
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« Reply #13 on: April 20, 2004, 09:51:28 am »

I don't understand Tangle Wire in this deck. The deck is light on acceleration and permanents. In my opinion, if you want this deck to be somewhat competitive, you need to load up on either massive hate (Null Rod, and maybe Blood Moon and Gorilla Shamans, or even Miners with stuff like Meltdown or Pulverize in the SB) or big damage cards (4x PoP for starters, then look into Fireblast or Shrapnel Blasts). This deck certainly *can* beat Slaver and control decks like Keeper, and can even give Hulk and Landstill a run for their money. It might not be a consistent tournament performer, but if you have budget limitations its not such a bad choice despite the negative views most players have of this deck.
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« Reply #14 on: April 20, 2004, 10:42:30 am »

In a similar deck, I've found that if you opt not to use Null Rods, Aether Vial is an excellent addition. It let's you keep some hands with only one land, which means a lower landcount can be used in addition to making your creaturs uncounterable as well as sneaking under a Trinisphere or Sphere of Resistance.

And yes, this deck needs Shrapnel Blast and to an extent, Fireblast to make sure those "Whoops, did you just died?"-hands to come up every once in a while.
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Arvid
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« Reply #15 on: April 20, 2004, 10:54:13 am »

For starters I will probably switch from Damping Matrix to Null Rod.

@jpmeyer
Regardless of this, how can the tog matchup be improved? Doesn't REB's and Pyroblasts from the sideboard work?

@Gbj
My decklist differs from yours on not very many points, you play Incinerate instead of Price of Progress and more creatures instead of Matrix/Null Rod and Pillage. I will keep PoP; It's better in this meta, maybe worse in mirror and against budget decks, but you should aim high, right? Regarding Pillage I really like having artefact destruction maindeck, Null Rod and Gorilla Shaman/Goblin Vandal does almost the same thing, but I think Null Rod is better hate. I should try to find something else to take out for 2-4 more creatures, but I really dunno what...

@dicemanx
The ideal play is to follow a Slith up with a Tangle Wire, making the game stall for a few turn making your Slith bigger. Anyway, thanks for some positivism!
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slighguy
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« Reply #16 on: April 20, 2004, 01:23:06 pm »

Hi first let me start out by saying that anhk sligh is a very versitile deck and has no auto losses but unfortunetly has no auto wins either.I have played anhk sligh variations for a long time(around 5 years-until i got power) and one card i would say that your sideboard needs scald as far as the tog matchup gos cause it is an incredible card as far as a permanent damage source & it also provides good mana denial cause they wont wanna play much when they take a point of damage every time they tap an Island.

Scald  [r][1]
Enchantment
When ever an island is tapped for mana its controler take 1 point of damage.
I have found this is a great card againts keeper/mono u/tog.
 Rolling Eyes
I will post my deck list for you to look at and test if you want to.


creatures//
4-jackal pup
4-goblin cadets/mogg fanatics
4-slith firewalker
3-gorrlia shaman
to the dome//
4-lightning bolts
4-chain lightning
4-price of progress
4-cursed scroll
4-anhk of mishra
utility//
1-sol ring
1-mox ruby (lotus petal)
1-black lotus(mox diamond)
1-fork(not needed)
1-black vise  Twisted Evil
land//
4-wasteland
1-strip mine
15-mountains
side board//
4-scald  Twisted Evil
3-rack&ruin
2-slice and dice
2-blood moon
4-null rods
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jCoKn
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« Reply #17 on: April 20, 2004, 01:32:04 pm »

I like your build, slighguy, with a few exceptions:

Cursed Scroll faces too much hate nowadays. Playing artifacts are suidice. Lavamancers, believe it or not, are sometimes harder to get rid of. Plus, if you ever need to, he's a blocker.

Second, find room for Wheel of Fortune. They didn't restrict it for nothing: it's and incredibly powerful card that also deserves a place in a sligh build. And one last thing, Mana Crypt. You want as many 1st turn Ankhs as possible.
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slighguy
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« Reply #18 on: April 20, 2004, 01:37:35 pm »

Quote from: jCoKn
I like your build, slighguy, with a few exceptions:

Cursed Scroll faces too much hate nowadays. Playing artifacts are suidice. Lavamancers, believe it or not, are sometimes harder to get rid of. Plus, if you ever need to, he's a blocker.




I do agree that cursed scroll can be a waste of time to play and that the lavamancer is better in alot os situations but i have learned that you must have atleat 3 scrolls in your MD to have any chance against decks like the big O cause stompy just wrecks sligh.
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« Reply #19 on: April 20, 2004, 01:37:38 pm »

Sligh can beat tog fine if it's not ass. My friend was like 6-2 in games with ankh sligh vs tog at gencon world champs...

What makes sligh bad is control slaver and big beefy aggro which is around.
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« Reply #20 on: April 20, 2004, 02:10:04 pm »

Alright, I feel like I have to chime in...I've been dicking around with a sligh deck for a pretty long time now, and IMO, the only card that even gives it a chance vs. the better control decks is Pyrostatic pillar. Seriously, this card is house. In almost every game it'll do 6+ damage. Here's my version:

4 Pillar
4 Fireblast
4 Chain lighting
4 Bolt
4 Pup
4 Lavamancer
4 Slith
3 Shaman
3 Null Rod
4 Price

5 Strips
1 Lotus
1 Mox
15 Mountain

I don't play ankh cause honestly, it really isn't a threat vs. most good decks. Tog only needs 4 mana to survive, and slavery can just go workshop ----> Crypt -----> Lotus. Lets not even get started on fast combo decks.

Pillar on the other hand is a house. If you look at all those fast decks, they need to cast a shitload of spells to get going. The fact that pillar is an enchantment means that Tog has no way of removing it (seeing as most tog decklists have moved away from naturalize for more artifact hate).

I REALLY want to fit in shrapnel blast, but again, it has poor synergy with null rod and fireblast. You can't put in artifact lands because of null rod, and even if you do, fireblast becomes less consistent. I also want to fit in blistering firecat, as that card is just house! it's ball lightning with none of it's disadvantages.

I'm thinking of cutting down to 3 lavamancers, as unlike fish, getting shit into your GY can be difficult at times. Anyways, the rest of the deck should be self-explanatory.

I TOTALLY agree with Smash (has this ever happened?). Sligh, built right, has no realy problem beating control. However, when pared against randomscrub.dec or aggro, it just loses. I really can't beat TnT, and as soon as slaver gets out a pentavus, I'm done. Also, it has almost NO chance vs. draw 7. The best you can hope for is going first and getting a second turn pillar and them not countering. Vs. Dragon, you stand somewhat of a chance, as you have burn to kill dragon and can side in crypts. Anyways, my $0.02.

-Bob
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Gbj
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« Reply #21 on: April 20, 2004, 02:31:27 pm »

@ Clown of Tresserhorn

If you replace Fireblast with Ankh of Mishra you have a standard Ankh Sligh build and you have improved matchup against Keeper, Landstill, Gay/r and Dragon.

Pillar main is a good choice in the right meta, it can be replaced by Incinerate in an aggro field and can be sided if you play against Tog or Combo.

I think to beat Workshop decks you need at least a pair of Goblin Vandal and Null Rod beetwen main and side, Rack and Ruin can be sweet if you find room for it in side.
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« Reply #22 on: April 20, 2004, 02:43:02 pm »

These are the biggest problems of Ankh Sligh.  In order to make the deck playable, they must be solved one way or another.

1.  The deck's threats aren't threatening enough.

Simply put, Ankh Sligh's threats suck; 2/1's for one mana and burn spells just don't cut it anymore.  Your creatures and burn aren't big or fast enough to be able to compete with other aggro or aggro-control, and you don't deal enough damage quickly enough to have a game against Psychatog decks and whatnot.  Burn spells are significantly less effective than they once were, since blockers tend to be too big for them and counters are probably more common than ever.


2.  The deck lacks disruption, speed, and flexibility.  

Sligh decks, by their nature, are too focused on reducing the opponent's life to zero as quickly as possible.  This strategy simply does not work anymore; this is especially true in Sligh, since its clocks are far too slow and its disruption almost solely centered on the opponent's mana base.  


Let's look at two decks that do work, and why.

Food Chain Goblins: It has the potential for a combo win on turn two or three, giving it the ability to race combo and aggro or win before a control deck sets up.  Without the combo, it is still a very fast aggro deck.  

UG Madness: Force of Will, excellent card drawing, and significantly stronger threats.  'Nuff said.
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Machinus
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« Reply #23 on: April 20, 2004, 03:25:39 pm »

The reason I posted was to point out that since sligh is weak on both disruption and threat bases, Arvid has started with a good disruption base. Like I said, shamans would really improve this aspect of the deck. The sad truth is that red just doesn't HAVE any really good threats. The strength of sligh comes from its swarm approach, attacking life totals with burn, artifacts, creatures, and lands. Focus on streamlining your disruption core first, and then concentrate on how to kill. You have to decide if you want to build the deck around ankh first, though. If you include ankh, you must give priority to mana denial. This deck has to win quickly - permanents that "shut down" the opponents deck are not useful because sligh is supposed to win before the other deck even when they are allowed to play their game. It was productive of you to mention that you are trying to construct this deck without power, but unfortunately speed is the only good weapon sligh has.
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« Reply #24 on: April 20, 2004, 03:38:44 pm »

I just wanted to know what peoples thoughts on slice and dice as a sideboard card is cause i thinbk it helps in the keeper matchup but everyone dissagrees with me.

Slice and Dice cycles to kill all the soldier tokens and gives you a few turns to kill not to mention that you get to draw a card when killing all those ugly lil soldiers.
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« Reply #25 on: April 20, 2004, 03:39:40 pm »

How do you think this would do?

-3 Damping Matrix
+3 Null Rod

-1 Pillage
-1 Tangle Wire
+2 Gorilla Shaman

-1 Mountain
+1 Chrome Mox

-1 what?
+1 Mana Crypt
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« Reply #26 on: April 20, 2004, 04:16:50 pm »

Quote from: Machinus
speed is the only good weapon sligh has.


It doesn't even have speed.  


Arvid: those changes would more or less be for the better.  However, the rest of your deck seems to need work.  Blood Moon and Tangle Wire are both far too slow to be worthwhile; Blood Moon is severely weakened by the presence of fetchlands, and Tangle Wire is simply not worthwhile when you can't play it until turn three.  Shrapnel Blast is probably better off being a better burn spell, such as Incinerate or Chain Lightning.  

Overall, however, I really don't see much hope for this deck.  As has been stated multiple times, it just has terrible matchups against too many prominent decks.  Other than its five strips, it can do little more than sit there and watch the opponent be broken, and has very little brokenness itself.  A deck simply cannot afford this.  Other decks are significantly faster (FCG) and/or much more flexible (Ug Madness).
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Clown of Tresserhorn
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« Reply #27 on: April 20, 2004, 04:34:51 pm »

Ok people, ankh of mishra is now a dead card. seriously. It has been replaced by Pyrostatic pillar. The only reason it was good was because GAT + FeverMask + Keeper were good. GAT and Fevermask ran fetchs like mad or used fastbond. Keeper NEEDS lands to live. for those reasons, Ankh was house. Now, all decks are fast and don't necessarily need like 10 lands to win. Instead, most of the top decks need to cast a boatload of spells to stabilize/go off. For this reason, Pillar is now much better than ankh. first turn pup, second turn pillar is house. The only reason I can see running ankh is if you see a SHITLOAD of dragon. And seeing as how dragon isn't nearly as popular anymore, ankh, in my eyes, has fallen out of flavor.

Also, Null rod is now a must. Damping matrix really blows in sligh cause of the mana base, and it doesn't do shit vs. moxes (although you still have shamans). Honestly, sligh in my eyes has become a bad stacker deck full of hate.

To address sligh's problems: It can't do shit vs. aggro. seriously. It's almost as bad as trying to tweak astral slide to beat MWC in type 2. Sligh can't afford to run big creatures because of it's manabase, and it's already running the most efficient burn spells. Also, take note that most competitive aggro decks have some sort of card drawing engine (O Stompy ----> Bazaar, TnT---->Survival, U/G Madness ----> Brainstorm, FCG----->Ringleader). Sligh has didley shit. If sligh can't kill an opponent before it goes into topdeck mode, chances are, it lost.

It's really sad. Sligh was the first competitive deck I built and piloted to a T8 finish. But in today's metagame, it just isn't good enough. Just like there aren't many reasons to run keeper over tog, there is almost no reason to run ankh sligh over FCG.
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« Reply #28 on: April 20, 2004, 05:22:32 pm »

Clown of Tresserhorn hit the nail right on the head.  Ankh Sligh was decent "back in the day" (Has it even been long enough ago to validate calling it "the day?") due to the proliferation of fetchlands.  Fetchlands, while still present, are not as prevalent as they once were.  As such, you aren't guaranteed a 5-point hit whenever someone lays a land.  That was the source of Ankh Sligh's power; it was a ultimately an "environment deck" ("Environment" essentially meaning "meta-metagame."), and the environment has since changed.

I feel as though Pyrostatic Pillar - while an excellent effect - is too asymmetric to your disadvantage.  With the emergence of decks like Slaver, Big O, Madness (To an extent), 7-10 Split, and Deck-Using-Workshop X, not all opponents will be nabbed by the Pillar.

[card]Spellshock[/card], though its casting cost of 3 might elicit some nay-sayers, has potential.  Almost all of your spells are under 3, and as such you'll face Pillar damage regardless, whereas your opponent has the potential to have spells that are allowed on the proverbial roller-coaster by exceeding Pillar's height cut-off.  

Currently, the problem lies in the casting cost.  It's all-too-possible to not reach 3 mana in game, considering your strip effects and possibly Barbarian Rings.  I'm not attempting a mass proselytization or anything- it's merely food for thought.

Pillage is very iffy.  Having a versatile maindeck removal card is a definite boon, but it faces the same casting cost stigma as Spellshock (An even greater onus, given its greater dependency on red.).  I won't entirely shoot down your idea, but it's something to keep in mind.

I probably wouldn't run 4 Fireblasts; you never want to see one in your opening hand.  In the past, I've run 2-3 and have been quite happy in doing so.

My proposed list:

Sw-Ankh-y Sligh v0.1a

4 Grim Lavamancers
4 Jackal Pups
4 Goblin Cadets
3 Slith Firewalkers
3 Goblin Vandals

4 Lightning Bolts
4 Chain Lightnings
4 Pyrostatic Pillar/Spellshock *
3 Null Rod
2 Fireblast
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Black Vise

1 Mox Ruby ***
1 Strip Mine
4 Wastelands
17 Mountains

If the feeling so captures you, removing the Fireblasts, Wheel, and Vise for 4 Prices of Progress would be fine; either permutation will not disappoint.

*This would be an infamous "Metagame Call." (TM)

***Observe, as before your very eyes it becomes a basic Mountain when in the hands of a Budget player/Someone who doesn't own a sharpie!

Edit:  I removed the savage Barbarian Ring-Grim Lavamancer combo because it was too good.  Tech!
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« Reply #29 on: April 21, 2004, 02:17:48 am »

Everyone, I have already swapped the Damping Matrices for Null Rods, no need to discuss this anymore!

Furthermore, I'm going to playtest the following configuration later today/tomorrow:

-4 Pillage
-4 Tangle Wire
+4 Goblin Vandal
+4 Incinerate

This changes will make the number of creatures higher, the number of removal aswell as direct damage higher, and lower the overall CC. I felt that Tangle Wire are very reliant on other cards, if you don't have a creature out they're almost dead cards. Pillage, while versatile, costs 3, are sorceries and can also be more or less dead cards in some matchups. Any comments?

EDIT: I play Incinerate over Chain Lightning because this is better against Chalice of the Void and Chain Lightning has poor synergy with Blood Moon.

Regarding Ankh of Mishra, I think they still are stabile. Someone mentioned that Blood Moon not is a bomb 'cause of fetchlands that can fetch basiclands. This is 5 damage. Furthermore, if there are so few fetchlands in the environment as you other people say, then the chances that they draw into non-basics are higher, meaning Wastelands and Blood Moon are more disruptive and Price of Progress are better. I don't know which of you that are right (probably you don't either 'cause you don't know my meta anyway), either way the opponent will come run into some problems, whether it is damage or mana disruption.
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