Rectal Plunge- the Pain Returns

[TheFram]

It seems to me that Plunge Into Darkness is, um... somewhat synergystic with Rector Combo.

This is a list that I am working with at the moment. It is Rector/Tendrils
adapted to fit plunge as a tutor/rector killer. It's obviously not a major advancement, but it does give the deck +3 rector killers and +3 tutors which will make it both more consistant and somewhat faster (as I can tell from some goldfishing).

//NAME: Rectal/Plunge
//Mana
        4 Dark Ritual
        1 Tolarian Academy
        3 Scrubland
        4 Underground Sea
        1 Tundra
        4 Flooded Strand
        1 Mana Vault
        1 Sol Ring
        1 Mana Crypt
        1 Black Lotus
        1 Mox Sapphire
        1 Mox Ruby
        1 Lotus Petal
        1 Mox Pearl
        1 Mox Emerald
        1 Mox Jet

// Win Target Game
        2 Tendrils of Agony

//Draw/Broken
        1 Ancestral Recall
        1 Tinker
        1 Memory Jar
        1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
        1 Necropotence
        1 Windfall
        1 Timetwister
        1 Yawgmoth's Will
        1 Vampiric Tutor
        1 Demonic Tutor
        1 Mystical Tutor
        1 Mind's Desire
        4 Brainstorm

// Hand Hate/Rector Kill/ Search
        4 Duress
        3 Plunge into Darkness
        4 Academy Rector
        4 Cabal Therapy

As for a sideboard, I haven't really tried anything yet.

It seems to me that (post 5d) Rector combo is in a position to advance itself in the meta, since graveyard hate is minimal and only Germbus is running plows. Plunge into Darkness appears to be an excellent inclusion at face value. Any ideas/comments/criticisms?

-TheFram


Edit: Current Test Builds

Build 1, Tendrils:
//NAME: Rectal/Plunge - Tendrils
//Mana
        4 Dark Ritual
        1 Tolarian Academy
        3 Scrubland
        4 Underground Sea
        1 Tundra
        4 Flooded Strand
        1 Mana Vault
        1 Sol Ring
        1 Mana Crypt
        1 Black Lotus
        1 Mox Sapphire
        1 Mox Ruby
        1 Lotus Petal
        1 Mox Pearl
        1 Mox Jet
        1 Mox Emerald

// Win Target Game
        2 Tendrils of Agony

//Draw/Broken
        1 Ancestral Recall
        1 Tinker
        1 Memory Jar
        1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
        1 Necropotence
        1 Windfall
        1 Timetwister
        1 Yawgmoth's Will
        1 Vampiric Tutor
        1 Demonic Tutor
        1 Mind's Desire
        1 Mystical Tutor
        4 Brainstorm

// Hand Hate/Rector Kill/ Search/ Combo
        4 Duress
        3 Plunge into Darkness
        4 Academy Rector
        4 Cabal Therapy

Trix Build:

//NAME: Rectal/Plunge - Trix
//Mana
        4 Dark Ritual
        1 Tolarian Academy
        3 Scrubland
        4 Underground Sea
        1 Tundra
        4 Flooded Strand
        1 Mana Vault
        1 Sol Ring
        1 Mana Crypt
        1 Black Lotus
        1 Mox Sapphire
        1 Mox Ruby
        1 Lotus Petal
        1 Mox Pearl
        1 Mox Emerald
        1 Mox Jet

// Win Target Game
        2 Illusions of Grandeur
        2 Donate

//Draw/Broken
        1 Ancestral Recall
        1 Time Walk
        1 Yawgmoth's Bargain
        1 Necropotence
        1 Chain of Vapor
        1 Yawgmoth's Will
        1 Vampiric Tutor
        1 Demonic Tutor
        4 Brainstorm
        4 Force of Will

// Rector Stuff/Hand Hate
        2 Duress
        3 Plunge into Darkness
        4 Academy Rector
        4 Cabal Therapy



The Test Trix build's strength is in it's Force of Wills. Plunge is probably even more synergystic w/ trix than with rector/tendrils. However the Tendrils build has Draw7 backup and is more resillent to being Slavered.
 
Will test.

[jpmeyer]

I thought that it would be worth possibly including a single Illusions and a single Donate so if you have 5 mana sitting around you could Plunge sacrificing Rector to Rector out Illusions and dig for the Donate.

[TheFram]

I thought of that for a bit as well. The main question was: what to drop?

I think the most obvoius answer is
-1 Duress
-1 Windfall

However, I really, really like having 4 duress in this deck (I played it for a good two months last year and when I went to 3 duress I felt that I was much less secure). Also Windfall seems rather broken with Bargain, and becomes especially usefull now since I will be paying life more often with the Plunge and won't be able to bargain for as much some times.

The more "bold and daring" option would be:
-1 Vampiric Tutor
-1 Mystical Tutor

Since plunge adds 3 more tutors, this might be a viable option, but I am pretty loath to consider it. MAYBE, MAYBE I would drop the mystical, but the Vamp is pretty set.

So basically, JP, I am conflicted about how to fit those two in.

Any solutions?

-TheFram

[rvs]

with plunge, I think you can miss mystical at least. I'm not totally sure about vampiric yet, but it's definately worth a few test runs.

[MrZeroPing]

I don't think adding Illusions/Donate would be a wise decision. First of all you need 6 mana for the proposed combo of getting an Illusions out, Plunging into a Donate, and playing the Donate. As far as the ordering of the stack, life gain comes after Plunge resolves, right? So you are very limited to maybe a 15 Plunge at best. I don't think that 15 cards deep is enough to find 1 Donate. I just don't think it would work in the Tendrils version.

As far the the Trix verison of the deck I feel that Plunge either has very limited possibilites with the deck or very VERY synergistic possibilites. I must first ask though, how are you going to use Plunge in the Trix version? I've been thinking about it all morning and Plunge can either become the main way you get your combo, as opposed to Bargain. Or it can either just strengthen the deck's consistentcy as a way to get Bargain in play. But If that is the case I think you need to run more Illusions.

So are you running Plunge as just a Rector kill method? Or would you run it with the purpose of entwining it?

[Tempe]

Plunge is synergistic because it can be used as a sacrifice outlet, a tutor, or both. But as the person before me said, Trying to Plunge for a single donate while rectoring out Illusions is probably not the greatest idea. You _could_ run into it or a tutor for it, but you may not, leaving you in a not so good position.

--Tempe

[TheFram]

Yes, even minimal goldfishing seems to imply that the single Illusions/Donate in the Tendrils build is not the best. The timing of Plunging a Rector into an Illusions impedes our ability to go searching for the Donate, and the Donate is not gas.

However, the Trix build is surprisingly good because of the synergy of Plunge.

-TheFram

[JuJu]

Few things, I like the Trix list way more because I hate Tendrils in decks short of Long. Anyways, about the Trix build, why the Lotus Petal? Wouldn't a 2nd Tundra be better. Ever think about Gemstone Mines? Also what about the Chain of Vapor, any particular reason it's used over Seal of Cleansing? Also is 2 Duress good, I'd feel safer with 4.

What other Enchantments do you think could fit in here? Dream Halls maybe?

[MrZeroPing]

My intial thoughts of Plunge was that you would only realistically use this on your main phase as a method to Donate your Illusoins. But with 6 spare mana floating around you should have gone for Bargain and just drawn cards and won.

Then I realized that this is INSTANT speed killing and tutoring and I got a big grin on my face. I can now see why this would be such a good addition to the deck (@JPMeyer: now I also see why you need just 5 mana for the Plunge/Donate). Play EOT Plunge and wait for your main phase. However, you would need to be in position to set up a really nice hand in order to protect Illusions til your main phase. I think this method of Plunge could realistically be used as the main way to combo out Trix. I think though that you would really need to up the Donate count to 3 just so you are sure that you get Donate the first time around. Again, life gain comes after you you are severly limited by your first 20 life to get the donate.

@JuJu As far as the Chains of Vapor question, its just really good spot removal to get rid of the Donated Illusions. I use Rushing Rivers myself but lately I think I may swtich over. Misdirections are becoming used less and less  and its much cheaper, so Chains may be the way to go. As far as other enchanments (such as Seal) belong in the sideboard. Only place that has room for them.

What intrigues me most about this card's addition is possibly cutting out Necropotence for Plunge number 4. Ever since I've been playing this deck Necropotence's addition has been a questionable. At least in my eyes. I have only been glad to draw Necro once or twice and I have only won games once or twice by playing/rectoring Necro and I really want to try testing it without. This may not be wise though. Any thoughts on that?

[Saucemaster]

What intrigues me most about this card's addition is possibly cutting out Necropotence for Plunge number 4. Ever since I've been playing this deck Necropotence's addition has been a questionable. At least in my eyes. I have only been glad to draw Necro once or twice and I have only won games once or twice by playing/rectoring Necro and I really want to try testing it without. This may not be wise though. Any thoughts on that?

I played both Rector Trix and Rector Tendrils for a while when it was a good deck.  I will tell you right now that even despite its relative weakness in the Tendrils build, I would never, ever think of cutting Necro from the deck.  It's spectacular against control in particular, where the fact that it's easily hardcastable makes it one of the best ways to play around Coffin Purges post-board.   The fact that Bargain is superior in this deck does not mean that Necro is dead weight.  You will lose games with Necro that you would have won with Bargain, but you shouldn't ever be choosing to drop Necro INSTEAD of Bargain.  And you will win plenty of games with Necro simply because, well, it's Necro.  This is particularly true with the Trix version, where you aren't usually killing in one turn anyway.

I'd also suggest searching for the old Rector Tendrils decks that ran 3/4 Force of Will.  Westredale had an incredibly sweet list that was probably as tuned as the deck was going to get at the time (pre-Plunge), and Force of Will makes a tremendous difference, particularly with even nastier threats in the metagame now, like the potential for first-turn Trinispheres post-board coming from any deck running Workshops.

I'd also like to add that I think the real question here is that, while pretty much everyone agreed that the Tendrils version was better pre-Plunge, has Plunge made the Trix version a superior choice now?  The early Rector Tendrils builds were superior to the Trix builds simply because they had a secondary game plan, sort of a proto-Draw 7 gameplan of simply playing D7s, accumulating mana, and eventually casting Tendrils.  This (and the aforementioned Necropotence) were your only really good answers to the Coffin Purges that put the deck out of business in the first place.  The Trix Plan B (just straight up drawing and playing Illusions + Donate) was so slow that it was incredibly easy to stop them once you had Purges to stop the Rectors.  So the question is: will the increased redundancy in your A game mean with a Plunge Trix build outweigh the potentially superior B game of a Tendrils build, with or without Plunge.

[MrZeroPing]

I've always defended the fact that Trix was more stable of the two choices. I feel that Plunge could really make Trix more viable than Tendrils. Plunge gives you the other method of kill, as opposed to drawing it and playing it out with Bargain. I also believe its a stronger version because you are able to protect yourself with FoW. With that much Blue in the deck running 4 FoW is no problem. At least I never had any problems with the build I was playing.
Just looking at the two builds make me thing the Trix version will be more solid and that Plunge gave Trix more edge in the game as far as speed goes. I thought the old choice was between reliability or speed. Trix or Tendrils? Since Plunge appears on the surface to add more speed to Trix I think Trix could very well take the spot of Tendrils for Rector decks.

[TheFram]

So far I am finding them about even.

Plunge is a little more synergystic w/ the Trix Build, because it can be used as an Uber Impulse to hard-cast the combo. Also, it is easier to find room for FOW in the Trix Build.

The Tendrils Build has much more of the "oops... I win" hands because its Storm combo and runs D7's. The Synergy with plunge is there, but Plunge has more synergy with Trix b/c you gain life before you win.

-TheFram