SlapJack: NEW Deck by LotusHead

[LotusHead]

Much of this list was originally in the Casual Forum, but I wish to submit my "tested enough for me for now" rogue deck for critique, suggestion and/or playtesting by others.  Any deck with new mechanics that have a  "Long.dec" or "Dragon.dec" etc explosive potentials deserves at least some attention. Thanks in advance for any replies.

I built a deck around some of the fun new Fifth Dawn series, namely Trinket Mage and Auriok Salvagers and    broken type one cards.
It has since mutated into SlapJack, the deck by LotusHead.  

Behold: (Edited List- Thanks you guys!)

4 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Mountain
1 Swamp
1 Plains
1 Island
3 Bloodstained Mire

5 Moxen
1 Chrome Mox
1 Lotus Petal
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Black Lotus
1 Lion's Eye Diamond

4 Force of Will
2 Mana Drain
2 Ertai's Meddling
1 Last Word

4 Trinket Mages
4 Auriok Salvagers

3 Brainstorm
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Lim-dul's Vault
1 Timetwister
2 Intuition


1 Gorilla Shaman
1 shiny Orim's Thunder
1 Conjurer's Bauble
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Lantern of Insight
1 Future Sight
1 SHARED FATE  
1 Cunning Wish

Sideboard:
Grim Reminder
4 Blue Elemental Blasts
1 Stifle
1 Capsize
1 Veldaken Orrery(it WAS in the deck...)
7 other cards

The gist of this deck is, if I resolve an Auriok Salvager, and have a Conjuror's Bauble/Pyrite Spellbomb and Lotus/LED, then I have an infinite mana loop, infinite card/deck draw/recycle loop (SlapJack). Then, I can cast Future Sight and Shared Fate, remove all of my opponents card's from the game, PLAY them, then disenchant Shared Fate with Orim's Thunder. On a lucky draw, I can do this turn one (okay, a VERY lucky draw), but with my counter-capability, I can hold off on longer games.

If this deck goes off, and it can, I can play as many cards in my deck as I want, and cycle cards back into the library. I have one each of many cards to deal with Platinum Angels and the like...

Kismet, Disciple of the Vault and Rule of Law/that blue equivalent card are some permanents that can disrupt this deck, as can other things...

I can lock people (for a while or at least long enough) with Auriok Salvager and Lantern of Insight by keeping their top-decked goodies away.  This winning by 2/2 or 2/4 beatsticks is still winning.

The 4 Blue Elemental Blasts in the sideboard are for, well, Goblins etc.

On a side note, I beat Neo-Academy 2 times out of 4 with this deck. YAY! (Neo-Academy was my first introduction for Lopsidedly Broken Type 1 Decks. One year later, I finally beat it.)

This deck always has the threat of going off on turn 2 or 3 (or turnone...it's happened) WITH Force of Will backup.

SlapJack, the deck.

[Bulls on Parade]

Why is Trinket Mage better than Artificer's Intuition in a deck with 16 artifacts?

Why do you feel the need to write shiny in front of the card names?

All the options of this deck certainly haven't been explored yet, but a lot of your specific card choices have me baffled.
Also- doesn't this make like 4 active threads pertaining to this less than stellar deck? How about no more new threads until we've made a big discovery/innovation...

[Squee]

All the options of this deck certainly haven't been explored yet, but a lot of your specific card choices have me baffled.
Also- doesn't this make like 4 active threads pertaining to this less than stellar deck? How about no more new threads until we've made a big discovery/innovation...

Yes, especially since we have yet to figure out why this combo-control deck is better than any of the tier 1 or 2 options.  

It plays a slow, vulernable combo with some decent control to back it up.  The problem is plays neither the control nor the combo game well so it is very awkward.  

As for your card choices, 3 Brainstorm...wtf?  You also don't play any fetchlands to smooth out your mana base and make BS amazing but you manage to find room Latern of Insight, Wayfarer's Bauble, and other randomness.  

On a side note, I beat Neo-Academy 2 times out of 4 with this deck. YAY! (Neo-Academy was my first introduction for Lopsidedly Broken Type 1 Decks. One year later, I finally beat it.)

I hate to break it to you but Neo-Academy hasn't been viable in type 1 for quite a while.  Unless you mean Draw-7 or TPS or Deathwish Long  that is.

[jpmeyer]

Or instead of using like 5 cards to kill your opponent with after you've demonstrated your combo, you could like, use Pyrite Spellbomb and only require one card.

[The M.E.T.H.O.D]

It took you a year to beat NEO-academy?

[LotusHead]

Artificer's Intuition?  Never heard of it until now.  That card would fit in the deck, and I'll look into it.  The trinket mages are 2/2 beatsticks/chump blockers in addition to being a combo peice.  They tutor for the Black Lotus like madmen.

Wayfarers Bauble is in there to get basic land into play.  With the Salvager, I can get all 4 basic lands into play.  As for the lack of pitchlands, I don't have blue ones yet.

As for taking a year to beat Neo-Academy, gimme a break.  I only have so many High Powered players out here to play against.  In this case, he had power 10 proxied.  This was the second chance I had to play against it.  I've been re-thinking how I play magic to compete in the Type 1 world.  I just got done playing BU Dragon.

3 Brainstorms?  I only recently noticed Serum Visions was a sorcery, and am on the road.  Don't have brainstorm #4 on me. Sorry.

Shiny Lands?  Hey, it's my personality coming through.

Lantern of Insight?  I have beat several decks by screwing over their decks with it, with or without Lotus backup.

Got to go now, but don't forget the Conjuror's Bauble and Shared Fate as kill cards!!!

Thank you for all of the feedback, good and bad.

[AngryPheldagrif]

So basically you've created an awful version of The Shining. . . . .

3 Brainstorms? I only recently noticed it was a sorcery, and am on the road. Don't have brainstorm #4 on me. Sorry.

It's not a sorcery; it's an instant.

Shiny Lands? Hey, it's my personality coming through.

For the future, just stick with decklists. Foils do not affect game play, therefore highlighting them is useless and confusing.

Got to go now, but don't forget the Conjuror's Bauble and Shared Fate as kill cards!!!

Shared Fate is not a kill card, and Conjurer's Bauble is useless when you could just use a Pyrite Spellbomb and end things that much quicker.



You're running way too many single copies and janky stuff. It ends up as a really bad combo-Keeper, except without the consistency that The Shining had.

-Dan

[Garth One Eye]

I've personally faced this deck numerous times recently, and yes it definitely needs tweaking, but it can and has gone off for turn 2 kills.

You guys should try being a little more positive and lay off the caffeine.  

[AngryPheldagrif]

But why would you want to play a deck that "has the threat of going off on Turn 2 or 3" as opposed to something that consistently goes off on Turn 1-2 (like Draw-7)?

-Dan

[edit]: I actually find caffeine discusting, and I rarely partake in it. My only issue is with a poorly formatted list for a combo thats already been discussed in numerous other threads.

[edit2]: The main problem is that this combo is vulnerable to both artifact AND graveyard hate. Most people are going to have some sort of maindeck hate and a ton of SB hate for you. It's simply not the right choice for a competitive metagame.

-Dan

[LotusHead]

OK, I finally figured out how to edit my own posts.  Here goes:

Why Trinket Mages and not Artificer's Intuition?  Never heard of it until today.  But that one makes to you discard an artifact to get the tutoring ability.  I get an artifact NOW with trinket mage AND get a cool 2/2 beatstick.  They are like Tinker to me (sad, I have Power 7 and no tinker...) With all the mana accelleration, I can get Trinket Mage out on turn 1, 2 or whenever I feel like it. Or pitch it to Force of Will.

Why is it better than other Combo-control options? Well, this deck has the Salvager/Lotus/Conjurer's Bauble engine.  The Salvager is the only neccessary piece to resolve.  The rest I just cast again and again and again.  

Why not use Pyrite Spellbomb? I'll consider it, but I don't always have red mana availiable.  (EDIT: I'm sold.  Pyrite Spellbomb is the bomb.   I forgot that I can draw cards off it without red mana. Thanks you guys...) The Conjurer's Bauble is at least equal to the spellbomb as a kill condition. Drawing all my cards wins me the game. But to recur the Spellbomb to kill anoying weenies...? Well...the Paradise Mantle is a weak slot in the deck that may much be better served with Pyrite Spellbomb. Thanks.

Uh...when I mentioned Brainstorms and sorceries.  I apologize.  I meant to say that Serum Visions was a sorcery, which was the 4th brainstorm slot.

As to why not play Draw7 or something?  Well, that doesn't help me tune THIS deck which has ton's of counters, lots of comeback plays and so forth. I don't know the details of The Shining, but I am not about NetDecking.

The decks under discussion are not this deck, they are merely Auriok Salvager combo decks.  I have offered my combo's to them to help their decks, but I am perfectly happy to have SlapJack discussed here and not there. I don't know if they have been tested against actual people or not.I did not see them until after I posted this one.  This deck, built two weeks ago with much tuning, has been working like a champ.  

As for the format of the decklist, I'll try and do better when I update this list.  

The Auriok Salvager/Lotus/LED mana engine has been solid so far.  My build has always had the Conjurer's Bauble in it, which has also been solid.  My deck has dealt with decks with graveyard hate, from Tormond's Crypts to Haunting Echoes (misdirected, yes!) and survived.  The Conjurer's Bauble and Auriok Salvager can get stuff OUT of the graveyard at instant speed.  With moxen and tundra's, I don't fear graveyard hate.  This deck, to me, is like Dragon (my last deck) without the catastrophic Dragon collateral damage.

Keep the feedback coming, I appreciate it.

PS: SlapJack is the card slapping motion for the Salvager/Lotus/Conjuror's Bauble comboing out.

Edit: The original decklist has been modified and cleaned up a bit. In short,
-1 Balace
-1 Swords to Plowshares
-1 Paradise Mantle
-1 Wayfarer's Bauble
-1 Orim's Thunder
+3 Bloodstained Mires (till I find Polluted Deltas)
+1 Volcanic Island
+1 Spellbomb

Thanks again.

[AngryPheldagrif]

#1: Put in Tinker. It's a Legacy uncommon. If you have power, you can get a Tinker.

#2: You don't have to worry about red mana for Pyrite Spellbomb. You recur Lotus for infinite white mana, then recur it for a whole ton of red mana, then kill.

#3: The Shining was Combo-Keeper. Basically it was a standard Keeper deck that won with the Grim Monolith/Power Artifact combo.

With moxen and tundra's, I don't fear graveyard hate.

Um, ok. Anyways, Tormod's Crypt is not good against this, I meant instant speed things like Coffin Purge. And nobody plays Haunting Echoes (competitively). Also, the weakness to artifact hate compounds the problem. You have very little to deal with either Null Rod or Damping Matrix.

You need to clear the random junk out of the deck. You don't need to run so many odd 'win' conditions. Cut the 2 Baubles and the Lantern. Cut the Future Sight and Shared Fate, they're just egregious. Cut the Orim's Thunder and Gorilla Shaman. Not only are they off color, but they're mostly useless and contribute nothing to the combo. For your counters, drop the 2 Meddlings and the Last Word for another pair of Mana Drains. Ertai's Meddling just isn't good. I have no idea why you are using Paradise Mantle, but it is crap. And what exactly do you mean by '8 Moxes'? You need to add in more mana in the form of Fetchlands and some more Duals. There's really no good reason to add 1 of each basic land to the deck, since your cards are quite color-specific. Up the Cunning Wishes and build yourself a proper wishboard. Make sure you include something like [card]Volcanic Geyser[/card] to give yourself a wishable win condition. As for Artificer's Intuition, it doesn't make a ton of difference over the Trinket Mages, the key being to dump something to find Lotus, then dump Lotus to find the red spellbomb and win.

Good luck,
-Dan

[edit]: Seems you've already implemented some of my suggestions.

[LotusHead]

Tinker, tinker, tinker...I know...
I have power/duals because I've always had them.  I'm old school and never got rid of my cards. Luckily, the Trinket mages do the same thing in this deck, AND there's four of 'em, aaaaannnnd I don't have to sacrifice anything, and and and they are 2/2 beatsticks! :lol:

I put the Pyrite Spellbomb in the Paradise Mantle slot, and goldfished away.  On my first draw, I was dissappointed to see the Spellbomb, but brainstormed into Lotus, Tolarian Academy etc and went off with the Spell bomb.  I am a beliver now.  Thanks for laying it out for me how it works.  I simply forgot it had the card draw mechanism .  The Conjurer's Bauble stays for now, but I fear it's days are numbered...

As for Mana Drains, I'll stick with two for now since I only have two.  I gave my other two to a good friend hooked on Slaver.

I was thinking of making this deck a little more White/Blue, but I don't have Flooded Plains yet.

Ertai's Meddling is my secret tech.  It is my anti-Blue tech. It mostly delays (hence counters) their counterspells.  They have been pulling their weight in this deck.  They stay.

Shared Fate also stays for now.

Somebody asked about the 8 Moxes.  That would be 5 moxen, and Chrome, Mox Diamond and I guess I meant 7 moxes...

More secret tech, unveiled today through testing: Engineered Explosives .  This has replaced Orim's Thunder.  Engineered Explosive costs X (and hence 0 for Trinket mage purposes) and kills anything I want. It has sunburst and destroys all non-land permantents with CCC of the number of charge counters on it.  Yes! I CAN Trinket for it, right? and Salvage it back?

Thanks again for any and all feedback.

Long live rogue decks! (and Dragon!)

[lilmidget]

Tinker, tinker, tinker...I know...
I have power/duals because I've always had them.  I'm old school and never got rid of my cards. Luckily, the Trinket mages do the same thing in this deck, AND there's four of 'em, aaaaannnnd I don't have to sacrifice anything, and and and they are 2/2 beatsticks! :lol:

If your a combo deck, what use do you have for a 2/2 beatstick. besides if an opponent stifles the ability (unlikely, but still possible if they know what you're playing) then you just paided 3 mana for a vanilla 2/2. Artificer's Intuition > Tinker Mage

[LotusHead]

"If your a combo deck, what use do you have for a 2/2 beatstick. besides if an opponent stifles the ability (unlikely, but still possible if they know what you're playing) then you just paided 3 mana for a vanilla 2/2. Artificer's Intuition > Tinker Mage"-Lilmidget

SlapJack is a combo-control deck that just happens to have 8 creatures that help it do crazy mad stuff. It uses the Auriok Salvager "engine" and uses Trinket Mages for tutoring abilities. Creatures=Beatsticks as a built in bonus.

The Auriok Salvager, a 2/4, is vital to the actual combo of the deck.  Not vital to winning, but vital to get the "I can do anything I want now, like win" combos.  It is still a beat stick. It can still screw someone over with Lantern of Insight. It can still get me cards with Conjurer's Bauble and Pyrite Spellbomb.

The Trinket Mages, 2/2, are FOUR TINKERS as far as this deck goes. And they are 2/2 beat sticks.  

If my opponent Stifles my Trinket Mage's comes into play ability, then that is fine by me. 2/2 beat stick.  I have more Mages.

If my combos come up, then I win.  If they don't, then I may just win with creatures.  It's happened over and over again.  

I am looking forward to next week when I should have a chance to test this deck against pretty much every t1 deck.  I know a guy with all the cards who only netdecks and can assemble anything.  Tough to beat.  

I am still glad that I can beat Control Slaver and Neo-Academy.  Next on my list is FFCG (F'n Food Chain Goblins...) For the record, I lump Neo-Academy, Rectal Agony, etc as the same kind of deck:Blue Broken Combo Bull$&*#.  I'm just glad that SlapJack's first incarnation could take it on.  Yay!

I am still concerned about an early Trinisphere.  Wait, no I'm not...I play with Trinket Mages! Trinket for Engineered Explosives!  Ok, I AM worried about Sundering Titans...  Wait, no I'm not...I play Trinket Mages! Chump block, hopefully go off with Salvagers based on moxes and loti! Anyways, these are some of the other reasons I have been happy with the Trinket Mage.

Folks, I am very pleased with the feedback so far.  The changes to my deck have been great. I will personally see to it that Trinket Mages become the most abused common creature ever!  To those of you who have simply pointed out the obvious, like say...play with Spellbombs, thank you.

EDIT:  I was only thinking of making it more White/Blue.  I will test with Artificer's Intuition, but I'm not sold yet.

Thank you for your comments. I appreciate them.

[sa17dk]

With your color specific deck (you said you wanted it to be white/blue), I dont think Engineered Explosives will be too good on 2 colors, unless you're going to run oddly paired dual lands.

As for what the other people said, I would have to agree on them about the Tinker/Artificer's Intuition comments. A combo deck is about speed, so a re-usable efficient tutor source is a lot better than a one-time use creature. If you're worried about needing 2/2 blockers for aggro (I would say attackers, but the amount of damage you do with the creatures doesnt even matter in this deck) then that means it's not viable.

[jpmeyer]

Fabricate does pretty much the same thing as Trinket Mage and it fetches Memory Jar too.

[AngryPheldagrif]

I am still glad that I can beat Control Slaver and Neo-Academy.  Next on my list is FFCG (F'n Food Chain Goblins...) For the record, I lump Neo-Academy, Rectal Agony, etc as the same kind of deck:Blue Broken Combo Bull$&*#.  I'm just glad that SlapJack's first incarnation could take it on.  Yay!

I am still concerned about an early Trinisphere.  Wait, no I'm not...I play with Trinket Mages! Trinket for Engineered Explosives!  Ok, I AM worried about Sundering Titans...  Wait, no I'm not...I play Trinket Mages! Chump block, hopefully go off with Salvagers based on moxes and loti! Anyways, these are some of the other reasons I have been happy with the Trinket Mage.

#1: Lumping combo together is a mistake if you want to thoroughly test your deck. The big difference between Neo-Academy and Rector-Tendrils is that one has been dead for a loooong time, and the other is still 'theoretically' viable.


#2: Your second paragraph concerns me greatly. Arrogance is not a good idea against decks that you haven't played yet. Trinisphere means that your combo doesn't work anymore.[/size]Don't count on a single Engineered Explosives to save you. You need 3 colors to kill it with the Explosives, and if your opponent happens to get a Sundering Titan out in addition to the aforementioned Sphere, then your chances of accumulating 3 colors is fairly low. You also have to worry about the other fun Sphere, Sphere of Resistance. Chances are, a deck like TriniStax or just plain old Stax can get these out quickly and in multiples. Engineered Explosives can only deal with one casting cost, and Tangle Wires and Smokestacks say that you're not going to be able to Trinket Mage for an Explosives and cast it. As far as I am concerned, artifact is one of your worst matchups. Don't forget the fun of comboing out on yourself through a Mindslaver.

-Dan

[VGB]

More secret tech, unveiled today through testing: Engineered Explosives .  This has replaced Orim's Thunder.  Engineered Explosive costs X (and hence 0 for Trinket mage purposes) and kills anything I want. It has sunburst and destroys all non-land permantents with CCC of the number of charge counters on it.  Yes! I CAN Trinket for it, right? and Salvage it back?

You give yourself waaay too much credit.

Feel free to "borrow" any tech from here, if you wish.  Your deck differs from the one I presented, but there are enough parallels to make it worth your while to look it over.

Regarding Tinker, I felt AI was strictly superior, although in my deck it could potentially fetch Crucible.  As the main focus of the deck is Salvagers, though, it didn't seem to warrant a slot since AI functions so much better:

1) It comes out a turn earlier.
2) It can tutor repeatedly.
3) It hurts less when countered.

Were Crucible the focus of the deck, Tinker would definitely warrant inclusion - but since the emphasis is on Salvagers combo, it has a harder time earning a slot.

#3: The Shining was Combo-Keeper. Basically it was a standard Keeper deck that won with the Grim Monolith/Power Artifact combo.

The kill varied from build to build - sometimes Tendrils was used.  The main thing that set The Shining apart was the fact that it used Future Sight + Fastbond - which is how the deck got it's name; Future Sight == Precognition == Shining.

The deck was also called Your Mother,  but why I can't remember.

[LotusHead]

Thank you for all your comments. I'm vacationing with the folks and have had time to work on this deck and test it.  Thanks for all comments.

Memory-Jar, I don't own one, and am not sure if I need it for this deck.  I have been thinking about Wheel of Fortune since I put in fetches/Volcanic Island. No Tinker yet.

In testing against Blue Broken BS Combo Decks, I can lump them anyway I want.  They all have the same cards in them.  I either have Force of Will in my hand, or I don't.  That's why those decks are scary.  I am still happy that I could beat them (I play in a VERY underpowered Meta, but have had pleny of practice with this deck versus BBBSCD's and Control Slaver and Rogue Hate Decks. ) As for other matchups, like versus WelderMUD or 7/10 or Fish...we'll see.

I am happy about Engineered Explosives, because I tossed it in as an experiment (removing, for now, Final Word), and only after Trinketing out of desperation to deal with a Welder with Lightning Greaves on it, did I realize that I could choose Engineered Explosives!  Give myself credit? Sure. Happy that it could take out Trinsiphere, you bet. Confident that it can? You're darn tooting right I am. Tech is tech. Borrow from your link? No, I didn't.  I did read it a few days ago (Friday?), but upon re-reading it, you did put on in your main deck.  You didn't explain how it works for us slower folk (I don't always connect all the dots.)

One nice thing about this deck is that even though it is still new and developing and (gasp) uses Trinket Mages, it still has a long game.  I can be down to one life on a top-decking war and this deck can pull through.

Thanks again for all critique, and thanks to whoever a)told why The Shining was called The Shining and b) backing me up on Blue Combo Decks Samedness (cool as those decks are).

[AngryPheldagrif]

I really do not think you're going to have to worry about Lightning Greaves in T1. And using Explosives to take out a Trinisphere is 5 mana, including 3 different colors, and getting 5 on the board is not going to be easy with all your artifacts costing 3. And nobody backed you up on the blue combo thing, because there's soooooo many different versions, with so many different ways of winning. At a T1 tournament today, I played Draw-7, another blue combo deck. But to lump together mine with Neo-Academy, Rector-Tendrils, and TPS would be a mistake, simply because of the different styles of play. While we might share a lot of cards, even a majority of cards, the strategy that beats Academy might not work against TPS, or vice-versa. It's just to much of a lump to make. Claiming that you can beat mine because you beat Neo-Academy is a very unheathly assumption to make. And Force of Will is not always the deciding factor. Don't forget that most of them play Forces too, TPS has Duress, and Rector has Therapy.

You really need to be more conservative about your chances. Overconfidence is the worst thing that you can do to a deck in testing. Don't just assume that Trinisphere, etc. is ok because of your Explosives, think about things like them welding the darn thing right back in.

-Dan

PS: And for the record, I'd be happy to play you on Apprentice some time to show you about the weaknesses of your deck. Hit me up on AIM (HunterKiller403) if you'd like.

[LotusHead]

In my exposition on Trinket Mages as being a prime defence against Trinisphere and 7/10, much of that paragraph was meant to be taken rather lightly.  I was happy that my deck had AN answer to Trinisphere, as opposed to no answer. If I need to Trinket the Explosives out, I would be more than happy to blow stuff up next turn, as opposed to never.

Engineered Explosives, with Auriok backup can blow stuff up over and over again. With infinite mana (even without a kill condition handy), Engineered Explosives can blow up all of my opponent's non-land permanents.  My permanents (okay, cheap artifacts) can be re-Salvaged and replayed.

With Trinket Mage (or Artifact Intuition), Salvager Decks have Black Lotus's in play every game.  Sweet.  Keep the tech developing folks!

I really need to get some blue fetchlands.

Magic on Apprentice?  How does one go about it? PM me.

[VGB]

Apprentice @ e-league

Magic Workstation

[LotusHead]

To the type 1 community.

You are playing agains a scrub with power7, that scrub plays Shared Fate.

Would you counter it? (assuming this is on turn 1 or 2.)

Shared Fate was originally put into several decks I play as an experiment(how else to test a card that changes the game...). With some of my jank decks, Shared Fate meant that my opponent drew crap while I got to time walk, play welders, etc.

With SlapJack (I'm not giving up on this, folks. I'll let you know when I have done FULL testing, not just against Control Slaver, or Hate Decks or Scrub Decks), I had Shared Fate listed as a Kill Card.  Granted, that is assuming I have my Infinite Card Draw, Infinite Mana combos happening.

But what if, someone resolves a Shared Fate, and you do NOT have actual board advantage at this point.  Counter/Naturalize, or no? Wht would you do? Think about it...this is what The Mana Drain is good for...

I won't start a new thread on Shared Fate, just yet, because I want to fine tune this deck, my Auriok Salvager deck.  Combo, but not completely so...
But the Shared Fate Question, depending on what your favorite Meta-deck is...What would you do? What WOULD you do? Counter/destroy, or no? If you decide (or can) do anything about it, does that mean Shared Fate has an untapped potential?  All of this is the main reason that I leave Shared Fate, as a 1 of, in my deck, new as it is...

LotusHead-The only kid on my block who never gave up his Power Cards...

end note: this post is only about deck types that have power that use Shared Fate in a T1 environment.  Seriously, what WOULD you do? -Testing against the best that TMD users have to offer...Also, Engineered Explosives have been FANTASTIC in this deck.  Blammo, there go X permanents.

[LotusHead]

Okay, my current build is as follows:

Land:14
4 Tundra
2 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Island
1 Plains
4 Flooded Plains
1 Tolarian Academy

MoxMana: 10
5 Moxen
1 Lotus Petal
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lion's Eye Diamond

Combo Critters: 8
4 Auriok Salvagers
4 Trinket Mage

Draw/Search: 11
3 Brainstorm (yeah, I know...)
2 Intuition
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Timetwister
1 Lim-Dul's Vault
1 Cunning Wish

Counter/Control: 10
4 Force of Will
2 Mana Drain
2 Ertai's Meddling
1 Stifle
1 Misdirection

Utility/Kill: 8
1 Pyrite Spellbomb
1 Conjurer's Bauble
1 Future Sight
1 Acquire
1 Lantern of Insight
1 Gorilla Shaman
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Shared Fate

SideBoard: Under Construction

I've decided that I may just want to have FOUR Stifle's maindecked against better decks than mine.. Shared Fate, Acquire and Lim-dul's vault will probably get the axe.

Again, thank you Mana Drainers, this is where my deck is now..

[AngryPheldagrif]

Several things.

#0:

You are playing agains a scrub with power7, that scrub plays Shared Fate.

Would you counter it? (assuming this is on turn 1 or 2.)

Being a 5-mana enchantment, I doubt it'll hit very quickly, but I would indeed counter it. I would have no way of knowing if your deck has a win condition or not. Most decks that people are looking at with Shared Fate generally involve control elements with no way to win. Also no enchantment destruction. The basic idea is that if your opponent doesn't have any solutions in hand, they just lose (assuming their deck can win ). The fact that Shared Fate removes cards instead of actually drawing them lets you play a ton of control, especially Duress and Unmask, since they become worthless under Shared Fate. Also, Force of Will can't be alternately cast. Your deck is not set up to take advantage of this in any way. Also, you're giving them a deck that can win.

#1: In your new list you only play 1 land that doesn't produce blue. I don't see why you would want to run Ertai's Meddling over Mana Drain. Mana Drain lets you hold back, and then bust out the Salvagers or even a Trinket Mage on your free colorless.

#2: Single Cunning Wish. There's no point in blowing a chunk of your sideboard on wish targets if you're only going to run 1. Either cut it or dump the maindeck Stifle and Misdirection (cards that just aren't that helpful as singles) to up your Wish count to 3.

#3: Shared Fate. I know it's just one card, but it seriously is useless to the point of being counterproductive. What do you do if they draw a Salvager and pull out their own Lotus or something? There's just so little point to running a single one when you could be running another kill method or tutor.

#4: On the subject of additional tutors, why not Enlightned? It fetches you your vital combo piece and costs only a single mana.

Good luck,
-Dan

PS: Still available for testing if you want!
PPS:

[LotusHead]

Mana Drain: I have two.  I don't forsee getting two more anytime soon. So I stay at two.  Ertai's Meddling is an odd choice of counter, and it pretty much is my substitute for Mana Drain.  I may well replace these with 2 more Stifles.  I really want 4 Stifles maindecked now...

Cunning Wish.  If I find room for them, I may wall put in at least one more (for a total of two).  Three if I somehow find room.  But the one I have is for "just in case" and I can tutor for it if things are going badly.  Decks should never have 1 Cunning Wish in them? It is a win condition if I go off, however.  I will have at least Stroke of Genius sideboarded or Volcanic Eruption (or is it Volcanic Guyser?)

I don't have an Enlightened Tutor at the moment (almost got one today...) but that is on my list of "things I should have access to...". I am seriously thinking of putting the Vampiric Tutor in the sideboard "Keeper style" to find room for another Cunning Wish.

I am now truly appreciating the value of each card in the deck with a 60 card minimum and Type 1's exacting standards.  Shared Fate/Conjuerer's Bauble still stay, but their days are obviously numbered.

Thanks again.  Hopefully full testing this weekend.

[goober]

Shared Fate<<<Brainstorm

Just run 1 more Spellbomb if you want a redundant way to win, that way it is easier to pull off, and frees up a slot for Brainstorm #4.

[AngryPheldagrif]

We tested this last night. He beat my old MaskNought (though my hands were not exactly conducive to winning) 2-1, then I beat him with Workshop Slaver 4-0, and then beat him with Draw-7 in a single game. Overall, performs ok, but just dies to decent control even worse than other combos. Also not as consistent. Needs more tutors/draw and less control elements.

-Dan

[Sandster]

Lotushead, will you please stop mentioning that you cannot acquire 50 cent commons and 2 dollar uncommons?  Brainstorm, Tinker, Enlightened Tutor, and Memory Jar combines for less than $8.  Just post your optimal decklist and work towards it by acquring the cards.  Posting an inferior deck simply because you do not "own" such common cards simply defeat the entire purpose of this forum.

I'm amazed how inexperienced you seem for an "oldschooler" like you.  Why would you care about creatures in your deck?  If you rely on beating with a 2/2, you have probably lost the game already.  Your primary (and only) concern should be getting your combo out, so both AI and Fabricate are superior to Trinket Mage.

As people have already said, cut the off-color (Gorilla Shaman?!) and excess (Shared Fate...) stuff and focus on getting your combo to work.

[LotusHead]

I now have Tinker and Memory Jar.  I am trying to make this deck rawk, and you guys have been helping me a lot.

As for being an inexperienced oldschooler, you are to some degree correct.  It was almost a year ago, to the day, that I faced a severely hard-core Type 1 deck.  Pissed me off to no end.  (I am a casual player at heart, I just happen to have Moxen, Lotus, Twister.)

In the last year, I have stumbled across Dragon (it was my ordinary dragons deck, with Scornful Egotists and Burnt Offering/Dragonstorm).  When I put Worldgorger Dragons in, I already had Animates in there.  Took me one whole week to realize the combo.  I was still adjusting to "the stack" as it stands now, as opposed to Magic when Interupts were a card type.

With Dragon, I had a deck that could compete with the big boys, and with The Mana Drain, I got info/insight on other deck types out there.

I am old school.  I see myself as a Planeswalker as described in the original rulebooks, duelling for control (or at least bragging rights) against the Plainswalker across from me.  Whatever deck I play that has the privelige of containing my power is my showcase deck.  Right now, that deck is SlapJack. My deck.

As for the Gorilla Shaman and Shared Fate, those two cards are probably going to get the axe in favor of Stifle.  As for the 4th Brainstorm, I just had three on me when I made the deck.  I have no problem running three at the moment, but I will probably go back up to four soon.  

I am interested in figuring out how to make this deck work, with the Salvager engine at it's heart.  Chalice of the Void for zero decimated me, but I DID have a Cunning Wish in hand, ready to go one of those times, and I had a Stifle ready another of those times (I'm pretty sure Stifle can get one spell through, once...right?).  I just got hosed by Sundering Titan soon after.  That can happen.  I was outclassed by Workshop Slaver.

As for posting an optimal decklist, that would assume that I am in a financial situation to better my position in getting better Type 1 cards.  I have never had my grubby little hands on an Ancestral Recall or Time Walk, but I DID get the rest of my power by trading back in the day.  (and it HURT!).  Planeswalker.  I still buy cards one or two packs at a time.  This is part of the fun for me.

Thank you ALL for any comments, even ones that may seem snippy.  I can take it.  And thank you AngryPheldagriph for letting me kick ass against your first deck before destroying me with Draw7 and Workshop Slaver. (I still think I can take 'em.  4 Stifles game 2 and 3.  Will it make the difference?  I WAS playing a little agressive.  That's the downside of goldfishing/playing against scrubdecks.)