Type 0

[whitepanther]

Alright, so I live in Peterborough which is in Canada about and hourish North of Toronto. And up here we play Type 0 because everyone is too lazy to run sanctioned or even proxy events. But on the flip side of that, noone around here has power, no Mana Drains, no anything. In fact, there are a total of 4 people who have FoW (including wu, but he rarely comes to tournaments). The tournament itself is pure round Robin through to top 4, with the top 2 playing swiss for prizes.
So that is the background on the area, the regular meta is far from predictable, it is a fairly scrubby meta, where any well built deck will win. Al (wu_affiliate) worked on this list for GAT, and I decided to post it here hoping to get some suggestions on the list...

4 Psychatog
4 Quirion Dryad
4 Force of Will
2 Misdirection
3 Duress
4 Gush
4 Serum Vision
4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
2 Merchant Scroll
1 Fastbond
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Berserk
1 Cunning Wish
4 Lotus Petal
4 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
4 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
1 Library of Alexandria

Later Al, had this to say:
my thinking is that this should help vs annoying things
4 Psychatog (this guy is the backup plan to dryads, if they want to deal with multiple dryads ill just beat heavily with this since i draw so many cards)
4 Quirion Dryad (this can be a 5/5 in 1.5-2 turns with this deck)
4 Force of Will (deals with random removal)
2 Misdirection (deals with random removal, may want to go to 4)
3 Duress (deals with random removal, daze may be a better choice at jeff's)
4 Gush (broken draw that makes my dyads and togs fat as hell or draws me more threats)
4 Serum Vision (same as above minus talk about broken draw)
4 Brainstorm (same as above)
1 Time Walk (i tutor/draw into this if i get a tog, so its a 1 turn win, drop talk, walk, win)
1 Yawgmoth's Will (replay everything removal destroys, draw alot of cards, and win)
1 Demonic Tutor (gets me what i need when i need it)
1 Vampiric Tutor (gets me what i need when i need it)
2 Merchant Scroll (gets me what i need when i need it, through tutor chaining)

gat has never had alot of problems with removal since its so fast, removal is rarely viable because they cant possibly gotten the mana to deal with multiple threats in the fist 3-4 turns which this tech wins. this deck should win turn 2-3 or have an insermountable advantage that cannot be beaten by those turns.

So any thoughts on the list and comments keeping in mind this is for a format with no restrictions.

[Jacob Orlove]

Type 4

If there are no restrictions, then you're playing Type 0.

With no restrictions, I'd definitely make room for more pitch counters, since you don't want to lose on their first turn. Probably Foil and Daze.

Also, why only one fastbond? It's instrumental to your fastest kills--you need at least two.

1 demonic/1 vamp/2 merchant seems worse than just 4 demonic, or even 4 consults.

You should also probably run a second will--maybe even 3, since it's so good with fastbond/gush.

[whitepanther]

Wow, yeah I should probably get the name of the format correct first. So how does this look then?
4 Psychatog
4 Quirion Dryad
4 Force of Will
2 Misdirection
3 Duress
4 Gush
4 Serum Vision
4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
3 Yawgmoth's Will
4 Demonic Tutor
2 Merchant Scroll
2 Fastbond
2 Berserk
4 Lotus Petal
4 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
4 Polluted Delta
3 Flooded Strand
1 Library of Alexandria

The suggestions of adding more tutors and Will's etc. was great! Thanks for the help, but on the issue of pitch counters, never in my 3 years of playing at the tournament have I seen or been involved in a kill coming earlier than turn 3. Unfortunately the people in the area with the exception of a few are scrubtastic and do not play well made decks. Those that do play good decks, usually play Control or Aggro-Control (4 Balance, 4 Yawgmoth's Will, 4 Sol Ring, 4 Demonic Tutor makes up a large portion of the top players decks weekly). Any other suggestions...?

[Matt]

Someone should make up a Mind's Desire deck. 4 LED, 4 Demonic Tutor, 4 Mind's Desire, 4 Dark Ritual, 4 Lotus Petal, 4 Mana Vault, 4 Sol Ring, 4 Academy, possibly Crop Rotation, possibly Frantic Search.

Possibly multiple Crypts or Monoliths, plus like Wheels and Wills and Regrowths and stuff. Maybe Fastbonds, I don't know, but expect turn two kills, even through Force.

Just keep winning these things til they start realizing why cards are restricted.

Hahaha, you could even play 4 Vise, while I'm thinking of Shandalar!

Also: 4 Tinker 4 Sol Ring 4 Jar 4 Vault 4 Monolith? 4 Mind Twist, 4 Bargain...

[goober]

If you include power, heres a nice T0 deck.

// Mana
    4 Tolarian Academy
    4 Black Lotus
    4 Mana Crypt
    4 Mox Sapphire
    4 Mox Ruby
    4 Mox Pearl
    4 Mox Jet
    4 Mox Emerald

//Draw
    4 Time Spiral
    4 Windfall
    4 Ancestral Recall
    4 Wheel of Fortune
    4 Timetwister

//Force
    4 Force of Will

//Win
    4 Brain Freeze

Pretty much the closer you can get your deck to that, the better it will be.  Just use Long from November, and make whatever additions you can.  I am pretty sure this wins turn1 99% of the time.

[johnstown713]

Wow, that Goober, is the sweetest deck I have ever seen.  Can I get that in foil??? :lol:   Is it up to par with others.  It looks amazing and seems like an automatic first turn win unless you get hit with some carzy countering.  It seems like I would want to include mana drain in that but that could actually be to slow.  I can't beleive I just said mana drain was useless.

[Jacob Orlove]

We had an old thread on budget type 0 a few pages back in this forum. I tested the academy/desire deck, but it just wasn't stable enough. Since you have Ancestral and Walk, I'll add those to my last build from that thread, which instead exploits gush/fastbond:

4 Gush
4 Dark Ritual
4 Fastbond
4 Demonic Consultation
2 Demonic Tutor
4 Mana Crypt
4 Mind's Desire
3 Burning Wish
3 Yawgmoth's Will
3 Windfall
4 Force of Will
3 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal
4 Polluted Delta
3 Tropical Island
4 Underground Sea
1 Volcanic Island
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk

SB:
1 Will
1 Tendrils
1 Windfall
1 Living Wish
1 Dryad
1 Tog
1 Xantid Swarm
Other random SB cards. Maybe some bounce or Mis-ds/Foils.

[whitepanther]

People around here have played Desire a few times with 4 Sol, 4 Vault, 4 Academy, 4 petal, 4 Grim, 4 Voltaic Key etc. but it never seemed to work as well as it should, but it still is fun as hell to pull that turn 1 kill against scrubs.

[Jacob Orlove]

People around here have played Desire a few times with 4 Sol, 4 Vault, 4 Academy, 4 petal, 4 Grim, 4 Voltaic Key etc. but it never seemed to work as well as it should, but it still is fun as hell to pull that turn 1 kill against scrubs.

The problem with that deck is that you end up turning all the colored mana you need into colorless mana you don't really want. The Gush engine is much more robust--it's easier to get going, you're more likely to have the mana and cards you'll need, and you can set yourself up for a turn 2 win easily as well. Try the deck out on apprentice, at least.

[CCClark]

No power?

Here's what I would try

Balance x4
Mind Twist x4
The Rack x4
Dark Ritual x4


You get the idea.

[Royal Ass.]

if there are no restrictions, id get four chaos orbs

[Nazdakka]

We've run a T0 tournament on MWS at #O-Gaming, we found that when you put any effort into breaking it you find it's a silly, silly format The tricks to deckbuilding are to a) Run as many FoWs as possible (ie. you ideally want Force, MisD AND Foil) and b) Be able to 'win' on turn 1 - this doesn't mean you want a consistant turn 1 kill - Chalice for zero or Null Rod work just as well. Here are the decklists we came up with: http://www.o-gaming.com/tourneys/index.php?fuseaction=tourney&authnumber=Dave06280472&

As you can see, the combo decks are beatable with sufficient hate - in the top 8 we had 4 Storm combo, 3 Fish and 1 'Tog.

[VGB]

As you can see, the combo decks are beatable with sufficient hate - in the top 8 we had 4 Storm combo, 3 Fish and 1 'Tog.

That 1'st place Desire deck could be better - but it's still pretty damn hot  :shock:

99% first turn wins = priceless

[Trollstorm]

My friends and I learned of a semi-monthly type 0 tournament nearby, and we thought this was simply ridiculous. So we scraped together 4 sets of power (well, 4 lotus, 4 Mox Jet/Sapp and Blue Pieces) and sent one of our group with the ultimate tendrils deck to teach them why they shouldn't play type 0.

[Sauce]

Well, I myself have been building a type 0 GAT deck, I've been thinking about also making a 7-10 as well.

So far this is what I've been thinking

Mana 30

4 Tolarion Academy
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Ruby
2 Sol Ring
4 Mishra's Workshop
3 Gilded Lotus
4 Volcanic Island
4 Wasteland
1 Stripmine
4 Mana Crypt

Beats 8

3 Sundering Titan
2 Razermane Masticore
1 Darksteel Collosus
1 Duplicant
1 Triskelion

Broken stuff 17

4 Goblin Welder
4 Tinker
4 Trinisphere
2 Crucible of Worlds
1 Memory Jar
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Timewalk

That leaves 5 slots open...

People might be wondering about the collosus, but it's definitely the best (most fun?) first turn play. Sundering Titan isn't going to get any lands, and with 4 Tinker's and 4 Mana Crypt's a first turn Collosus isn't out of the question.

The reason I went with 4 Mana Crypt and only 2 Sol Rings was because of the first turn Tinker. Also, this deck doesn't really have any problem getting rid of the Crypt if it becomes a problem.

Anyway, I'd like to see what other people think, and maybe get some feedback on the last 5 slots.

[wuaffiliate]

This is also non proxie you can only play cards you own or can borrow. That GAT list was from cards i own , hense no 4 dtutors and such. The format isn't really fast because no one knows how broken they can be, they all just play shit decks. If only they realised combo .

But i usually just play some sort of control. This is the deck i will have done soonish .

4 Force of Will
4 Meditate
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
4 Mind's Desire
4 Yawgmoth's Will
2 Tendrils of Agony
4 Memory Jar
4 Tinker
3 Glimmervoid
4 Tolarian Academy
4 Grim Monolith
4 Mana Vault
4 Sol Ring
4 Lion's Eye Diamond
4 Lotus Petal

I would play this, i just need a bunch of cards. Yeah so that thing wins every game turn 1, and if you are unlucky or you suck turn 2.