[Deck] Workshop Slavery and Evil Dead

[Blackest Lotus]

“Buddy, you ain’t leadin` anything but Jack and shit, and Jack just left town.”
-Ash

The best way to start out any new thread is one involving quotes, especially if they are completely irrelevant. 

It has been awhile since I have posted anything, but I have not been idle. In fact, I have been feverishly working on a new twist to an old deck. Here is my list with oddities in bold.

Workshop Slavery

Mana Sources-27
4 Volcanic Island   
4 Shivan Reef
4 Mishra’s Workshop
2 Ancient Tomb
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
3 Gilded Lotus

Draw/Tutors-16
4 Brainstorm
4 Thirst for Knowledge   
3 Gifts Ungiven   
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Memory Jar

PHEAR OF GOD-9
4 Goblin Welder
3 Mindslaver
1 Pentavus
1 Memnarch

Disruption-8
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void

Sideboard-15
4 Trinisphere
3 Engineered Explosives
2 Triskellion
1 Platinum Angel
1 Duplicant
2 Red Elemental Blast
2 Rack and Ruin

Card Explanations:

Ancient Tomb-- The deck now has a higher density of colored spells, thus Tomb has been a perfect fit. It also stabalizes the manabase moreso than other options. The two damage has rarely been a problem for me.

Gifts Ungiven- I know Team CAB, as well as others, have used this card to great success. However, I came upon this independently, but hey, I give you all props anyways. In a nutshell Gifts Ungiven speeds up the deck like crazy, being able to get both Mindslaver and Pentavus at instant speed is hot. Not only that, it can also solidfy your manabase by getting lands, or just get you insanely broken stuff like Ancestral, and Wheel, or just more disruption.

Engineered Explosives- With the rise of Oath, and other decks with troublesome permanents, I have looked for a way to rid myself of them. E.E. fit the bill perfectly, die, die, die Ground Seal, Oath of Druids, and any other number of things from Auriok Salvagers to Back to Basics. Better yet, when set at 2 or 3 it kills none of my permanents.

Exclusions:

Time Walk- This card has performed poorly for me. There are two major problems with this card. First off, it interferes with Chalice of the Void, because the majority of times it is set at two to shut off Mana Drain and other reactive cards. Time Walk is an underpowered card in general. It allows for an additional untap and an extra card. Whoopee. Compared to everything else in the deck, it is weak in comparison.

Timetwister- Draw-7's are good. Very good. However the reason why Twister is excluded and Wheel isn't, Timetwister is not an additional discard outlet, and messes up Welders.

Windfall- A Draw-7 that is not always a Draw-7, no thank you. Windfall is too inconsistent to be played.  It's a horrible topdeck when you have spent your hand, unlike all true D7's.

Gifts Ungiven is more consistent than any of these, it's just better to get the cards you need than desperately searching for them.

Library of Alexandria- The biggest setback of the deck is the manabase. Sometimes you get the colored spell, Workshop draw, or vice versa. LoA helped this drawing into additional mana sources. Since LoA does not produce colored mana, or more than 1 colorless, I cut it.

This is what I have been goldfishing for awhile with this and has performed well.

The only card I am uncertain of maindeck is the inclusion of the third Slaver. I think maybe an Explosives maindeck, or maybe even a Patinum Angel or such, to give me an even wider array of Tinker targets.

Any and all criticism is welcome.

[Revvik]

Jester's Cap?  I used it pretty successfully in Control Slaver as both a Tinker target and recursion with Welders, and it happens to neuter a lot of decks.  Maybe it's only good in certain metas though.

[Moxlotus]

Is there any reason why you don't include Sundering Titan?  And why is this deck any better than 7/10?  How has Memory Jar been, since you can rarely lay down all the cards you draw with it?

[Blackest Lotus]

Jester's Cap?  I used it pretty successfully in Control Slaver as both a Tinker target and recursion with Welders, and it happens to neuter a lot of decks.  Maybe it's only good in certain metas though.

If I had a better metagame (or just a meta in general) I might play it maindeck, seems pretty good against Tog. However there is some free board space so it might take up some space there. It also looks like a pretty good anti-combo card, but that is already a pretty good match for me anyways, probably why I have never considered it.

Is there any reason why you don't include Sundering Titan? And why is this deck any better than 7/10? How has Memory Jar been, since you can rarely lay down all the cards you draw with it?

As a matter of fact, I have tested Titan before and he was the bombzor with Welders, and for some reason I have felt more comfortable with 3 Slavers, However, with Gifts, three Mindslavers is excessive and makes Tinker less powerful. So the 3rd Slaver spot might be Trike, Plats or Titan.

Memory Jar has been pretty good. I have had very little problems with throwing away cards I wanted to hardcast, mostly blue cards. But everything else is expendable, extra lands and expensive artifacts can be chucked with not much of a second thought. Anything else can be Brainstormed to the top of my library. When I do use it, though, it rocks. Every now and then Jar does force you to toos out some good stuff, sometimes fate throws you junk.

As for why this is better than 7/10, if I had a decklist I would be able to tell you, I haven't seen one in awhile. If you could pm me one or point me to a link, that would be greatly helpful.

The best answer I can think of, is this is far more focused on getting a Slaver activated, and then, if necessary, infinite Slaver lock with Pentavus.

I have been trying to come up with a good name for the deck, would something like Workshop Gifts work, or is that to vague? Perhaps an acronym would be better, like WG or WSG, what do you think?

[majestyk1136]

Post deleted. Spamming with decklists that are not even representative of the original deck mentionned in the thread goes against the rules
-Toad

[wonkey_donkey]

Is there any reason why you don't include Sundering Titan? And why is this deck any better than 7/10? How has Memory Jar been, since you can rarely lay down all the cards you draw with it?

As a matter of fact, I have tested Titan before and he was the bombzor with Welders, and for some reason I have felt more comfortable with 3 Slavers, However, with Gifts, three Mindslavers is excessive and makes Tinker less powerful. So the 3rd Slaver spot might be Trike, Plats or Titan.

Memory Jar has been pretty good. I have had very little problems with throwing away cards I wanted to hardcast, mostly blue cards. But everything else is expendable, extra lands and expensive artifacts can be chucked with not much of a second thought. Anything else can be Brainstormed to the top of my library. When I do use it, though, it rocks. Every now and then Jar does force you to toos out some good stuff, sometimes fate throws you junk.

My first thought when I saw this was that titan would be a good replacement for a slaver - with gifts, you don't have to worry about seeing a slaver as much as you otherwise might do, and having an extra artifact to gifts for if the need arises would prove useful, I imagine.

Do you want the third gifts over windfall? Having played some similar lists in the past, I know I always liked having FoF (the most comparable card to gifts for the current situation, even though they have different functions), but I'm wondering whether you've got too many in there. Just a thought.

Seems like a decent effort to revive the deck, though. Nice one.

Tom

[Whatever Works]

Maybe its just me but I dont exactly see the point in running that high of # of threats (especially in multiples) if you have that many ways to fetch and chuck them into the graveyard. It seems a little overboard in spots where the draw 7's (which i believe are musts) would be better fits.

Oath doesnt seem like it would be that large of a problem considering the deck can run trinisphere and more importantly chalice of the void set at 1 consistently turn 1 or 2. Though board hate does help... I personally thought that Gifts just didnt fit the deck, and even with tombs (which i have always ran anyway) getting the 4 mana to cast it seemed rather weak compared to just casting TfK and winning etc.

[Hi-Val]

Have you tried this with Intuition? I found when I was playing around with it many moons ago that the problem with the Draw-7s was that they were too big of an effect, letting the opponent bounce back just as easily. Intuition solved those problems, being able to grab Welder or some Fat Beats. The added benefit of being able to hardcast whatever beater the opponent gives you is strong as well. Finally, it costs 1 less mana, so it can go off a Gilded Lotus a lot faster. The strength of Chalice and Gilded Lotus in this deck is amazing; I have a personal soft spot for Memnarch myself (partially because of my soft spot for Smmenen).

[Covetous]

In this deck, I might think that the fourth Gifts is better than FoF.  Certainly the fourth Gifts is better than the much-too-even Wheel.  I will echo that MemJar is really nasty, but possibly unnecessary because you aren't going to drop 3 6/7-cost cards in one turn.  The deck has too many expensive cards and too many spells as opposed to permanents, and simply might not need the Jar.  

I don't know whether the 3cc intuition is better than the 4cc Gifts.  Intuition searches out fewer cards and doesn't give you +1 card, but it can guarantee what you get.  Have you tested both and decided that Gifts is better?

I would consider running a more diverse and larger threat base, by cutting the draw-7's for 2 more large things, ending up with:
Jester's Cap (so the bomb)
PentaBus
Smmemnarch
2 Mindslaver
Trike (he rules)
Big Platz (why not just win sometimes?) or Dupes (removal can be good)

Just a few thoughts.

[majestyk1136]

I don't know... I think that cracking the jar during your upkeep generates such an unfair tempo swing in your favor it's impossible not to advocate it.  Even if you're only able to cast a couple of spells (due to Trinisphere) you typically can really get over on your opponent through your use of Gilded Lotus.  Who cares if you can't play the artifact fat you draw off the jar?  You're going to weld it up anyhow.  Just beware Artifact mutation on Gilded Lotus...

[Blackest Lotus]

Is there any reason why you don't include Sundering Titan? And why is this deck any better than 7/10? How has Memory Jar been, since you can rarely lay down all the cards you draw with it?

As a matter of fact, I have tested Titan before and he was the bombzor with Welders, and for some reason I have felt more comfortable with 3 Slavers, However, with Gifts, three Mindslavers is excessive and makes Tinker less powerful. So the 3rd Slaver spot might be Trike, Plats or Titan.

Memory Jar has been pretty good. I have had very little problems with throwing away cards I wanted to hardcast, mostly blue cards. But everything else is expendable, extra lands and expensive artifacts can be chucked with not much of a second thought. Anything else can be Brainstormed to the top of my library. When I do use it, though, it rocks. Every now and then Jar does force you to toos out some good stuff, sometimes fate throws you junk.

My first thought when I saw this was that titan would be a good replacement for a slaver - with gifts, you don't have to worry about seeing a slaver as much as you otherwise might do, and having an extra artifact to gifts for if the need arises would prove useful, I imagine.

Do you want the third gifts over windfall? Having played some similar lists in the past, I know I always liked having FoF (the most comparable card to gifts for the current situation, even though they have different functions), but I'm wondering whether you've got too many in there. Just a thought.

Seems like a decent effort to revive the deck, though. Nice one.

Tom

Yep, the 3rd Gifts is FARRRR better than Windfall. Windfall is inconsistent. Not only does it rarely ever draw you 7 cards, it is still governed by chance, you can get crap off it. However, Gifts sets up an infinite Slaver lock, and fills the graveyard for Goblin Welder fun.

Maybe its just me but I dont exactly see the point in running that high of # of threats (especially in multiples) if you have that many ways to fetch and chuck them into the graveyard. It seems a little overboard in spots where the draw 7's (which i believe are musts) would be better fits.

Oath doesnt seem like it would be that large of a problem considering the deck can run trinisphere and more importantly chalice of the void set at 1 consistently turn 1 or 2. Though board hate does help... I personally thought that Gifts just didnt fit the deck, and even with tombs (which i have always ran anyway) getting the 4 mana to cast it seemed rather weak compared to just casting TfK and winning etc.

In all actuality, they, Draw 7's, are not. Sure they look nice on paper, but they are inconsistent. THIS is the decks largest problem. Sometimes they give you crap. And what's far worse is that they give your opponent more cards to kill your Welders, and generally fuck up your day. The only reason I am even using Wheel and Jar is that they have advantages over other D7s as Wheel is a discard outlet, and Jar lessens the impact of giving your opponent a new hand, and is recurrable. Still, they need to be replaced. It's far better to resolve a Gifts for huge BOMBS than chance it with Twister, Wheel and Co. and get hand of jank.

Your last statement confuses me somewhat. TFK is better if you have the pieces in hand or draw into them. However, A resolved Gifts will set you for an infinite Slaver lock. A resolved Gifts is nuts. Simply nuts. Especially seeing as how you can hardcast what they give you as well.

Have you tried this with Intuition? I found when I was playing around with it many moons ago that the problem with the Draw-7s was that they were too big of an effect, letting the opponent bounce back just as easily. Intuition solved those problems, being able to grab Welder or some Fat Beats. The added benefit of being able to hardcast whatever beater the opponent gives you is strong as well. Finally, it costs 1 less mana, so it can go off a Gilded Lotus a lot faster. The strength of Chalice and Gilded Lotus in this deck is amazing; I have a personal soft spot for Memnarch myself (partially because of my soft spot for Smmenen).

I have tested with Intuition and it was a pretty good. The most signifigant things that it has over Gifts is that its is 1 colorless cheaper, which is huge, and just as important it can tutor for Goblin Welder, like you said. I might go ahead and replace the remaining 2 D7s with Intuition.

Everytime you cast you have to scream "SMEMNARCH!" Not only does it freak people out, it's just freakin sweet.

In this deck, I might think that the fourth Gifts is better than FoF. Certainly the fourth Gifts is better than the much-too-even Wheel. I will echo that MemJar is really nasty, but possibly unnecessary because you aren't going to drop 3 6/7-cost cards in one turn. The deck has too many expensive cards and too many spells as opposed to permanents, and simply might not need the Jar.

I don't know whether the 3cc intuition is better than the 4cc Gifts. Intuition searches out fewer cards and doesn't give you +1 card, but it can guarantee what you get. Have you tested both and decided that Gifts is better?

I would consider running a more diverse and larger threat base, by cutting the draw-7's for 2 more large things, ending up with:
Jester's Cap (so the bomb)
PentaBus
Smmemnarch
2 Mindslaver
Trike (he rules)
Big Platz (why not just win sometimes?) or Dupes (removal can be good)

Just a few thoughts.

Fact or Fiction vs Gifts Ungiven- The uses for these cards seem very subtle, and I am unsure of whether or not to replace the FoF with the 4th Gifts. FoF digs deeper, can get you more than 2 cards, and can also fetch Welders. Gifts sets you up for the win, and gets you what you want. You can also fine tune what you will recieve, instead of blindly digging. So, I am unsure of which is better.

I like the extra card you get from Gifts. I think I might actually run them both though. I am not too sure. From testing though, Gifts and Intuition are both solid choices for the deck, which is better I can not say....yet. Maybe I will proxy up some decks and get busy, like I should.

I do agree with the inclusion of Trike, not so much with Platty and much less with Duplicant. More testing must be done!!

Thanks for all the comments!

[Maabush]

Hi all, this is my first post, i'm little excited  :lol:

i love ws.slaver and i play a list that is little different from your, i'll show you

“Workshop Slavery

Mana Sources-27
4 Volcanic Island   
4 Shivan Reef
4 Mishra’s Workshop
2 Ancient Tomb
1 Tolarian Academy
1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Pearl
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mana Vault
3 Gilded Lotus

Draw/Tutors-16
4 Brainstorm
4 Thirst for Knowledge   
3 Gifts Ungiven   
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Wheel of Fortune
1 Memory Jar

PHEAR OF GOD-9
4 Goblin Welder
3 Mindslaver
1 Pentavus
1 Memnarch

Disruption-8
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void

mana

i play with fetches and islands, instead of shivan reef(in your metagame there aren't bloodmoon?)

-4 shivan reef
+4 flooded strand
-1 gilded
-1 ancient tomb
+2 island

phear of god  

-1 mindslaver
+1 sundering

i think 2 mindslaver are enought, and sundering can say a lot of things to our opponents  

disruption

it's the same  

draw

i use timetwister instead of wheel, i know that wheel is usefull to discard our menaces, but i prefer twister, 'cause it's like a reset(usefull when the shit is all over our head, and is pitchable by force of will...don't forget)

gifts ungiven...welll, don't you think 3 are too much?

when you resolve the first, i think you get the best your deck has, and the second one? you get only useless cards(ok, not so useless, but not the best, assuming that the opponent discard the best 2 of 4   )

i play 1 gift, 1 frantic search(simply great) and time walk(why not in your list?)

i don't talk about the sideboard list , 'cause i don't have a final one(but i'm working on it)..

[Blackest Lotus]

I really don't expect Bloodmoon anywhere, seeing as how most decks have evolved to the point where it is only a minor annoyance. So zero to very little chance of BM or BtB in my meta. It is also a more aggro oriented meta, so more "real" mana sources against Wastes are helpful.

Currently I play Triskelion over the 3rd Slaver. Better against aggro.

In my opinion, 3 Gifts is optimal because you want to draw at least one. the other two are there because they can get Duressed or countered, and the second one pitches to force. Or if you resolve your first one, then you win, and it doesn't really matter what you draw after that because the game, for all intents and purposes, is over.

Frantic Search is a horrible topdeck. See above on Timewalk.

[Maabush]

well, you're not sure that resolving a gift let you win(get a great advantage ok, but not win). may be you're right that duress and fow may limit the use of this card, so 2x may be good..but 3 is a slot-waste.

frantic search is very synergic with this archetype, three lands untapped may let you strike a big shot(memnarch, pentavus and mindslaver are very mana intensive), or just draw some other things(thirst and so on)...

when i topdeck frantic i always smile  :lol:  (only if you have 0 cards in hand is lesser usefull, but considering the draw engine we have...it's a  rare situation)

[Blackest Lotus]

Current list-

- Mindslaver
- Wheel of Fortune
- Memory Jar

+ Mystical Tutor
+ Sundering Titan
+ Triskelion

With three Gifts you dont need three Slavers. Two will work. Titan and Trike make Gifts better as well allowing for two strong castings instead of one. Mystical fetches Gifts or whatever you need. It is not so hot against control but I see very little of that. Draw- sevens eliminated due to their randomness.

[Maabush]

mmmm, i don't think tutor is the best choice...do you totally disagree with frantic search? this fucking limited card is a bless, trust me...does everything we wanna do in this deck..draw, discard and gives mana...in one word...excellent!!!

now i'm trying with only two gifts, and i think this mid-way is the best solution(the third gift is ALWAYS a dead card...).

trisky main deck is a nice choice..may be i'll promove one from the sideboards(as the 61th card...i don't really know what to leave :lol: )..

[Blackest Lotus]

There are many reasons why I dislike Frantic Search.

It does not produce any card advantage, it only filters. This deck does not need anything like that. The fact that it is free is only a slight plus, it should not be included as a mana producer, add another Gilded Lotus if that is what you are looking for. The deck also doesn't need any more discard outlets. 4 TFK, 3 GU, 1 FOF is enough. Don't forget the deck also plays Mishra's Workshops for a reason. You don't always need to discard artifacts, you can hardcast them.

Compared to Mystical Tutor, Frantic pales in comparison. Mystical always gets you what you want, and is cheaper by a wide margin.

[Maabush]

it's not rare to play a frantic search and than to play a tfk, looking for 5 cards instead of 3...deep search it's a winning strategy for this archetype.

if i don't remember workshop, you're forgetting welder  :lol:

this card is the REAL winning condition of this deck. we don't have a lot of fatties to hardcast instantly. the best thing(also the first we have to cast) we can hardcast is a chalice(followed by gilded).

if we have a chalice with 2 counter in play we can start our "draw session", and so, more we draw,faster we win...

[Covetous]

The deck needs ways to draw cards, i.e. make n(cards in hand) --> n(cards in hand) + x.  Frantic search makes n(cards in hand) = n(cards in hand) - 1. This is not an improvement.  I would run Intuition over Frantic Search any day of the week and not think twice.  Frantic Search isn't really that good, it just has the potential to be broken in storm decks, etc.  If UG madness doesn't play it (where it would theoretically be great), then that's your first indication that it's not that good.  I'm still less than convinced that FoF > GU.  I guess that FoF can be a 4cc impulse for a welder or something, but it often can just suck.  Mystical tutor certainly can be very good in this type of deck, where resolving an instant or sorcery bomb often wins games.

[Toad]

Frantic Search is terrible. Intuition is far better, but implies you have to make some slight changes to the build to make It good even if you don't have a Welder on the board. It also gives you a great access to the Crucible of Worlds combo, if used.

[Maabush]

intuition in this deck sucks like a whore... gifts ungiven >>>> intuition

it costs 1 more(not a problem), but it gives 1 more menace to menage with welders...

intuition is usefull when we just need one copy of that card, and in this deck there are not a lot of 4x to gain advantage from it...i think we can't use intuition to get welder, because it's like to kill 2 of our best friends...this is a waste...

frantic search: i don't understand what is the "hate point" against this card...obviously it's not a good idea to declare this when we have no cards in hand...but when we have 3 or 4 cards and a bit of mana(and this deck can provide it...), frantic become a bomb...may be also usefull to gain a lot of mana from our workshop...

P.S. sorry, but there is no cow combo in this deck  

[majestyk1136]

Frantic search has the potential to create mana under a limited number of situations with this deck.  You have to have Tolarian + a couple artifacts or 2-3 non-workshop lands + a workshop and a mox or something to be even moderately impressive.  Your main source of casting colored spells lays with tapping Gilded Lotus.  That is poor synergy with FS.  Use anything but this.

[Covetous]

This deck is based around gilded lotus, not tolarian academy.  Frantic Search does not combo with Gilded Lotus.  The stated situation where you have an empty hand and topdeck Frantic Search but it sucks is very telling about how terrible the card is.  This deck tends to crap out its hand early and require re-filling.  This is why draw-7's were originally used in the deck--you need cards and if you slave then it's irrelevant what your opponent has.  I'm not necessarily saying that draw-7's are necessary now, but the necessity of using cards that draw more cards for you is illustrated by this concept.  

The situation where you have FS and an active welder and cards in hand is irrelevant because if you have this condition, you are already winning and intuition or gifts ungiven will be a strong play, and both cases will be better than playing FS.  Frantic search == complete dog crap.  It is playable in TPS only because of storm and synergy with lands.

EDIT:
I have been trying to accommodate the different suggestions mentioned in this thread into a single decklist, and this is what I came up with:
Threats (9):
4 Goblin Welder
2 Mindslaver
1 Pentavus
1 Memnarch
1 Triskelion
Card Draw (13):
4 Brainstorm
4 Thirst for Knowledge
3 Gifts Ungiven / Intuition
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Ancestral Recall
Disruption (8):
4 Force of Will
4 Chalice of the Void
Other Useful Things (5):
1 Crucible of Worlds
1 Tinker
3 Gilded Lotus
Mana Sources (25):  
8 SoLoMoxCrypt
1 Mana Vault
4 Volcanic Island
3 Flooded Strand
1 Island
1 Seat of the Synod / Darksteel Citadel
1 Strip Mine
4 Mishra’s Workshop
1 Ancient Tomb
1 Tolarian Academy

Does this seem like a reasonable series of changes for this deck?  The question of whether or not this deck is truly viable is a different story...

[Toad]

intuition in this deck sucks like a whore... gifts ungiven >>>> intuition

it costs 1 more(not a problem), but it gives 1 more menace to menage with welders...

The 1 mana difference often matters. You should not assume you'll always have a Gilded Lotus on the board. Smart players will always counter it if possible.

intuition is usefull when we just need one copy of that card, and in this deck there are not a lot of 4x to gain advantage from it...i think we can't use intuition to get welder, because it's like to kill 2 of our best friends...this is a waste...

Intuition for Gilded Lotus if you need one.
Intuition for Goblin Welder if that wins you the game.
Intution for whatever you want with Goblin Welder on the board will win you the game.

frantic search: i don't understand what is the "hate point" against this card...obviously it's not a good idea to declare this when we have no cards in hand...but when we have 3 or 4 cards and a bit of mana(and this deck can provide it...), frantic become a bomb...may be also usefull to gain a lot of mana from our workshop...

Frantic Search is terrible because you lose a card. The untap is quite irrelevant most of the time for such a costed spell. Running Frantic Search there is like running Careful Study. You wouldn't run Careful Study right?

P.S. sorry, but there is no cow combo in this deck  

There should.

[Maabush]

what you wrote is right, but is right just if we have 0 cards in hand(and with this draw engine we'll have a lot of chances to have more cards than 0), if you can use the mana that fs provide us...well, it's another story...

just to show ya an example: a play fs, then i discard a slaver, untap my lands, exchange slaver with an artifact, and with the mana fs gave us...i'll make your turn...


i play ws.slavery with 4 volcanic, 2 island, 4 fetch, 1 tolaria, 1 ancient tomb e 4 ws...i don't have only gilded lotus...just if i use fs and i untap ancient tomb i gain 1 more mana...

this deck is really mana intensive

mana is usefull for:

slaver
memnarch
pentavus

+ everything we wanna cast...

if we support those 3 cards, we have the match in our hands....

[Wollblad]

The deck still has the same inconsistency problem it had from the beginning: The Workshops are underused often effectivly loosing you a land drop leaving you with 2 ordinary mana and 3 Worhsop mana turn two, a combination that the deck cannot use for much at all but casting Gilded Lotus which is far from commonly available. Compare with Satx which often can use all of its mana each turn the first three turns and compare to this deck which seldom uses all man on turn two and/or three.

The question is not which of Intuition or Gifts that is best (or worst), instead, the focus must be on what artifacts that can be included that are good round two drops, becasue that is what this deck is lacking. Crucible is not bad at all, but does not pose a threat round two which is necessary. I want to get away from the ideal play: 1) workshop+mox+chalice, 2) land+gilded+a good spell. I want to be able to go 1) workshop+mox+chalice, 2) land+brainstorm/welder+good artifact. Thus the artifact must cost 3 or 4 and help the deck to come closer to slaving its oponent.

EDIT: I agree that Frantic Search sucks for reasons already given by Toad.

[Moxlotus]

You are going to have 3 non MWS lands to tap and untap with Frantic Search?  Why not be able to use your artifact mana and not cast a card disadvantage spell.

[Blackest Lotus]

The deck still has the same inconsistency problem it had from the beginning: The Workshops are underused often effectivly loosing you a land drop leaving you with 2 ordinary mana and 3 Worhsop mana turn two, a combination that the deck cannot use for much at all but casting Gilded Lotus which is far from commonly available. Compare with Satx which often can use all of its mana each turn the first three turns and compare to this deck which seldom uses all man on turn two and/or three.

The question is not which of Intuition or Gifts that is best (or worst), instead, the focus must be on what artifacts that can be included that are good round two drops, becasue that is what this deck is lacking. Crucible is not bad at all, but does not pose a threat round two which is necessary. I want to get away from the ideal play: 1) workshop+mox+chalice, 2) land+gilded+a good spell. I want to be able to go 1) workshop+mox+chalice, 2) land+brainstorm/welder+good artifact. Thus the artifact must cost 3 or 4 and help the deck to come closer to slaving its oponent.

EDIT: I agree that Frantic Search sucks for reasons already given by Toad.

I have not been a large fan of Crucible because it doesnt have a lot of offensive potential, you have to run suboptimal cards, a Strip Mine or an artifact land to start welding. Once you do then the deck starts looking  a lot like Goth Slaver.

The problem with adding additonal artifacts is that I havent found any to make the deck better. You can add Tangle wires and Smokestacks, but then the deck starts to act more like a bad Stax deck. The reason I play the deck is because Mindslaver acts like ALL the Stax components wrapped into one. So that eliminates most lock parts. Another good suggestion was adding Jesters Cap. Which seems decent. And that's all I got.

P.S Frantic still sucks.

[Whatever Works]

I have had a lot of success with a version that took out the brainstorms... My list looks something like this only going to mention some of the more key changes...

3 Ancient Tomb (this card is amazing in the deck for the version I run the usfulness of the card has no end when you run 4 Thirsts and 3 Intuitions...
4 Thirst For Knowledge (standard)
3 Intuition (this card is better than Gifts ungiven in testing because you can consistently cast it turn 2, and it can guarantee you get the card you want (ie FoW, Welder, etc.)
NO Brainstorm (this card was usually awful, and I wold rather be casting something big like Chalice (which is usually set at 1 or 2 anyway)...
4 Trinisphere (With brainstorm out of the deck I can successfully fit these into the deck while maintaining the steady manabase...also it fits well in the maindeck sinse I can still cast everything like Welder with a Volcanic Island, and ancient tomb... 1 of the reasons this wasnt run maindeck was because of brainstorm which is now not in the deck to prevent its use.)
removing brainstorm, and adding Intuition etc. has kept my # of blue cards high enough to be able to successfully suport FoW.

Any deck that can cast chalice for 1 or 2 or cast trinisphere with FoW back up turn 1 should be able to compete. In testing my results vs. Control Slaver have been over 55% at a minimum.

[Wollblad]

4 Trinisphere (With brainstorm out of the deck I can successfully fit these into the deck while maintaining the steady manabase...also it fits well in the maindeck sinse I can still cast everything like Welder with a Volcanic Island, and ancient tomb... 1 of the reasons this wasnt run maindeck was because of brainstorm which is now not in the deck to prevent its use.)

Any deck that can cast chalice for 1 or 2 or cast trinisphere with FoW back up turn 1 should be able to compete. In testing my results vs. Control Slaver have been over 55% at a minimum.

But then you are taking out the card that gives the deck some kind of consistency. Also, how good is it to slave your opponent if he cannot do much to sabotage for himselfe? I have also tested the configuration but found it to be just bad. I often foudn myselfe unable to play my FoW when I needed and that when I managed to slave my oppenent, he was so locked under Trinisphere that I often lost more resources slaving him than it gave back.