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Author Topic: Sword of Kaldra and Kamigawa Dragons  (Read 1520 times)
LotusHead
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« on: March 26, 2005, 02:35:46 am »

I have a ping deck with a random Sword of Kaldra. Ping a creature, remove it from the game.

I equipped it to my flying 2/2 Savant (now 7/7) and chumped my opponent's incoming Kamigawa Dragon (5/5 probably).

A bystander commented that the Dragon actually goes to the graveyard due to state based effects, and is not removed from the game as per Sword.

Is this true? I can't decide for sure. Some relevent rules for you would be judges out there. Thanks in advance!

310.1. As the combat damage step begins, the active player announces how each attacking creature will assign its combat damage. Then the defending player announces how each blocking creature will assign its combat damage. All assignments of combat damage go on the stack as a single object. Then any abilities that triggered on damage being assigned go on the stack. (See rule 410, “Handling Triggered Abilities.”) Then the active player gets priority and players may play spells and abilities.

410.2. Whenever a game event or game state matches a triggered ability’s trigger event, that ability triggers. When a phase or step begins, all abilities that trigger “at the beginning of” that phase or step trigger. The ability doesn’t do anything when it triggers but automatically puts the ability on the stack as soon as a player would receive priority. The ability is controlled by the player who controlled its source at the time it triggered. It has the text of the ability that created it, and no other characteristics.

420.5c A creature with lethal damage, but greater than 0 toughness, is destroyed. Lethal damage is an amount of damage greater than or equal to a creature’s toughness. Regeneration can replace this event.

420.3. Whenever a player would get priority (see rule 408, “Timing of Spells and Abilities”), the game checks for any of the listed conditions for state-based effects. All applicable effects resolve as a single event, then the check is repeated. Once no more state-based effects have been generated, triggered abilities go on the stack, and then the appropriate player gets priority. This check is also made during the cleanup step (see rule 314); if any of the listed conditions apply, the active player receives priority.
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Tristal
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« Reply #1 on: March 26, 2005, 04:25:05 am »

Equipped creature gets +5/+5.
Whenever equipped creature deals damage to a creature, remove that creature from the game.

This is a triggered ability.  The damage isn't 'dealt' until combat damage resolves.  Since your 7/7 crushed his 5/5, when SBEs check they notice two things: that Sword needs to trigger, and that the 5/5 has lethal damage and should be placed in a graveyard.

Both happen, but when the trigger attempts to resolve, it will find that the creature no longer exists, so there will be nothing to remove.
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No longer a DCI Level 1 Judge.  Just a guy who likes rules knowledge.
LotusHead
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« Reply #2 on: March 26, 2005, 12:00:55 pm »

So if my opponent's Dragon had 8 toughness and survived the combat damage, then it would be removed from the game? but it died in actual combat so it goes to the grave? Weird. I've been playing this deck forever and this is the first time this has come up.

Magic is so brainiac.

Thanks!
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