CS in a wide open metagame

[tpiro]

Hi guys,

  There's all this discussion in the forum about what is the optimum build of this or that, but what if you are not in the "ideal metagame." I have a control slaver deck and I'm thinking of playing in an upcoming tournament. This tournament does not allow proxies, so my guess is that there won't be that much power. My question is, how flexible should I make my deck? Should I worry about random elf and goblin decks, or should I let the power lead me to victory. My current build is (sorry, no mox pearl):

4 Island
4 Volcanic Island
2 Underground Sea
3 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Tolarian Accademy
1 Strip Mine
1 Library of Alexandria
1 Darksteel Citadel

1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Jet
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt

4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
4 Thirst for Knowledge

4 Goblin Welder
1 Gorrila Shaman
1 Pentavus
1 Triskelion
1 Mindslaver
1 Platimun Angel

1 Ancestral Recall
1 Time Walk
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Tinker
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Echoing Truth
1 Fire/Ice

Sideboard:
2 Tormod's Crypt
3 Arcane Laboratory
1 Echoing Truth
1 Gorilla Shaman
3 Rack And Ruin
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Pyroclasm

Is it worth changing this build around drastically to prepare for a wide open metagame?...For example Engineered Explosives may be good in such a metagame, and Gorilla Shaman may be unnecessary. Maybe more Fire/Ice in the maindeck or at least in the sideboard? What do you guys think?

[Moxlotus]

1 Strip Mine
1 Library of Alexandria

What's with the Strip Mine? 

A few builds don't include Library because it doesn't produce blue.  You want Drain up on turn 2.  If it is included, it is in control heavy metas, and your metagame doesn't sound like it will be a control heavy meta.

[absolute]

Without Crucible of Worlds there is no apparent need for the citadel or strip mine, and Library should be your only colorless mana source. The inclusion of platinum is 'comfortable', although it would be assumed that a duplicant or second mindslaver would be superior (triskelion will dominate random aggro, and isn't as easily fought around). Other than that the deck should be fairly well rounded, and engineered explosives isn't needed with the inclusion of a well rounded 'creature base' and tutorable answers (which you have). Finally, it should be noted that control slaver isn't suited for the "random metagame."

[PipOC]

In an unknown or diverse metagame, I definitely wouldn't include platinum angel in the main.  She's only good against combo and occasionally shop aggro.  Like the above posters said, lands that don't produce blue are generally suboptimal and should only be included if A) you're running crucible, which is commonly considered a bad move, and I personally discourage it, as it reduces the amount of metagame slots you have available and B) Library, if you're in a high control metagame.  I think that rack and ruin is generally a superior inclusion to Fire/Ice as it often will just serve as mana denial, but randomly it's amazing and can remove multiple threats.  I'd also highly encourage you to play a majority of snow-covered islands, as they can frequently trick your opponents into thinking you're playing Gifts and casue them to misplay.

My suggestions would be

-1 Platinum
-1 Darksteel Citadel
-1 Library
-1 Strip mine
-1 Fire/ Ice
-4 island

+1 Gifts Ungiven
+1 Rack and Ruin
+1 Mindslaver
+1 Fetchland
+5 Snow Covered

[tpiro]

> Finally, it should be noted that control slaver isn't suited for the "random metagame."

Okay, what is best for a random metagame? Would Oath be better? Anything else? I don't have workshops, so that's out of the question.

[Xman]

+5 Snow Covered

I have never understood the reaosning behind runnign snow covered lands or regular lands.  Both can be stripped.  Both can be fetched.  It really doesn't make a difference.  Why run these over islands?

[the boogie man]

I'm not sure why he's doing, but normally you'd run1-2 snow covered, making them accessible to gifts ungiven.

[Arvid]

He's doing it to trick the opponent he's playing Gifts.

[forests failed you]

Okay guys.  Citadel and Fire/Ice are both maindeck worthy cards.  I played both in my maindeck at GenCon and they were both fantastic.  Just because Crucible isn't in the deck, doesn't mean that Citadel isn't great.  It does so much.  It is an artifact that can be eaten by Shaman, it allows you to Tinker around Chalice 0 and 1, it powers up Tolerian Academey, and it can't be Striped.

As for Fire / Ice.  I would strongly recomend playing at least one card that kills creatures in the maindeck of Slaver.  Xantid Swarm, Gorilla Shaman, and Opposing Goblin Welders are a big Problem; especially on turn one.  You can't always count on Mystical Tutor for Tinker Trisk on turn one.  Sometimes you only make two Mana on turn two.  Not to mention that if Trisk is already in your hand you run the risk of losing to a turn two Dragon or Tendrils because of the little green bug. 

Also, there is no reason to maindeck Rack and Ruin in a wide open metagame.  I only decided to do that after I watched the qualifying event and saw 10 Shop decks at tables 1-8 at GenCon.  From what I understand of Tpiro's situation and metagame playing with cards that kill creatures and deal with random threats are probably going to be the way to go.

I would make the following changes for a random metagame.

-Library of Alexandria
-Polluted Delta
-Platnum Angel

+Mana Vault
+Mindslaver
+Fact or Fiction

Playing without Mana Vault is clearly a mistake.  Slaver loves all of the fast artifact mana that it can make.  And the fact that it costs 1 instead of 0, in a time dominated by the power of Chalice of the Void makes it all the sweeter.  I personally always play two Mindslaver, and I don't understand why people cut the second to play another Robot.  The deck is called Slaver after all, and that is where it gets its bustedness from.  If a player just wants to beat down with fat robots they should be playing CA.  Dubs Mindslaver is the hotness, you should at least test it out. 

Also, I agree that playing a maindeck Platnium Angel probably isn't the best move right now.  Type 1 has adapted to the point where she doesn't really steal you games the way that she used to, and everybody has ways to get rid of her.  If you really want to play a third robot I would opt for a Sundering Titan.  I don't really like him personally, but he is savage in underdeveloped Metagames where opposing players try and do  dumb stuff like "curve out" and beatdown.

I also think that Fact or Fiction should be an auto include in Slaver.  The deck doesn't draw as many cards as Gifts does and it is a problem.  Fact gives you another way to draw cards besides Brainstorm, Recall, and TFK.  Also, when an opponent drops Chains Fact is the best card in the deck.  It is a midgame card, however when your opponent is Slavered it says put five in the grip.

Those are my random thoughts on your list.


And one last thing.

Right now Slaver is the best deck to play in a random meta.  It is slow, but consistent, and can beat any deck in the format if played well.  CS is essentially the new Keeper it is the slow, but steady, control deck that beats everything when played correctly.  It is the most versitile deck in the format and can answer everything one throws against it.  You just have to live through the first three turns and have land on the board.  The other Savage thing about Slaver is that it can win lots of matches on the draw.

Cheers,
Brian

Playing Snow-Covered Island gives you little to zero strategic advantage.   Good players know their roles and when they see an Island  know they have a job to do.  Any matchup, Stax, Combo, Fish, et cetera knows it has to beat Drain, and is going to try and do so.  Regardless of whether that Drain deck kills via Slaver, Tendrils, or Decree of Justice.  It doesn't matter.  I refuse to play SC Island on principle...  It looks awful next to hot cards.

[elias]

I guess upping the number of Triskellions in a random field would give you the edge against the many aggro decks you could be facing. Duplicant in the SB against oath seem a good idea.

Cutting brainstorm for impulse as a foil to Chalice for 1 is something I've been meddling with. It weakens the "hiding cards from duress aspect", but overall, I'm liking it better.

cheers and good luck.

PS, I find that having 2 mindslavers is optimal. as it prevents random phyrexian furnace activations...

[Xenoben187]

Right now Slaver is the best deck to play in a random meta.  It is slow, but consistent, and can beat any deck in the format if played well.  CS is essentially the new Keeper it is the slow, but steady, control deck that beats everything when played correctly.  It is the most versitile deck in the format and can answer everything one throws against it.  You just have to live through the first three turns and have land on the board.  The other Savage thing about Slaver is that it can win lots of matches on the draw.

I agree 100% with almost everything said in this post, (besides pitching LoA).  My maindeck at Gencon was nearly identical to Brian's and I came in 26th and was 4-1-1 going into the 7th round. 

I think, Bob Yu said it best with his analysis of CS, CS is a 55 card deck with 5 metagame slots making it the most versatile deck in the format and the best deck to play in a random metagame.  I most of the time like to fill those 5 slots with slaver #2, trike, shaman, vamp, and lavadart/fire ice.  But those five slots can just as easilly be DSC, Tormod's Crypt, Gifts, Vamp, Rack and Ruin for a different metagame.

But, Slaver is a deck about knowing the deckl and testing first, and metagame choices second.

[cosineme]

" It is a midgame card, however when your opponent is Slavered it says put five in the grip."



I didn't know this about FoF. Can you make a split pile like this? 0 in one pile, 5 in the ohter?

[Luiggi]

I didn't know this about FoF. Can you make a split pile like this? 0 in one pile, 5 in the ohter?

Yup. Fact or Fiction says that an opponent separtes them into two piles, and those piles can contain anywhere from 0 to 5 cards.

Luiggi

[_Conca_]

I think you could play 3/4 Duress in side


this is my sideboard:

2 Tormod's Crypt
4 Chalice of the Void
1 Jester Cap
3 Rack And Ruin
2 Red Elemental Blast
3 Duress

[Disburden]

I'm having trouble seeing the reasoning behind cutting Library for a metagame call. To me this isn't a metagame card and shouldn't be cut unless you don't own the card yourself and can't afford to push the proxy limit.

Every time I've gotten Library first turn against ANY deck I've basically been able to achive huge card advantage over my opponent and create a huge pressure on them. How is Library less good turn one in a meta that isn't tons of drain/control? Either way you're going to get more cards and see more threats in your hand and eventually lock out faster because of it.

[absolute]

Okay guys.  Citadel and Fire/Ice are both maindeck worthy cards.  I played both in my maindeck at GenCon and they were both fantastic.  Just because Crucible isn't in the deck, doesn't mean that Citadel isn't great.  It does so much.  It is an artifact that can be eaten by Shaman, it allows you to Tinker around Chalice 0 and 1, it powers up Tolerian Academey, and it can't be Striped.

Fire/Ice is a wonderful maindeck card in a random metagame, although I don't agree that the citadel has enough benefits to outweigh Library, or for that matter, strip mine. The citadel is a land in your opening grip that you can't use that instant, and is only useful with tinker, and in the face of a strip/waste lock. In the first situation I would have to say I have been less than satisfied with not having drain mana up second turn without a reason, even at the risk I may not be able to use a land for that one restricted bomb in my deck. Under a strip or waste lock there is the ability to refuse breaking a fetch. Basically it boils down to the fact that citadel is often just an artifact that says "I'll sit here until I'm useful", where another basic/library/strip can be used now.

Right now Slaver is the best deck to play in a random meta.  It is slow, but consistent, and can beat any deck in the format if played well.  CS is essentially the new Keeper it is the slow, but steady, control deck that beats everything when played correctly.  It is the most versitile deck in the format and can answer everything one throws against it.  You just have to live through the first three turns and have land on the board.  The other Savage thing about Slaver is that it can win lots of matches on the draw.

Slaver is a versetile deck, and is very dependant upon player skill, feeding off from what decks are winning currently. Slaver has a leniently good matchup verses anything with artifacts, although I dont think that any of the decks you have noted are to be considered those described from a random metagame.

[forests failed you]

The reason I don't like Library is that it is a card that sets you up to win in the mid to late game.  Slaver already wins in the mid to late game if the game goes that far.  It is redundent.  Slaver needs more cards to help it win when it is already losing or in jeoparday of losing.  Tinkering around Chalice or ripping a Gorilla Shaman are often the only way you can win games against  Fish when they play first and drop a Chalice.  Also, in the mid to late game you can always pitch Citadel to TFK and net card advantage, whereas a LOA is worthless and requires another card to be pitched. 

[Xenoben187]

The reason I don't like Library is that it is a card that sets you up to win in the mid to late game. Slaver already wins in the mid to late game if the game goes that far. It is redundent. Slaver needs more cards to help it win when it is already losing or in jeoparday of losing. Tinkering around Chalice or ripping a Gorilla Shaman are often the only way you can win games against Fish when they play first and drop a Chalice. Also, in the mid to late game you can always pitch Citadel to TFK and net card advantage, whereas a LOA is worthless and requires another card to be pitched.

Well, you know how much I like library (I was your round 1 opponent at Chicago).  It just wins games sometimes.

[forests failed you]

Well that changes everything then!!!

I was actually playing Gifts Slaver then, and I had Library in that deck as well.

I worry about decks that play Chalice of the Void and beat down.  Drawing cards doesn't help you beat that deck the way it does in the control mirror.  I am also worried about Gorilla Shaman.  Since GenCon (and possibly partly because of my own insistence that he is a maindeck MUST in Slaver) he is showing up a lot more.

Also, Mark Biller's list that won GenCon last year included two Darksteel Citadel and 0 Library of Alexandria.  I'm not convinced it is necessary.  But I've been wrong before.  It is definately good in control heavy Metagames where the majority of the decks you play against do not attack your Mana Base or try to beat down.