MaskNought - aggro/control

[And11]

During the last couple of weeks, me and a pal have been toying around with this thing. We came up with an aggro/control deck featuring the deadly combo of Illusionary Mask and Phyrexian Dreadnought, mana denial and rock solid answers for all hate aimed at our combo. Please note that you do not _need_ the combo components to pull off a win, since we also added MoxMonkeys and Mishra's Factory and the Standstill engine.

The perfect hand would feature first turn Illusionary Mask, but if that does not happen, you wanna lay back, draw some cards, deliver some beats and eat some mana sources until it shows up. The list:

beatz: 15
4x Illusionary Mask (Makes your dudes uncounterable and sneaks the Deadly Nought into play)
4x Phyrexian Dreadnought (Fat beats that laughs at Colossus, but watch out for Giant Growth!)
3x Gorilla Shaman (Contributes to the manadenial strategy and swings for a few damage points)
4x Mishra's Factory (Solid beater that rocks with Standstill)

draw/search: 13
4x Brainstorm (Digs deep to find that missing Mask or Nought and pitches to FoW)
4x Standstill (Great with a Mask or Factory in play and is the best draw engine available for this deck)
1x Ancestral Recall
1x Demonic Tutor
1x Mystical Tutor (Easy access to Ancestral, Rack and Ruin, Time Walk and Will. It might be suboptimal though)
1x Vampiric Tutor (Finds all the above PLUS Mask and Dreadnought. Sweet card)
1x Demonic Consultation (Mask, Dread, Fire/Ice, Force...I wouldn't cut it)

removal/answers: 10
4x Force of Will
3x Fire/Ice (Welder removal is very important in here. You can cycle it or pitch it to FoW or MisD if you don't need it)
2x Misdirection (You really want to resolve Illusionary Mask early and MisD helps you do that perfectly.)
1x Rack and Ruin (Very nice tool to have maindeck, since Null Rod, Workshops and moxen are out there)

b0rk3n: 2
1x Time Walk (1U: 12 damage, untap, draw a card? Sign me up!)
1x Yawgmoth's Will (Very debatable, since we don't like long games. Is it too powerful to pass up?)

MANA: 20
1x Black Lotus
1x Mox Ruby
1x Mox Jet
1x Mox Sapphire
4x Wasteland (I love how this deck plays like fish, just with an actual clock instead of fancy Grizzly Bears)
4x Polluted Delta
1x Flooded Strand
1x Island
1x Badlands
1x Underground Sea
3x Volcanic Island

Quick thoughts on the deck's strengths and weaknesses:

-There's this two-card combo that often steals games early...kinda like Oath/Orchard first turn.
-Very low mana curve provides a certain protection vs. opposing Wastelands/other mana hate. This also helps getting around Mana Drain.
-It doesn't fear Welder thanks to Fire/Ice, Rack and Ruin and Gorilla Shaman.

-Phyrexian Dreadnought is a completely dead draw without the Mask and you can't afford to Brainstorm-fetch him away unless you have multiples IMO.
-After sideboard, we're kinda vulnerable to Rack and Ruin. How can we solve ths problem? I've considered adding white for Hannah's Custody, but the other colors seem superior.
-My sideboard in general is a mess and we've not settled on anything yet. We really need your help.

All thoughts and comments are welcome.

Thanks in advance,
/Andreas

[UR]

The list I ran had only two colors (U/B) and had Dark Ritual in it for additional speed. It also had some Shadowmage Infiltrators to fill my hand back up although this was definately sub-optimal. Heck, I'm currently experimenting with Dimir Cutpurse and I think it is better in Vintage because people so rarely block (whole different discussion though).

Duress was good in this deck. It doesn't really slow you down and it will get rid of that FoW (because nobody is going to just let you cast an Illusionary Mask).

I can see your point in running red. The Rack and Ruin gets you around Chalice set for 1 and 2 and the MoxMonkeys are good enough... I really like Hearth Kami though... it gets around Chalice for One and does more damage than the Monkey. I haven't tested a lot with it yet, but the first results have been promising.

[lordmayhem]

Have you given any thought at all to running some copies of Hunted Horror? They seem good to me.

Also, how about Darkblast instead of Fire//Ice? Repeatable removal against Welders is great.

And whatever happened to utility morphs? How have things worked without them?

[And11]

Gorilla Shaman does a few things better than Kami:

-Kills multiple Moxen/Chalice.
-Kills Chalice @ 2, which is pretty damn huge. If they play it @ 1, I'll be much more calm.
-Makes an opponent "rush" when played face down, since they fear the Dread.

About Hunted Horror:

-We did start out with three copies of, but it seemed that it was just sitting in hand to often doing nothing. And when we finally got the Mask into play, we had Dreadnought anyway.

Darkblast vs. Fire/Ice:

-Vs. Welders, the Blast is better, but when facing other stuff I like having the opportunity to cycle Fire/Ice or pitch it to FoW/misD. I hate having dead cards maindeck and I believe that the Blast will be exactly that sometimes. Also, I think that the deck will be a little too light on blue without Fire/Ice.

What utility morphs do you have in mind?

Thanks a lot,
/Andreas

[lordmayhem]

What utility morphs do you have in mind?

Skinthinner
Voidmage Apprentice

maybe
Willbender?

Also, what about Pithing Needle to stop opposing Kamis and Shamen?

[Necrologia]

Red doesn't seem like it adds much to the list. True, Gorilla Shaman is huge right now, but so are basics. Recoil, Rebuild, and Force should probably be enough to answer Chalice at 2, and by cutting colors you can have a rock solid mana base.

Have you tried Artificer's Intuition yet? The last Masknaught list I saw was more focused on the combo, making it the perfect inclusion. Being able to find Lotus, and both halves of your combo is amazing. If you want to go that route, Hunter Horror is definitely a great option as it gives you even more redundancy. That said, I've never seen a deck running Masknaught in a Fish skeleton.

I think the problem you're going to end up having is the high prevalence of artifact hate right now. From Welder to RnR to all manor of bounce, your naughts aren't going to be getting in as often as you'd like. In addition to Hanna's Custody white would give Enlightened Tutor for the combo, along with StP, and the various fish critters that might work in your particular build. Unfortunately, not even Custody deals with Rebuild/Hurkyl's Recall so this might simply be unable to compete in the current metagame.

[Binary]

Have you tried Artificer's Intuition yet? The last Masknaught list I saw was more focused on the combo, making it the perfect inclusion. Being able to find Lotus, and both halves of your combo is amazing.

How can you find Mask with Artificer's Intuition, seeing as how Mask costs 2 and AI only finds artifacts with a CMC of 1 or less?

I would run something like Tainted Pact first. At least it can find both halves of the combo.

[Necrologia]

How can you find Mask with Artificer's Intuition, seeing as how Mask costs 2 and AI only finds artifacts with a CMC of 1 or less?

I would run something like Tainted Pact first. At least it can find both halves of the combo.

Yeah, that's my fault. I really need to stop making quick suggestions before heading to class, I'm like 0/3 on being correct. Intuition is indeed incapable of finding Mask, the thread where it was mentioned uses it more to find narrow solutions such as Needle. With that in mind it seems quite poor.

I still like Hunted Horror in this deck. It's great with Mask, and if you could find room for 1 MD Echoing Truth it could actually be hardcast from time to time.

[Anusien]

Why no Tinker + Colossus?  I'd think that the opportunity to randomly win the game would be worth two slots, and if you need you could also Tinker out Mask to drop a Dreadnought (if you're holding Colossus with no shuffle).  I'd cut the Demonic Consultation to make room, because Consult will go to win a card that says I win, and you're essentially replacing that with a card that says "I win".

[policehq]

Artificer's Intuition and Sensei's Divining Top will find Illusionary Mask with blinding speed and efficiency.

EDIT: And I didn't mainboard Pithing Needle, instead Engineered Explosives. It's much more versatile as Slaver hate.

[Necrologia]

And I didn't mainboard Pithing Needle, instead Engineered Explosives. It's much more versatile as Slaver hate.

Not to nitpick or anything but Wolven was the guy who created the thread, and he did indeed run Needle main, with 3 in one of the lists further down. Artificer's Intuition is a nifty tutor, but I don't think using it as extra copies of naught is really all that great. Thanks to Hidden Horror you can already have 8 beefy things to squeeze through mask, the problem is actually finding the mask itself. Tainted Pact/Spoils can do this, and are also capable of finding whatever else you might need quickly and cheaply. Intuition+Top is cute, but seems really slow and clunky for a deck that's got little in the way of backup plans.

That said, none of that deals with my main criticism, that artifact hate is starting to migrate into the maindeck of many top decks. Shamen, Welder, Rack and Ruin, and Rebuild, are all major threats that this deck needs to answer before I'd be comfortable taking it to a decent sized tourney.

[astre]

kira is fine also ay protecting your dudes.

I used to play a mono U fish with mask and dreadnaught.

it was probably something like that :

4x mishra/waste/mask/dread/spiketail/chalice/FOW/standstill
3x daze/rootwater
2x kira
1x strip/trall/walk/fabricate 4 moxen/black
11 lands mix of fetch and island

I played 1 fabricate because it act as my 5th mask and 5th dread if needed. it could also in an earlier vertion fetch and crucible of world.

while this liste was solide (6 month ago) it proved to be slightly too slow and may gain of an additional splach color but that's hox the list began his life, as an URB fich with dreadnaught. I swaped the colors with blue for more consistancy...

My previous list was :

2 Volcanic Island
4 Polluted Delta
3 Island
3 underground sea
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine
5 moxen
1 black lotus

4 mask
4 dreadnought
2 shaman gorille
2 finkel   
2 kira
2 rootwater

4 Force of Will
3 Daze
4 chalice du vide

4 brainstorm
1 trall
1 time walk
1 DT
2 fire/ice
1 REB

[And11]

Morphs 'n' Horror: I honestly don't think that we need any more cards that stink in hand without Illusionary Mask and I haven't really missed this "utility" so far. I did test out the Horror, but it made me mulligan more (as in having him in my opening hand, but no Mask = mulligan).

Artificer's Intuition: I saw that thread a while back, but wasn't too excited about 3cc and it's ability to tutor out tools. This deck is all about doing damage, hating mana and negating opponent's bombs and not do to fancy tricks involving the Top or other utility stuff. That's a whole different deck IMO.

Tinker/DSC: Consultation and Will could easily go for this deadly combo. I'll test definately test it.

Rebuild/Hurkyl's Recall: Yeah, they're a pain too, but against blue I'll be sideboarding in REB to help Force and MisD's. Rack and Ruin is another story, as you won't bring in BEB in order to hate out their hate for you. That's just too narrow, since they might not even have the damn Racks.

Opposing Kami/Shaman: Fire/Ice will take care of these before they'll have 5 mana availabe to take out your Mask. And since I don't run 10x SoLoCryptVaultPetalMoxen and have a low mana curve, I'm not too woried about the Shaman.

Colors: If I were to cut red, I'd need to restructure the whole deck, since my beloved Gorilla's would be gone and therefor, my mana denial plan would be dead. He is the only thing that can't be replaced in other colors and is sooo important for the deck. Maybe MaskNought should be all about speed, instead of disruption...with Rituals and more artifact acceleration.

Thanks.

[policehq]

I'm pretty sure Wolven started the thread after reading my tournament report called DxM...

Spoils of the Vault is a horrible tutor, as much as I dearly wish that it were great.

Gorilla Shaman isn't that bad of hate against you, since they need five mana to destroy a Mask. Regarding other artifact removal, play Hanna's Custody to screw their Welders and prevent your threats from being killed.

Playing Hidden Horror is another reason to go with Artificer's Intuition, since it grabs Explosives (against Pithing Needle and 3/3's).

[Wolven]

My list was actually Mono-U... allowing for it to play minimal mana base, while making it resistant to hate.

I havn't been able to test my Masknought build in a proper event, mostly cause I'm playing with a 5c Gifts build. However, if anyone still cares here it is:

8 Island
4 Flooded Strand
1 Academy
5 Moxan
1 Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Vault
1 Mana Crypt
1 Lotus Petal


1 Colossus
4 Dreadnought

4 Force of Will
4 A.I.
4 Brainstorm
3 TFK
1 Tinker
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral
1 Rebuild
1 Chain of Vapor
1 Mystical

4 Mask

3 Pithing Needle
3 Chalice of the Void
1 Tormod's Crypt(really want a second MD)
1 Sensei's Top

I'd like to point out that I don't think Masknought lend's itself to being a control deck effectivly. I tested out the deck as such, and I came to the conclusion that you rarly want to play that control game. FoW is key, and so is disruption. However, I think that you have to be wary of creating an identity crisis for the deck.

Also, in testing, I found that the deck has two things it wants to do... play mask-nought... or find mask-nought. This means that early game you want to be tapping out and applying pressure and castign threats in order to force when you need into play.

Also what is your meta like? Do you expect much Stax? Gifts? Your mana base looks like it wants to make baby jesus cry... no offence... but... Badlands? Can you deal with Uba Mask? I'm not trying to be rough or anything... it just seems like Stax is a headache and a half for you, and I don't think any deck can afford to have a bad Stax match and hope to do well in a diverse metagame.

[And11]

My metagame is non-proxy, which means a lot of aggro (Affinity, R/G, Sligh, Chalice Fish and FCG), Oath (fliers and Salvagers), a few TPS, CS, Gifts, Stax and random byes. I'd say that 2/40 are piloting Stax.

I think that this deck, because of its extremely low cc of all spells, can afford to run a manabase that makes jesus baby cry. What's up with the Badlands? It's not like we need UU for Drain and Red is our second color, you know? I've seen TPS/r builds running Badlands also.

English is not my first language, so correct me if I'm wrong. Are you saying that I'm trying to go the control route with this build? I'd say I'm going the aggro route because of Shaman, Facs, Standstill and more pitchcounters, but I might be wrong. It's not like I'm sitting on Drain like CS og Gifts - I'm actually playing out threats. Could you please explain yourself better?

Stax is obviously not my best matchup, but I'm convinced that it's winnable the same way Oath used to defeat it. By speed. I have some tools in the board to help out too.

I really like your monoU build, but what does the sideboard look like? I'm thinking that it's stuffed with A.I. tools and bouncers, which doesn't sound attracting to me. If I were to build it monoU, I'd splash for stuff like Balance and Hanna's Custody.

Thanks,
/Andreas.

PS: You don't have to apologize for not agreeing with me. We're both adults.