Important Announcement about TMD

[Jacob Orlove]

StarCityGames.com Acquires The Mana Drain

I know it sounds all legal and menacing, but nothing around here is actually going to change, except for an ad banner.

So, questions? Comments? This is the thread for any discussion on this topic.

[Vegeta2711]

End of an era.

[JuJu]

Agreed with Josh. I really hate seeing this, despite the fact that for now it'll be fine. TMD For Life.

[Roxas]

I can't honestly say I'm excited about this, but it's good to know that the community is still going to be taken care of.  Only time will tell whether this will turn out well, I suppose. 

[Klep]

Honestly, I trust Pete.  If he says nothing is going to change, I'll believe him until I see evidence to the contrary.  I'm glad this frees up Steve to focus on his family.

[Revvik]

Why is this a bad thing?

[JDawg13]

The extra influx of people could go either way, but so long as the forums are still run the same way, I don't see how this acquisition can be that bad for TMD.

[Juggernaut GO]

This has the potential to get more people from other formats to get interested in vintage.  All the tons of people who browse the forums on star city website can now just link over to TMD to explore a new format, EASIER then having to go out and look for it, it's now just a link away from the SCG page.  With any luck, vintage events hopefully will get an influx of more people willing to give it a shot.   I'm gonna buy Pete a fuckin hot ass hooker in rochester for this.

[Anusien]

I trust Pete and Zherb, and if they both think this is a good decision, I'll have to agree.

Incidentally, let's keep this classy.  No whining and complaining on SCG forums; that only makes us look bad.

[nataz]

End of an era.

[Godot]

Honestly, I trust Pete.  If he says nothing is going to change, I'll believe him until I see evidence to the contrary.

Exactly.  Pete has done nothing but good things for this community, and I dont really expect taht to change.  Much love and respeck to Z for all hes done, but I for one welcome our new overlords.

[Mr. Fantazy]

Did anyone really not see this coming? Many people said this would happen back when SCG went premium.

I'm really happy if this helps Steve have time for his new family, as a parent of 3, I know what the time for family means. Enjoy it Sir, these are times you will cherish forever.

I do have to agree with Vegeta2711 "End of an Era"

I hope the changes stop at an ad banner, but 40+ years of life tell me they won't.


-Shawn

[Buttons]

I hope the changes stop at an ad banner, but 40+ years of life tell me they won't.

If anything changes, aside that, it should be a new layout to the site.  Different shades of the same color is BORING.

The LEAST we could do is have different colors.  For instance:  The main screen, where you see all the different forums, we could have that be GREEN.  Then, when you enter into a forum, it could be RED.  Then, when you go to a particular thread in the forum, it could be BLUE.  And finally, when you go to post a topic, or a reply, it could be GRAY.

That's not hard to do.  If you wanted to get snazzier, you could actually put emblems, and designs, and people who design threads could actually make the thread look how they want it to when you enter into it.

[Cross]

We just changed the layout, and as far as I'm concerned snazzier is worse.

I'm not sure how I feel, but I'll wait and see if it does stay the same.

[Joblin Velder]

End of an era.

[Darkmage]

End of an era.

[Machinus]

Obviously I am nervous about such a change, since business is the bottom line.

However, I can't think of many other people I'd rather have control. Pete has put a lot of time and effort into Vintage in the past year and a half, and his contribution to the community is comparable to those made by people like Ray Robilliard and Steve O'Connell himself. The P9 series is one of the main reasons that Vintage experienced such rapid growth in the last two years, and Pete has demonstrated his commitment to Vintage with great coverage and tournaments.

SCG has always taken good care of TMD and it's members. The success of the American Vintage community is largely dependent on the success of SCG.

I welcome Pete and hope that both groups will continue to benefit from each other.

[Demonic Attorney]

I propose starting a pool on how long it takes before the first premium services and/or membership fees are introduced.

This is not me trying to be a jerk.  Zherbus was a private individual who had a generous and supportive attitude towards Vintage.  SCG is a business.  The ultimate purpose of businesses is to make money.  My experience has shown they will do virtually anything they can get away with doing in order to accomplish that goal.  I certainly hope that a lone banner ad will be the only change that ever comes about as a result of the shift in ownership, but at the same time I fear that somewhere down the road, the temptation of revenue gleaned through premium services or other fees for TMD access will be irresistible.

[NicolaeAlmighty]

Honestly I think people are completely and totally overreacting about this. A ten spot says that if they hadn't made it public and had merely slid a banner in at the top, no one would have noticed or cared. You go to the page you want and scroll down. It isn't going to be anything different. To get paranoid about fees and premiums is just pathetic. It's still The Mana Drain. Nothing has changed. Nothing will change. Now we've got sponsorship from the top Magic store... is this really a bad thing?

[TheUprisal]

Its definitely nothing all that bad, at least for now.

The moderation on this forum is much better than on SCG's, and for that factor being unchanged, TMD will be fine.

[PacmanXSA]

I propose starting a pool on how long it takes before the first premium services and/or membership fees are introduced.

This is not me trying to be a jerk.  Zherbus was a private individual who had a generous and supportive attitude towards Vintage.  SCG is a business.  The ultimate purpose of businesses is to make money.  My experience has shown they will do virtually anything they can get away with doing in order to accomplish that goal.  I certainly hope that a lone banner ad will be the only change that ever comes about as a result of the shift in ownership, but at the same time I fear that somewhere down the road, the temptation of revenue gleaned through premium services or other fees for TMD access will be irresistible.

It would seem that Steve's main point of negotiation was for the forums to stay the same, however if TMD becomes the next Brainburst, there'll be a whole mess load of people that'll leave or be totally fed up; myself included.

Pac

[Moxlotus]

I don't expect anything to change

[Polynomial P]

While it is scary that a corporation is taking over TMD, we must realize that Pete has poured money into our format for some time. He has taken losses on many of the P9 events, yet he has not changed the prize payout and has promised another year of P9 events. Pete has pushed the envelope of proxy events (along with the TMD open) and has really aided our format.

While the private ownership of TMD was great, I think Pete will be a good owner of TMD since he has truly supported our format no matter what his cost.

[mongrel12]

I dispute the fact that SCG has been taking losses on the P9 events. They make so much from buying up power and staples at these events that a low turnout rarely hurts their profit. In fact, it is a perfectly reasonable assumption to make that if the scg events had not been turning a profit, they would not be continuing.

[xrizzo]

Thanks so much Steve.  You have been a great steward of this format and you deserve all the credit for this site. 

[The Atog Lord]

Let me begin with a heart-felt thank-you to Steve.

Over the years, through your own effort and expense, you have kept The Mana Drain as the finest online community anyone could hope for. Ever since Hyperion introduced me to this website years and years ago, I have always been appreciative of the wonderful community that has made these forums so amazing. Without your efforts, Steve, this would not have been possible. And while your family is (rightly) becoming your first priority now, do know that you have made a real and lasting difference in the lives of many people.

Thank you, Steve.

Now, onto the future of TMD, and my thoughts.
I would love to think that nothing will change. I would love to believe that things will be as they have been, and that TMD will remain a vibrant and wonderful community. Sad to say, however, I'm not sure that will be the case. I do believe Pete when he says that aside from a banner there will be no changes made to this website. The problem isn't really one that SCG can solve. The problem is one of community.

TMD has always been an effort of individuals driven by a passion for a game and a format, even when Type One wasn't nearly as popular as it is today. Now, the sight is controlled not by people in it for the love of the game, but rather people in it for the money. Sure, you can say that SCG has been "good" for Type One. But you know as well as I do that if they were losing vast somes of money by paying attention to Type One, they'd stop. And it isn't bad that they would -- they're a business. That's their job.

But when I submitted a good article/post to TMD, I always felt like I was in my own way contributing to a community -- not for profit or any material gain, but because I believed in this community and what it stood for. TMD was all about individuals working together to discuss a great format and moreover to create a great community.

Now, whenever I submit a clever article/post to TMD (which, I admit, hasn't been as frequent lately due to grad school), I'm just donating labor to a corporation. Behind the curtain now isn't a man doing this without profit because he loves the game, but rather a corporation which has made a business decision to go ahead and acquire a popular website. And again, I say this not to blame SCG -- making financial calculations is their job -- but because it is true. To me at least, there is a difference in spirit between a website run by a person driven by love for something, and a website driven by corporate interest.

So, I lament the death of TMD as a community held together by passion. May what rises in its place still be something I can feel proud to be a part of.

Rich

[mrieff]

I think Peter really deserves some credit for his strong comminment to Vintage. I'm sure his take-over will be a success.

And Steve, thank you for your time and effort in building the site. I think you did/doing the right thing

[knickers]

Thanks for all the good times Zherbus!
Wish you nothing but the best, and take care.

[Vegeta2711]

Let me begin with a heart-felt thank-you to Steve.

Over the years, through your own effort and expense, you have kept The Mana Drain as the finest online community anyone could hope for. Ever since Hyperion introduced me to this website years and years ago, I have always been appreciative of the wonderful community that has made these forums so amazing. Without your efforts, Steve, this would not have been possible. And while your family is (rightly) becoming your first priority now, do know that you have made a real and lasting difference in the lives of many people.

Thank you, Steve.

Quoted for massive amounts of truth.

[jpmeyer]

I would trust Pete with my baby