NinjAtog it's Fishy

[Hillboy]

Hello Vintage Community I'm a new guy,

I've been playing type 1 for a couple years now (Casually, Mall tournaments) starting with WW (losing) switching to welder variant switching to The Mountain Wins Again, then UW Fish Then UR Fish.

I read about magic alot and play an hour or two a day (in the winter) sometimes just goldfishing. I was looking at a starcitygames deck called Ninja's that featured using blue ninja's and thing's like ornithopter for speed and I thought about building a "ninja deck" Ninja of the deep hours is already being abused why not any others.

I kept looking at magic sites and articles and I saw an article by Aaron Conole on Mtgcity about an optimal decklist that was around type 2 preRavager that used Atogs and cheap artifacts.

The wheels started turning and I figured that once ornathopters been ninja'd it gets useless sac it to atog and I've got a beater.

I started playing around with the idea and made a decklist around it.

Land

4 Mishra's Factory
4 Seat of the Synod
2 Great Furnace
4 Volcanic Island
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Flooded Strand
2 Island
1 Strip Mine

Creatures

4 Mistblade Shinobi
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours
4 Atog
4 Ornithopter
2 Phyrexian Walker

Artifacts
3 Umezawa's Jitte
Instants
4 Shrapnel Blast
4 Force Spike
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
1 Misdirection

First off this deck is not really playtested tried and true in the type 1 environment, the closest deck I playtested this against was a form of goblin sligh using piledrivers and lackeys.

I was actually taking my UR fish deck apart to build a Worse Than Fish deck when I had the idea.

Some of the card Choices

Force Spike > Chalice of the void. I was going to use chalice to drop at zero but ornithopters and walkers didn't like it. plus at 1 mana the only other card in the deck is brainstorm plus Force Spike can be pitched to Force of will

Brainstorm> Standstill The deck doesn't run Cloud of Faeries plus using brainstorm to dig up what I need at the right time has been somewhat useful.

Shrapnel Blast is somewhat usefull it seems that when I've used it so far however a magma Jet or Lightning bolt may have been just as effective without having to sac an artifact on the plus side however 5 damage is alot more than 2 or 3 when the opponent is at 5 life.

Mistblade Shinobi and Waterfront Bouncer. Bouncer is arguably better as his ability can be used anytime not just when it hits the player but shinobi ninja's out an ornithopter turn two and bounces back a goblin lackey.

Atog without Atog the deck is pointless sacrificing Walkers Ornathopters and artifact lands adds up and in the event of an emergency turning mishra's factory into an artifact creature and sacrificing it to the tog can be just what the doctor ordered.

Wastelands I don't actually have a set(Proxy Meta) although I know I should invest in them.

Moxes, i don't have any except the chrome one and the card disadvantage is not worth it.

I almost Forgot Sideboard cards (Which are not perfect)
4 Tormod's Crypt
3 Rack and Ruin
3 Arcane Labs
4 Annuls

Essentially I wanted to throw this out there and see just how crazy I am and wether or not I should continue working on this or build WTF.

Thanks

Jed

[LotusHead]

Land

4 Mishra's Factory = good
4 Seat of the Synod = 1 should be a Mox Sapphire, unless you are in a non-proxy friendly environment
2 Great Furnace = 1 should  be Mox Ruby unless people have a problem with your proxying a Mox Sapphire already
4 Volcanic Island = 8 Red spells maindeck (Atog and S.Blast). 3 might suffice, given say, wastelands and Crucible or something
2 Wooded Foothills = uh...Blue is better than red, generally speaking, but wait...you play with 4 Strands...
4 Flooded Strand = 6 Fetchlands? You going extended Goblins tech on us? Ok, but 1 of these 6 could be a proxy Black Louts(they are cool)
2 Island (has been kicking Library of Alexandria out of the Power 10 slot for at LEAST a year.  Islands are tech)
1 Strip Mine (Where are their wasteland friends? Proxy 3-7 is where they are! Don't let your opponent goldfish while you resolve 'Thopers.

Creatures

4 Mistblade Shinobi = The suck. I am not even consulting the Gatherer or www.FindMagicCards.com to see what this does. cut them.
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours = Ninja! 4 of a must.
4 Atog = NinjaTog! your namesake.  Perhaps with Izzet cards coming out, this deck will get stronger.
4 Ornithopter = The Suck, but they do enable 2nd turn Ninjas. 
2 Phyrexian Walker = See Ornithopter, without the evasion thing.

Artifacts
3 Umezawa's Jitte = Tech!
Instants
4 Shrapnel Blast = Uh, cool direct damage
4 Force Spike = Suck.  Daze, maybe, Counterspell/Mana Leak, maybe.
4 Force of Will = Cool
4 Brainstorm = Cool
1 Misdirection = What, in your meta, makes you want to play Misdirection? No proxy but everyone has Ancestral but you? Try Crucible.

Keep it up.  But to see if your idea works, at this very point in time, proxy up any Gifts.dec, Oath.dec, Stax.dec or Slaver.dec to see if it has a snowballish chance in hell to survive the global metagame.

Good luck and welcome to TMD!

[The Atog Lord]

Pretty much the best idea for a deck design I've seen in ages.

Ninjas and Atogs, together at last.

Well, Yawgmoth is the Official Evil God of Atogs worldwide, seeing as he essentially lets Atogs recycle everything.

Also, I really find that Discipile of the Vault makes a fine barn for Atogs. I mean, Atog eats, and Disciple hits the oppopnent. He basically turns Atogs into Megatogs.

In all honesty, I'd strongly recommend taking a look at some past Extended and Type Two Affinity decks. Atogs are very happy to be surrounded by lots of inexpensive artifacts, and Skull Clamps.

[Nantuko Rice]

I am so happy to see someone come up with something new and interesting, but am even more happy to see that the community is isn't immediately thinking "this isn't any of the current tier decks, it must suck."

I agree with lotushead that you test it against some of the current tier decks.

I am very happy t osee this deck because it reminds me of one of my old creations: WU Tang Fish.

Ninja, Flying Man, Daze & Meddling Mage
VS
Ninja, Ornithopter, Force Spike & Atog

Very interesting. Atog allows for a fast clock, but mage offers disruption.

The only thing good about mistblade shinobi is that it owns colossus. I'm not sure about playing 4 though.

I like the name Ninjatog, but this deck is really a Fishatog. Which would make one think about the old deck combo-control deck Psychatog. So what happens if someone combines classic fish with classic psychatog?

[Hillboy]

Well I live in a ten proxy but I devoted 8 proxys to Volcanic Islands and Flooded Strands.

I could probably take out 1 volcanic and 2 flooded strands for 3 wastelands.

Add a mox sapphire and a mox ruby to bring me up to ten.

Then force spike and chalice and Flying men and ornithopters.

What if I went
-4 Force spike + 4 chalice
-4 Ornathopter + 4 flying men
-2 Phyrexian Walker +2 Cloud sprite

I could also go WTF route and add aether vial to vial in the flying men after a ninja out.

Not sure though on that.

Mistblade shinobi gets chumpblocked right after he hits or dies in other ways he might leave unless I add the other ninja walker of secret ways which I don't think would help.

Disciple of the vault could be a finisher if I went heavy on the artifacts

Say
4 great furnace
4 seat of the synod
4 vault of whispers
5 mox proxys
1 black lotus
4 volcanic island
1 sol ring
1 mana vault

Thats a really rough looking manabase that I should look into and iron out.

Edit  I thought about Psychatog too especially since some ninja's are black that route would take out the artifacts and want to go with as much card draw as possible, too bad Gush is restricted, its not a bad idea though and with the ninjadraw could be kindof interesting, I never played tog though and don't know how it works exactly.

I'll get back to you on where I go with this, Thanks everybody.

Jed

[orgcandman]

I kept looking at magic sites and articles and I saw an article by Aaron Conole on Mtgcity about an optimal decklist that was around type 2 preRavager that used Atogs and cheap artifacts.

You win the internet. Please claim your prize.

I figured that once ornathopters been ninja'd it gets useless sac it to atog and I've got a beater.

The only problem I see here is that your ornithopter sits in your hand during combat when you ninja. Maybe there's an additional way of using this effectively, but I'm not sure.

ALSO, one thing not to forget is that chalice 0 is running around. I'd go with affinity-esque creatures, and try not to get clogged up at the 0cc slot.

4 Mishra's Factory
4 Seat of the Synod
2 Great Furnace
4 Volcanic Island
2 Wooded Foothills
4 Flooded Strand
2 Island
1 Strip Mine

Creatures

4 Mistblade Shinobi
4 Ninja of the Deep Hours
4 Atog
4 Ornithopter
2 Phyrexian Walker

Artifacts
3 Umezawa's Jitte
Instants
4 Shrapnel Blast
4 Force Spike
4 Force of Will
4 Brainstorm
1 Misdirection

K, I'm gonna address your card choices, from a purely theoretical standpoint, as well as possible changes to make.

Shrapnel Blast is somewhat usefull it seems that when I've used it so far however a magma Jet or Lightning bolt may have been just as effective without having to sac an artifact on the plus side however 5 damage is alot more than 2 or 3 when the opponent is at 5 life.

Shrap. blast can be a house, especially since 5 to the dome is no joke. However, at 2cc + an artifact, you're committing a lot for that 5 damage. Think about this, for 1 additional blue mana, you can turn that artifact into 11 to the dome ala colossus. I'm not saying you should run tinker-colossus, but I AM saying that you need to look at other options especially in the 2cc slot.

Mistblade Shinobi and Waterfront Bouncer. Bouncer is arguably better as his ability can be used anytime not just when it hits the player but shinobi ninja's out an ornithopter turn two and bounces back a goblin lackey.

Shinobi are there, I'm guessing for game vs. workshop fatties, and colossus. However, is 4 the correct number? Like, a 1/1 isn't super hot, and even less hot when his conditional ability won't even matter half the time.

Wastelands I don't actually have a set(Proxy Meta) although I know I should invest in them.

I would say that these are the most important tool you will have.

Possible cards I would test with this (again, just theoretical):

1. Tinker->colossus, just because it's a super clock, and you're in no shortage of artifacts.
2. Disrupt, maybe as a 2-of.
3. Annul, for handling stax and playing into mana denial. 3sphere ends your deck.
4. Disciple of the Vault. As Rich said, this dude hangs out with atog to make a rapid fire machine gun, mowing down life. Sure, it adds a 3rd color. It's worth it.
5. Thirst for Knowledge. This one is a little odd, but you have plenty of artifacts to support it, and it says "Draw 3 cards"
6. Spellbombs. Instant Speed discard (necrogen), bounce (aether), or shock (the red one) OR you get to draw cards.

Those are what I can figure off the top of my head.

-Aaron

[Hillboy]

Well I've been tinkering with the deck for a little while now and its getting different anyway. I have to work out the mana issues so that I have what I need when I need it. A pair of Underground Seas should help as long as I leave in the four flooded strands.

I added Aether Vial which helps get out the disciple out turn 2 even without colored mana.
On the ninjaing effect with the ornathopters I agree that having an ornithopter sitting in my hand is rather useless.
The way to combat that would be to leave a vial at 0 or consider running Fleshgrafter to discard it and hit like wild mongrel does but at 3 mana I doubt I would cast him very often and he wouldn't allow disciples ability to kick in anyway.
I feel I need a flyer that can drop turn one though, ornathopter does fit that bill. no matter the color mana.

Then theres arcbound ravager which might be better than atog in a couple instances, although I'd rather leave atog in.

Unfortunately mistblade shinobi is poor but I took them out in favor of goblin vandal but I don't like vandal either at least not in the mainboard.

I also have to strike a balance between the amount of colors, I took out too much blue to the point that Force of will became a dead card half the time.

Luckily I happen to have a tinker and collossus lying around so I can test them as well..

And spellbomb>Shrapnel Blast as I think the cycling ability is worth it.

and Phyrexian furnace may be a good mainboard card as well.

I'd post a decklist but its really rough right now and I want to clean it up first,


Thanks

Jed