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Author Topic: [Report, 1st place] Atog and Loving It  (Read 6358 times)
Matt
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« on: January 29, 2006, 02:43:23 am »

Well it's been awhile since my last tournament, but here we are. Sunday 1.5, we got 11 players. Here's the breakdown, with names where known:

B/W BraidsStax (Derek)
R/w Goblins
DredgAtog (Matt)
Angel Stompy (Woodrow)
Fecundity combo (Tristan)
Rec-Sur (John)
R/G Survival
Tradewind Geddon (Eric)
U/w/b Landstill
U/B Confidant Fish (John)
G/W/U Survival

My decklist:

//Card drawing
4 Brainstorm
4 Accumulated Knowledge
3 Intuition
1 Mystical Tutor

//Primary Engine
1 Wonder
1 Stinkweed Imp
1 Life from the Loam
1 Regrowth

//Removal
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell

3 Pernicious Deed
2 Darkblast
1 Putrefy
1 Persecute

//Winners
4 Psychatog
4 Nimble Mongoose

//Lands
2 Lonely Sandbar
1 Wasteland
1 Cabal Pit

4 Flooded Strand
2 Polluted Delta
1 Land Grant

4 Underground Sea
2 Tropical Island
2 Bayou
3 Island


//Sideboard
SB: 4 Engineered Plague
SB: 1 Vedalken Shackles
SB: 1 Pernicious Deed
SB: 1 Naturalize
SB: 1 Putrefy
SB: 1 Life from the Loam
SB: 1 Mystical Tutor
SB: 1 Gifts Ungiven
SB: 1 Massacre
SB: 1 Haunting Echoes
SB: 1 Nature's Ruin
SB: 1 Constant Mists

I arrived just as they were entering names into the pairing software. I had little time to build a deck, so I had to quickly choose from the decks I had built: Tide, G/B Survival, and the Tog list I'd been working on. Seeing as my fetchlands were in the Tog list, it required the least card movement, so I went with that. Way to metagame, eh? I threw together a SB and off I went.

ROUND ONE - Tristan (Fecundity combo)

This wasn't pretty for him, despite him winning the die roll. I let Ashnod's Altar and Saproling Cluster go, then Deeded the board (killing a Bird, the loss of which took two Thran Quarries out). I got off Intuition for Loam and Wasteland and later on Togged out.

In: Haunting Echoes, Deed, Naturalize
Out: Stinkweed Imp, Cabal Pit, Darkblast.

Game two I let him actually cast the whole combo and go off, drawing his whole deck, then Intuitioned for triple Force and countered his Whetstone. He got infinite life with Staff of Domination, and got infinte tokens...but he had to pass the turn, which I used to drop and blow a Deed. He drew his one Darksteel Colossus which had been shuffled back in, and got himself decked. So I beat him with his own combo. Very Happy

ROUND TWO - David (Confidant Fish)

Again I lose the die roll, and it makes game one is very, very close. He wins the counterwar over my first Deed, but the second makes it through. However, the tempo he's gotten from a Jitted Cloud of Faeries has left me at a precarious four life. However, when the dust clears I drop a Mongoose and ride that to victory.

In: Massacre, Shackles, Deed, Putrefy, 3 Engineered Plague (lots of X/1s, and I'll never need to Deed for more than two against him)
Out: Stinkweed Imp, Wonder, Loam (I was expecting graveyard hate), Mystical Tutor, Regrowth, Land Grant

Game two can be summarized easily: Darkblast destroys Fish. He tried to rules lawyer me about some EOT Darkblasting, which was an especially low move considering I had to remind him that Flooded Strand can't get a basic swamp multiple times. In the end it didn't matter, two Mongeese is a fast clock.

ROUND THREE - John (Rec-Sur)

This round was a lot less fun. This guy was one of the annoying types of Magic player. When he was winning, he was god's gift to card games; when he was losing, he was manascrewed and that never happens to his deck. Remember folks, "winners" and "whiners" aren't spelled the same.

I win the die roll. Game one I counter his turn two Survival, and then I make a HUGE mistake. I need green mana to use the Loam I have in hand, so I Mystical...for Land Grant. It would have been infinitely better to get Intuition, and use THAT to get triple fetch for Tropical Island. Then he resolves a second Survival, and while I stalled out, he abused it a bunch then launced a Living Death at me. He had an Avalanche Rider which whacked my Trop, leaving me with no green mana. A couple turns later, I just conceded.

In: Haunting Echoes, Shackles, Putrefy, Deed
Out: Darkblast, Regrowth, Persecute, Stinkweed Imp

I didn't bring the Naturalize in because if Survival gets an activation, I've already lost. I countered a Survival, Deeded a Bop, Masticore, and Spike Weaver, then won somehow. Oh yeah, and he mulliganed to five.

Game three he once again got the "incredibly unlucky" mana screw. I took a risk and kept a hand featuring Cabal Pit and Land Grant as my only mana (but with lots of gas otherwise), but I topdecked a Trop and fetch the next two turns and it all fell into place. He conceded when I got Loam/Wasteland going. His buddy playing next to us was also being a dick; talking later, it turns out no one really likes him.

ROUND FOUR - Derek (B/W BraidStax)

He wins the die roll, and it makes all the difference. This game goes LONG. I have to wait out a Smokestack at one counter, while countering the occasional Crucible. I accumulate a hand of Island, Island, Underground Sea, Tog. If I can just get one turns' reprieve, I can get that second Island down, counter his play, then play a Tog and Tog out. But I never get that one turn reprieve, as he topdecks the Smokestacks like it's his job, which I suppose it is.

In: Deed, Loam, Putrefy, Naturalize
Out: Darkblast, Stinkweed Imp, Wonder, Persecute

I manage to get a Deed down under his two Spheres of Resistance but I never need it, as I draw like nine lands (including playing out my two Sandbars), get Loam/Waste going soon enough and the Spheres end up hurting him a lot worse than they did me.

Game three was another close one. It went to time and though he had the complete lock (Crucible, Braids, Sphere of Resistance) he couldn't kill me fast enough once the five addtional turns was called and we ended up with the unintentional draw. I was DEFINITELY not stalling - in fact I was starting to get worried HE was stalling in game two for awhile! Derek's a standup guy, I was just getting paranoid after the unsporting shit the last two rounds sent me. Anyway, I Deeded a Crucible and tried to ride out a Smokestack, assembling an awesome hand of Naturalize, Putrefy, Deed, Tog, and three lands. But again, I never could get to two mana to start breaking out of the lock. If I'd been running Mox Diamond or something, or if the Naturalize had been an Oxidize, I could have had this game won.

As it was, I'll take the draw, and with that I finish in first place with a 3-0-1 match record, and a 7-2-1 game record.

Thoughts on the deck:

Wasteland/Loam was excellent all day long; I may try to get a second Wasteland in here somewhere.

Stinkweed Imp was my most sided-out card, and I never felt like I needed it. I guess it serves some purpose as a way to deal with large fat things like the sort Reanimator might dish out, but overall I don't like it. It may become another Putrefy or something, I don't know.

The Land Grant was awful, and only played because of my lack of a third Trop. Grant is the worst card in the deck by far.

Darkblast is a fucking house. This card is awesome.

The anti-synergy between Mongoose and Tog only came up once, and it didn't matter that game. Mongoose is the better complement to Tog than Werebear or similar because it evades the stuff Tog doesn't, such as REB and StP and Maze of Ith. Also, it takes down Lackeys like a champ, and Darkblast turbocharges my threshold in much the way 3cThreshold uses Mental Note.

Persecute never got a chance to shine, but it is a great weapon nonetheless. Tutor it up, wipe their hand, drop Tog, and win. It's a trump against MWC's clogged hand full of removal. It's possible this should be the Haunting Echoes, which is a lot more universally useful.

Cabal Pit was another powerful silver bullet whose werewolf never showed - it's tits at removing white weenies, who often have some very annoying pro:black abilities (either naturally or granted by Mother of Runs).

I never felt the need for another Loam maindeck. Intuition and Mystical are my Loams #2-4.

The sideboard was basically me saying, "Here are some control cards I never use. Let's use them." The Mystical was crap when my gameplan is better than "find silver bullet, the Gifts only useful for the blue control "mirror", Nature's Ruin (which I thought was tech against Meddling Mage) lets them regenerate so it needs to become Perish, I'm not sure where Constant Mists is useful, and the Plagues were possibly overkill because Goblins hasn't been a terrible matchup. Fitting in some cheaper graveyard hate would be pretty good -- probably Coffin Purge, which has synergy with Intuition and dredge.
« Last Edit: March 26, 2006, 02:54:50 am by Matt » Logged

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« Reply #1 on: January 29, 2006, 02:48:54 am »

You mean Saturday, right?

What else was the B/W player running?

Thanks for the report.
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« Reply #2 on: January 29, 2006, 03:10:18 am »

Yes I do mean Saturday.

Here's cards I saw in the Stax list:

Ancient Tomb
City of Traitors
Wasteland
Crystal Vein
Scrubland
fetches
basic Swamp, basic Plains
Maze of Ith
Mox Diamond

Braids
Exalted Angel
(sideboarded Ghostly Prisons and Engineered Plagues)

Smokestack
Tangle Wire
Crucible
Chalice (possibly sideboarded - game one went long, like 30 min or more, and I saw none)
Sphere of Resistance (possibly sideboarded, see Chalice)

(sideboarded Damping Matrix)
I'm sure he could have had Time Vault if he wanted to, I've seen him slinging fully powered zero-proxy Uba Stax, but I saw none

definitely zero Suppression Field, Powder Keg, Mishra's Factory, and he said he had only Matrix to bring in (so no Tormod's Crypts in the side). He ended up at 2-1-1, missing prize payout on tiebreakers to the annoying kid, who had the 3cLandstill deck.
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« Reply #3 on: January 29, 2006, 12:28:24 pm »

Congrats Matt! Thanks for the report.
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« Reply #4 on: January 29, 2006, 02:13:30 pm »

This deck looks like a lot of fun to play.  Congradulations.

Leo
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« Reply #5 on: January 29, 2006, 08:15:07 pm »

Mox Diamonds are an obvious add and you already commented.

Do you really need Mongoose there?  Would something like Genesis be a more attractive option?  My favorite Dredge-Tog trick is to Intuition for Genesis, Tog, Wonder or something similarly ridiculous.

Is that enough cycling lands?  Specifically, do you think you ought to go 1 blue cycling land, 1 black cycling land to avoid Pithing Needle or somethign appropriate.  I found though that unless I use 4 or so, I can't count them as lands for my manabase because there's too much of a risk to play them.

Wasteland: Really that good?  I kept finding it was overkill.  The matches you won with Wasteland lock, would you have won anyway?

What about Exploration?  Something I've wanted in all my LftL decks (STE edged them out in Slide), and it would ease the biggest problem with Waste-lock: it eats up all your drops.

Do you really need Cabal Pit?  I'd think that would be better off as a land, and you could run an extra Deed or something if you felt the need.

I second that Stinkweed sucks.  I'd suggest replacing it with an extra Putrefy.  You can also consider Witness if you add in Genesis in place of Regrowth, because it interacts better with Dredge.

AK: Worth it?  I'd think going to 4 Intuition and then extra cycling lands or removal would be better.  My first Intuition always goes for the Life from the Loam engine, and the second sets up Togs.

Congrats!  <3 DredgeTog

Edit: Almost forgot.  1-3 Nightmare Void in the side.  It depends on whether you can force Intuition through or not.  If you keep Mysticals in too (which I feel is a mistake), I'd just go with 1.
« Last Edit: January 29, 2006, 08:24:11 pm by Anusien » Logged

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« Reply #6 on: January 30, 2006, 01:00:12 pm »

Nice work Matt!

A couple of question:

Mystical Tutor? Really?

No Deep Analysis?

Also, how did Regrowth treat you? I can see it being on the short list to fill in some holes, but would you play it again?


Quote from: Matt
His buddy playing next to us was also being a dick; talking later, it turns out no one really likes him.

This just made me sad.

But in a lot ways, your list looks a lot like mine. Here's why I left off before I started working on a couple of different projects:

Legacy Psychatog
by Bardo
Blue/Black/Green Combo-Control

4 Psychatog
1 Wonder
1 Genesis

4 Accumulated Knowledge
4 Brainstorm
3 Intuition
2 Deep Analysis
1 Life from the Loam

4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell

3 Pernicious Deed
2 Vedalken Shackles
2 Purefy
1 Darkblast

4 Underground Sea
4 Tropical Island
3 Flooded Strand
3 Polluted Delta
3 Lonely Sandbar
1 Cephalid Coliseum
4 Island
1 Swamp
1 Bayou


(Sideboard)
4 Engineered Plague
2 Hydroblast
2 Naturalize
2 Duress
2 Perish // Haunting Echoes
1 Filth
1 Wasteland
1 Nightmare Void

(To be clear, this is my personal list; I don't own Mox Diamonds, so they're not in there.)

Again, nice report.
« Last Edit: January 30, 2006, 01:19:29 pm by Bardo » Logged

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Matt
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« Reply #7 on: January 30, 2006, 06:01:45 pm »

I only own one Mox Diamond. It was in there originally but it kept getting hammered by Deed, so I took it out. If I owned four I could count on the accel keeping stuff under control so that I didn't need the Big Button, but I do need that reset, so Mox went out. I brought it back over the Grant, but it may be better as my lone Exploration.

Regrowth is very good with Intuition, in two ways: one, you can Intuition for a card you only have two of left in the deck (or 3 and you want to preserve the ability to get a second). Two, if I have Regrowth in hand and the opponent doesn't know about it, you can bluff them into some hardcore Intuitions for three different cards (Deed, Putrefy, Shackles for instance). It's also an easy placeholder card, much as you use Sleight of Hand in Threshold.

Mystical isn't great but it is good. Having a second Haunting Echoes or Loam for example is hot stuff, and it helps find one-ofs like Massacre when it's imperative that you find such cards now. It's also a $2 Intuition #4, when I only own three. It's hard to describe but I feel Mysticals make the deck more limber by giving that +1 to every important card count in the deck.

I have not been impressed with Cephalid Colisseum. Everyone says it's amazing, but this really isn't a combo-Tog deck, so I don't see the use. Maybe I'm just playing it wrong, but it seems like by the time I have threshold, I have all the digging I need already.

Same with Deep Analysis. When do I need this? It's crap in hand, I don't really dredge as much (as compared with a list which uses Imp or Grave-Troll to hyper-mill), and I have to wonder if the three life won't bite me.

Why Filth in the SB? Do you expect a lot of swamp-using decks to have flying creatures?

I don't like Nightmare Void. It's soooooo slow (you'll never ever cast it twice in one turn), and not very good in any given matchup. It seems wholly inferior to Persecute, for example.

I don't know about Genesis, but Mongoose is pretty awesome, because it requires totally different answers than Tog. It's also good early. I might be more inclined to Genesis if I had a ready card to cut...I turned the Imp into a second Putrefy, maybe it could be Genesis.
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« Reply #8 on: January 30, 2006, 06:11:31 pm »

Against something like Landstill or MWC your plan can be to Nightmare Void them out of cards, however long that takes, and then swing with Tog for a guaranteed kill.  Persecute can be countered.
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« Reply #9 on: January 30, 2006, 07:36:45 pm »

Persecute is waaay better than Void against MWC, and Landstill is better dealt with by the cards you already play: Loam and Wasteland. Notice how I run 4-5 maindeck artifact killers, plus counters, to stop Crucible.
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« Reply #10 on: January 30, 2006, 07:38:19 pm »

Why Filth in the SB? Do you expect a lot of swamp-using decks to have flying creatures?
I assume it's just to win Wonder wars, but I could be wrong.
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« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2006, 02:23:50 pm »

Re: Regrowth. Whenever I pull the deck apart and put it back together again, Regrowth is always on my short list. However, I consistenly shave it to make room for other cards, usually when I'm hammering out the removal slots. So, I understand its merits, but I found it getting dredged-away a little too frequently, and I'm trying to keep my non-graveyard-friendly singletons to a minimum. Ditto for Mystical Tutor.

Re: Cephalid Coliseum. The Coliseum slot is an experimental slot, and it's been Oboro, Quicksand, Wasteland, Barren Moor, and Sandbar #4 in the past couple of months. But honestly, I haven't played with it enough to be completely sold on it, it's just what was in my list when I left off. However, it's nice to have another uncounterable draw engine, but I think it may be overkill. Really, I'm not sure.

Re: Deep Analysis. DA just has a lot of synergy with the deck. But it really shines in the deck's 'kill turn' where it will be in the yard from being dredged earlier, fed to Tog, or as a cast-away from an Intution. Anyway, when it's in the bin it will give you the gas you need to keep dredging to make Tog lethal, etc. Two DAs may be overkill, but I wouldn't go less than 1.

Re: Filth. The mirror! But if I were really worried, I'd rather have Tormod's Crypt, or heck, even Krosan Reclamation.
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