Eon Blue Apocalypse (EBA)

[wethepeople]

As you all know I have been switching around on decklists for quite some time now, i have gone from stupid combo decks i made myself to lists i have copied and modified to my liking, such as Birdshit, and SS. I really liked playing BS but it had weak points (especially against heavy control, yet it destroyed other aggro) SS was great, it just was trampled by my slightly aggro meta. Which brings me to my next topic.

The Metagame:

The tournament i plan to attend to has a rather wierd metagame, last month it had 5 or 6 Control Slaver appearances, 5 Gifts, and 7 or 8 random Aggro decks flying around. (all Fish variants aside from one R/G Beatz deck) I didnt mention Stax because there is very little of it around , i think i only saw 1 or 2 people playing it in the final results, both of which did pretty bad in the standings. Combo doesnt show up much, however i must be sure to expect it because it did very well last month, so i should see the same soon. But anyway, this seems like a hard meta for me to adapt to, so much Aggro, yet so much Control.

I went over lists and chose depending on their matchups with Aggro and Control, and little Combo. I found that BS sucks against Drain decks, however it had its great moments in testing. SS did very well against Control, just more so Aggro decks (such as Fish) were very hard to compete due to the lack of good creature removal. I soon picked up EBA, similar to SS, just slightly more Aggro, this was exactly what i was going for.  EBA was very versatile when it came to sideboarding as well as adjusting the maindeck to your meta. Small things like adding aditional Swords to Plowshares made the Aggro matchup much easier, and using additional counter disruption allowed my Control matchup just as good.

I really like the list i am currently playing, it uses Bob, and Mages, and instead of Negators or Angels i chose Grunt. I will now explain why. Negators sucks when trying to block, so they would never work against so much Aggro. Exalted Angel's CC, as well as Morph Cost are almost impossible to pull off with WW in the casting cost. Grunt's CC is no problem at all, and its Cumulative Upkeep isnt either. When the graveyard begins to get low i have the ability to Stifle, and hold off for a turn. Darkblast also makes it much easier, allowing me to not only take out creatures but continue to swing with Grunt.

I use a few cards that so many people find stupid. Daze fits right in, i dont want to ever cut it. Duress is a must have in this deck, especially with Meddling Mages, but i cant seem to find room four a full set. I run 3 Stifles because they work to stop all those Wastelands, as well as hold off Grunt, stop fetchlands, hell, i could go on forever. I only MD two Swords, i might* up the count to three. But idk, i can just run them in the SB. Darkblast is use to take out annoying things as well as stall Grunt. i think i have explained all of my strange selections in my Disruption base, havent i?

One last thing is Mishra's Factories, i love these, they help soo much in the Aggro matchup, as well as speed up the Control match. I also dont run Wastelands, which many of you may find stupid. I dont think they help as much as you would think, so many players have learned to get around them, and Stifle seems to be showing up so much now. Wasteland not only disrupts your opponent's mana base, but it does the same to yours. I still run Strip Mine because it is just too good not to, but Waste on the otherhand is optional.

but anyway, here is the list i am currently running, i will post modifications whenever i do so:

Creature Base:
4 Dark Confidant
4 Meddling Mage
3 Jotun Grunt

Disruption:
3 Duress
3 Stifle
3 Daze
4 Force of Will

Removal:
2 Swords
1 Darkblast
1 Strip Mine

Draw Engine:
4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

Other:
1 Time Walk

Mana Base:
4 Tundra
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Sapphire
1 Pearl
1 Jet
1 Lotus
1 Petal
3 Underground Sea
3 Mishra's Factory
1 Island
1 Plains

i run two basics so i can continue to play spells and avoid Wastelands, I may remove a Plains some time. I expect the meta to change greatly after the results are posted for SCG Boston (which I will not be attending  ) I have not yet finished my sideboard. It is currently made for my weak points that i didnt pack MD hate for, which is Stax and Combo. this is what i am running so far:

4 Extract (does very well against Gifts, Slaver, and Long)
4 Energy Flux (owns Stax, enough said.)
2 Swords to Plowshares (i still want to have additional aggro hate, you know?)
5 -Empty- (any suggestions?)

but yeah, i encourage everyone to criticize my list, i would not be surprised if i missed something very important.

//wtp.

[EnialisLiadon]

EBA uses Drains, and is a dedicated control deck.  This looks like it plays so much differently that I would hesitate to slap such a moniker on it.

I can't imagine not wanting Yawgmoth's Will, even with Grunt eating the grave.  Replaying an Ancestral, Time Walk, a dead guy, etc is generally a good thing, even without Drains and full power.  Will doesn't have to be game-breaking--but it can almost always allow you to recover or gain more of an advantage over the opponent.

I personally think Daze is trash, but if it works for you, go for it.

As for the sb...crypt and bounce are always all-purpose sb slots.  A few BEBs could be techy with welders and R/G beatz.

[wethepeople]

i have seen several builds not using Drains. there isnt a whole lot of things that they work with besides Yawg Will. i cut will for the whole Grunt interaction, i always got Grunt out first and never Will, so by the time i did, there wasnt much left to play. I can however play it, Drains dont seem to me like something i need though.

i did find a build running Scrys and FOF with Drain, but it didnt run Grunts, Negators, or anything, so i am assuming it would have a similar matchup with aggro as SS. i am going to look up a few more lists before i make any permanent changes however.

[never]

You probably want jitte or sword of fire and ice in your sideboard for the aggro match. Some combination of three should be plenty. And Dave Feinstein seems to think Threads of Disloyalty is great against aggro decks, and I tend to agree with him.

Also, are the energy fluxes necessary in your sideboard if you're not going to play stax?

[wethepeople]

well if i do come across Stax, i want to be sure to have something for them, because my MD is very weak in that matchup.

i found more builds using Drain, a few builds only run two, so they clearly arent must haves for the deck. my build is more aggro, i dont think Drain helps in that area. Threads of Disloyalty doesnt seem that great to me, why not just use Old Man, or Control Magic so i have the ability to take much better things?

//wtp.

[Imsomniac101]

BS but it had weak points (especially against heavy control, yet it destroyed other aggro)

I found that BS sucks against Drain decks,

Are you serious!? BS is brilliant against Drains, in fact, it destroys those kind of decks. I can't believe you just said that.

[wethepeople]

BS runs very little disruption, it didnt do so well in testing unless i managed to resolve something fat, however when i did, the deck did actually do well.

EDIT: I admit that i didnt get a whole lot of CS/Gifts testing in with that deck, but several times i failed getting the right cards out due to lack of disruption.

[Imsomniac101]

BS runs very little disruption, it didnt do so well in testing unless i managed to resolve something fat, however when i did, the deck did actually do well.

You must be joking. BS runs the highest amount of disruption out of the aggro control decks. And almost all of it is at instant speed. I'm not sure what you're talking about.

[zeus-online]

The only problem i've seen with BS decks is that they have no way of reloading their, short of ancestral recall...most games i play vs. birdshit go like this:
I loose the first counter
I win the second counter war, and the game

Or if i loose its more like "Stifle your fetch" "waste your sea" "Daze that draw spell". Or the good ol' Meddling mage, which usually tends to name whatever is on top of my library. *Sigh*

/Zeus

[Sean Ryan]

Read these thread:
http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=28523.0
http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=28392.0

The tempo (Fishy) version of EBA is much more powerful IMHO, and has placed highly at Worlds and Waterbury.  Personally I made the Finals in two Seattle Power tournys with my homebrew list.   

It is really designed to beat Slaver and combo game one, with a side board built for Stax and aggro.  Recently, I've been playing Vial Fish which I think has better overall matchups but, EBA probally has a better Slaver match.

Hope this was helpful.

Sean

[wethepeople]

thanks for the lists, another thread on similar decklists helps alot to give me ideas. i will be editing soon.

i think i am going to play my BS deck a little bit again, i havent played it much in a while.

//wtp.

[never]

Threads of Disloyalty doesnt seem that great to me, why not just use Old Man, or Control Magic so i have the ability to take much better things?

//wtp.

In the fish matchup, they also have swords to plowshares, which makes Old Man less appealing. And as far as control magic, what would you take against a fish deck, that you can't take with threads of disloyalty? The fish creature curve stops at 2.

The only other creature you're going to worry about is Darksteel which is in Mana Drain decks and do you really want to be casting a 4cc spell at a Drain deck? Especially when you have swords.

[wethepeople]

True. I couldnt manage to find much of anything with CC=3 or greater in common Fish builds, that is certainly an idea.

[BreathWeapon]

How is Birdshit even viable in a field of Fish and EBA where MD Jotun Grunt is the offensive weapon of choice? I don't see how Werebear and Nimble Mongoose could be better than Jotun Grunt and Phyrexian Negator, and I highly suggest you play with both (you can Stifle Phyrexian Negator just as easily)

I would use Shadow of Doubt long before I used Daze, it has 18 targets in MDGifts and 15 targets in Pitch Long and it cycles. The card should be seeing much more play in Fish build than it is at the momemt, especially over cards like Daze, which have no effect unless you have Null Rod in play or your opponent is a bad player.

[wethepeople]

Grunt is much better than Negator. no question.

i like Negator and all, but i think three Grunts is enough beatdown, running maybe 2 Negators is an option, but Grunt is much much better versus Aggro since it can attack and/or block without killing all your shit. I love Shadow of Doubt, i tend to side it out against Fish/Aggro though. tell me if that is stupid before i get used to doing it.

thanks for the help everyone. //wtp.

[wethepeople]

Creature Base:
4 Dark Confidant
4 Meddling Mage
3 Jotun Grunt

Disruption:
4 Duress
4 Stifle
4 Force of Will
1 Shadow of Doubt
0 Daze!

Removal:
2 Swords
1 Darkblast
1 Strip Mine

Draw Engine:
4 Brainstorm
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Mystical Tutor
1 Demonic Tutor

Other:
1 Time Walk

Mana Base:
4 Tundra
4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Sapphire
1 Pearl
1 Jet
1 Lotus
1 Petal
3 Underground Sea
4 Mishra's Factory
1 Island
1 Plains

I cut Daze, finally. I only run a single Shadow of Doubt (i have seen several SS builds doing this, so it must help). I now run 4 Stifles, 4 Duress (again, like SS). My sideboard consists of:

2 Swords to Plowshares (why not improve aggro matchup?)
4 Energry Flux (go Stax hate!)
4 Extract (it has proved well)
5 -open slots-

I am thinking about one more Shadow of Doubt, then a 4'of. Leyline of the Void is great, so is Tormod's Crypt. idk which one i will use. Leyline cant be countered (if you draw it opening hand) but it isnt necessary late game, because you are most likely dead. Tormod's Crypt can be countered, cant be welded around, but can be drawn after your opening hand. Leyline can't be hardcasted in this deck.

A problem with g/y hate is that it interacts with Jotun Grunt. i have though about running Negator instead of Grunt in matchups where g/y hate is necessary, so it wont mattter. This idea would however take up much of my sideboard, yet since i have 5 slots open, and everything in there can be changed around, i think it could be done.

So maybe, 4 Leyline, 2 Negators for those open slots. how does that sound? (cut 1 StP)

//wtp.

[BreathWeapon]

Shouldn't there be Rod or Kataki in the MD? Fish isn't fish with out either of these cards in the MD, IMO, because Fish is at its heart a mana denial deck, and Kataki just makes your Stax match up that much better.

[wethepeople]

that is Energy Fluxes job. Kataki just taps out their moxen and a land or two. Kataki gives them a reason to get rid of Stacks so they can just weld it back in without having to sacrifice a thing that turn. I have seen this play just once before versus Uba, however i dont want such a thing to happen again.

i never really liked Kataki anyway, the whole legend thing sucks because i tend to draw multiple copies, even if i run just 3 MD. i have two versions of this deck that i commonly play, one is more so mana denial, no Null Rods however. i think it is stupid to just slow your opponent, as well as you down by running so many Strips because it isnt long at all until they get a new land. Mishra's Factory make the aggro matchup so much better because they can be 3/3s when blocking, as well as serve as an easy creature. If i get the time i will post the other version.

//wtp.

[BreathWeapon]

Ok, I don't understand the fetish you have for improving Fish's aggro match up, Fish is a deck desinged to compete against the Spikes of our format, not the Timmys. If you are so concerned about aggro, you should be playing Oath. Kataki is awesome, I have never, ever seen a Stax player that didn't whince when Kataki resolved. U/W Fish runs Rod and Kataki, screw drawing multiples, both cards are that pivotal to Fish.

[wethepeople]

this deck does very well against CS and Gifts, but more aggro builds of Fish and Stax, not so much. Its not like i am packing a ton of hate for aggro, but when i put together this list it was certainly on my mind. there is more CS/Gifts appearances than Fish, but i am not going to ignore my aggro matchup completely.

if you take a look at the list i didnt do a whole lot. i MDed another StP and MD 1 Darkblast. My SB has 1 more Swords to cut for cards that serve no purpose against aggro, like Shadow of Doubt (unless i want to stop a fetchland).

Kataki can easily be played around, i would much rather just SB in Energy Flux. i have been testing against Stax and i mulled to four with two land, a Flux, and a Daze. I won that game just because of Flux on like turn 3. I dont really care about game one versus Stax, i rarely win so i usually wait until game 2/3 to take over. Not many people think of this but Dark Confidant actually makes the Stax matchup much better. It allows me to continue to bring in sources when i should be locked up, it also gets around Uba. But anyway, there is so little Stax in my meta so the matchup is very rare so MDing Kataki isnt worth the slot.

//wtp.

[Tha Gunslinga]

Ok, I don't understand the fetish you have for improving Fish's aggro match up

Because as more people play Fish, there will be more and more aggro matchups.

[wethepeople]

I am thinking about finding room in the MD for some of the new Time Spiral cards like Trickbind or even Children of Korlis. I have not however decided whether or not i should do so quite yet. Anyone think any of the new cards are worth slots on the list?

[horse the name]

I am thinking about finding room in the MD for some of the new Time Spiral cards like Trickbind or even Children of Korlis. I have not however decided whether or not i should do so quite yet. Anyone think any of the new cards are worth slots on the list?

It all depends on how much combo is in your meta. Both trickbind and children seem great against tendrils decks. Regardless, I think that trickbind might deserve the current shadow of doubt slot.

Also, do you have any thoughts on Drifter il-Dal here?

[wethepeople]

I am thinking about finding room in the MD for some of the new Time Spiral cards like Trickbind or even Children of Korlis. I have not however decided whether or not i should do so quite yet. Anyone think any of the new cards are worth slots on the list?

It all depends on how much combo is in your meta. Both trickbind and children seem great against tendrils decks. Regardless, I think that trickbind might deserve the current shadow of doubt slot.

Also, do you have any thoughts on Drifter il-Dal here?

i dont really like the single Shadow of Doubt either, it never has been at hand at the correct time unless i really wanted to use it on like a fetchland, where Stifle could simply do that. I see a bit of Combo, but not a whole lot, enough for me to want to plan for them, you know? I have seen a few random WGD decks pop out every once and a while lately, but my deck seems to already do very well against it.

i dont have any idea however what Drifter il-Dal is, is it from Time Spiral?

[wethepeople]

most recent sideboard, along with ideas and such:

4 Extract- works very well against most decks besides Stax and Aggro, i am probably going to find something better than this, however it is great for now.

4 Energy Flux- pretty much gives you the game versus Stax. every time i have gotten it onto the board in a game, i have won.

Copy Artifact- works well to copy something like Crucible of Worlds so you almost never run out of perms.

Sacred Ground- same as above, just a little better IMO

The Rack- my secret Uba Stax tech. Versus Uba, my opponent never has a hand, ever. Unless they havent yet put down the combo pieces. So unless they have a welder on the board (which i rarely allow happen), they are going to take 3 damage a turn from Rack.

Renounce- something else i have been testing lately. one card i have found luck in versus Combo is Renounce.

"Renounce CC=W1
Instant

Sacrifice any number of permanents. You gain 2 life for each one sacrificed this way."

not many Combo players go over much life on the Tendrils count so gaining additional life usually screws them up for quite some time. am i the only one who does this?

Leyline of The Void, Tormod's Crypt, Planar Void- i have not decided on which one to use, but all of them work rather well. This card isnt completely necessary in my meta, but i want to make sure to have a little bit of GY hate so i dont get screwed over when the matchup comes along.

Trickbind- stops Pitch Long. woot.

Children of Korlis- obvious reasons.

additional Swords to Plowshares- odvious reasons.

those are just about all of the cards i have looked into for SB use lately, additional suggestions are greatly appreciated.

//wtp.

[horse the name]

http://ww2.wizards.com/gatherer/CardDetails.aspx?&id=108918#

Drifter seems powerful, but the one U per turn may be too much for fish to handle. any thoughts?

[wethepeople]

its not necessarily too much to handle, its just not really worth it. i could see the card being used with like Ninja of the Deep Hours, but not in this list.