Cycle of really, really huge Timmy Spells

[Nazdakka]

I was thinking about the Great Designer Search cycle challenge, and I came up with a very Timmy thing to key off:

Incalculable Knowledge
Sorcery
10UU
Target player draws X cards, where X is the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control.

Inestimable Suffering
Sorcery
10BB
Search target player's library for X cards and remove them from the game, where X is twice the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control. That player shuffles his or her library.

Inexpressable Rage
Sorcery
10RR
Put X 3/1 Elemental creature tokens with haste into play, where X is the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control. Sacrifice them at the end of turn.

Immeasurable Might
Sorcery
10GG
Creatures you control get +X/+X and trample until end of turn, where X is the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control.

Inexhaustible Health
10WW
You gain X life, where X is ten times the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control.

What do we think? These set a very high bar in the 'utterly, ridiculously, huge effects for a very large price' category, and Spike won't like them too much because they have a chance of doing nothing, but then again, he's not meant to. These are all unashamedly for Timmy.

Current Wording:
Immeasurable Might
Sorcery
10GG
Creatures you control get +X/+X and trample until end of turn, where X is the total converted mana cost of all permenants you control.

[zeus-online]

I think their cost should be reduced, just a little bit...
They look funny, but ...hmm too ridiculous? they're certainly not good, but they look like something from an UN set.

/Zeus

[Anusien]

If you cast this, you win the game, which seems about right.  Can we safely put "Cannot be countered" on these?  For 12 mana spells, come on!

[jro]

Why would you want to clutter up the rares of a set with a cycle of basically unplayable cards?  What's the point of making a cycle of them?  That's basically saying that 1 out of every 10 rares (if it's in a small set) is going to be one of these.  It's kind of entertaining to have one card that keys off the idea of "total converted mana cost", but why bother with the cycle?  I think these are bad Timmy cards because they have a chance of doing nothing.  Timmy does not play cards that do nothing.  His cards should always be splashy by themselves.  It's Johnny that wants cards like this, so they can find a way to break it.  And they are bad Spike cards because they cost 12 mana and you can't cheat them into play.

[Godder]

5 in a set would be painful, but across a block, or even one per block for 5 years (c.f. Kor Haven) would lessen the pain significantly.

[Matt]

Why would you want to clutter up the rares of a set with a cycle of basically unplayable cards?

Agreed. These will basically never ever be used in any format except casual play.

[Nazdakka]

If people really don't like the idea of a cycle of these, I can cut them down to one card - the Green one is probably the strongest and most spectacular.

[jro]

If people really don't like the idea of a cycle of these, I can cut them down to one card - the Green one is probably the strongest and most spectacular.

I think the green one would be the best of the lot, since you'd want creatures out to make it useful, and those creatures are liable to have cost something to play.  The blue one, for example, just seems extremely contrary to any sort of strategy that involves lots of card drawing (either to help out yourself or to deck the opponent).  The green one is sort of like Accelerated Mutation, but for everyone, and for more than just your highest casting cost.  It would fit the role of the "pump spell finisher" like Overrun or Tromp the Domains.  I think it could probably cost something like 9 and be fair.

[President Skroob]

If people really don't like the idea of a cycle of these, I can cut them down to one card - the Green one is probably the strongest and most spectacular.

I think the green one would be the best of the lot, since you'd want creatures out to make it useful, and those creatures are liable to have cost something to play.  The blue one, for example, just seems extremely contrary to any sort of strategy that involves lots of card drawing (either to help out yourself or to deck the opponent).  The green one is sort of like Accelerated Mutation, but for everyone, and for more than just your highest casting cost.  It would fit the role of the "pump spell finisher" like Overrun or Tromp the Domains.  I think it could probably cost something like 9 and be fair.

It's a much more powerful effect than Vitalizing Wind, which clocks in at CC 8 if I recall, so I'd agree with a cost of CC 9 at minimum.

[Nazdakka]

Vitalizing Wind is 9 mana. However a) V.Wind has never been played in serious constructed and b) V. Wind is actually more reliable than the green one of these. I think we're looking at somewhere between 9 and 12 mana as the correct costing.

[President Skroob]

My bad on the cost. I sadly can't check cards at work...

I'm not really sure that it's less reliable than Vitalizing Wind. If you've ramped up a minimum of 9 mana, you're bound to have at least a total of 10CC in permanents on the board to still be in the game at all. Essentially, a board position which makes this card's requirement for permanents with converted casting cost to make it weaker than Vitalizing Wind would also be bad for Vitalizing Wind itself.

But then, as you mentioned, Vitalizing Wind doesn't see play at all, and there's a reason for that.

[Negator131]

Man, I wish all of these would see print, just for the purpose of Imprinting them on Spellweaver Helix.

[Matt]

This card is fundamentally flawed in two ways. One, this really isnt very different than just "+10/+10". Two, this card makes you add a bunch of numbers, and Timmy don't like math!

[Anusien]

Two, this card makes you add a bunch of numbers, and Timmy don't like math!

That's flawed.  Have you ever seen someone count up the benefits from two pumps and three auras or so?  I think Timmy can appreciate more work making a better creature.

[Matt]

Yeah but that's math that has to be done to know what happens. 95% of the time no one is going to bother with the math, since it will be obviously enough to kill with. So why bother? Just make it a super overrun and be done with it.

[Anusien]

Well my point is, this is going to win the game if the creature connects anyway, since it's going to be some super terrific pump bonus.  So why not let Timmy have the benefit of getting to do the math and exclaim, "Hit you for 37!"?  After all, Spike is going to appreciate it being better/worse depending on the game state, and Timmy is going to like how well it works when he has stuff on the table.