my mono U deck

[neal]

hi guys, i havn't been to TMD in a while... and just got back into magic... i've always played blue... my first blue deck was full of counterspells, and lots and lots of tim's(he's a freaking champion in numbers)

primary win condition is of course disable/control followed followed by beat down by tims....

my friends always play control/combo decks(gift's, slave...blah) and sligh(goblins!) so keep in mind my meta game....

neal's "powered championship deck"
power(6)
1 library of alexandria
1 ancestrall recall
1 sol ring
1 mox sapphire
1 black lotus
1 time walk

control (10)
4 counterspell
4 fow
2 misd

utility(13)
4 x brainstorm
4 x curiosity or ophidian's eye?
3xcapsize
2xenergy field

hate(5)
2 tormod
3 back to basics

creatures(9)
morphling
4 x suqauta fire walker
2 x thornwind faerie's
2 x man of war

land (20)
16 island
4 polluted delta

im thinking about putting in extract, im not quite sure if i should have more draw options... should i toss in mana drain as well?? dont know hwo to balance it out... control versus bounce versus more tims

[neal]

also thinking about dropping in null rods... i dont got that many art's
but my friends drop em like its hot....kinda annoying

[technogeek5000]

if your mono blue run mishra's factory for extra beater,

curiosity is better then ophidian eye

Please play mystical tutor

take out energy field and capsize for 3 ninja, 2 ummewaz'as jitte

your creature base looks awkward, you can keep the man-o-war (works in the format). but you should run flying men, good synergy with curiosity (great thing with ninja).

I would add more artifacts and add tinker colossus for the random win.

Do you have a sideboard?

you can test with me on MWS if you want, so i can see how this works in action. just PM me

[neal]

hmm sideboard? don't really play with SB with friends but i guess if i did

sb

1xmisdirection
2xtormod's crypt
4xred elemental blast
4xextract
4xenergy flux

[neal]

hmm i dont like artifacts... i like to keep it blue.... i kinda want to run more artifact hate like null rod or energy flux because everyone runs artifacts........

the reason why i say ophid' eye is because i play in a control heavy environment... cant counter it and you get the card advantage when you put it on tim in play...

tinker/colossus.... everyone does it... and like i said i dont wish to run so many artifacts... they still get hosed like crazy imo... and getting your tinker countered hurts (i know cuz i do it to my friends all the time)

bounce is really powerful... thats why the cap... and the buyback is ok...

energy field is for ppl who drop the colossus on turn 2 against me.... i rather just chill there poke with my tim and draw cards and boucne the colossus when the energy field falls... also energy field seems like a good idea agaisnt sligh...  slight always give blue control problems

[Nydaeli]

It seems like you can't decide between BBS and mono-blue Fish.  BBS is probably going to be better in the long run.

The creatures you're running don't seem that great.  I'd run 4 Ophidian, 2 Morphling, Tinker/Colossus and nothing else.

Merchant Scroll or Cunning Wish would also help you out for tutor power.

Toss in 1x Rebuild to help out with artifacts.

Strip Mine, Mystical Tutor and Fact or Fiction are all good restricted cards to add.

[desolutionist]

I made this for a friend:

4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Tolarian Academy
9 Island
1 Academy Ruins

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Aether Spellbomb

1 Sundering Titan
4 Trinket Mage
2 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir

4 Merchant Scroll
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
4 Counterspell
2 Shadow of Doubt
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Rebuild
1 Echoing Truth

----------------------
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl’s Recall
4 Extract
4 Threads of Disloyalty
2 Trickbind

[wethepeople]

Desolutionist, I really like your list, it's probably the best Mono that I've seen in a long time. My only question is, where's Back to Basics? As far as I know, B2B is the only reason people still play Mono . Is there any particular reason why you don't?

My favorite part of your list has got to be:

4 Trinket Mage

Seeing as you run Mage and the standard Toolbelt, why don't you run Chalice of the Void while your at it?

You've got a full set of accel, and I wouldn't doubt you having a fairly weak Aggro matchup, so Chalice at 1-2 may improve it's game a lot. You can always set it at 0-1 for Combo, Gifts, and so forth.

Though considering that you only made that deck for a friend of yours, and may have not even played it, I would understand if you chose not to answer my question(s).

[Implacable]

Mine eyes may be deceiving me, but I don't see Brainstorm in your list.  I really like how that list works, but I'd recommend cutting Counterspell for Brainstorm.

[zeus-online]

Brainstorm actually isn't all THAT good in mono blue, i can definetly see why it isn't included...

Also wondering about B2B ? its not that B2B is still the bomb that it was, but its the only reason for mono U imo.

/Zeus

[Implacable]

Brainstorm actually isn't all THAT good in mono blue, i can definetly see why it isn't included...

Also wondering about B2B ? its not that B2B is still the bomb that it was, but its the only reason for mono U imo.

/Zeus

 :shock:

Brainstorm is, at the very least, one the three most powerful unrestricted cards available.  It smooths over draws, find singletons, and increases card quality.  There is absolutely no reason, ever, to not run Brainstorm in a control deck!

[OfficeShredder]

Grim Tutor, Mishra's Workshop, Force of Will.  Merchant scroll, gifts ungiven.  Goblin welder.  Empty the warrens, Bazaar of Baghdad? 

The top three unrestricted cards is suspect at best.  Besides, mono-U shouldn't need mana fixing, and has very few singletons, and even fewer that can't be found via merchant scroll.  And it doesn't really increase card quality when all your cards do the exact same thing

[silvernail]

I'd probably consider running wither Null Rod ( heavily altering the deck) or at least B2B as others have said. Also I'd cut a few cards for Sea Drakes or Serendib Efreets if you can't find Drakes.

4 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
1 Tolarian Academy
9 Island
1 Academy Ruins

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
+ 1 Chalice of the void
- 1 off color mox
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Aether Spellbomb

- 1 Sundering Titan
+ 1 Darksteel Colossus ( why run Titan over DC ?)
4 Trinket Mage
2 Teferi, Mage of Zhalfir
+ 4 Sea Drake

4 Merchant Scroll
4 Mana Drain
4 Force of Will
- 2 Counterspell
2 Counterspell / 2 Misdirection
- 2 Shadow of Doubt
1 Fact or Fiction
1 Time Walk
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Tinker
1 Rebuild
1 Echoing Truth

----------------------
1 Tormod’s Crypt
1 Pithing Needle
1 Engineered Explosives
1 Rebuild
1 Hurkyl’s Recall
4 Extract
4 Threads of Disloyalty
2 Trickbind (maybe cut these and a threads for 3 Back to Basics?)

[OfficeShredder]

What, precisely, is the purpose of the fetchlands in this deck?  Just land thinning?  It seems like they're just being run because "that's the thing to do"

[silvernail]

Yes they warrent inclusion because they thin your deck of lands, allowing you to draw other non land cards more frequently. Just look at legacy goblins, it runs fetches to get that exact effect ( though sometimes it wants color fixing if they splash). 6 fetches and 9 lands to search for seems a bit wrong however, at least for a control deck.

[wethepeople]

What, precisely, is the purpose of the fetchlands in this deck?  Just land thinning?  It seems like they're just being run because "that's the thing to do"

That, and, Brainstorm turns into the near-equivalent to Ancestral Recall when teamed with a fetchland.

[OfficeShredder]

Except there aren't any brainstorms...

[Implacable]

Grim Tutor, Mishra's Workshop, Force of Will.  Merchant scroll, gifts ungiven.  Goblin welder.  Empty the warrens, Bazaar of Baghdad? 

The top three unrestricted cards is suspect at best.  Besides, mono-U shouldn't need mana fixing, and has very few singletons, and even fewer that can't be found via merchant scroll.  And it doesn't really increase card quality when all your cards do the exact same thing

Brainstorm is more powerful than Grim Tutor, Shop, Scroll, Welder, Warrens, and Bazaar when paired with fetchlands.  It's that simple.  Brainstorm makes bad hands good, which is the most powerful thing that a card can do.  Brainstorm is the universal card of Vintage; every deck, from combo to Fish, runs it as a 4-of.  The card is just that good.

[wethepeople]

Except there aren't any brainstorms...

utility(13)
4 x brainstorm
4 x curiosity or ophidian's eye?
3xcapsize
2xenergy field

Yeah, except for the four that he has maindecked in under "Utility".

On the subject of not-running Brainstorm:

Quite frankly, Brainstorm is a card that I would never not-want to see in my hand when playing a deck like this. BStorm gives you three cards right when you need them for . So right then, it is the equivalent of Ancestral Recall, nonetheless. Now, you do need to give up two cards, okay, no problem, considering all decks generally have some sort of dead card at hand. Plus, most all Vintage decks also use Fetchlands to "shuffle away" those dead cards, including Neal's "Mono Deck" . Brainstorm also provides you of a way to "hide" cards from opposing Duresses or Cabal Therapies, which certainly have been popular lately. So really,  there is no logical reason to not-want it in here.

I really don't feel it's necessary to get into details however, seeing as this argument is ridiculous.

[OfficeShredder]

That would be great, except I was referring to desolutionist's build 

[zeus-online]

Brainstorm actually isn't all THAT good in mono blue, i can definetly see why it isn't included...

Also wondering about B2B ? its not that B2B is still the bomb that it was, but its the only reason for mono U imo.

/Zeus

 :shock:

Brainstorm is, at the very least, one the three most powerful unrestricted cards available.  It smooths over draws, find singletons, and increases card quality.  There is absolutely no reason, ever, to not run Brainstorm in a control deck!

I'm fully aware of how good brainstorm is, but in Mono-u they really aren't that great, you never draw broken stuff off the top, and your deck is pretty much just mana and counters.

I'm not saying that they're bad, they're just not "insane" in mono-u.
And yes the fetch lands is for land-thinning, its not a matter off how good that is, or how much it affects the game, but more of "why not?", why wouldn't you want to be thinning your deck for lands for no cost at all?
(oh and they're obviosly better with B-storms)

/Zeus

[Jank Golem]

And yes the fetch lands is for land-thinning, its not a matter off how good that is, or how much it affects the game, but more of "why not?", why wouldn't you want to be thinning your deck for lands for no cost at all?

Fetchlands do have a cost though, 1 life. This may not sound like a big deal but against Fish or Combo one or two life can make a world of difference. Fetches should only be use if you run a multi color deck, or if you use the shuffle effect (Brainstorm). There is a really good article about this subject here: http://magic.tcgplayer.com/db/print.asp?ID=3096

[OfficeShredder]

Why not for fetchlands:

Blood moon, root maze, mishra's ankh, stifle, shadow of doubt, trickbind.

Some of those are more popular than others right now, but there are ample reasons to not run fetchlands

[Nydaeli]

4 Brainstorm is mandatory, for reasons that have been discussed.

Fetchlands to accompany it are mandatory as well, although running too many is bad.  Five should be about right in a monocolored deck.

[dksxmks]

I think a good number for fetches in a monocolor deck is 6+. Gifts at a minimum run 5, why would a monocolor deck run the same amount. I personally run 7 in UW Fish.. The deck thinning is invaluable, especially for the long game, which is the general plan for BBS.

Can you elaborate on "too many fetches" and why it would be bad?

[wethepeople]

I think that the fact that fetches thin decks and make Brainstorm better is a good enough reason to run them. The only real reason I can imagine not-wanting to is the fact that they cost 15-20 dollars, whereas a basic Island costs less than a dime.

[neal]

i dont wish to run so many artifacts as i believe artifacts are so easily hosed

i really think energy field is great against beatdown

i wish to keep this mono u.... blue is my favorite color

4xbrainstorm with 4 xfetchland is good... in the beginning it can help a lot especially if ur landscrewed or if waht you have in your hand is not what you need... it can hide good cards from duress/hymn and cycle threw your deck faster to get what you need...

the original idea behidn this deck was to bring out the tims as fast as possible... and bounce all the big creatures... and recounter them...  and control the game late on with bounce and counterage....... the non powered version of this deck is great fun in a casual environment but yea i really think it might be ok in a vintage environment especially when powered and other utility/hate thrown into it

everyone runs either control or combo or both... its rather annoying but bounce is all around good utility to mess around against that..

hmm thanks for the comments guys

[desolutionist]

@Brainstorm -

With a deck as redundant as mono blue control, Brainstorm doesn't really have a profound effect on anything.  The fetchland synergy is certainly very good, but not better than simply having a lot of counters.  Most combo decks today are built assuming that the opponent only has a maximum of 8 counters (4 Forces and 4 Drains); 14 completely invalidates conventional countermeasures.  So even if you can find room for Brainstorms without cutting counterspells, I'd still argue that the slots would be better used as additional counterspells. 

When I initially built the deck, I didn't entertain the possibility of drawing a Sundering Titan, which would be the ONLY sound justification for the Brainstorms.  But it seems better to just use DSC and throw in a few Thirst for Knowledges (which should be in anyway).

-Echoing Truth (We already have EE)
-Merchant Scroll
-Sundering Titan
+Thirst for Knowledge
+Thirst for Knowledge
+Darksteel Colossus

@B2B -

This doesn't seem like a worthwhile addition to me.  MUC should be primarily focused on control through spell denial (as opposed to mana denial); how does B2B assist this strategy?  Also, B2B is probably the easiest mana restriction to play around.

[Godder]

I'm not so sure about modern Vintage, but B2B was the primary reason to play MUC in Vintage for the longest time. It shuts down a lot of opponents while doing nothing to yourself.

[neal]

can u guys tell me where MTG players gather to play t1 on IRC?

thanks