New Dual Lands

[Marco]

Not sure if these should be rare or uncommon:

Dystopian Mire
Land – Swamp Mountain
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Dystopian Mire comes into play, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Forgotten Delta
Land – Island Swamp
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Forgotten Delta comes into play, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Jagged Foothills
Land – Mountain Forest
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Jagged Foothills comes into play, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Sheltered Strand
Land – Plains Island
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Sheltered Strand comes into play, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Sun-Drenched Heath
Land – Forest Plains
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Sun-Drenched Heath comes into play, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Post-M10 Update:

Dystopian Mire
Land – Swamp Mountain (Rare)
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Dystopian Mire enters the battlefield, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Forgotten Delta
Land – Island Swamp (Rare)
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Forgotten Delta enters the battlefield, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Jagged Foothills
Land – Mountain Forest (Rare)
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Jagged Foothills enters the battlefield, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Sheltered Strand
Land – Plains Island (Rare)
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Sheltered Strand enters the battlefield, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

Sun-Drenched Heath
Land – Forest Plains (Rare)
(: Add or to your mana pool.)
When Sun-Drenched Heath enters the battlefield, target opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. If that player does, he or she then shuffles his or her library.

[Anusien]

Definitely rare.  Interesting, although I'm questioning whether these should be basic land types or not.

[Marco]

Care to elaborate? (It only took 14 days for someone to respond.)

The consensus at www.mtgsalvation.com is that this can/should be uncommon. They started out as rares.

I definitely like that they have basic lands types. What is your rationale for making them plain old nonbasic lands?

[Matt]

1. Well giving them basic types obviously makes them much stronger. Few cards punish lands for having land types compared to the wealth of options that reward them.
2. Rarity: They're pretty darn good. Certainly they're better than the Invasion CIPT lands, although probably not quite as good as Ravnica duals.

[andrewpate]

I agree that, from a balance standpoint, they would be fine at uncommon.  Thing is, as Matt points out, they are very good.  It's a simple matter of precedent to say that good multicolored lands go in the rare slot almost every time.  The one notable exception involving really outstanding mana fixing lands of lower rarity is the presence of the Karoo lands at common in Ravnica Block, and I think we can agree that this was due to a combination of 1)the multicolor theme needing good common color fixing and 2)the fact that WotC elected to put two entire 10-land cycles in the same block.

Frankly (and perhaps not just a little cynically), I think Hasbro needs to sell packs, and stellar rare lands seem to do it.  I just can't imagine seeing an uncommon land this good previewed on wizards.com for an upcoming set.  What would the forum reaction even be like?  There's just no precedent except the outlier Ravnica Block, where it was taken in stride for a number of unique reasons (including the fact that the rare slot was already jammed with tournament staples even without more lands).

[Matt]

Well there were also the Tainted Lands from Torment.

[andrewpate]

True, I did miss those, but again you're getting into multiple land cycles within a block.  The go-to multilands for OTJ are the filter lands, which are rare.  The lands in this thread look much more like "main" color-fixing lands rather than "cool, interesting variant" ones in the line of the black-based Torment lands or the Karoo lands.

That said, in a multicolor block like RGD, I could totally see these going at common with some other lands at rare (probably these would not have the basic lands types in that case, as nonbasics with those types seem to be exclusively confined to the rare slot).  They would play GREAT in Limited by fixing one person's land count while fixing the other's colors.  My post was from the "design in a vacuum" standpoint; it is possible to imagine a context where these would not be rare.

[zeus-online]

Am i the only one who thinks these lands are awful? Sure they produce two colors, but they the opponent a land! I really don't wanna give my opponent cards unless it's illusions of grandeur

Shock-lands are way better
Pain-lands are way better
Fetch-lands are way better
And obviously the original duals are better

Seriously, i'd hate playing with these lands.

/Zeus

[Norm4eva]

Whether or not they are truly better depends on if the opponent is playing with any basic lands.  They'd probably be bad in Standard but as you move into Extended and beyond, there are increasingly more decks which eschew basics for one reason or another.  Affinity, 2-Land Belcher, some Threshold decks... these guys don't necessarily have any at all, so in this instance they're actually pretty much on par with real duals. 

[Anusien]

Well if you're both playing them, it sort of evens out.  I can think of circumstances where I'd prefer this over CIPT lands.  We're spoiled by the large amount of manafixing available to us today, but many blocks would have killed for this.

[Marco]

Thank you for the intelligent commentary.  Here is the thread at www.mtgsalvation.com discussing these cards.  The argument for making these uncommon stems more from not screwing over casual players...

I think there is a lot to be said about the context of the set that these cards will appear in ("Context is Everything").  I haven't written anything at length about my burgeoning set, I'll have to do that sometime.  But, as they say, life happens.  In the meantime, I believe the other cards, themes, and mechanics in my set can support these lands as they are... and at uncommon they would allow for a cycle of legendary lands in the rare slot...

I do have a several cards that lend themselves to multiplayer games in my set.  As such, I considered making these:

"When Jagged Foothills comes into play, each opponent may search his or her library for a basic land card, reveal it, and put it into his or her hand. Then each player who searched his or her library this way shuffles it."

Thoughts?

One nice thing about the current wording is that if your opponent has Ivory Mask or True Believer in play, he or she cannot search his or her library... and my set may have other ways to negate this drawback.  I'm thinking maybe an undercosted fattie with the ability "Your opponents have shroud. (They can't be the targets of spells or abilities.)"...

[Matt]

If you make it "each" then that guarantees that they'll never be used in mutliplayer.

Unless it's combined with Ancient Runes or Ankh of Mishra, or something, but you get the idea.

[latviathan]

I'd love to see these at uncommon, and I think they are a great idea. We have the almost the entire weight of precedent for multilands on the side of rare, except for one thing -- the power level of this specific cycle. These are significantly worse than a lot of other manafixers because they do get your opponent a land. I'd say they are almost exactly on par with the Invasion taplands, which were indeed uncommon. I also agree with choosing an opponent, not each opponent. No reason to make the cards worse.

[The Acidic Hasidic]

maybe you should make it say if you played this land from your hand, then an opponent may search.

[Lotus Fairy]

The art on those cards is amazing! very well done.

[Anusien]

They're aren't, to my knowledge, any lands with multiple land types that aren't rare.  This seems somewhere in the vicinity of a Ravnica dual or Murmuring Bosk, so I'd be much happier with them in rare.

[Mantis]

The art on those cards is amazing! very well done.

Totally agreed. Is that Rob Alexanders art? It's freaking awesome!

[Marco]

Updated post # 1 with post-M10 wording.

[BruiZar]

Agree. A dual land that can be used the moment it comes into play and can be fetched should always be atleast rare