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Author Topic: When Ponies Attack! 4th in Norwich  (Read 6936 times)
Almighty
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« on: April 06, 2008, 01:54:06 am »

Ahh, the overview. Vintage, it has been a while, but I'm back(maybe). I had no idea that it was even feasible to make this tourney for a little while. In fact, it wasn't until I got laid off that I suddenly found the time to sling some cards again. I tried to shake off some rust by playing at an FNM and getting my mechanics down a little bit before I tried again tomorrow, and practice I received.

Maybe it's because I play with a fellow named Dan Yarrington a lot, but I have grown very fond of the attack step. In fact, if the deck's main focus isn't turning dudes sideways, I wanted nothing to do with it. My number one deck has been R/G beatz for roughly a year, but some testing with Oli, Craig, and Dan showed me that red was just a terrible color to feature in this archetype, and I need to find inspiration elsewhere. And elsewhere I found it. I began with a theory: Elves + Gaddock Teeg + Lightning Greaves means YOU CAN'T LOSE! So I threw a deck together with cards that featured all of the above. I wanted it to be a casual deck that randomly
steals games from good decks, and that's normally good enough for me to have a blast at a tournament, but even Teeg elves turned out to be a miserable concoction. I can only sacrifice so many to Skullclamp before I can no longer win with Blasting Station.

So after I gave up on that abomination of an idea, I drew inspiration from old TMWA lists(which Dan no longer runs? For shame!) It involves lots of lock pieces on legs that also happen to beat down. Unfortunately, beyond Magus, red has really bad lock pieces, and no real beatstick. Green still has Teeg, which if my theory proved correct, is still a very viable threat to the NE metagamne. And Goyf, which after today proved it's worth as the absolute nut high. White provides Glowrider, which was excellent all day. I used Dan's current Suite of anti Oath tech, 8x Ponies! (Kami of Ancient Law and RONOM FREAKING UNICORN!) While they proved themselves relevant only once this tournament, they certainly wouldn't hurt against the Oath and Tyrant Blue matchups I managed to avoid.

Aven Mindcensor is a card that just doesn't see enough play right now. Every single good deck, save Oath, wins with a chain of Tutors, and there is no better card at stopping every single one of them than this card. The only other thing I was absolutely sure of was Yixlid jailer in the side. I can board in 15 cards to fight Flash and I'm still not guaranteed to win. Ichorid is that other unwinnable matchup for myself that I can win with enough hate, so I decided to focus my efforts against that deck and ran from there. In the end, my deck looked a little something like this:

When Ponies Attack!

4 Aven Mindcensor
4 Kami of Ancient Law
4 Ronom Unicorn
4 Glowrider
4 Tarmogoyf
3 Gaddock Teeg

4 Thorn of Amethyst
4 Skullclamp
4 Swords to Plowshares

1 Mox Jet
1 Lotus petal
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Pearl
1 Black Lotus
1 Sol Ring
1 Mana Crypt
2 Scrubland
1 Bayou
4 Windswept Heath
4 Savannah
1 Strip Mine
2 Plains
4 Wasteland

SB:

4 Duress
3 Yixlid Jailer
4 Leyline of the Void
4 Oxidize

I really dislike running Leyline, but Oli talked me into it. It has terrible synergy with my Goyfs, and if I can't more then one out, I'm asking to lose to a Chain of Vapor. Duress was underwhelming. It will likely be replaced with Samurai of the Pale Curtain, which both Oli and Dan suggested to me and it does sound really good on paper. Oxidize because of all my sphere effects, i needed the most inexpensive artifact kill I could come up with.

On with the report! Unfortunately, I did not take notes, so you will have to bear with me on some instances.


Round one: Workshop Aggro

Game 1 involved me Swordsing a Juggernaut, holding down the ground with a 5/6 Goyf, while an Aven flew overhead. Eventually I started drawing more creatures vie Clamp, and I overran him.

In game 2 I Oxidized a Sword of fire and ice and played more dudes than he could handle. His Juggernaut was forced to run into a 5/6 goyf after I sacrificed a Kami to nerf a Pyrostatic Pillar. Eventually I played more dudes than he could handle and I took the match.



Round two: Flash

Not much to say about this, he flashed ge turn two game one and tinker->Platinum Anger game two which I could not answer in time. We both played very sloppiny, as I drew a card on the play, and when he tinkered, we both forgot Mindcensor was in play until it was too late. I deserved to lose this round.


Round three: Ichorid

He did the Ichorid thing game 1. I knew he was that new fangled Mana Ichorid, which means no Reverent Silence anyways. I got smashed

Game 2 I mulled into Leyline, which he was worried about for a little while, until he ripped Chain off the top like a champ. I in turn showed him how much of a champ I was when I ripped the Lotus to hard cast it next turn. Over the next couple of turns, I dropped a Jailer and a Teeg, and he conceeded shortly after digging with Bazaar a few times.

Game 3 I opened with Leyline and two strips for his two lands. I started building up my lands again and dropped 2 glowriders. He was unable to cast a non-Narcomeoba the whole game and I pulled out the win when I had a small army assembled


Round Four: GAT

He was a younger kid who seemed nervous to be on the cusp. The winner of the match gets in. He has an idea of what I am playing, and I know what he is on by watching his match next to me the previous round. I'm not going to underestimate him despite the fact that he looked no older than 11, and the match was underway!

Game 1 he kept a mana light hand. I punished it with an Aven Mindcensor when turned into a must counter when I responded to his fetch. A couple of Strip effects before he could stabilize plus some lock pieces and he was dead in a few turns

Game 2 he had the nuts. Wasn't going to win. He pyroclasmed some dudes though

Game 3 he seemed really nervous. Perhaps this was his first time on the bubble? I tried to have a conversation with him to calm him down, with limited success. I want my opponents to enjoy themselves and he was visually shaking. He allowed both Glowrider and Teeg to resolve not understanding what either of them did. Skullclamp was equipped to Teeg when he clasmed, forgetting that his ponder costed two mana now. This tapped him out as the turn passed. I played a Goyf and two clamps equipping them and started bashing. I then dropped a Glowrider. At this point, he needs to pay a minimum of 3 per non creature spell via Thorn and Rider. Goyf swung again and he was forced to block and trade his dryad. I drew 4, played out my hand, and won shortly thereafter.


Round 5: ID


Top 8: Mono blue Magus of the Moon? Drainless Slaver w/Magus?

I wasn't sure what to make of his deck because I steamrolled him. I had a very good opening hand game 1 and I walked his tinker into a Mindcensor game 2 after duressing him and plucking a Clasm. This match ended in about 8 minutes.


Top 4: Flash Again

He had the nuts game 1. Game 2, he fooled me with a transformational Oath sideboard. I drew no ponies to trump his Oath and I eventually lost to Platinum Beats.


3/4th Playoff against Ray Robilliard. We split the prizes and played for the glory of the bronze medal. As the topic implies, I lost a very tight, enjoyable, and one of the most fun matches in my magic playing career.

I'll describe this match at a later time. It was a very tight match with a ton of interactivity. Kinda late for me now unfortunately.

I snagged a minty Mana Crypt and 6o store credit for my troubles, which bought me a Chains of Mephistopheles and a Thoughtseize. These cards are so much easier to acquire when you win them.  Wink

Props:

Dan for his work on the Archetype. I borrowed a lot of tech from his earlier TMWA builds to come up with this deck.
Oli for providing some valuable testing experience which allowed me to settle on a maindeck.
Ruby Tuesday's for having Rogue Dead Guy Ale on tap. I have never seen this beer on tap before, and it's been one of my favorites for a long time.

Slops:

While everyone at the store was friendly and worked to make sure everyone was welcomed, it was a sinking feeling that the store sold porn magazines right out in the open. Especially when young kids were allowed behind the counter to where they were on display.


Overall I had a fun time at the event, even if I held the car ride up by 3 hours because everyone else scrubbed. Very Happy

Thanks for reading!
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« Reply #1 on: April 06, 2008, 02:55:03 am »

Congratulations on making top 4.  Sinking feeling you say? That sounds like the most ragged card-shop/magic tournament venue I have ever heard of;  Porn magazines and 11 year-old GAT players?!  RAGARDIO!  I am happy that some unexpected decklists did well and that you had fun. 
   Food for thought:  Maybe that 11 year old kid wasn't nervous because he was playing you...maybe he was just shaking to get his hands on a minty new porno magazine >.<  hahaha  classic.
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« Reply #2 on: April 06, 2008, 07:41:28 am »

Good finish and a nice deck.
Have you considered Kataki? Perhaps it can replace Oxidize in the sideboard. Boarding Kataki's in for Thorn of Amethyst against Workshop decks seem pretty good.

Perhaps I might load this deck up in MWS sometime and see if I like for a tourney. Could you tell me a bit about the matchups?

Also, what is up with Skullclamp? Do you really want to invest your own creatures into drawing more cards? I'd rather splash blue for Recall, Time Walk and perhaps Ninja of the Deep Hours then play Skullclamp I think.
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« Reply #3 on: April 06, 2008, 08:44:14 am »

I snagged a minty Mana Crypt and 6o store credit for my troubles, which bought me a Chains of Mephistopheles and a Thoughtseize. These cards are so much easier to acquire when you win them.  Wink

Quote
the store sold porn magazines right out in the open.


You totally should have put your 60 in store credit into porn.
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« Reply #4 on: April 06, 2008, 02:42:28 pm »

Here's how my match vs Ray went down:

He won the die roll and elected to play. He opened up with Shop->Trinisphere. On my turn, I Wastelanded his Shop and we were underway. We each played Land go for a couple turns, but he stopped on two, while I made it to three first and had a couple of options. I had Mindcensor, Teeg, and 2 Ponies. I elected to drop Teeg first so as to not get shut down by Chalice or owned by Explosives. He made a Monkey who say there and looked menacing. He also dropped a three mana artifact that produces a good bunch of mana, Teeg, plus a pony had beaten down for a couple of turns which dropped him to around 12. I plopped a Glowrider down, trying to shorten his outs, but he had tinker ready to go. I had a white mana source, but no STP. He sacked his 3sphere and turned it into a Sundering Titan. Titan Nerfed all of my lands, leaving 4 turns to find a swords. I looked at the Mindcensor in my hand and decided that my guessing game may have been incorrect. That guy would have been a wee bit better than a glowrider. I dropped a Plains and passed. He strip mined it, played a Welder and I was now drawing dead.

I sideboarded out the garbage Thorns in favor of much better Oxidize.

Game 2: I drop a turn one pony with a Mox and pass. He plays a mana vault and City of Brass, a Mox Jet and yet another Turn one 3 sphere. I had 2 strips in hand, so I may get lucky and turn this game into a blowout. I bashed with the Pony, stripped his City, and waited for him to do it again next turn. Sure enough he did, and  stripped his land once more. After I bashed 3 times, he finally hit three mana, which was unfortunately before me. Still, I made it to 3 mana and dropped a Goyf. Goyf wasn't huge at this point, but still fairly menacing. He Monkeied away his Mana Vault after chumping my Goyf to not lose to it and he finally dropped a Trike off an Academy. I did some math and decided that the best plan of action was to swing right into the trike, getting two damage through and trading the board position. He had Top out, but I needed to finish him off before that thing won him the game. I bashed and we traded, clearing the board of dudes. After dropping creatured 3 turns in a row, he finally scooped it up.

Game 3: He Tutored out an early crucible/strip lock, but I wasn't going down that easily. I played out two fetchlands and a strip mine, forcing him to not go after my lands just yet. He Played an Orb of Dreams, which forced me to go into action, sacking both of my fetches. To his surprise, I kept a very mana heavy hand, and I played a creature every turn. I whittled away at him while he stripped my lands, then he finally had a Welder and a Trike in play. I untapped with very little left to do to stay in the game. I had two Glowriders, a Pony and a Teeg out. He was at low enough life where I could swing in and he was forced to do something. I had a STP in hand ready for his Trike, which was unfortunately locked under my glowriders. I knew he wasn't concerned with them too much, as his mana base was very developed, but the two power they had was extremely threatening. I went all in. He removed two counters to kill two Glowriders. He blocked my Teeg, and stacked damage. He threw the last counter at my head, and I sent his Trink farming at the last second to keep it out of the graveyard. He was down to a Welder with nothing very good to weld in, I had a Pony out and was finally succumbed to the strip/crucible lock. It was a metter of whether or not he could find an answer in time. The odds were in his favor, but he was still under a bit of pressure to get there in time. He spun the top... and finally found Crop Rotation->Barbarian Ring. He dropped a 2sphere, blasted my pony, and I was finally completely locked out. Heck of a match.


Quote
Good finish and a nice deck.
Have you considered Kataki? Perhaps it can replace Oxidize in the sideboard. Boarding Kataki's in for Thorn of Amethyst against Workshop decks seem pretty good.

Perhaps I might load this deck up in MWS sometime and see if I like for a tourney. Could you tell me a bit about the matchups?

Also, what is up with Skullclamp? Do you really want to invest your own creatures into drawing more cards? I'd rather splash blue for Recall, Time Walk and perhaps Ninja of the Deep Hours then play Skullclamp I think.

Kataki is an option I had forgot about. It's worth a spin to say the least. I really like spot artifact removal, as without the Oxidize, I would have lost handily to the Sword of Fire/Ice. Certainly better against Stax varients, but much worse against Shop Aggro. I guess it depends what you expect to see more of. It's a metagame hate deck first and foremost and needs constant retooling to stay competitive. Unfortunately, if you have to win the game by attacking without plaing an aggro control suite, constant retooling is absolutely necessary look at how many variants of TMWA there are at this point!

Skullclamp is very important in matchups that feature dudes that block or bigger dudes that force you to block. If there was a metagame with minimal GAT, Random Aggro, Fish, and no Goyfs whatsoever, skullclamp helps me dig down to either win the Dude advantage or dig for removal to kill their big guy. When a redundant deck like this draws 4 cards a turn, some decks simply cannot win.
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« Reply #5 on: April 06, 2008, 04:57:34 pm »

Thanks for posting the report, and congratulations on the finish!
I'm glad you top 4'd at the one tournament you could attend.

If I'm not busy, maybe I'll see you at Myriad or something.

... PONIES!!!
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« Reply #6 on: April 08, 2008, 05:10:42 pm »

Congratulations, Kyle!

Go Ponies!!!

 {R} Very Happy {R}
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« Reply #7 on: April 09, 2008, 08:09:42 am »

NIIIICE deck Smile. Anyway, I'm also currently trying to perfect the old TMWA/Fish archetype and I found this deck very fascinating. A couple comments though.

Have you considered:

Dark Confidant?

And what cards from Shadowmoor might find a home in this deck?

I can think of one very interesting card you might like. Check out Dusk Urchins. I'm not sure if its good, but it certainly has interesting promise as a beatstick.

How are 8 dudes who kill enchantments working for you MD? That seems like too many to me. I'd only run 4-6 in the MD as Oath can be dealt with in other ways too (StP is an example). Teeg is also pretty good against Oath right now because they run FoW AND Gush.

Anyhoo, those are my questions for now. Congratz on the tourney!

-Storm

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« Reply #8 on: April 09, 2008, 11:21:42 am »

NIIIICE deck Smile. Anyway, I'm also currently trying to perfect the old TMWA/Fish archetype and I found this deck very fascinating. A couple comments though.

Have you considered:

Dark Confidant?

And what cards from Shadowmoor might find a home in this deck?

I can think of one very interesting card you might like. Check out Dusk Urchins. I'm not sure if its good, but it certainly has interesting promise as a beatstick.

How are 8 dudes who kill enchantments working for you MD? That seems like too many to me. I'd only run 4-6 in the MD as Oath can be dealt with in other ways too (StP is an example). Teeg is also pretty good against Oath right now because they run FoW AND Gush.

Anyhoo, those are my questions for now. Congratz on the tourney!

-Storm



Thanks Fox, Dan, and Stormanimagus!

There looks like there should be a home in this deck for confidant. Maybe in place of Skullclamp in a black heavier build. Getting the black out was only my concern in the Ichorid and Flash matchup, although I feel that flash is a losing battle no matter which direction you take this deck. Perhaps with a deck that focuses more on attacking the hand and less with attacking the mana base, Confidant could easily find a home.

I am unfamiliar with pretty much every Shadowmoor card. If there is a potentially useful one, can you link me to what it does?

Teeg was amazing against everything relevant when he came down. The 8x Ponies in the deck never mattered in the tournament, but they shined in favor of any X/1 due to random blockers such as Welders and Mox Monkeys and Trikes in my match against Ray. I have a feeling that without so much enchantment hate, Oath would run right over me though. It has yet to be seen in practice, but still, that's what I feel would happen.

Thanks for the comments and well wishings, everyone. Keep further questions coming!
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« Reply #9 on: April 09, 2008, 06:12:13 pm »

Hey, what about a more mana-denial centered UWg list something along the lines of this?

Land (18):
4 Flooded Strand
1 Windswept Heath
3 Tundra
2 Savannah
1 Tropical Island
2 Plains
4 Wasteland
1 Strip Mine

Artifacts (5):
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Mox Emerald

Creatures (23):
4 Meddling Mage
4 Tarmogoyf
4 Ronom Unicorn
4 Glowrider
4 Aven Mindcensor
3 Gaddock Teeg

Instants (9):
4 Swords To Plowshares
4 Stifle
1 Ancestral Recall

Sorceries (1):
1 Time Walk

Artifacts (4):
4 Skullclamp

SB
4 Thorn Of Amethyst
4 Oxidize
3 Kami Of Ancient Law
1 Gaddock Teeg
3 Tormod’s Crypt

This was just a thought that came to mind when looking at your list. Stifle seems really good in an Oath/Flash/Storm Combo heavy meta and it is even better when combined with 5 Strip effects.

Thoughts?
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« Reply #10 on: April 09, 2008, 06:57:11 pm »

Any Vintage deck consisting of Ponies gets my vote for best deck in the format. Well done!
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« Reply #11 on: April 10, 2008, 10:10:47 am »

The thing I don't like about stifle in this deck is that holding stifle sets you turns behind. My build is very focused on tempo and denying it from my opponent, and leaving mana open for stifle is detrimental to my game plan. The deck was very good at dropping a turn one Thorn or other lock piece, which essentially does the same thing as Stifle except you don't have to wait around for it to be good. Holding on to Stifle might mean you dropped your clock by a full turn which can be enough time to find an answer to your dudes or sphere effects.

And while Stifle is Decent against flash, I cannot see that deck having any game against it. Turn 2 plus protection spell (maybe I am unlucky, but I have never survived to my third land drop VS. Flash, and if I do, they have at least 2-3 counters in hand) and Stifle becomes clunk that you probably wished was something else.

I like the addition of Meddling Mage, however. Mage and Teeg in the same deck is a headache for anything that opposes it. Drop a mage on Dryad while having Teeg in play seems tough for GAT to beat. If you are holding Swords, the game is essentially over.

Stifle seems like an excellent card to have relegated to the sideboard, but I would certainly leave the Thorn in the main if I were to walk into a NE metagame. If Flash is that big of a concern, unfortunately, the correct move is to play something else unless you wish to MD Leylines.

I do like your deck though. I may try out a version that has my suggestions to it in the future.


And thanks for the words, Shockwave. Ponies rule!
« Last Edit: April 10, 2008, 10:13:50 am by Almighty » Logged
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« Reply #12 on: April 17, 2008, 07:52:50 pm »

Damn you Kyle for making me want to play Vintage again, nice deck, have to love shoving it down the throats of irresponsibly broken crap stacks.


Well done sir
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« Reply #13 on: April 21, 2008, 10:59:59 pm »

It may be outdated tech, but has anyone thought of running vial in that uwg list?? you run 15(!) 2-drops and 8 3-drops, and that could ease up a lot of the stress on the mana base, letting you use wastelands, especially turn 1, to get the creature train rolling. If you can find the room, ponder would raise the sorcery count for goyf.
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« Reply #14 on: April 22, 2008, 07:27:06 am »

It may be outdated tech, but has anyone thought of running vial in that uwg list?? you run 15(!) 2-drops and 8 3-drops, and that could ease up a lot of the stress on the mana base, letting you use wastelands, especially turn 1, to get the creature train rolling. If you can find the room, ponder would raise the sorcery count for goyf.

Umm Vial is TERRIBLE right now.  Even Goblins isn't running it. 

Also take a lesson from Type 2 players, you don't have to build your deck any special way to make Gofy huge.  He just gets there.
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« Reply #15 on: April 22, 2008, 10:29:25 am »

I meant Ponder as a draw spell, not just to pump goyf. Plus, there is some blue in the deck, and I'm wondering if there would be a way to toss force of will in the deck. As it stands, there are 10 blue spells in the deck. I personally think that 4 mindcensor might be too many, and I also think that 4 stp is one or two too many. Probably one too many. Ponders and brainstorms could be uses to dig for creatures or skullclamp, something that skullclamp can't do on its own, especially first turn. Granted, though, you do run a ton of creatures.

Plus, I don't really remember Goblins ever really using vial, unless it was in legacy. I could be mistaken, though. I wouldn't mind vial in this deck, because the games seem like they would take a lot longer than a Game of goblins doing what its suppose to do.
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« Reply #16 on: April 22, 2008, 11:21:12 am »

I meant Ponder as a draw spell, not just to pump goyf. Plus, there is some blue in the deck, and I'm wondering if there would be a way to toss force of will in the deck. As it stands, there are 10 blue spells in the deck. I personally think that 4 mindcensor might be too many, and I also think that 4 stp is one or two too many. Probably one too many. Ponders and brainstorms could be uses to dig for creatures or skullclamp, something that skullclamp can't do on its own, especially first turn. Granted, though, you do run a ton of creatures.

Plus, I don't really remember Goblins ever really using vial, unless it was in legacy. I could be mistaken, though. I wouldn't mind vial in this deck, because the games seem like they would take a lot longer than a Game of goblins doing what its suppose to do.

It has nothing to do with it being to slow for Goblins.  But everything to do with Flash making the format to fast right now.
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« Reply #17 on: April 22, 2008, 02:50:59 pm »

Vial is a better addition than I think you are giving it credit for. This deck has such a terrible game against Flash that it just isn't worth trying to make the match up any better. I tinkered around with a more hand disruptive version and while it does give me a better game against flash, the match ups that i used to prey upon(GAT and Oath) were significantly worse. Personally, I feel if you were going to run this deck with blue, you may as well run fish with a green splash for Goyfs.

To reiterate, the Flash match up is bad enough, who cares if it's worse?

I will probably continue to run aggro in the future, just because I love crashing with guys, but Mana denial is the best strategy I can think of right now
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« Reply #18 on: April 24, 2008, 11:50:31 am »

Have you considered the addition of the new green blast to the deck, it might help with your Flash matchup?
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