Duress vs Thoughtseize

[Ophidian]

Hi everyone, This is is my first post. I've been playing since Ice Age and played Vintage up till 2000 and just started to play again since there are tournaments around her again.

This question came up with some guys I play with. What would you rather play with duress or thoughtseize? One guy is saying duress since it can't be misdirected and the lost of life is to great for rarely picking a creature. I think have 2 of each is good as it helps more against creature base decks without overcompensating for the threat of creatures which is small here. It was brought up that playing 4 is best because rarely more that 1 or 2 misdirection are played in a deck and you normally only play 2 or 3 in a deck.

I know that the deck decides greatly what to play. I would like to know people preferences. 

[Oath of Happy]

It really depends what deck you are playing.  In a fish deck, thoughtseize is generally better, because you need to win the creature battle in aggro mirrors, or just get rid of chump blockers.  In Storm decks, Duress seems to be the weapon of choice because its more effective at snagging a force of will or a stifle and doesnt pay life which can add up with necro, bargain, and grim tutor.  Storm decks don't really care much about creatures anyway because by the time creatures will swing for the win, the storm player just wins after duressing disruption (counters, null rod).  Control decks are the tough one.  I use thoughtseize, because even vs non aggro there is goblin welder, which is a devistating threat.  Even vs decks like Ad Nauseam they bring in cards like Xantid Swarm or mabey Dark Confidant so almost any matchup will have a creature that you might want to take.  I find the life loss to be very minor, although it does suck sometimes, and if it gets Misdirected I find it to usually be an even trade or better, 2 blue cards for 1 of my cards, 1 mana, and the card I dont want (extra moxes, robts). and lastly, In a deck using Gift's Ungiven you might want to run at least one of each so that you have the option of tutoring for both.

[Implacable]

Side point: with some decks nowadays using Ethersworn Canonist, at least post-SB, Storm decks might like Thoughtseize more.

[nineisnoone]

Agree with what Oath of Happy said. 

I would also add that if you have maindeck creature removal, Duress becomes better and perhaps even preferable.  However, if you don't run main deck creature removal, Thoughseize becomes hands down better.  Generally the more you are relying on it the better Thoughtseize is.  If it's more like your 9-12th piece of disruption, Duress probably becomes better.

[Troy_Costisick]

Duress also has the advantage of costing about one tenth the money Thoughtseize does. 

[Mantis]

In my book Thoughtseize is miles better. How bad does it suck to get randomly paired against Goblins, Fish or Shop Aggro and Duress them only to see all creatures there and then proceed to lose to a Magus of the Moon or an Ethersworn Cannonist. I would feel much more comfortable with Thoughtseize, although an exception could be storm combo where life is heavily used as a resource.

So basicaly what Oath of Happy said.

[mans0011]

Side point: with some decks nowadays using Ethersworn Canonist, at least post-SB, Storm decks might like Thoughtseize more.

Can't storm just bounce and then continue to win?

[Guli]

Yes, storm bounces and then wins, unless the aggro player can prevent the bounce with counter magic or protection (shroud, pro blue). Another way to stop combo is to have multiple threats that need to be dealt apart. (Gaddock Teeg + Canonist) You do need to keep up the pressure and threaten with more lock/disruptive elements to put a clock on their head otherwise they will easily find a way to bounce both your lock components.

As a fish player I say go for the thoughtseize, they hurt me way more than duress.