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Author Topic: Meadbert's testing results with some new lists.  (Read 11386 times)
meadbert
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« Reply #30 on: May 03, 2009, 05:35:54 pm »

I actually tested Implacable's version against B/U/G fish and was pretty impressed it was definitely an improvement.  By the way, Stifle is a real pain for Arcane Denial because they can Stifle the Denial trigger, so being about to potentially board out Denial's or Baubles for Annuls was huge.

Also, while I still suspect that Annul will be slow for Resistor, it is not slow at all for Rod because Rod is not usually a turn 1 play.  BUG Fish also has plenty of other 2 drops so Annul was always golden.
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« Reply #31 on: May 03, 2009, 08:29:22 pm »

Hey, thanks for looking into that.  Yeah, I think my version definitely gives up a bit against Drains, but it should definitely be better v. Fish and Shops.  And yeah, Annul's spicy against Rod, but it's also worked pretty well against Resistors: on the play it's obviously great, but even on the draw you often go Turn 1 Land + Mox against a Sphere, and then have Annul open with your three mana on Turn 2.
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« Reply #32 on: May 18, 2009, 12:32:12 pm »

I wonder if Spell Snare would be better than Annul, it counters rod and spheres but also goyf, confidant, drain and oath.

After playing a few games, I don't feel very confidant about the mana base.. and this was vs an opponent who didn't play any mana denial. I often missed land drops on 2nd turn even with arcane denial on a 0-mana artifact. But overall this deck is pretty interesting Wink
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meadbert
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« Reply #33 on: May 18, 2009, 04:05:28 pm »

You really want to hit that second land drop which is why I recommend to always use Arcane Denial to draw on turn 1 if you are missing land drop #2.

At that point you should have your starting 7, +3 off Denial and another for your turn 2 draw.  That puts you 11 cards deep into a deck with 14 blue sources so you will usually have your second land drop, but I could see upping the land count to 13 from 12.  I could definitely see adding an Island to the board for matchups where you face mana denial.

Spell Snare is pretty good in the board and I have been testing it.  Here is a question I have been pondering.  If you are playing B/U/G Fish and you Spellsnare Bob on turn 1, but he follows with Rod on turn 2, would you have been better off letting Bob resolve and countering the Rod?  I was frequently forced to do this when I had Annul since Annuling Bob was not an option.  I then swapped out Annul for Spellsnare and found that Rod was more likely to resolve for the above reason.  If we are better off saving Spellsnare to counter Rod then we are probably better off with Annul since it can also counter Trinisphere and that most annoying Mystic Remora.  If countering Bob is the right play then perhaps Spellsnare is better.  I am still not sure that Explosives is not the best answer.  It does nothing to Rod, but it answers Remora and Resistors so well that it is hard not to use it.

In either case, the card that worried me most with Fish in general is Stifle since getting rid of 3 draws for  {U} is so good.  Against decks with more dedicated mana denial I have not been struggling that much.  Although there are games where turn 1 Trini or Resistor just crush me, there are other games where I either have turn 1 Force or Denial into it and then follow up with a quick Tinker or Warrens for the win.
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meadbert
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« Reply #34 on: May 26, 2009, 09:52:31 am »

http://www.themanadrain.com/index.php?topic=38025.msg0

Arcane Denial just split a 31 man tournament.  The list had a few changes including Key/Vault added.  Hopefully Martin can comment on his experience.
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