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covetousrat
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« on: May 09, 2010, 03:22:22 am » |
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Decklist
Lands 4 Mishra’s Factory 2 Polluted Delta 2 Misty Rainforest 2 Flooded Strand 6 Islands 1 Tolarian Academy 1 Library of Alexandria
5 Moxen 1 Black Lotus 1 Mana Crypt 1 Sol ring
Creatures 1 Iona 1 Sphinx of SteelWind 1 Emrakul
Protection 4 Force of will 3 Mana Drain 3 Spell Pierce
Broken Blue 3 Polymorph 1 Tezzerat 1 Jace 1 Mystical Tutor 1 Repeal 1 Hurkyls Recall 1 Thirst for knowledge 1 Show and tell 1 Merchant scroll 1 Ancestral Recall 1 Brainstorm 1 Ponder 1 Time Walk 1 Fact or Fiction 1 Gifts Ungiven 1 Tinker
Broken Artifacts 1 Senseis Divining Top 1 Time Vault 1 Voltaic Key
Rough Sideboard
Stax 1 Hurkyls Recall 3 Energy Flux
Ichorid 3 Ravenous Trap 2 Tormods Crypt 1 Pithing Needle
Fish 1 Show and Tell 2 Sower of Temptation
Combo 1 Mindbreak Trap
Oath 1 Claws of Gix
As you can see from the decklist, this is a mono blue Polymorph deck which resembles very closely to its big brother, Oath and some Tezzerat decks. Why would you play this over Oath or Tezzerat? First, there will always be the surprise factor. No one will expect you to use Polymorph in the first place. There will be no sideboard hate dedicated to this deck. I won’t guarantee after this post. Secondly will be its mana stability of 18 Lands with 6 Islands gives you insurance against Wasteland where Stax and Fish are everywhere. Finally, you don’t fold to graveyard hate which may be good or bad. I don’t run black thus, no Black tutors and the broken Yawgmoth’s will.
Why not to play this deck? The combo costs 5 mana as compared to Oath’s 2. This means that you will always be in the controlling role as compared to Oath may have into some insane combo draws. Not many insane plays.
Here are the card choices.
4 Mishras Factory to power up Polymorph
18 lands with 13 blue sources. I started with 17 lands and 12 blue souces but after some testing I feel that the blue count is too low and thus added the 13th blue land.
8 Moxen: Bahroken. This is why we play Vintage.
3 Creatures: I don’t run Terastodon, as normally you will need another Oath activation to win. Polymorph is just a single shot of Oath. I choose Sphinx over Darksteel Colossus to combat the fish matchup. Emrakul is awesome. It can’t be bounced and eats the board.
10 Protections where another Spell Pierce or Mana drain can be added
3 Polymorph. The cost for the combo is a total of 5 mana (4 mana for Polymorph and 1 mana to activate your Mishras Factory). This is very high compared to Oath’s 2 mana. Running 3 Polymorph is exactly enough as they will always sit dead in your hand until you find the Factory or just pitch them to Fow.
I’m still not too sure on the role of Gifts Ungiven in this deck. It doesn’t get you anything good enough. Probably I will consider this into the extra Mana Drain or Pierce. A pile of Tinker+Polymorph+Time Walk+Tezzerat for bombs may seem decent. I’m leaving it in at the moment.
I choose to run the Tezzerat Time Vault package and Jace for extra win conditions. The others are self explanatory due to power level.
The sideboard is a bit random but I have advocated some slots for the metagame. It may need more Oath hate.
Finally enjoy Polymorph.dec, Oath’s little brother.
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chrissss
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Just be yourself
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« Reply #1 on: May 09, 2010, 04:24:43 am » |
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have you tested the deck? how did it do vs Oath or stax for example? Seems stax could be a very hard matchup because of the mana costs of the combo, compared to oath which only needs to get oath in play. which decks are your best matchup? I like the idea a lot though 
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Yes,Tarmogoyf is probably better than Chameleon Colossus, but comparing it to Tarmogoyf is like comparing your girlfriend to Carmen Electra - one's versatile and reliable, the other's just big and cheap.(And you'd run both if you could get away with)
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covetousrat
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« Reply #2 on: May 09, 2010, 05:55:31 am » |
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chriss
I mainly test through MWS againts those better players and I dont play in real life. No vintage here. It plays very close to Oath. Iv only tested a few matchups againts Tezz and Drain Tendrils and I will say these matchups are 50/50. You should have some advantage in the surprise factor and determined by your knowledge of the matchup. Most of the games ended out with counter war over some critical card and casting your own bomb during your turn. Haven't tested much against Stax/Fishes yet.
It feels weird to get your time vault countered or destroyed and no way to get it back thus eliminating that route of victory. I may consider of adding black into the deck.
+Vamp, Demonic tutor, Yawgmoth's win, On color fetches, U.sea
for 1 Polymorph, Repeal and Jace but this is for your personal preference. Running mono blue isn't too bad either.
If your Time Vault is in your graveyard, with 2 Mishras Factory in play + Tezz, you can always untap and pump those Factories. Polymorph targets any creatures not only your own.
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« Last Edit: May 09, 2010, 06:47:59 am by covetousrat »
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #3 on: May 09, 2010, 11:04:28 am » |
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interesting idea. kind of taking the deck in a different direction, but have you considered working this into a landstill deck? that would incorporate more man-lands into your deck, give you standstill for some draw power, but still give you the option to power out creatures with Polymorph.
You should probably just pick one creature rather than have Iona and Emrakul. I'd say Emrakul is probably better since you won't get multiple creatures like with Oath.
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I laugh a great deal because I like to laugh, but everything I say is deadly serious.
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Nefarias
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« Reply #4 on: May 09, 2010, 11:19:46 am » |
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Secondly will be its mana stability of 18 Lands with 6 Islands gives you insurance against Wasteland where Stax and Fish are everywhere When your entire game plan requires you to have a nonbasic land out, Wasteland seems like it's still a pretty big problem.
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Team GG's This will be the realest shit you ever quote
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Mantis
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« Reply #5 on: May 09, 2010, 11:52:29 am » |
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Play 4 Misty Rainforest and 1 Dryad Arbor to cater the needs of Polymorph. This way you can cut the Mishra's Factories for additional U producing lands to better support Mana Drain.
I don't think Landstill is going to work very well in Vintage, I talked to Shockwave at GP Madrid and he told me that he just couldn't make Landstill work in Vintage anymore after receiving a disappointing beating at the Vintage side event. If Richard can't make that deck work, I don't think anyone can unfortunately.
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covetousrat
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« Reply #6 on: May 09, 2010, 11:50:09 pm » |
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You should probably just pick one creature rather than have Iona and Emrakul. I'd say Emrakul is probably better since you won't get multiple creatures like with Oath.
I think you are right. The second Emrakul is better than the Iona. Iona is too random and Emrakul is just too good. I have thougth of Standstill before but it just doesnt work and too slow. Secondly will be its mana stability of 18 Lands with 6 Islands gives you insurance against Wasteland where Stax and Fish are everywhere When your entire game plan requires you to have a nonbasic land out, Wasteland seems like it's still a pretty big problem. Ya Wasteland is very hard to fight through when theyre in play. Go for another win condition. What I meant from that statement is with the high land count you are very likely to draw into one. Play 4 Misty Rainforest and 1 Dryad Arbor to cater the needs of Polymorph. This way you can cut the Mishra's Factories for additional U producing lands to better support Mana Drain
Veryinteresting one. BUt doesnt this just fold into wasteland if you only run 1 Dryad arbor in your deck. You wont be able to run other Man lands where you will probably Polymorph into Dryad Arbor. Lastly, Fish Variants is a hard match up game 1. No doubt. Its the same for Tezz againts FIsh. And remove those Sowers in the SB. I have polymorph into them lol.
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #7 on: May 10, 2010, 01:39:09 am » |
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You should probably just pick one creature rather than have Iona and Emrakul. I'd say Emrakul is probably better since you won't get multiple creatures like with Oath.
I think you are right. The second Emrakul is better than the Iona. Iona is too random and Emrakul is just too good. I have thougth of Standstill before but it just doesnt work and too slow. Secondly will be its mana stability of 18 Lands with 6 Islands gives you insurance against Wasteland where Stax and Fish are everywhere When your entire game plan requires you to have a nonbasic land out, Wasteland seems like it's still a pretty big problem. Ya Wasteland is very hard to fight through when theyre in play. Go for another win condition. What I meant from that statement is with the high land count you are very likely to draw into one. Play 4 Misty Rainforest and 1 Dryad Arbor to cater the needs of Polymorph. This way you can cut the Mishra's Factories for additional U producing lands to better support Mana Drain
Veryinteresting one. BUt doesnt this just fold into wasteland if you only run 1 Dryad arbor in your deck. You wont be able to run other Man lands where you will probably Polymorph into Dryad Arbor. Lastly, Fish Variants is a hard match up game 1. No doubt. Its the same for Tezz againts FIsh. And remove those Sowers in the SB. I have polymorph into them lol. Well, I was thinking more of just running 1 Emrakul, but I guess it's up to you whether then +16% chance of getting an Emrakul over your Tinker target is worth it. Personally, I'd just go with one Polymorph target. And I don't see how going Landstill would make your deck any slower, if anything it'd make it faster since you'd more frequently have man lands in play and it's not like your deck was especially fast.... Landstill is not a "slow" deck because of it's shell, it's a slow deck because it wins on Land beats, so it wouldn't really apply to a landstill-polymorph deck. But as Mantis said Landstill in general might not be the best idea. The idea would be that you wouldn't search for a Dryad Arbor until you needed it to combo out with. So if they have a Wasteland out, you just search for an Island or just leave your Misty Rainforest in play until you get rid of it. You should at least run 1 Dryad just to increase your % of man-land draws. I wouldn't necessarily cut the Workshops though. The best thing about this deck would be that it screws with Oath.
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I laugh a great deal because I like to laugh, but everything I say is deadly serious.
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serracollector
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« Reply #8 on: May 10, 2010, 01:53:39 am » |
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One thing you may want to consider is the rise in Bribery in blue decks as a 1 of in a lot of blue decks of late. Oath can easily race this 5 mana, you on the other hand also have to reach 5 mana with a man land in play. If you played 2 Emrakul with no recursion, and they bribery 1 either before or after you get yours, its gonna cause lots of problems. If your running the mistys and arbor, and 1-2 tropical, you can then splash green for the regrowth or for a living wish. Also any deck that plays reveal fatty xxx creature should play at least 1-2 See Beyond. If your gonna go the 2 creature route tho, I would drop tinker/sphinx, and throw in 2 See Beyond.
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B/R discussions are not allowed outside of Vintage Issues, and that includes signatures.
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BruiZar
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« Reply #9 on: May 10, 2010, 03:13:46 am » |
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Why in the hell would you want to drop tinker, ever?
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CorwinB
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« Reply #10 on: May 10, 2010, 06:10:09 am » |
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What about Khalni Garden as a land ? Since it produces a 0/1 token upon entering the battlefield, it sidesteps Wasteland nicely...
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covetousrat
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« Reply #11 on: May 10, 2010, 09:23:10 am » |
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Playing with both Factory and Dryad Arbor is bad. Polymorphing your Factory into Arbor makes you look like a jackass T_T. Khalni Garden is good a good choice as it dodges wastelands but doesn't hit. It all depends on your meta. If you expect lots of Wastelands go for the Khalni route. Solo Arbor gives you access to Green but you cant combo off with a Wasteland in play. A decent opponent will waste your factory when you cast your Polymorph. There is no way getting rid of Wasteland in the main. I have added more Pithing needles in the sideboard. Going for the solo Arbor may be the right path but I'm not sure.
Regarding the Tinker Sphinx. Its not so insane play if you Polymorph into Sphinx. I don't think its a good idea to remove Tinker as the other part of your deck is the TimeVault Key approach. I have won nearly half of my games from this combo. Removing Sphinx and leaving Tinker in the deck isn't too right either. A fast Tinker can win you games against aggro. I'm leaving both of them in currently.
See Beyond isn't a bad idea. I always compare See Beyond to Show and Tell. Which do you prefer when you have a fattie in hand? I think this is just me. See beyond is good during other scenarios of shuffling your bad card into your deck. What would you remove if you were to add a See beyond or two?
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #12 on: May 10, 2010, 09:56:24 am » |
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Playing with both Factory and Dryad Arbor is bad. Polymorphing your Factory into Arbor makes you look like a jackass T_T. T_T. Fail on my part. Arbor definitely is the suck in this deck. I forgot it'd do that. Khalni Garden sounds like a good plan on avoiding it though. Or the best of available ones at least. I don't see the point about Bribery though. If they cast Bribery and get an Emrakul into play, you're basically going to lose. It doesn't matter whether you have another one in your deck or not. Unless you are hardcasting it (which isn't likely) it's going to get annihilated next turn anyways.
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I laugh a great deal because I like to laugh, but everything I say is deadly serious.
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the boogie man
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« Reply #13 on: May 10, 2010, 10:03:24 am » |
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isn't it legendary?
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Unrestrict: Gush, Flash, Frantic search, fact or fiction (probably), and burning wish if it doesn't suck now.
this may be the last time you hear the boogie song.
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #14 on: May 10, 2010, 10:36:00 am » |
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isn't it legendary?
T_T. I'm just all kinds of fail lately. Even then, I don't see it as being all that great of an option to address getting your Emrakul bribed. I'd rather run a Bribery of my own.
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I laugh a great deal because I like to laugh, but everything I say is deadly serious.
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covetousrat
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« Reply #15 on: May 10, 2010, 10:55:05 am » |
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I hope someone will try out this deck and post their results here. Preferably against the meta decks. Stax/Fish/Oath. Thanks
God are there decent players on MWS? Stop leaving dudes...
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« Last Edit: May 10, 2010, 01:19:50 pm by covetousrat »
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the boogie man
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« Reply #16 on: May 10, 2010, 02:01:13 pm » |
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Is stifle an option? there isn't mana denial in the main, but it has synergy with pierce. and it takes care of wastes. then again there is always needle from the board, which has it's uses in other matches.
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Unrestrict: Gush, Flash, Frantic search, fact or fiction (probably), and burning wish if it doesn't suck now.
this may be the last time you hear the boogie song.
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covetousrat
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« Reply #17 on: May 13, 2010, 02:05:22 pm » |
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Upon some consideration against the Stax and Fish matchup I have added red to the decklist. Red offers the best sideboard slots for these two fearsome matchups. Heres the maindeck changes mostly on the lands.
1 Tolarian academy 4 Islands 4 MIshra's factory 1 Library of Alexandria 4 Scalding Tarn 1 Polluted delta 2 Volcanic Island 1 Mountain
Sideboard currently 1 Hurkyls Recall 1 Show and tell 2 Ravenous Trap 2 tormods Crypt 1 Mindbreak Trap 1 Pithing Needle 3 Rack and Ruin 3 Pyroclasm 1 Red Elemental Blast
Im not too sure of running the solo Mountain in the mainboard, where theres currently 0 red in the main.
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mort-
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« Reply #18 on: May 21, 2010, 03:11:23 am » |
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Have you tried adding black for Bitterblossom? It just seems very strong in this kind of deck, acting as a plan b if your Polymorph gets countered and at the same time producing creatures so you don't have to tap for 5 to combo out. Maybe Goblin Assault in red?
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LotusHead
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« Reply #19 on: May 21, 2010, 04:25:07 am » |
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A local proxied up a Polymorph deck to get on this Vintage thing. He playes green for Regrowth and Channel for Emrakil (the hotness), Time Vault combo and plays probably 6 man-lands (of the factory/blinkmoth nexus variety) and drains into Polymorph about half the times we play against him (which was enough for him to "real it up" to a 20ish proxy card deck.  Definately possibilities in this archetype, and hard to hate out.
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covetousrat
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« Reply #20 on: May 21, 2010, 09:40:22 am » |
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Lol. Good to hear someone trying this out. Channel into Emrakul is oooh.
Havn't test much on this deck. There are a lot of ways to work around this deck. Adding Bitter, Goblin Assualt, Regrowth and Channel etc. Whats the main concern here picking the second color. Black gives you Demonic, Vampiric, Yawgmoths Will, and Duress. Green gives you Channel, Regrowth and Natures Claim. Red gives you a lot of sideboard option against Stax and Fish. In the end I'm still more inclined towards black as it gives you the best tutors and will. They are just too good not to run. Drawing Yawgmoths will > Regrowth. Tutors>Channel. Feel free to post your decklists here for discussion.
Emrakul is GODLIKE. Hes hard to get rid. Edicts, Curfew etc. I got gatekeepered of Malakir one game after Polymorphing him. LOL.
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« Last Edit: May 21, 2010, 09:43:25 am by covetousrat »
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Delha
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« Reply #21 on: May 21, 2010, 10:53:58 am » |
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A local proxied up a Polymorph deck to get on this Vintage thing. He playes green for Regrowth and Channel for Emrakil (the hotness), Time Vault combo and plays probably 6 man-lands (of the factory/blinkmoth nexus variety) and drains into Polymorph about half the times we play against him (which was enough for him to "real it up" to a 20ish proxy card deck.  Definately possibilities in this archetype, and hard to hate out. I wonder how this holds up against the Euro Tezz builds, which all pack heavy Repeal counts. That's my biggest worry whenever I dream up a hypothetical Polymorph list. The critter you're morphing is pretty much always zero cost and tiny (token or manland), so the primary combo feels really vulnerable to removal.
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I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
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covetousrat
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« Reply #22 on: May 21, 2010, 01:43:12 pm » |
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Heres the update list.
1 Tolarian Academy 1 Flooded Strand 3 Islands 4 Mishras Factory 1 Library of Alexandria 1 Misty Rainforest 4 Polluted Delta 3 Underground Sea
1 Sphinx of Steel Wind 2 Emrakul
1 Hurkyls recall 1 Tinker 1 Tezzerat 2 Polymorph 1 Show and Tell 3 Mana Drain 3 Spell Pierce 1 thirst for knowledge 1 Time Walk 1 Senseis D Top 1 Merchant scrol 1 Gifts ungiven 1 fact or fiction 1 Time vault 1 Ponder 1 Brainstorm 1 Ancestral recall 4 FOW 1 Voltaic Key 1 Vampiric tutor 1 Demonic Tutor 1 Yawgmoths will 1 Mystical Tutor
5 Moxen 1 Mana crypt 1 sol ring 1 Black lotusl
SB 1 Hurkyls Recall 1 Show and Tell 3 Ravenous Trap 2 Tormods Crypt 1 Claws of Gix 1 Mindbreak Trap 3 Energy Flux 1 Pithing Needle 2 Massacre
Stax and Fish matchups are not so bad as you think. 3-0 Stax and 1-0 fish. Against Repeals you wouldn't want to cast Polymorph unprotected. Having access to black gives you more choices on the better combo route during different situations.
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