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Author Topic: 2 Vigor and 1 Triskelion  (Read 1696 times)
vartemis
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« on: July 17, 2010, 07:41:18 pm »

Vigor's ability:

If damage would be dealt to a creature you control other than Vigor, prevent that damage. Put a +1/+1 counter on that creature for each 1 damage prevented this way.

I'm assuming everyone knows what Triskelion does.

With 2 Vigors in play, could the Triskelion hit itself an arbitrarily large number of times to give it tons of counters?  I guess what it comes down to is if both vigors will give it counters, or only the one you choose to have prevent the dammage.

Cheers,

j
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Yare
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« Reply #1 on: July 17, 2010, 07:58:30 pm »

Vigor has a replacement effect which basically says, "Instead of doing X, do Y and don't do X at all." Since both Vigors will be trying to replace the same event, the relevant rule is:

Quote
616.1. If two or more replacement and/or prevention effects are attempting to modify the way an event affects an object or player, the affected object’s controller (or its owner if it has no controller) or the affected player chooses one to apply, following the steps listed below. If two or more players have to make these choices at the same time, choices are made in APNAP order (see rule 101.4).

So, you pick one Vigor (it doesn't matter which) to replace the damage and the other won't do anything. Therefore, you'll be removing one counter to try to ping Trike, resulting in your only getting one counter. You can do this an indefinite number of times, but you'll still end up with the same number of counters that you started with.
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Delha
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« Reply #2 on: July 19, 2010, 12:47:21 pm »

Vigor has a replacement effect which basically says, "Instead of doing X, do Y and don't do X at all." Since both Vigors will be trying to replace the same event, the relevant rule is:
Are you certain it's a Replacement effect rather than a Prevention effect? Since the quoted section mentions both, I don't see it changing the end result of this case, but there are board states where it would make a difference.
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Clariax
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« Reply #3 on: July 19, 2010, 03:05:32 pm »

Are you certain it's a Replacement effect rather than a Prevention effect? Since the quoted section mentions both, I don't see it changing the end result of this case, but there are board states where it would make a difference.

Damage prevention IS a replacement effect.  Once one effect prevents the damage, there's no longer any damage for the other effect to prevent, so the second one will do nothing.
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Aaron Cutler
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« Reply #4 on: July 19, 2010, 03:22:38 pm »

Are you certain it's a Replacement effect rather than a Prevention effect? Since the quoted section mentions both, I don't see it changing the end result of this case, but there are board states where it would make a difference.

Damage prevention IS a replacement effect.  Once one effect prevents the damage, there's no longer any damage for the other effect to prevent, so the second one will do nothing.
Thanks for clarifying. I had looked over the Comp Rules and the below phrasing led to me believe they were separate.

Quote
615. Prevention Effects
615.1. Some continuous effects are prevention effects. Like replacement effects (see rule 614),...
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I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
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