sassfactor4
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« on: September 10, 2010, 11:41:42 am » |
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 You guys like playing multiple restricted artifacts? You guys like having an extra lock piece every turn? You about an extra artifact land drop while you crucible lock? Prototype Portal Imprint When Prototype Portal enters the battlefield, you may exile an artifact card from your hand.  ,  Put a token that's a copy of the exiled card onto the battlefield. X is the converted mana cost of that card.
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« Last Edit: September 10, 2010, 11:44:23 am by sassfactor4 »
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Brainstorm. Draw with bob take 5 from force of will draw lotus for turn. ... 
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meadbert
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« Reply #1 on: September 10, 2010, 11:50:34 am » |
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There are several problems. First, this is really slow. Second it is vulnerable to artifact removal, Null Rod and Pithing Needle all of which can two for one you.
EDIT: Maybe I was too hard on this. 2for1 Only happens with removal. Counters are only 1 for 1 and if they do not counter it you can basically play an uncounterable copy of your best spell every turn. It is slow, but has some of the advantages of Aether Vial with a Draw engine built in. Playing spells EOT might be good as is doing it in response to Wire. This is more interesting that I originally thought.
You can dodge 2 for 1 by waiting till you the mana to activate this guy. He is also interesting if Welded in.
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« Last Edit: September 10, 2010, 03:18:48 pm by meadbert »
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T1: Arsenal
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sassfactor4
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« Reply #2 on: September 10, 2010, 11:56:12 am » |
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Yeah I can't think of a hand where this is good in an opening situation, and if it ever gets online, you were probably better off just playing the imprinted card in the first place?
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Brainstorm. Draw with bob take 5 from force of will draw lotus for turn. ... 
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Troy_Costisick
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« Reply #3 on: September 10, 2010, 12:10:59 pm » |
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The effect is great, but the cost is just too high- even for Lotus and Moxen. 
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BruiZar
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« Reply #4 on: September 10, 2010, 12:38:49 pm » |
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I know its mana intensive, but wow. You can pump spheres that are NOT AFFECTED by other spheres already in play! This is like a strip lock, but more sinister! I don´t think its too expensive. Triskelion and Duplicant see play. Also, artifact removal is really only relevant when they can pay for it. This card wants a deck with welders, spheres and tanglewires.
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #5 on: September 10, 2010, 12:40:56 pm » |
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The effect is great, but the cost is just too high- even for Lotus and Moxen.  Lotus with this would be insane.... of course, that's just one card. I actually think this is a really good card. Sure it gets hit by artifact hate, Pithing Needle, and Null Rod but so do a lot of cards that that Shops are going to want to run. I mean, Smokestack? Not that I'm saying play this with Smokestack (though you could Imprint Mox to ramp up the counter), but Smokestack is another 4 cost long-term card that does nothing on the turn that it drops. And it's gooood. The only kinda irritating thing is that you can't use Shop mana for the ability. I can't imagine very many more scary turn 1 plays then Turn 1 Prototype Portal -> imprint Sphere. I mean, sure you lose if they go Vault-Key-laugh. But if they don't win turn one, this will recoup that loss of tempo extremely quickly. Plus, as a mid-game drop you have tons of mana anyways so paying 4 + whatever probably just means you actually use all the mana that you have, especially considering the activated ability won't be effected by Spheres. Too bad you can't imprint Chalice of the Void, and be able to cast it at various levels (I don't think you can) that would be sexy. Oh, and it gives you a legitimate reason to run Voltaic Key. Which means you have a legitimate reason to run Time Vault. Which is good.
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I laugh a great deal because I like to laugh, but everything I say is deadly serious.
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LotusHead
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« Reply #6 on: September 10, 2010, 01:22:26 pm » |
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BruiZar
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« Reply #7 on: September 10, 2010, 01:37:18 pm » |
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pics
If you win with that, people will really think vintage is a coinflip.
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LordHomerCat
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« Reply #8 on: September 10, 2010, 01:48:33 pm » |
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pics
If you win with that, people will really think vintage is a coinflip. Zing!
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Team Meandeck Team Serious LordHomerCat is just mean, and isnt really justifying his statements very well, is he?
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serracollector
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« Reply #9 on: September 10, 2010, 01:50:47 pm » |
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This card just makes Memnite all the more broken.
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« Last Edit: September 10, 2010, 09:40:57 pm by serracollector »
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Troy_Costisick
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« Reply #10 on: September 10, 2010, 02:10:49 pm » |
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This card just makes Memnite all the more broken.
Why? Cause it's a four mana Bitterblossom that's vulnerable to artifact hate?
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Delha
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« Reply #11 on: September 10, 2010, 02:17:57 pm » |
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I'd like to see this in action with a Bomberman-style silver bullet package. I'd expect you can do something absolutely backbreaking for nearly any matchup. This card just makes Memnite all the more broken. There's this other card that does the same thing for four, and oh btw, it also eventually makes your crap indestructible for the rest of the game.
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I suppose it's mostly the thought that this format is just one big Mistake; and not even a very sophisticated one at that.
Much like humanity itself.
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nineisnoone
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« Reply #12 on: September 10, 2010, 02:28:24 pm » |
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This card just makes Memnite all the more broken.
Why? Cause it's a four mana Bitterblossom that's vulnerable to artifact hate? But you forget, it's less vulnerable to Ray of Revelation that just destroy Shop decks.
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Bibendum
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« Reply #13 on: September 10, 2010, 02:38:32 pm » |
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Fun and all, but as I think it was stated its going to be rare you want this over what you imprinted in a stax deck. Theres a good chance you cant activate whatever you imprinted that turn so it takes longer for a smokestack to activate, or a tangle wire to lock them down. The extra sphere is nice but I think this is limited in its applications.
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The Going Get Tough, The Tough Get Debt Don't Pay Attention, Pay The Rent Next Of Kins Pay For Your Sins A Little Faith Should Keep Us Safe
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LotusHead
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« Reply #14 on: September 10, 2010, 02:52:49 pm » |
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5c Stax plays Tinker (3 cmc + sphere effects)
Using this to crank out Tangle Wire after Tangle Wire. That's hotness!
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zeus-online
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« Reply #15 on: September 10, 2010, 07:03:37 pm » |
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.
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« Last Edit: March 19, 2015, 02:46:51 pm by zeus-online »
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The truth is an elephant described by three blind men.
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TopSecret
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« Reply #16 on: September 10, 2010, 07:13:49 pm » |
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I think those who mentioned copying Spheres and Tangle Wires made an interesting point.
If you can pop out a Sphere every turn, how will the opponent deal with that? What about Tangle Wires like a mofo? What about stuff like Sol Ring every turn?
Plus, if you are playing the mirror match and you imprint Lodestone Golem, isn't that GG?
At this point, I would probably have to compare this card to Smokestack or Tangle Wire since I'm really not sure what else you would cut for it and it probably only fits into stuff like Stax.
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Ball and Chain
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Rico Suave
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« Reply #17 on: September 10, 2010, 07:35:07 pm » |
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If you can pop out a Sphere every turn, how will the opponent deal with that?
It's a shame this card suffers from the same hate cards that keep Panoptic Mirror from dominating the format.
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Suddenly, Fluffy realized she wasn't quite like the other bunnies anymore.
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Random Noob
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x=0²
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« Reply #18 on: September 10, 2010, 07:42:52 pm » |
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This is a sketch from my imagination:
4 Prototype Portal 4 Smokestack 4 Tangle Wire
4 Sphere of Resistance 4 Thorn of Amethyst 4 Chalice of the Void
4 Lodestone Golem 3 Karn Silver Golem
1 Mox Jet 1 Mox Sapphire 1 Mox Emerald 1 Mox Pearl 1 Mox Ruby 1 Black Lotus 1 Mana Vault 1 Sol Ring 1 Mana Crypt
3 Mishra's Factory 3 Rishadan Port 4 Mishra's Workshop 4 Ancient Tomb 1 Tolarian Academy 1 Strip Mine 4 Wasteland
I guess it's pretty good to play every Turn a 2Sphere or Tangle Wire (in response to your Tangle Wire trigger on your own Turn just put another one into play).
For the kiddie in me it looks really cool.
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brianpk80
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« Reply #19 on: September 10, 2010, 07:52:48 pm » |
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I don't think Memnite is the best use for it, but to be fair, in Workshop, it would be a 2-mana Bitterblossom that taps the turn it comes into play and doesn't require life loss... but the tokens don't fly.
How about Expedition Maps and Spellbombs?
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"It seems like a normal Monk deck with all the normal Monk cards. And then the clouds divide... something is revealed in the skies."
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serracollector
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« Reply #20 on: September 10, 2010, 09:41:48 pm » |
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With Memnite, its a 4 mana Bitterblossom that doesn't cost life, can be cast off Workshop/colorless mana, provides perms to sac to smokestack and tap to tangle wire, provides more beats under sphere affects, Pumps up Master of Etherium, gets pumped by Master of Etherium, can be made at ANY time not just during upkeep, gets around chalice for 0, 1, or 2, and can be sacked to tinker/welder every turn. If they made an artifact that simply was 4 cc, and said "tap: put a 1/1 artifact token into play", it would be considered good by a lot of players I would believe.
Don't laugh at the Portal to Memnite Ville combo. It will decimate you.
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TopSecret
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« Reply #21 on: September 10, 2010, 10:02:51 pm » |
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You can also use Prototype Portal to imprint Prototype Portal.
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Ball and Chain
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vassago
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« Reply #22 on: September 10, 2010, 11:39:43 pm » |
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You can also use Prototype Portal to imprint Prototype Portal.
Almost had to divide by zero here....
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.... "OMGWTFElephantOnMyFace".
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BruiZar
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« Reply #23 on: September 11, 2010, 04:23:13 am » |
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THE most important part of this card is not the mana cost or the copying of spells. It is slipping permanents in play without paying for sphere effects And the virtual draw you make. This is like a weird dark confidant for artifacts that ensures your opponent never gets out of locks regArdless of strip effects or land drops. But you need to play with welder. You'll tie the game up with 7 spheres so u can't cast anything either which means you have to cheat things in play. Slipping a Thorn under this thing is a good way to still play threats versus Tezz decks and other creature light decks.
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« Last Edit: September 11, 2010, 05:14:53 am by BruiZar »
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Wagner
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« Reply #24 on: September 11, 2010, 09:12:54 am » |
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Oh, no one mentioned it before, so I will... It's a very lazy design, they only changed 3 words, seriously, still opens up a lot of design space, so it's still decent. 
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bb-g
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« Reply #25 on: September 11, 2010, 09:22:18 am » |
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Strange it hasn't been mentioned before, but 4 of this tingy, 4 goblin welders, 4 Mindslaver, 4 Soul foundry, 4 memnite, 4 kuldotha Forgemaster can be a good start to build a combodeck around that focuses on slavering your opponent every turn. (I'm not saying this would be viable, but it can be done...)
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Troy_Costisick
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« Reply #26 on: September 11, 2010, 10:04:59 am » |
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Not sure if this is important, but it can copy artifact lands too. Too bad there weren't any really great landfall artifacts.
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Neonico
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« Reply #27 on: September 12, 2010, 01:55:41 am » |
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I think that a Sphere/Tangle/golem every turn is enough to make this nuts.... In allmost all situations, it's better than Sculpting steel (except opposite tinker) Definatly a 2 of for me in MUD lists.
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BruiZar
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« Reply #28 on: September 12, 2010, 10:05:57 am » |
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Oh, no one mentioned it before, so I will... It's a very lazy design, they only changed 3 words, seriously, still opens up a lot of design space, so it's still decent.  Soul Foundry is nothing like this card at all, even though it may look similar. It is like comparing the iPad to the iPhone. It looks similar but its vastly different. @RicoSuave: Comparing this to Panoptic Mirror displays a lack of understanding of vintage. You judge the card too quickly by making a direct comparison to Panoptic Mirror, just because it has the same imprint/copy mechanic. Soul Foundry:It costs 4 mana, and can only copy creatures. This is important. Colored creature decks don´t run Mishra´s Workshop. AEther Vial is much better, because it's only 1 mana and can cheat creatures into play. It takes 2 turns to ramp AEther Vial and it takes 2 turns to benefit from Soul Foundry as well, but at the cost of a 4 mana investment and a mana investment for every token copied. AEther Vial works like virtual land, and we all know that AEther Vial is slow in this format. Colored Vintage creatures are usually not that good in multiples. 2 Ethersworn Canonists, 2 Aven Mincensor, 2 Gaddock Teeg, 2 Gorilla Shamans. You don't want to have these in multiple. Even a card as broken as Goblin Welder isn't good because it is by definition a support card. On top of that, they all suffer from summoning sickness. Copying a Noble Hierarch is rather underwhelming, since it provides nothing but exalted. By the time your non-workshop deck ramps to 4 mana, untaps, cheats a creature into play, and then cheats another creature into play, you will have lost. Panoptic Mirror:Panoptic Mirror is powerful, no doubt. But it costs  mana and is useful the turn after you put it in play. Decks that support enough instants and sorceries do not want to waste 5 mana casting, and  ,  or  mana imprinting (Exiling) a broken card and then using it AFTER passing the turn. Decks like this typically just want to spend that mana casting the broken card, playing yawgmoth's will and recycling their entire graveyards to win, or they simply assemble a vault key lock before that. Workshop decks could power out Panoptic Mirror, but it doesn't run instants or sorceries. Also,  or  mana is a world of difference. Prototype Portal:This is the closest thing to Smokestack we have ever gotten, and I suspect it might even replace Smokestack in some builds. For starters, it costs  mana, the same as Smokestack. Instead of lowering the permanent count of both players, this card increases your permanent relative to the permanent count of your opponent. This is advantageous to the shop player, because it is synergistic to smokestacks and tangle wires. Smokestack deals with all sorts of permanents. It doesn´t neccesarily tie down mana, instead, it ´destroys´ your opponent´s least valuable card in play. Prototype Portal copies a sphere each turn, this means that, if your opponent wants to neutralize your spheres, he MUST top-deck a land each turn. If he does, he will not be able to get more mana than he had, because topdecking land only ensures parity. To break parity, the shop player can unload its other cards in hand until it becomes impossible for either player to cast anything. The spheres plan is the most disruptive shop plan there is at the moment, so it makes sense to copy spheres. Since the imprinted card is not affected by the spheres in play, it is easy to spam the board each turn. The imprinted cards can not be countered either. If you want to ensure that a sphere resolves, you can cast Prototype and see if your opponent counters it. If he doesn't, you imprint a sphere and go loose with it. If he does, you can cast your sphere in hand unmolested. Either way, the sphere will hit the board. Your opponent doesn't want to counter your prototype because you 2 for 1 him with his force of will. He will counter a card that does nothing on its own, so the threat in your hand is still there. This is important. Another important part is the fact that this card is much better in multiples than Smokestack is. For example, you can copy a Mox each turn. This is significant because you will by-pass the need for Crucible of Worlds to keep Smokestack active. Your deck becomes more redundant and focused on mana denial (The areas of attack are: Smokestack+Crucible, Smokestack+Prototype, Prototype+Sphere, Prototype+TangleWire, Crucible+Stripwaste, 13 Golemspheres). There is more overlap in your threats which results in a harder to disrupt decks: Prototype combos with 3 diferent card types (Counting 13 spheres as one, and counting Moxen/SolRing/ManaVault/ArtifactLand as one.) Crucible combos with 2 different card types (counting strip mine and wasteland as one) Smokestack combos with 2 different card types Once you have achieved a sphere lock and both players are out of threats and castable cards, simply break the stalemate with Mishra's Factory. Mishra´s Factory is a strong choice in the meta because it combats opposing Golems, can attack Jace, block confidants and serves as an alternate win condition in this deck. Copying a card each turn is the same as having a Dark Confidant online. One of the biggest problems of workshop decks is running out of gas. By quickly dumping your hand, the shop player over commits and either hits a Hurkyl´s Recall or wins the game. Prototype Portal, at it´s worst, is a card that fuels Smokestack and serves as a confidant.
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« Last Edit: September 12, 2010, 10:24:08 am by BruiZar »
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madmanmike25
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« Reply #29 on: September 12, 2010, 11:52:54 am » |
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This card is definitely interesting, but I'm still on the fence about it. The question is, when do you cast it?
Am I going to play this over a Sphere effect? No. Not unless I have 6 mana. How often do I have 6 mana turn 1?
Am I going to play this over Lodestone? No. Not unless I have 8 mana. 8 mana to cast the first Lodestone is too much, although I admit multiple Lodestones is superb.
Am I going to play this over a Tangle Wire? No. Not unless I have 7 mana.
If I have that much mana, or if not, can afford to NOT cast a lockpiece now and cast this instead strikes me as a tad bit 'win more'.
4 mana to put a mox out now and every turn for free thereafter? A tad underwhelming though not without merit.
I wouldn't compare this to Smokestack at all. Taking away permanents from the opponent is not the same as me having more of them. My opponent has a 7/11 and I have more moxen...who wins?
So, since this card is not better than casting a lockpiece unless you have mana for BOTH, RIGHT NOW, when do you cast it?? Later on I suppose, and I wonder when you topdeck this badboy how good it would be if you have no relevent artifacts in hand because you had to cast them to disrupt your opponent. Or just have lands in hand.
I find this card to be very similar to Sculpting Steel in that it complements an artifact you already have either in play or in hand. Steel isn't affected by Null Rod, can copy opponents artifacts, but can't keep cranking out artifacts.
This card does open doors to several other non-Null Rod strategies for MUD. I am willing to bet Metalworker (and consequently Null Rod) will be seeing a lot more play. First turn Metalworker might become a 'must-counter' since you don't know if your opponent has Staff or Prototype Portal and enough mana to activate it. I wonder if any other cheap artifacts will be coming out that would be better to copy. Let's wait and see before we come to any conclusions about this card.
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