I WISH to SHOW you Something

[msg67183]

With Burning Wish being unrestricted I think that Show and Tell is the best option. I have also included Cunning Wish to have a complete Wishboard. Here is the list, I will admit that I haven't tested it but I would like people's thoughts on this deck and if you have questions simply ask.

4 Burning Wish
4 Cunning Wish
3 Show and Tell
3 Griselbrand
2 Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
1 Blightsteel Colossus
3 Omniscience
4 Force of Will
4 Mana Drain
2 Jace, the Mindsculptor
Ancestral Recall
Time Walk
Time Vault
1 Voltaic Key
Brainstorm
Ponder
Black Lotus
5 Moxen
Mana Crypt
Sol Ring
Library of Alexandria
Tolarian Academy
2 Mountain
4 Island
4 Scalding Tarn
4 Volcanic Island

Sb

3 Ravenous Trap
3 Hurkyll's Recall
1 Empty the Warrens
1 Grapeshot
1 Show and Tell
1 Lightning Bolt
1 Pyroclasm
1 Shattering Spree
1 Mindbreak Trap
1 Flusterstorm
Tinker

Thanks for reading. Let me know what you think and ask any questions.

[The Atog Lord]

4 Burning Wish
4 Cunning Wish

Historically, this has never worked. A single Wish plan devours so much of your sideboard. Having two different wishes in a deck means that you won't have a functioning sideboard for either. Also, why Vault/Key? There's really no way to assemble the combo and it seems sort of glued-on to your other two-mana combo.

[Wagner]

I'm wondering why Omniscience is in this thing actually. In case you have Griselbrand AND Emrakul AND Omniscience in hand and want to play all of them?

[msg67183]

Omniscience is in here to have a bomb game. Once it is in play everything is free (including the drains and Jace). You can then use the draw cards to draw into Griselbrand and/ or Emrakul. Vault/ Key was just a throw in. What would you replace them with?

[hvndr3d y34r h3x]

I really don't think your cunning wish targets are good enough. It also seems like the wishes slow the deck down quite a bit.

[Wagner]

Omniscience is in here to have a bomb game. Once it is in play everything is free (including the drains and Jace). You can then use the draw cards to draw into Griselbrand and/ or Emrakul. Vault/ Key was just a throw in. What would you replace them with?

Well, anthoer Griselbrand would be better than an Omniscience. I'm just worried about getting a Show and Tell and Omniscience and no juice. Also, getting rid of them would also liberate 2 sideboard slots that seem to only do a storm combo when you have Omniscience and 2 Burning Wish.

[msg67183]

-4 Cunning Wish
- Voltaic Key
- Time Vault

+ 1 Griselbrand
+ Yawgmoth's Bargain
+ 2 Hurkyll's Recall
+ 1 Empty the Warrens
+ Mystical Tutor

Does this look better? Maximize on draw and add the storm win main? The Sb will need changed though.

[Jblaze4lif]

The list looks similar to the Legacy Omni-Tell decks running around. I don't think Omniscience will be strong enough for Vintage. Workshop with sphere effects will be tuff. The legacy deck works because of all the cantrips.

4 Brainstorm
4 Ponder
3-4 Preordain

Hurkyls Recall will def be important for going off on storm. Might as well run the 1 Petals of Insight in the SB for infinite storm and dig through the deck for a Burning wish into Grapeshot or Tendrils.

[Jblaze4lif]

Omniscience is in here to have a bomb game. Once it is in play everything is free (including the drains and Jace). You can then use the draw cards to draw into Griselbrand and/ or Emrakul. Vault/ Key was just a throw in. What would you replace them with?

Well, anthoer Griselbrand would be better than an Omniscience. I'm just worried about getting a Show and Tell and Omniscience and no juice. Also, getting rid of them would also liberate 2 sideboard slots that seem to only do a storm combo when you have Omniscience and 2 Burning Wish.

You can go infinite storm with 1 Burning wish if Omniscience is played. Burning wish for Petals of insight which has an infinite dig loop as lOng as no spheres are in play. Dig For about storm 20 then draw 3 giving you the second Burning wish and wish for a grapeshot.

Workshop will be an impossible matchup it seems like.

[msg67183]

Well against Shops, you dont have to go for the storm win. Instead you win with Emrakul. Like I said the Sb WILL need fixed.

[yankeedave]

I have been goldfishing something similar, but I have gone for the 3 colour build to help out my matchups. Here's my list and sideboard

1x Ancestral Recall
1x Black Lotus
1x Blightsteel Colossus
1x Brainstorm
4x Burning Wish
1x Demonic Tutor
2x Emrakul, the Aeons Torn
2x Flusterstorm
4x Force of Will
2x Griselbrand
1x Hurkyl's Recall
2x Island
1x Mana Crypt
2x Mental Misstep
1x Mox Emerald
1x Mox Jet
1x Mox Pearl
1x Mox Ruby
1x Mox Sapphire
3x Omniscience
3x Polluted Delta
4x Preordain
4x Scalding Tarn
3x Show and Tell
1x Sol Ring
3x Thoughtseize
1x Time Walk
1x Tinker
3x Underground Sea
1x Vampiric Tutor
3x Volcanic Island

2x Echoing Truth
1x Grapeshot
3x Ingot Chewer
4x Leyline of the Void
1x Petals of Insight
2x Pithing Needle
1x Show and Tell
1x Yawgmoth's Will

As you can see, I have access to the black tutors and I have dropped the Vault/Key Combo. I have also moved Y-Will to the SB as a wish target. iI also think that Tinker/bot shouldn't be in this list, but not sure what to replace it with.  Comments?

[vaughnbros]

Both of your lists are lacking a true draw engine which makes me question their ability to recover from a failed show and tell or two.  Also since both of you are relying heavily on omniscience workshops is going to be very tough your sideboards probably need to be reworked.  It should be noted that resolving show and tell into a legend against workshops is not a win.  They have duplicant, metamorph, and tanglewire.

@ Matt:  You are running far too many show and tell targets after your changes, 4 griselbrand, 1 bargain, 3 omniscience, 2 emrakul.  That makes 10 cards that are uncastable unless you have tolarian and a ton of artifact sources.  Empty the warrens also seems pretty dead in this deck with the lack of any way of storming unless you have omniscience out.  Library doesnt seem realistic in a deck running so little countermagic.  Your curve is also far too high only brainstorm, mystical, and ponder as 1 drops.

@ Yankeedave:  3 mental misstep, 2 flusterstorm, and 2 thoughtseize this should give you a great blue match up.  However,  this plus only running 1 hurkyls is going to make shops very difficult.  You really need 2 hurkyls, 1 to help you cast the show and tell another to actually go off with it.  

Really because of the inherent advantages of this decks strategy the only two decks you need to worry about are blue and shops.  The issue seems to be that there aren't really cards that are great in both match ups and not compensating enough for one can easily be fatal.

[Jblaze4lif]

Well against Shops, you dont have to go for the storm win. Instead you win with Emrakul. Like I said the Sb WILL need fixed.

Metamorph and Duplicant Plus spheres and trinisphere.

[yankeedave]

Both of your lists are lacking a true draw engine which makes me question their ability to recover from a failed show and tell or two.  Also since both of you are relying heavily on omniscience workshops is going to be very tough your sideboards probably need to be reworked.  It should be noted that resolving show and tell into a legend against workshops is not a win.  They have duplicant, metamorph, and tanglewire.

@ Yankeedave:  3 mental misstep, 2 flusterstorm, and 2 thoughtseize this should give you a great blue match up.  However,  this plus only running 1 hurkyls is going to make shops very difficult.  You really need 2 hurkyls, 1 to help you cast the show and tell another to actually go off with it.  

Really because of the inherent advantages of this decks strategy the only two decks you need to worry about are blue and shops.  The issue seems to be that there aren't really cards that are great in both match ups and not compensating enough for one can easily be fatal.

Hmm, I can understand those points. Tinker/Bot is strong against Shops, so I am reluctant to shave that. I would like to get both an extra Hurkyl's and an Ingot Chewer or Shattering Spree in the main. I could maybe lose a Thoughtseize, but I am unsure of the 2nd cut. Maybe an off colour Mox?

[Jblaze4lif]

This seems like a really fun casual game deck but I don't think it will be strong enough in competitive tournaments.

The deck is a house in Legacy I would stick with a solid Omni tell legacy build and for Vintage run Oath Griselbrand Gush or a Gush Cunning wish storm/Tinker type deck.

[vaughnbros]

This seems like a really fun casual game deck but I don't think it will be strong enough in competitive tournaments.

The deck is a house in Legacy I would stick with a solid Omni tell legacy build and for Vintage run Oath Griselbrand Gush or a Gush Cunning wish storm/Tinker type deck.

I disagree after testing my version of show and tell this is far and away more consistant and harder to disrupt than oath decks.  My version varies from these in that I think bargains are far more important in vintage than omniscience though.  This deck can support tinker and cunning wish isn't really played much in vintage.

Both of your lists are lacking a true draw engine which makes me question their ability to recover from a failed show and tell or two.  Also since both of you are relying heavily on omniscience workshops is going to be very tough your sideboards probably need to be reworked.  It should be noted that resolving show and tell into a legend against workshops is not a win.  They have duplicant, metamorph, and tanglewire.

@ Yankeedave:  3 mental misstep, 2 flusterstorm, and 2 thoughtseize this should give you a great blue match up.  However,  this plus only running 1 hurkyls is going to make shops very difficult.  You really need 2 hurkyls, 1 to help you cast the show and tell another to actually go off with it.  

Really because of the inherent advantages of this decks strategy the only two decks you need to worry about are blue and shops.  The issue seems to be that there aren't really cards that are great in both match ups and not compensating enough for one can easily be fatal.

Hmm, I can understand those points. Tinker/Bot is strong against Shops, so I am reluctant to shave that. I would like to get both an extra Hurkyl's and an Ingot Chewer or Shattering Spree in the main. I could maybe lose a Thoughtseize, but I am unsure of the 2nd cut. Maybe an off colour Mox?

I'd cut a misstep and both flusterstorms for a thoughtseize, shattering spree, and hurkyls.  I don't think making yourself reactive with flusterstorms and missteps is a good strategy with a deck that's trying to combo off by turn 3.  Flusterstorm shines in stopping your opponents spells not protecting your own.

[Jblaze4lif]

When you get a chance would you mind pOsting up your list. Do you use Gush as the draw engine? 2 Hurkyls main seems very important   

[msg67183]

What "draw engine" could I use in UR? And the reason I play so many Show and Tell targets is because I dont play tutors. Cards I think can be cut from this main deck now are Empty the Warrens, Library of Alexandria, and Mystical Tutor. I could throw in 3 Preordain and call it a day. The new sb I was thinking would look something like this:
4 Ravenous Trap
1 Show and Tell
1 Tinker
1 Grapeshot
1 Petals of Insight
1 Pyroclasm
2 Shattering Spree
4 Ingot Chewer

[TinkerRobot]

Blightsteel seems like a much worse Show and Tell fatty than Emrakul, even in Tinker decks, blightsteel is clunky and often not the best wincon. If Tinker could grab up an Emrakul, there would be no blightsteels in vintage.

Also, i think you need some game against whatever your opponent drops in with show and tell. Against shops, I think I would board in Angel of despair to kill whatever fatty/golem they show

[vaughnbros]

When you get a chance would you mind pOsting up your list. Do you use Gush as the draw engine? 2 Hurkyls main seems very important   

Here's what I've been playing:

Main Deck:
Land (16):
1 Mountain
1 Tropical Island
1 Polluted Delta
2 Island
3 Underground Sea
2 Volcanic Island
1 Misty Rainforest
4 Scalding Tarn
1 Tolarian Academy

Artifact Mana (9):
1 Mana Crypt
1 Mox Emerald
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
1 Mox Ruby
1 Mox Sapphire
1 Sol Ring
1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal

Restricted Stuff (6):
1 Demonic Tutor
1 Vampiric Tutor
1 Ancestral Recall
1 Brainstorm
1 Time Walk
1 Ponder

Gush Engine (5):
4 Gush
1 Fastbond

Business (14):
4 Burning Wish
3 Show and Tell
4 Griselbrand
1 Omniscience
1 Blightsteel Colossus
1 Yawgmoth's Bargain

Disruption (10):
4 Force of Will
2 Mental Misstep
2 Thoughtseize
2 Hurkyl's Recall

Sideboard:
Wish Board:
1 Tinker
1 Tendrils of Agony
1 Yawgmoth's Will
1 Show and Tell
1 Pyroclasm

Other sideboard slots:
4 Leyline of the Void
3 Ingot Chewer
1 Pithing Needle
1 Grafdigger's Cage
1 Surgical Extraction

The main win con is to bargain into omniscience then burning wish into tendrils for the win.  Secondary win cons are to burning wish for tinker or yawgmoth's will and win via them.  I haven't had any issue winning with an active omniscience especially if I draw a burning wish since I can grab yawgmoth's will.  This makes me feel like petals of insight is purely a win more. 

What "draw engine" could I use in UR? And the reason I play so many Show and Tell targets is because I dont play tutors. Cards I think can be cut from this main deck now are Empty the Warrens, Library of Alexandria, and Mystical Tutor. I could throw in 3 Preordain and call it a day.

Not having a good draw engine and not having tutors seems pretty good reasons to not play just UR for a 2 card combo deck.  What are you really gaining from going just blue red?  There a couple draw engines for those colors though.  Intuition/ak is both a tutor and a draw engine, but this is almost definitely too mana intensive for this style of deck.  With the focus of this deck being to win early mystic remora could be a potential draw engine in this list.  Gush without fastbond also isn't out of the question. Putting 3 preordain in and slightly changing the sideboard isn't going to fix your problems.  The curve is still far too high and this deck shouldnt be playing 10 cards to show and tell into.

Blightsteel seems like a much worse Show and Tell fatty than Emrakul, even in Tinker decks, blightsteel is clunky and often not the best wincon. If Tinker could grab up an Emrakul, there would be no blightsteels in vintage.

Also, i think you need some game against whatever your opponent drops in with show and tell. Against shops, I think I would board in Angel of despair to kill whatever fatty/golem they show

Blightsteel is there to grab with tinker when you dont have a fatty in hand to show and tell into.  And if you dont have anything else in your hand to show he still isn't bad.

Angel of despair is better than griselbrand at getting past revokers, tangle wires, and low life, but its worse against metamorph and isn't nearly as threatening on the board.  I don't think there is really room for an only situationally better against shops show and tell target.

[msg67183]

So Lance, you think I should take out 2 Emrakul and 1 or 2 Omniscience and 2 Jace? That gives me 5-6 slots. I would like to stay UR so what should I put in?

[Jblaze4lif]

I like the list but I think Show and Tell into a Legendary creature is not that Good bc Workshop. Their will be a 50 percent chance they will just drop down a Metamorph or Duplicant. This is why Oath is better than Show and tell in Vintage.

Show and tell into omniscience or bargain is very very good though.

[vaughnbros]

I like the list but I think Show and Tell into a Legendary creature is not that Good bc Workshop. Their will be a 50 percent chance they will just drop down a Metamorph or Duplicant. This is why Oath is better than Show and tell in Vintage.

Show and tell into omniscience or bargain is very very good though.

They can't show and tell into metamorph it just dies.  They have to cast metamorph on their next turn.  Show and tell into duplicant can kill my griselbrand and get them a 7/7, but I have time to respond and draw 7.  This basically means unless they show and tell into revoker I can activate my griselbrand. 

Oath needs to wait a full turn, doesn't really want to draw it's oath targets, and mills itself making it difficult to griselbrand as much as you want these are major drawbacks that this combo doesn't suffer from when compared to oath.  There's also deck building problems that oath runs into that show and tell doesn't.  You need to run orchard making gush worse and you can't run other creatures denying you of goodies like ingot chewer.  Oath also suffers from being shut off by cage.  Basically my opponent needs to be playing bomb permanents for show and tell to be bad.  The only area I really see oath being superior is when its playing against a show and tell deck.

So Lance, you think I should take out 2 Emrakul and 1 or 2 Omniscience and 2 Jace? That gives me 5-6 slots. I would like to stay UR so what should I put in?

I wouldn't run more than 1 emrakul or more than 1 omniscience.  You also don't have a draw engine so Jace can substitute for that, but if dropping him makes room for a true engine then yes I'd cut him.

[msg67183]

So like I asked... What 6 cards should I put in? Im not sure how good remora is right now since I havent seen it played very often. Im not sold on Gush without Fastbond.