[COMM] Sydri, Galvanic Genius

[d8dk32]

Opinions? Casting cost is low enough but colors are weird. First ability munches moxen as well. Not sure what to think.

Terese Nielsen did the art too so that's cool. I like her art.

[Samoht]

3 colored mana against Mishra? Good luck with that.

[brianpk80]

It's playable in the right shell.  Definitely better than Daxos since having an uncounterable Karn, Silver Golem to gobble up opponent's Moxen or Chalices is a relevant follow up to Thalia.  Occasionally may be instrumental to Darkblast a Sol Ring/Voltaic Key or Swords/Path a Time Vault or noncreature Shop lock piece.  The second ability is less important but could open up critical plays in a build w. Factories, Revokers, and Metamorphs, all cards that have been used in different iterations of Humans from time to time.  Shares a secondary creature type with Goblin Welder and Stoneforge Mystic.  The casting cost is cumbersome though most Human builds are designed to accommodate such things (ie, Cavern or Souls + Noble/Deathrite + Esper Mox or Dual land).  It's a mid to late game card.  It's interesting that Humans is now able to replicate many of the most notorious Shop lock pieces.    

 

[Guli]

Esper colors are very strong human colors. I think this card can do well in a build with thalia supported by artifacts like null rod, thorn, tangle wire and trinisphere. Crucible also comes to mind. This also powers or disrupts batterskull or other equipment. I would run welders and stoneforge mystics with this most likely. There are probably more applications.

[d8dk32]

This also powers or disrupts batterskull or other equipment.

I'm assuming  that if you activate her first ability targeting an equipment that is attached to a creature, it falls off, since creatures can't be equipped to other creatures, right?

The other place I could see this being used is as a one-off in an Esper-colored Bomberman type build, where it could play a disruptive role in addition to turning your Tops and Needles and Sol Ring into deadly chump blockers or little beaters to get a few extra points of damage in.

[psyburat]

It seems worthwhile to evaluate this card at the casting cost WUUB.

[Guli]

Yes, creatures can not equip creatures. That is what i ment with disrupt. Powering equipment means being able to block/attack with equipment without the need to equip. This can be relevant with Stoneforge online and open blue mana. Sofi or other equipment that do not come with a germ can be used as combat tactics. Elbrus, the Binding Blade is interesting here too.

[vaughnbros]

It seems worthwhile to evaluate this card at the casting cost WUUB.

I'm not sure it is.  Karn isn't evaluated at 6 mana, mox monkey at 1R, ect.  Certainly its better when you can activate immediately, but not required.  

That being said 3 colored mana is costly, and its abilities on top of that also cost colored mana.  This will make it a little late on the mox smashing party for most decks and I can't imagine playing a high non moxen artifact count of your own in a 3+ color deck would be a great strategy.  Fringe playable in something like humans, but thats it.

[Blue Lotus]

Interesting card. That fact that it can be mana denial is interesting, as well as an efficient response to an enemy chalice. If you run it with null rod it can turn extras into (situational) removal which is another bonus. I'm just not sure it's directly powerful enough to justify 3 colored manas.

[MaximumCDawg]

I am going to build four color Liquidmetal Coating now.

[Guli]

I mentioned Null Rod earlier as an example. I don't run Null Rod anymore, Stony is better. I think 4 Phyrexian Revoker, 1 Stony Silence, 1 Sydri, 4 Thalia, 4 Wasteland, 1 Strip Mine, 1 Trinisphere, 1 Thorn of Amethyst is a good place to start for the mana denial package. Sydra is not Karn, but it does have a cheaper mana cost and a threatening second ability that Karn doesn't have. I like the legendary on it too, I am all for Karakas these days.

I am also a fan of Phyrexian Metamorph, a card that supplements Revokers and Thorns quite nicely and remains an artifact even if it would copy a non artifact creature.

Another card that works really well with Sydra is Porcelain Legionnaire. First strike, Lifelink and deathtouch... that is absurd.

[brianpk80]

What I find interesting about the card is that its design seems like something out of Time Spiral--the first ability being a direct nod to Karn and the second relating to Wurmcoil Engine. 

[Saya]

Interesting,but will WUB want to make an artifact creature be deathtouch/lifelink?Although she is WUB,her ability is apparently for workshops.Contradiction.

[psyburat]

It seems worthwhile to evaluate this card at the casting cost WUUB.

I'm not sure it is.  Karn isn't evaluated at 6 mana, mox monkey at 1R, ect.  Certainly its better when you can activate immediately, but not required.  

That being said 3 colored mana is costly, and its abilities on top of that also cost colored mana.  This will make it a little late on the mox smashing party for most decks and I can't imagine playing a high non moxen artifact count of your own in a 3+ color deck would be a great strategy.  Fringe playable in something like humans, but thats it.

Karn actually impacts the board as a 5-drop, as it blocks most ground creatures as an 0/8.  This card is AWFUL without an ability.  If you're not activating it than it's not worth playing.  You will not see her perform well at competitive events.  Every Sydri that top 8s represents a soft tournament. 

[Grand Inquisitor]

actually impacts the board

This is pretty key.  I actually think the more interesting comparison is to something like Stoneforge Mystic.  Here Sydri is more expensive, more difficult colors, doesn't 2-1 and leads you into the same traps of being ruined tempo-wise vs. removal.

[Guli]

Not every creature has to impact the board immediately to fit in.

[AmbivalentDuck]

Not every creature has to impact the board immediately to fit in.

Bob probably being the clearest case of that.

[psyburat]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

[MaximumCDawg]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

[brianpk80]

This is pretty key.  I actually think the more interesting comparison is to something like Stoneforge Mystic.  Here Sydri is more expensive, more difficult colors, doesn't 2-1 and leads you into the same traps of being ruined tempo-wise vs. removal.

All of that is true but there is an upside to this card which is that it doesn't require another deck slot (or several more) that can lead to untimely dead draws or ugly opening hands as sometimes happens w. Batterskull.  

Not every creature has to impact the board immediately to fit in.

Yup.  Many great creatures still require the turn to be passed in generally all cases (Bob, SfM, Deathrite) or in some cases (ie tapped out after playing Trinket Mage for Sensei, hardcasting Salvagers, etc.) This card seems like a reasonable candidate for inclusion as a 1-of in a Humans list with artifact prison elements like Revoker.  It's not the card you lead off with, just as one would never throw out a Tangle Wire Turn 1 on the play.  But reusable removal + combat superiority + lifegain is a lot of bases covered in one package for a mid-late game card.  

That being said, I do wish the activation costs were and instead of  and  .

[Samoht]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

It's playable in the Humans deck, and that's about it. What makes Bob so good is the flexibility in cost and no further investment after casting.

[psyburat]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

No, it's not a real card.

[Guli]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

No, it's not a real card.

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

Well duh, it still costs less than Sydri.  

Everything is over-costed these days. See the idea of negative casting costs (some argue that this already exist with phyrexian mana. We all understand that things need to cost as little as possible in Vintage. My point is that some decks are extremely successful in slowing the game down, that they can play cards that give incremental value (with or without an activation cost) over the course of several turns.

During my testings with Human decks, I noticed that there was 1 slot available for something like Gorilla Shaman. I even tried Karn at some point because Humans is very well at acceleration and it really is not a big deal to reach 5 or more mana at turn 3. With Cavern, Noble, Deathrite, City of Brass and so on. Life was always a big deal for Humans because of Dark Confidant, City and sometimes Snuff Out. I can see Sydri taking up that slot in all honesty. It really doesn't always have to be super fast to have an effect on the board. IF I would play this, it would never be more than 1 copy though.

[psyburat]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

No, it's not a real card.

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

Well duh, it still costs less than Sydri.  

Everything is over-costed these days. See the idea of negative casting costs (some argue that this already exist with phyrexian mana. We all understand that things need to cost as little as possible in Vintage. My point is that some decks are extremely successful in slowing the game down, that they can play cards that give incremental value (with or without an activation cost) over the course of several turns.

During my testings with Human decks, I noticed that there was 1 slot available for something like Gorilla Shaman. I even tried Karn at some point because Humans is very well at acceleration and it really is not a big deal to reach 5 or more mana at turn 3. With Cavern, Noble, Deathrite, City of Brass and so on. Life was always a big deal for Humans because of Dark Confidant, City and sometimes Snuff Out. I can see Sydri taking up that slot in all honesty. It really doesn't always have to be super fast to have an effect on the board. IF I would play this, it would never be more than 1 copy though.

It's certainly an if statement, not a when, since you don't play in competitions.  Sydri is not part of an optimized strategy.  Also, if you're trying Karn in your Fish decks, you're digging way too deep and wasting your time.

[zeus-online]

I don't know about you guys, but my Dark Confidant doesn't cost mana to activate... or three different colors of mana.

Not necessarily.  Would you play this?

SuperBob WB
2/1 Duder
U: Reveal the top card of your library.  Lose life equal to its casting cost and put it into your hand.

I'd play that.

Considering that i can use the ability as many times as  i wish...hmm yeah, probably - despite the horrible casting cost.
Best Treasure Trove ever.

With the current power creep i expect SuberBob in the next block.


I fail to see what this has to do with mr. mini-karn.
I really dont see mini-karn as being playable, the casting cost is just too colour intensive.

[Guli]

The casting cost is easy, the hard part is finding that blue to become mini karn. Tundra and Sea with city can support this with drs and noble.

[Blue Lotus]

Not every creature has to impact the board immediately to fit in.

Bob probably being the clearest case of that.

If your argument for this card's playability is comparing it to Dark Confidant you do not have a very compelling argument.

[Guli]

Players who have had experience with Thalia know the value of a mox eater like Gorilla Shaman or karn. This is a Human version with that ability.

[brianpk80]

I tried several different ways of getting Gorilla Shaman on board as part of the team but the non-Human subtype, red color, and redundancy in multiples always worked against it.  Yes, most decks cannot support this card or make use of its ability, but anyone who's ever cast Abrupt Decay w. a Cavern of Souls in play (ie, something that happens all the time) knows that that the mana configuration shows up naturally with little effort in Humans.dec.  It's a candidate for testing in the 59th or 60th slot in a prison oriented Humans list, which would then simply be a niche subvariant--not really a major claim to greatness.  It will be fun to test out especially considering how awful Theros was.   

[Guli]

I tried several different ways of getting Gorilla Shaman on board as part of the team but the non-Human subtype, red color, and redundancy in multiples always worked against it.  Yes, most decks cannot support this card or make use of its ability, but anyone who's ever cast Abrupt Decay w. a Cavern of Souls in play (ie, something that happens all the time) knows that that the mana configuration shows up naturally with little effort in Humans.dec.  It's a candidate for testing in the 59th or 60th slot in a prison oriented Humans list, which would then simply be a niche subvariant--not really a major claim to greatness.  It will be fun to test out especially considering how awful Theros was.  

Exactly. Nobody made grandiose claims in this thread. But some people just like to play the role of butcher, jumping on every opportunity to point out how wrong other people are or how they should keep it to themselves attacking them on a personal level.

I think after my insight and Brian's spot on conclusion to wrap things up, this thread should probably be closed. I don't see any other person on TMD that can offer more insight on Sydri than we already have. This is because we are probably one of the few who have competitive experience with Humans and Sydri clearly has serious restrictions on the playability level. It just happens to be that Humans is a deck that supports 5 colors relatively easy and almost anything can make the deck given it has the right utility.

This thread started going downhill after this post.  Guli, if you have issues with responses on TMD, please use the 'report to moderator' function, or contact a staff member directly.  Your response was unacceptable. 

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