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Author Topic: Vintage Pillars: An Updated List  (Read 7852 times)
fow3
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« on: May 31, 2015, 05:15:13 pm »

Hello, I was thinking that what is known as the "Five Pillars of Vintage" (Mana Drain, Mishra's Workshop, Bazaar of Baghdad, Dark Ritual, Null Rod) is outdated and does not portray today's metagame, so I decided to create an "updated" Vintage Pillars list. It's very possible that there are better cards to represent the pillars, but these are the five I think best fit each strategy and are not restricted. Also keep in mind that while decks in these pillars possibly don't run all or even any of the title cards, those cards should represent the general strategies of the decks.



Decks included in this pillar: URx Delver, UWx Mentor, Gush Storm, Doomsday
Summary: This pillar contains decks which are mana-light (in both lands and Moxen) that subscribe to the "Turbo Xerox" principle that is more dense in cheap, efficient spells and abuses the card Gush, which can make up for missed land drops in addition to having a very powerful decks. Because these decks take advantage of Gush to its maximum potential, they often negate or even utilize its cost of returning to Islands to your hand. Cards that synergize well with Gush include Fastbond, Jace, the Mind Sculptor, Library of Alexandria, Doomsday and Brainstorm. Gush also gains value when it is cast in response to land destruction cards like Wasteland, Strip Mine and Ghost Quarter.
Final thoughts: Other cards I thought could possibly represent this pillar were Preordain, Gitaxian Probe and Dig Through Time, but these decks have and can exist without those cards, and Gush magnifies the most, the core strategy and design of these style decks.



Decks included in this pillar: Martelo Shops, Terranova Shops, Affinity, "Etc." Shops
Summary: There are definitely some differences between these decks, but there fundamental strategy is to utilize the card Mishra's Workshop, Ancient Tomb and broken mana accelerants to quickly play relatively expensive artifacts, which tend to be card which prevent/challenge your opponents from casting or being able to resolve their spells. The deck also plays lands to destroy the opponent's, all while beating down with artifact creatures and manlands. While Mishra's Workshop is an extremely powerful land that taps for three mana every turn, the deck is "restricted" in a sense that Workshop can only cast artifact spells. If it could produce colored mana and/or activate abilities, it would obviously be more powerful, as it could rapidly play some of the most broken cards in the format.
Final thoughts: This is one of two pillars which still remain from before. I am referring to "Etc." Shops as Shops decks which don't fit the first two versions, playing less common cards like Goblin Welder, Smokestack, Serum Powder and/or various colored spells.



Decks included in this pillar: Dredge, Dragon Combo
Summary: These decks are designed to take advantage of the card Bazaar of Baghdad by using their graveyards often as a primary resource. Dredge accelerated Bazaar of Baghdad by playing cards with the Dredge mechanic, so that it can use cards which work out of the graveyard or by being milled (Narcomoeba). The Dragon combo deck can generate infinite tapping and untapping of lands, which can put its entire deck in the graveyard when there's a Bazaar of Baghdad out, and then proceeds to kill the opponent by recurring a card out of the graveyard with its infinite mana.
Final thoughts: This may be the most boring pillar in that it has the least amount/variety of decks, and the decks are not interactive in either way. It is also the other pillar which has survived the test of time, even with improved graveyard hate, showing the resiliency of this strategy.



Decks included in this pillar: Grixis Control, Oath, Bomberman, Keeper
Summary: This pillar in many ways has a very abstract definition. The decks are generally controlling decks, and often have different combos to finish the game spontaneously, rather than in increments. These combos are often referred to as haymakers. The ultimate haymaker which all of these decks tend to run is Jace. It is generally agreed upon that Jace is the best four mana card to be casting in Vintage, at least in decks without Mishra's Workshop. These decks play many counterspells and run much of the broken artifact accelerants. Accelerants, that is, to Jace most often. Sometimes these decks play four mana blue spells, like Fact or Fiction or Gifts Ungiven, but Jace is most uniform. Other haymakers these decks usually play are Tinker, Yawgmoth's Will and the Vault-Key Combo, but Jace is the only unrestricted one of these, and is the most consistent.
Final thoughts: Other decks in other pillars run Jace, but usually not any more than two. You can think of decks in this pillar as being a crescendo, countering early threats and laying out their mana artifacts, until they hit their climax, a.k.a Jace.



Decks included in this pillar: BUGr Fish, Merfolk, Various Color Combinations of Hatebears
Summary: Similar to Gush decks and spells, decks in this pillar plays cheap, efficient creatures, while destroying lands, depriving other mana sources and preventing the resolution of spells. While your opponent is struggling to cast spells, they are being hit over time with creatures dropped early, so that if they eventually can recover, they are either out of life and/or are at a disadvantage in other resources.
Final thoughts: Previously these style decks were branded as primarily using Null Rod as the other access of mana denial besides Wasteland. However, these decks have adopted cards that Shops decks already lose, yet are still beneficial to this pillar of decks. These cards include Chalice of the Void and Thorn of Amethyst. Because I consider those cards as being in the same category as Null Rod, I wanted to title this pillar with a card that is uniform in these decks, yet unique in effect (the singleton Strip Mine notwithstanding).

There is a lot more I have to say about these pillars which I am just not recalling at the moment because my head is still spinning with so many thoughts and ideas. I would just like to say that maybe you didn't notice Landstill and/or Belcher decks in the pillars list. Landstill was not written anywhere because I think there are strong arguments to include it in both the Jace, the Mind Sculptor pillar, and the Wasteland one. I have no idea where to put Belcher because it is so different from all the other Vintage strategies (Dredge is as well, but it is more of an established and successful deck). There is no clear category to put Belcher in; maybe Gush because of the lack of lands, maybe Mishra's Workshop because it sometimes runs that card in its sideboard and maybe Jace, the Mind Sculptor, being it builds up to being able to cast a four-of haymaker (Goblin Charbelcher). Which decks do you think these two decks should fit into? Am I missing any prominent decks in my pillars list? Do you think I should change which decks go where and/or one or more of the pillars? Should my explanations of the pillars have more information? Am I just crazy? What do you guys think? Thank you for reading!! Very Happy Very Happy
« Last Edit: June 08, 2015, 08:06:17 pm by fow3 » Logged

evouga
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« Reply #1 on: May 31, 2015, 06:32:25 pm »

If I remember correctly, the moniker "Vintage pillar" was originally invented to identify those cards that ordinarily would be restricted, but were given a pass because they formed such a central part of Vintage's identity. Bazaar and Workshop fall into this category, as does Force of Will, and arguably, Wasteland and Oath of Druids.

I don't think the "pillars" are as useful of a tool for taxonomizing the Vintage metagame. Bazaar and Workshop, due to their all-in nature, do lead to very distinctive archetypes, but the rest of the field is much fuzzier, with decks positioning themselves more evenly along the explosive/controlling and combo-finish/attrition axes.
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« Reply #2 on: May 31, 2015, 07:04:34 pm »

If I remember correctly, the moniker "Vintage pillar" was originally invented to identify those cards that ordinarily would be restricted, but were given a pass because they formed such a central part of Vintage's identity. Bazaar and Workshop fall into this category, as does Force of Will, and arguably, Wasteland and Oath of Druids.

I don't think the "pillars" are as useful of a tool for taxonomizing the Vintage metagame. Bazaar and Workshop, due to their all-in nature, do lead to very distinctive archetypes, but the rest of the field is much fuzzier, with decks positioning themselves more evenly along the explosive/controlling and combo-finish/attrition axes.

Interesting, I didn't know that about the pillars. It's funny as I never really thought Dark Ritual or Null Rod were restrictable and didn't make the connection, though I am relative new-comer.

To the OP, that's good take on the format and pretty accurate at the moment. The problem with the pillars is that the game has become much more dynamic. Gush was an excellent card when it was unrestricted but probably not format-defining as Shops kept it in check. Suddenly, WotC prints Delver, Young Pyromancer, Dack, and Delve, giving Gush the tools it needs to compete with Shops. I feel the pillars will continue to evolve with Bazaar and Shops probably safe unless something completely crazy happens.
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« Reply #3 on: May 31, 2015, 10:18:50 pm »

 Magic is so different than it was when the pillars were adopted.
It just makes more sense thinking more along the lines of strategies or goals, to categorize a deck.
Examples:
Control
Combo
Combo/control
Fish
Etc...

Either way, I don't see why the pillars would need updating.
What is to be gained?

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« Reply #4 on: May 31, 2015, 10:24:59 pm »

While the only pillars to survive the test of time are Mishra's Workshop and Bazaar of Baghdad, the reason you cannot truly update them is because the restricted list is ever changing. For example Gush has been on and off the restricted multiple times already. The cards on the original pillar list are, for the most part, free from restriction. The ones you have listed, on the other hand, are not. It's entirely possible that in a few months this list will be outdated as well.

Also, as somebody else pointed out, the pillar system is not a static system. It is simply a way to allow newcomers to easily learn what sort of strategies are available to us. Most decks can and often will take up design space from multiple pillars.

That being said, your post is a good snapshot of the format as it currently exists.
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« Reply #5 on: June 02, 2015, 11:10:19 pm »

Shop and Bazaar are clearly 2 pillars...they define a decktype and strategy and are stupid broken 4-ofs. 

Ritual and Rod, I never saw as pillars...especially ritual.  If anything "Storm", the mechanic, was a pillar, but really only "cards" are pillars.

I'd definitely say FoW is a pillar.  Mana drain is broken and has had its ups and downs in play, but FoW is the quintessential blue card and is almost always a 4-of in any blue build.  When you think "blue" you think FoW...ever since its printing.  Mana drain had it's day, but you can't say it's an auto 4-of since its printing.  For the same reason as drain, I don't think gifts, Jace, or gush fit as pillars.  They aren't all 4 ofs and don't "define" a strategy, but enhance strategies.  All those blue decks running those cards in any number do one thing in common though...control.  And FoW is the poster boy for control.

Shop, Bazaar, FoW are the clear 3 for me.  The other pillars should be broken cards that are 4-ofs defining a clear strategy...much like the original pillars did.  Possibilities include:

Oath of druids - It's usually in a "blue" deck, but not always.  I've run it in a BG or BGW shell to much success.  It's run chalice and rod or draw and counters.  It has a variety of win cons, but it all hinges on one thing...resolving a 2 mana enchantment that wins the game ASAP.  It defines the archetype, is widely played, is a definite 4-of and is busted as hell.  I think that fits all criteria.

Cavern of Souls - I didn't pick wasteland, because a dedicated "kill all your lands" deck is really rare, and so many other cards do that better.  What wasteland does do is provide tempo and supplement other, slower strategies very well (i.e. fish and shops).  Cavern however is typically a 4-of and decks are completely built around it often.  "Humans.dec", merfolk, soldiers, etc are all examples of this.  It is a powerhouse rainbow-mana generator that totally hoses blue and dodges chalice.  Not sure if it really defines a strategy and deck type though.  Its usefulness in shops to push out welders, in bomberman, and other various decks obscure its defining-power.  It's a tough call on this.

Dark Depths - Almost always a 4-of, broken as hell in combo, and CLEARLY defines an archetype.  The issue here is that it does nothing on its own and it is fringe played at best.  For me the "I sit here with virtually no function on my own" attribute disqualifies DD as a pillar.

Standstill - This is intriguing for me.  I don't think its as much a slam dunk as Oath, but it's close.  It is a 4-of in a deck that plays it.  It is a clear archetype/strategy.  It is very powerful for what it does.  If ancestral recall were a 4-of, it would be an undisputed pillar...so this is really attractive.

If I had to nail down 5 like the original ones, they'd be: Shops, Bazaar, FoW, Oath...and "weenies" (I know, it's not a card, but Caverns doesn't seem 100% right and there's a plethora of weenie decks that all aim to beat fast through combat over incremental swarm advantage and disrupt while doing it).

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« Reply #6 on: June 03, 2015, 11:46:40 am »

Workshop was restricted back in the day btw.

Wasteland is justified as a replacement for null rod for sure.
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« Reply #7 on: June 04, 2015, 07:10:58 pm »

The pillars concept was merely a heuristic that took on policy significance when Tom Lapille published a latest developments article fleshing out the pillars notion, and identified the pillars of the format, perhaps in a way to justify why some cards aren't restricted.  The DCI hasn't really used that frame again, so I wouldn't put too much stock in it. It may be a helpful way to think about the various strategies in the format, but it's certainly not the only way.  I prefer the "schools of magic" heuristic, which captures many of the major strategies in the format today. 
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« Reply #8 on: June 04, 2015, 08:49:29 pm »

The pillars concept was merely a heuristic that took on policy significance when Tom Lapille published a latest developments article fleshing out the pillars notion, and identified the pillars of the format, perhaps in a way to justify why some cards aren't restricted.  The DCI hasn't really used that frame again, so I wouldn't put too much stock in it. It may be a helpful way to think about the various strategies in the format, but it's certainly not the only way.  I prefer the "schools of magic" heuristic, which captures many of the major strategies in the format today. 


When I was doing research for one of my articles, I came across this article:  http://archive.wizards.com/Magic/magazine/article.aspx?x=mtg/daily/ld/44

Is this what you're referring to? It was a good read, and very informative. I also noticed that only four "pillars" are described. Null Rod is conspicuously absent.

One of the first things I read about the format when I was first putting my collection together was the five pillars. It didn't take long before I began to see their limitations, and I think that it's best to think of them as a rough guide. A lot of decks seem to occupy space in more than one pillar, and many decks belonging to one pillar may not even play the namesake card.

Creating a new grouping would probably benefit newer players more than any group, and as far as I'm concerned it's important to assist new players in any way possible.

I'm new to competitive Vintage, but I first played Magic a long time ago. There's a gap where I didn't play at all, and I'm trying to catch up on all of the history since then. It's very interesting, to say the least.
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« Reply #9 on: June 05, 2015, 02:10:42 pm »

People tend to think of the pillars as historically relevant, permanent parts of the format, but if you look it up, (which isn't hard to do) it's pretty quickly clear that this isn't the case. The first mention of a "pillar of the format" on TMD references Yawgmoth's Will. At various points in vintage history, various cards have been referenced as the pillars, and it has never been a comprehensive list.

I've never liked the concept of pillars because it's never really been accurate, not now, surely, but not in the past either. New players to the format are told "vintage is different from other formats metagame-wise, and the pillars explain that" - but it isn't, and they don't.

When a new player learns about the Pillars, they're learning information that HURTS their ability to understand the format and win games. Most importantly it kills their ability to sideboard effectively. If you define your local metagame in terms of pillars you will be screwed - and if you teach a new vintage player about them, you're dooming them to bad deckbuilding.

You don't beat Oath with the same cards that beat Grixis. You don't beat Bomberman with the same cards that beat Merfolk. Good lord if you show me a player that thinks DOOMSDAY and DELVER require the same strategies to combat, I'll show you a player that will not be involved with the format much longer.

And probably my personal favorite bit - every time someone writes out a list of what they think the pillars are, they include Dragon as a vintage deck. It wouldn't make sense to have a pillar with only one deck, and since Bazaar is OBVIOUSLY a pillar, that means that Dragon must be a deck, too! In contrast, if you ask the same player to just list the top 5, 10, 20 vintage decks, chances are Dragon wouldn't be there.

It's not just wrong now, it's ALWAYS been wrong. Grouping archetypes by card is a silly thing to do in any format, which is why no other format is reasoned about this way.

Please do not use pillars to teach new players how to play vintage - it will make them worse. Please do not use pillars to determine which cards you think should be restricted or unrestricted - "pillars" change all the time (often through restrictions or unrestrictions) and do not accurately reflect the metagame on the ground.




On the other hand, if you want to use pillars to inform your deckbuilding and decision making at an event in which I am also playing, I highly support your decision to do so.
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« Reply #10 on: June 08, 2015, 03:54:07 pm »

The pillars concept was merely a heuristic that took on policy significance when Tom Lapille published a latest developments article fleshing out the pillars notion, and identified the pillars of the format, perhaps in a way to justify why some cards aren't restricted.  The DCI hasn't really used that frame again, so I wouldn't put too much stock in it. It may be a helpful way to think about the various strategies in the format, but it's certainly not the only way.  I prefer the "schools of magic" heuristic, which captures many of the major strategies in the format today. 

The "Schhlools of magic" heuristic is exactly the approach I take when talking to new/unfamiliar players about vintage.
Just easier to understand that way.
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« Reply #11 on: February 01, 2016, 01:22:21 pm »

If I had to name clusters I would use:

Gush (Mentor, Delver, Therapy Pyromancer)
Workshops  (all variants)
Bazaar (basically just dredge, but also some dark depths builds)
Oath of druids (Just oath obviously. But I think Oath is very different from other decks)
Mana Drain (Classic TimeVault Tinker control, Standstill)
Artifact Combo-Control (Painter, Tezzerett)
"Fish" (Bug Fish, Merfolk, etc)
Dark Ritual (Storm)

This leaves out the belcher deck though Sad. Maybe you could Belcher with Painter and Tezzerett. But Belcher is a very different deck. You could also plausibly lump all the thirst for knowledge decks together (this lump painter and "old school" Control. Though it leaves standstill with no where to go). Also this is at least 8 clusters which is significantly more than five.

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« Reply #12 on: February 01, 2016, 02:11:49 pm »

Would you put Gushbond Tendrils in Gush or Dark Ritual (Storm)?
How about junk/hatebears/etc?
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« Reply #13 on: February 01, 2016, 04:21:24 pm »

The pillars used to be the best cards for their archetypes, so much so that you always saw them in a deck filling a certain role. Vintage has benefited greatly from new printings since 2010, and unbannings, so that now I don't think the metric works anymore.  The term "pillars" kind of loses all meaning when you have multiple cards that fill the same role in slightly different ways.

Example: Counterspell-heavy blue control decks used to be clumped into the "Drain" pillar.  Now, our cup flows over with playable counterspells that are situationally better than each other (Spell Pierce, Mana Drain, Force of Will, Flusterstorm, Mental Misstep, Mindbreak Trap, Swan Song, etc).  So, if a deck is looking for a blue permission core for disruption, it could branch out in a variety of directions.

Second Example: Aggro decks historically had to use Null Rod because it was one of a precious few options for keeping up with the explosive mana and combo potential of its enemies.  Now, we have Stony Silence, which does the same thing, Chalice as anti-mox technology (until we lost it) and an absolute FLOOD of hate bears since Alara.  (Pridemage, Thalia, etc).  

Counter-Example that Proves the Rule: Dark Ritual and Cabal Ritual remain to this day the way to generate explosive mana in a black deck.  Tendrils of Agony, Demonic Tutor, and Yawgwill are also black, so these guys are not going anywhere.  Since we still have nothing competing with these Rituals when it comes to fueling these kind of decks, the pillar remains "Ritual."

Second Counter-Example that Proves the Rule:  Mishra's Workshop remains the premire way to accelerate out stupid artifacts at ludicrous speed.  Any MUD deck, no matter what variety, starts with four of them.  So, the pillar remains, "Shops."

Finally, and partly because of the huge number of options (many different blue draw engines, for one) we have new kinds of decks that didn't really exist before: Tempo and Token strategies. 

The age of the Pillars is over. 

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