ugh I live in the Berkeley area and I have a vintage deck but all my cards are back home in socal -_-

Aw damn it, I left all my cards back home in so.cal =(

Note to self: Bring your t1 deck for the spring.

Okay. The last time I posted was in early February. Now, that isnt too far away, being just 4 months, but as I come back to browse the forums there are a lot of unfamiliar terms/cards/changes. I was pretty active in terms of knowing what was going on with the metagame, etc but I got bored due to the lack of time to actually play magic. However, recently, my interests for the game have peaked again but it seems as if I've been left in the dust. So I have a few questions regarding how Vintage has changed within these few months:

1) Apparently Gifts got restricted, Gush got unrestricted, and something called Flash is popular. What's going on?

2) What are the top 5 decks right now? I understand that a concrete top 5 list wont be established from what I hear about the restrictions/unrestrictions/new mechanics, but I'm curious as to what are the speculated top contenders.

3) What happened to decks like Fish, SS, Gifts (is it completely dead now?), Oath, Stax (I didnt hear about this deck even back in February. Is this deck pretty much off the radar too?)

I thank you greatly for all your help.

What the heck happened to SS?

To the topic creator:

When I read your post it seemed as if you wanted to punish the people who practice/test and put a lot of time in the game to become good.

Excuse me for being retarded, but exactly how does Bomberman work? I understand the synergy between Salvagers + Lotus for infinite mana, but is the kill condition just beats?

Deathmark is terrible against Oath.

The only creature it hits is Razia.

Why would you play Slaver in an Oath/Fish field?

Oath isnt played as much as it used to be so you shouldnt worry too much.

Oath is one of those decks designed to smash Slaver's face.

Dont try making a Drain deck without drains.

This belongs more in Basic User Community.

Anyways, your friend is right. Invest in vintage staples that are "universally" useful. For example, the blue fetchlands, duals, etc. Youre also gonna want to focus on getting other not-as-general staples such as Force of Will, Brainstorm, Tutors, and all the other random commonly played stuff.

Have you tried to replace some of your creatures for Erayo? I know you already stated why Bouncers are good, but SS runs Erayo and seems to be doing fine.

Is there any particular reason why people prefer Pyroblast over REB?

How do you feel about the absence of the maindeck RnR?

Inuition is eh in Oath. As a tutor, it's too expensive for a deck that wants to be able to cast Oath/draw/tutors on turns 1 & 2. Otherwise, youre relying too much on drain.


Gifts Oath on the other hand is a different story...

Even without Mana Drain I would still run Thirst in a control Oath build.

I hate drains in Oath. I'd much rather run Leaks instead.

I disagree.

Category 2 cards are vintage STAPLES. Smokestack is NOT a staple at all. It isnt played in any deck out of Stax, and most of the time isnt even played IN Stax either. Forbidden Orchard and Oath are not staples. Not all decks should play Orchard, and not all decks that support green should play Oath.

Cabal Ritual is arguable because of its strong presence in modern non-Gifts storm combo decks.

I think you misunderstood the definition of a staple.

So if you could change it, would you add more Gifts? Personally I would leave it at one.

And why not Vampiric Tutor?

I was thinking of replacing the Thirsts too, but after you Oath, exactly what is there to Gifts for?

Thing is though, you'll have your whole deck in your graveyard, so drawing into Oath would be better than playing the 2nd or 3rd Gifts (unless it's for mana)

Can you post the list you used (if you did) for the tournament? I'm curious as to what it looks like.

That would make it basically a completely different type of Oath deck. With all 4 Wastes, Leaks, and Impulses, that basically makes it a GWS Oath deck which is completely different from ICBM's version.

I advise against running more than 1 or 2 Scrublands. City of Brass/Gemstone Mine is usually better, since after you cast Rector youre not ever gonna use the white again. I used to use a land base like this:

2 Polluted Delta
2 Flooded Strand
3 Underground Sea
1 Scrubland
2 City of Brass
3 Gemstone Mine
1 Tolarian Academy

Or at least close to that. I cant remember if I ran more or less lands.

Have you ever found that life loss from Doomsday and Infernal Contract too much?

20 Life
Infernal Contract
10 Life
Doomsday
5 Life

OR

20 Life
Fetchland
19 Life
Infernal Contract
Force of Will
18 --> 9
Doomsday
4 Life


That leaves you incredibly vulnerable to a simple tendrils for storm 2 or 3.

Why the heck would you want Morphling when you have Sky Swallower

It's standard ICBM Oath cept instead of the angels it runs 2x Moses.

Seriously though, I think I've seen it before. I recall it being a little janky with Muddles and Annuls/Stifles and other random cards.

It's for the Gaea's Touch tech so he can run Hidden Path 

Does anyone have the top 8 lists?

Actually the comment about arrogance was directed at R Thomas.

On topic: We dont take pleasure in telling you the card sucks. You think we do because the majority of us tell you so. You say we are dismissing your card without even testing it. Have you even tested it? Remember, all the burden of proof is on you, not us.

The reasons why it is bad is quite obvious. It isn't my job to tell him that, because if he hasn't realized why its bad yet, then he hasn't fully analyzed the card. Secondly, he's suggesting the use of the card. Therefore, first and foremostly he should be telling me why the card is good.


I cant believe you would call me arrogant while ignoring what he just said.

Yes we read it and it's crap. Give us a good example of a situation in which this card would be remotely useful and efficient.