What does "cosplaying" mean?

I'll post here again, just to stick up for my bud Steve.  The deck has the same "problem" as Turbo Land.  When you deck read it, it looks like it needs too many cards to win.

When in reality the deck is a harmonious design of intertwining combos, any 2 of which gain enormous tempo or card advantage and lead to a win very readily.

I've playtested against it with an even record with Animal Farm.  But since that's the only deck I'm focusing on right now, I'm really not qualified to comment on other matchups.

I will say in goldfishing, you shouldn't worry about the number of cards needed to pull of a "fully combo'd win".  When it starts gaining advantages, it usually only accelerates.

By the same method it got so good to begin with.  Playtesting.

Honestly, criticism from deck readers never entered into the previously successful formula.

You fail to realize...I don't need ANYTHING from the graveyard...till I'm ready to win.

And when I'm ready to win...I should have already killed the Wretch (with Barbarian Ring) and Living Wished it back (because he ate the Ring with the Wretch)...who cares.

And...bebe's antictodal information aside, a deck that attacks my hand is the worst strategy ever.  First of all...my threats stay on the table...not in my hand.  So you have to HOPE to catch them.  Second of all, Hymn or Spectering away a land is really fun to watch...

In all my playtesting, I have never lost a GAME against Sui...with MD Wretches.  It just doesn't happen.

Can we talk about something important now?

Answering questions (and silly attacks) from people who have never even bothered picking up the mentioned cards and goldfishing...really doesn't end in anything that's even remotely productive.

Any further sensible and well-thought-out questions can be answered by people who want to post on the deck's original thread on BB.  I did make some slight adjustments that I will post on an article on that site.

My Engineered Explosives have made a hoby of laughing at Chalices.

Also, Chalices for 1 and 3 are often not good for decks that like to use Chalice.

The problem with this deck reading you're doing is that you are not being practical.

Let me be more specific.  Imagine this...you adopt your strategy and by turn 4 there is 1 Exploration and 1 Horn of Greed on the table.  This will easily lead to 2 Explorations by turn 5.  Now on turn 6, let's say I drop a Horn.  

I am completely out-drawing you.  I play 3 lands, draw 6 cards...and I play fastbond.  Do you counter it?  If you don't, I'll draw my whole deck.  Now, assuming we're still using your strategy...  you MUST counter all 4 Crucibles, and Regrowth, and Yawgmoth's Will, and Timetwister...but you have to do that all on THIS turn.

See, it sounds great when you type it...if you use that as your strategy...you'll likely be out-drawn if you don't pay attention to what's happening in the actual game.

Have I lost to people using that strategy?  Sure.  But playtesting has proven that it's really only as valid as any other strategy.

Pay very close to that sentence.  That expresses why the deck works so well.  Probably better than I could have said it myslef.

(Ok...fine...I'll post on the mana drain...)

The reason most people immediately dismissed turbo land when Crucible was printed, was that "we all know 4 card combos don't work".  And generally speaking, that is true.

But if a deck doesn't really need any particular part to win...and having any two of them nearly guarantees a win, couldn't it break the rules just like Dragon does?

Dragon needs a Dragon, a way to discard it, an animate spell, and a win creature or a way to draw and discard the deck.  It needs more combo pieces than most people will willingly build into a deck.  The difference is it works because of redundancy.

It's kind of funny hearing people say, "Anyone who knows the deck would just counter all the ________"

The last one I remember reading on here was Crucible.  Ok, so you counter all my Crucibles...and you allow 1 Exploration and 1 Horn to resolve...   Do you think you're going to win?  What happens when I play another Horn?  Or, better yet, another Exploration.  You don't think you're still going to counter everything that stops me, do you?

I would encourage people to playtest Animal Farm.  It actually DOES work.  Even when people are prepared for it.

I've playtested COUNTLESS games vs. Tog and 4CC.  I have a positive playtest record vs. both.  That's precisely why I've played it.  Animal Farm handles countrol better than any other combo deck I've seen.



And 1 Crop Rotation, which mostly grabs Strip Mine vs. Control.  That makes seven.  7 Wastelands.  That's very important.  (Not including DT and VT)

Also, to understand the deck better you have to understand something very important.

It's Combo-Prison.  

It does not win faster than any other combo deck.  It can win Turn 1.  But that's not very common.  It's far more likely to draw all the counter from the opponent with early threats...then drop something that gains a HUGE swing in tempo.

Unlike other combo decks, Animal Farm is more likely to win a match of attrition against 4CC, Tog or Landstill.

Most other combo decks hope to throw all their power at you in one big turn.  That's NOT how this plays.

Against aggro it does, sure.

But against control it's a careful duel for advantage.  And it can usually achieve it.

I'm not saying it's some god deck.  It has holes like anything.  Mostly it's losses are to Fish and other combo decks.  Though I've had 2 big wins against my only combo opponents this weekend.  And I'm 1-1-1 against Fish for the weekend.

I've played 15 matches in 2 tournaments this weekend.  With only 2 losses (Fish and Tog), and only 1 Intentional Draw (against FCG today).  Not bad for only it's first 2 times in public.

I have been playing around with the idea of running Workshops and Storm Cauldrons in the combo version of Crucible.dec, along with the Explorations and Fastbond, to increase the number of cards that get you to start going off.  It looks like it's worth playing around with more.

Dreamer's runs weekly Type 1 tournaments on Fridays @ 6:30 in addition to the once a month Sunday tournament for a P9.

Alright, I just got home.  Wow, I come back from work and I have 4 pages of responses.  I knew the post was a bombshell.  It wasn't intended to be a milk-toast plea or anything.  But I'm still a little surprised.  

Ok, first, I obviously need to clarify something, so it's best to start by being clear.  I never intended to compare you, personally, to a Nazi.  Never.

The part of the post has been eliminated, so if you have a copy of it saved, I hope you re-read it after hearing this.  If not, I hope you're calm enough to trust I'm being honest.

The sentence or two about Nazi's and Communists was meant to try to reach a mutual understanding that those organizations were wrong.  It was meant to build the point, as evidence, of my central thesis.  (Sectioning out people, based on who can say what where, is, to alteast some degree, destructive.)  I knew we would both agree they were wrong.  I was trying to get you to agree on the fundamental mistakes they made, that made them wrong.

Sure, it was meant to be provacative.  It was meant to make people see that something they were doing, was fundamentally flawed, in a similar way to something historically that was also fundamentally flawed.  But it seems you feel I was calling you a Nazi.  Clearly, the original post never made that statement.  So I hope you accept my apology for making you feel that it was implied.



Yeah, sure.  Self interest is a pretty dependable motivator.  Why not?  And if you must know, I am insulted.  

[non-constructive rant]And I should be.  Milton has a full membership.  (Craig, you're a pretty cool guy in my book, don't take this personally.)  Milton, as far as I can tell has a membership because he's always had a membership, and because he posts more than I do.  He's not ranked as highly as I am.  He doesn't win tournaments as consistantly as I do.  There's no reason he deserves to post in any forum I'm not allowed in.  I had a BD membership.  And I had an early TMD memberships as well.[/non-constructive rant]

Ok, but here's the point.  There's a reason I didn't just spew the preceeding anger in my first post.  The preceeding rant doesn't really give the whole picture.  The whole picture includes all the people who don't give a shit anymore.  They don't care to re-prove themselves.  There are plenty of people like me, who have contributed to TMD, yet don't feel the need to post daily, or even weekly.  I own a business.  Like many Type 1 players (being older, thus more frequently professional=busier) I post when I can, and when I see something where I can add to the dialogue.

But I don't fit in to the new defenition of a poster.  I don't write long articles about the evolution of any deck type.  

But when an idea on a deck was being discussed, my adding to the conversation NEVER caused catastrophic pandamonium.  Is there really a reason, I shouldn't be alowed to add to the conversation?  And my point was broader than that.  Aren't there HUNDREDS of people who've been snubbed, who could also make the same arguement?

And I've read all the comments made in favor of "Quality Content Uber Alles".   I don't think you fully understand my viewpoint on this.  I love quality tech.  You're right, I come to TMD, to get it.  Atleast I always did.  But look at the numbers of people who aren't even asking for full memberships.  I believe there is a large number of people who have lost the taste for this site, with the new rules.

And quantity has now definitely gone down.  Let's look at the facts.  I'll take my friend Steve's post:

http://www.themanadrain.com/forums/viewtopic.php?t=6412

The deck has been up for 8 days.  It has 3 replies.  One of which is Steve.

The similar deck that had been posted on the old site had 10 replies...in 3 days.  That is dramatically different.

Perhaps downward trending graphs are satisfactory to you.  My experience in the real world tells me they should be avoided like the plague.  For all practical purposes, they are the plague.  A glaring indicator of something dying.

You don't really think most of those missing posts we have these days were useless spam do you?  

I think you have slighted a large number of people, who don't want to jump through hoops, just to be a part of something they had always previously felt at home at.  There may not be large numbers of people speaking out on this the way I do.  But silence is often a trademark of human reaction to insult.

I hope you don't feel I'm trying to "beat you up" for this.  I simply think you haven't really carefully thought out this mistake.

I haven't wanted to post here since the new changes, but this has been annoying me to no end, so I thought I should speak my mind.

I guess I never really saw the advantage of the old newbie forums.  It seemed like a lot of viable, innovative ideas came from it, so a person had to read both forums to get the highest volume of discussion and ideas.

Now we need 3 forums??  Honestly, what purpose could it really serve?  Sure, the posters in that highest of high forums will most likely put out FEW to ZERO bad ideas.  There's the threat of not being seen as the elite anymore.  That will generally make anyone post fewer ideas all together.

And the "wanna-be's" in the middle forum.  Are they now going to put forth every new deck tech they work on?  NO!  How could one be so risky?  After all, the inner circle over in that other room might see what I say, and disagree, and we couldn't have that, could we?  No, no.  It's far safer to make smaller comments, that are more genrealized.  Don't delve into those sometimes disagreable details.

The concept of quarantining "sub-par" posters is flawed.  It's destructive, elitist and will result in stifled creativity.  (Nazi reference removed).  

That's the problem with stifling speech unnecessarily.  You never know the ideas that would have been.

The way I see it, there are only two benefits that one could find in dividing the Type 1 community this way:

1. It becomes minutely more convenient to find quality posts.  But this benefit can easily be debunked.  Assuming you are new to Type 1, figuring out which posts are valuable, and which ones aren't, is your responsibility, and in fact it adds to the process of becoming a better player.  If you are already a skilled discusser of Type 1 tech, you should easily be able to look at any post, and within seconds, be able to determine the value of the data.

And if you're reading to hear and share ideas regarding new deck design, wouldn't quantity of ideas be equally valuable.  

So now, you'll need to read 3 forums to get quantity.  If you want more discussion on your posts, you have to post them 3 times.  So much for convenience.  

2.  It allows players to slap themselves on the back.  I saved this for last, because I'm sure it will be the most quickly dismissed idea in the whole post.  There's a perverse satisfaction felt by players who are in the top forum.  "I've made it."  "Look at what I am."

Ego.  We're all human here.  Don't take this as any major insult.  It's not any great secret that vanity is often indulged upon in Magic circles.  Why do players compete in PTQ's?  It's not to get all the bitches.  It's not because they have realistic expectations of supporting themselves financially.  It's because at the end of the day, it's fun to go home to your local shop and say, "Yeah, I'm the top player here."

Type 1 doesn't have it's big winner's circle.  It's understandable that players seek recognition for their Magic achievement here, online, in the arena of ideas.  So please, let me hereby acknowledge all the great players of Type 1.  You know who you are.  You've contributed immensely.  But don't you think we could put aside the idea that you're the only ones who can contribute?

Honestly, if you think dividing the Type 1 community further is healthy for the format, you really need someone to tell you that you are doing Type 1 no justice.

I personally feel that many of the points in this thread are worth discussing. Unfortunately, the thread is quickly turning into a Anti/Nazi flame war. For the future, please don't bring up such non-magic-related sensitive subjects and an obvious dangerous comment. -- Leviat