To our European Members

[Matt]

Not to be ironic, but all your base are belong to English.

[Anusien]

Y'all all talk funny, I reckon.

[Matt]

Fo' shur.

[rvs]

English's grammar and vocabulary are poorer than the french's, and that helped a lot when picking an international language too.

Wait, what? I was led to believe English had possibly the richest vocabulary of any language, due to the Norman invasion (where we got French and Latin words to replicate the Old English ones already in use - "canine" (from Latin canis) and "hound" (german: Hund) or how we use the R-words "regal, royalty" to describe kings (from the german König), for example).

However, Latin has a very low number of words compared to ancient greek for instance, so that probably doesn't account for any real influx of words.

[Matt]

We use some greek too, but not as much.

[Godder]

However, Latin has a very low number of words compared to ancient greek for instance, so that probably doesn't account for any real influx of words.

Having studied English Linguistics at university, I can tell you that Latin is responsible for substantially more words than you're giving it credit for. I think the thing that's being missed here is that when science, medicine and technology have required new terms over the past 500 years, Latin and Ancient Greek have been the major source of root words for these terms. Look at the names of the dinosaurs, for example (even the term 'dino-saur' is an invented Latin compound word meaning 'terrible lizard'), or most medical conditions, or names for branches in science. The other thing is that there are many Latin and Ancient Greek words that are synonyms for other words. These Latin/Ancient Greek words aren't necessarily in common use, but are still considered part of the total English vocabulary.

[dandan]

Any decent English dictionary (showing the source of the word) will show that Latin is a major source of English words. French is also a surprising important source (well, they did invade and conquer England in 1066, not that they were French in those days).

[Anusien]

Still, it's worth pointing out that English is not a Romance language, but a Germanic one.

I reckun.  Y'all.

[Dozer]

I reckun.  Y'all.

Ya bloody well might reckon lots, mate! *ahem*

As for Dutch next to impossible to master, 'tis true. My cousin studied in Holland, my godfather is Dutch, and they both agreed that Nederlands is helluva friggin' load of work to learn. Germans and Dutch understand each other well enough, if the Dutchies drift a little into German. But really speaking the language is very, very hard, especially because there are so many words that are pronounced WAAAY differently than they are written. At least, that's what those who learned it tell me. You know how you can't really understand a deep Southerner with a thick accent if you had no practice, even though he writes the same words? It's a little like that, only worse, because the words aren't exactly German, either.

Nederlands sounds great, though.

[Bram]

my godfather is Dutch

[nataz]

Germans and Dutch understand each other well enough, if the Dutchies drift a little into German

I was just taught to sing a dutch Christmas song the other day, it sounds something like this...

[terrible phonic translation]

sinter klashka
bona bona bona
huevue tin mae lickie lickie tone-ya
huevue tin mae lashka
dankya sinter klashka!

[/end terrible phonic translation]

I have no idea what most of the words mean, apparently its something about Santa Claus and barrels.

however I was pleased to have guessed that the "dankya" was equivalent to the English "thank-you" simply by phonic its similarity to the German "thank-you"


best story ever,
and then I found 5 dollars

[Anusien]

I'm getting sinister, Santa Claus, licks, and barrels.  This is either the story of Santa taking two from a shotgun or a very sexy story.

[Bram]

sinter klashka
bona bona bona
huevue tin mae lickie lickie tone-ya
huevue tin mae lashka
dankya sinter klashka!

It's actually not a Christmas song but a song for Sinterklaas-evening (the 5th of December) when we celebrate eve of the death of Turkish bishop St. Nicholas (who coincidentally is the guy you modeled your original Santa Claus character on, but whatever The correct lyrics:

Sinterklaasje
Bonne bonne bonne
Gooi wat in mijn lege lege tonne
gooi wat in mijn laarsje
dank U Sinterklaasje!

It's sung to this melody.

It means:

Good good good St. Nicholas
Throw something in my empty empty barrel
Throw something in my boot
Thank you St. Nicholas!

The word 'bonne' is an archaic Dutch construction, or rather a Diets word (a sort of proto-Dutch, or technically, a collection of southern dialects of Middle-Dutch which were spoken between about 1100 and 1500 AD and are often confused with German by English-speakers). It is derived from the French 'bon' which means 'good', pointing to the fact that this song is WAY old.

[nataz]

It's actually not a Christmas song but a song for Sinterklaas-evening (the 5th of December) when we celebrate eve of the death of Turkish bishop St. Nicholas (who coincidentally is the guy you modeled your original Santa Claus character on, but whatever  The correct lyrics:

Yea, they mentioned something about that to me, but I was too busy singing it over and over again by then.

[Bram]

By the way, I forgot to mention how awesome I think it is that you learned that song. And how had I lauged at 'lickie lickie tone-ya'

[BigMac]

By the way, I forgot to mention how awesome I think it is that you learned that song. And how had I lauged at 'lickie lickie tone-ya'

I way second that. We had a good laugh about this at my work actually.

Btw Bram, your assumption that it is way old because of the bonne bonne bonne is not completely correct. Well, it depends on what you think is way old. The Sinterklaas fest is from the second half of the niniteenth century i think, could even be early 20th. In this time French was considered a gentlemens language and to have French words in a song would somehow make it better. (how i have no clue as less people would actually understand its meaning)

For those of ytou who actually want to know. This Turkish saint actually lived on the island of Elba. He was renown for his goodness and especially towards children. We actually celebrate his birthday on the 5th of december and he and his morish minions come over from Spain to bring us gifts. From there on it pretty much is the same as you Santa Claus. It basically means we celebrate it somewhat earlier in the month and have fullgrown black elves. Instead of a sled our Santa has a speckled horse that can actually run over the rooftops.

The Black Pieten as we call the minions are somewhat like smurfs. As you have a music Smurf you also have a music Piet. As Smurfs the Pieten all have some kind of designation. I suspect that Peyo (the father of the smurfs) pretty much took the Pieten and made them smaller and with a tail. To make them really different he made them blue.

This song pretty much lets children beg for pressent.

[dandan]

Here in Slovakia, Mikulas (the Slovak for Nicholas [sort-of}) is celebrated on 6th December. Clearly he died a long painful death dragged from Holland to Slovakia .
We also get Christmas on the 24th (well, that's when you open the presents) and Three Kings on 6th January. We get to celebrate Chrimbo three times.

Note that Slovak bank holidays are on a certain date so if you are unlucky you get them on a weekend and so get no time off! The upside is that we have more bank holidays and can choose really silly ones. We recently had Cyrill and Method day.

[Jacob Orlove]

This thread got dutchjacked so bad.

[The Atog Lord]

I'll be in Italy and Greece for the next couple of weeks on vacation. I'll keep my eyes out for anything Magic-related while there. Hope to run into some Type One players! Though, I'm leaving my decks at home

[BigMac]

Don't take to many clotheswith you. It is way hot there atm.

Dunno about vintage players there though...

[Komatteru]

This thread got dutchjacked so bad.

It's been quite a while since that's happened.  Maybe that has something to do with the establishment of Meandeck Europe.

[Anusien]

For those of ytou who actually want to know. This Turkish saint actually lived on the island of Elba. He was renown for his goodness and especially towards children. We actually celebrate his birthday on the 5th of december and he and his morish minions come over from Spain to bring us gifts. From there on it pretty much is the same as you Santa Claus. It basically means we celebrate it somewhat earlier in the month and have fullgrown black elves. Instead of a sled our Santa has a speckled horse that can actually run over the rooftops.

Can you imagine the lawsuits in the US if the Elves were large black men?

[BigMac]

So why don't little people have lawsuits just because elves have pointy ears. Perhaps they could get some money to buy weapons to win over the lion.

[Dozer]

So why don't little people have lawsuits just because elves have pointy ears. Perhaps they could get some money to buy weapons to win over the lion.

Weapons aren't allowed in the contest, and anyway, the only weapon that would help would be... ANOTHER LION! Because no weapon can ever defeat the Lion. Not that particular one, anyway.

Back on T.O.P.I.C., in Germany we also have St. Nikolaus, who comes around on the 6th of December with his servant Ruprecht (a black man, but black as in smeared with coal), who has a wooden cane. Children put one of their shoes out (preferrably a large one) at the front door, and on the morning of the 6th it should be filled with sweets, chocolate and candy. Good children get sweets, bad children get a beating or a sock (not a sack, a sock) full of coal. Beating or coal depends on the area, but rarely happens anyway.

On the evening of the 24th, it used to be the Christkind (i.e. the son of Mary and Joseph, aka Jesus, in his infant form) who brought presents, usually accompanied by the same "Knecht Ruprecht" St. Nikolas had enlisted as helper. The Christkind was/is especially popular in the southern parts of Germany and in Austria.

Then Coca-Cola invented the red-white Santa Claus. (That urban legend is sticking to beliefs in Germany like old gum to the sole of a shoe coated in wet tar on a hot day.) Anyway, the "Christkind" belief has widely been replaced by the "Weihnachtsman", literally the "Christmas Man", who has no name, no servant and a couple of reindeers, who looks just like the Santa Claus on coke bottles, and is somewhat of a merger between St Nikolaus and his punishing servant Ruprecht.

There is a "Pro Weihnachtsmann" association in Germany, and a "Pro Christkind" association in Austria. Both endorse and spread the use of their respective symbol on Christmas Eve. No joke.

[Komatteru]

When I was in 8th grade, I once convinced a 1st grader that George Washington invented the color red so that kids would be able to color better at Christmas time.