[Deck] White Shadow

[policehq]

Looking at the popular decks out there, I believe this one has a good chance in the environment. It beats Tog hard:

4 Deftblade Elite
4 Leonin Skyhunter
4 Silver Knight
4 Soltari Foot Soldier
4 Soltari Priest

2 Disenchant
2 Empyrial Armor
4 Empyrial Plate
1 Enlightened Tutor
3 Land Tax
4 Orim's Chant
2 Swords to Plowshares
1 Zuran Orb

2 Maze of Ith

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mox Pearl
16 Plains

And now, a card-by-card rundown:

-Deftblade Elite - Originally I played 4 Icatian Javelineers to kill Goblin Welders. Later I splashed red for Soltari Guerillas and Lightning Bolts (plus Fire/Ice) in the sideboard. This way it's just so much easier, and he can also take out key Fish creatures (ie - Grim Lavamancer in particular), and he also acts as a mini-Fog when he's blocking. Pumped up with Empyrial Plate/Armor, he's even better.

-Leonin Skyhunter - This one is new, and I'm just playing it because of the evasion it has. I don't think that pro-black is all that useful when you can get card disadvantage from Fire/Ice, so I replaced Soltari Monk with this. It's helpful that this flies over Tog. I'm considering replacing these with Spectral Lynx to fight Stompy and regenerate from a Pernicious Deed. In this case, I'd obviously replace Plains with duals, 1 Swamp (searched for with Land Tax), and a Mox Jet.

-Silver Knight - Protection from red is very important in my metagame, and it is almost a form of evasion against Food Chain Goblins.

-Soltari Foot Soldier - Establishes early pressure against control. Awesome with Empyrial Plate/Armor.

-Soltari Priest - The best creature in the deck. Wins games more often than any other. The pro-red combined with evasion is just beautiful. Triskelion would be a pest if it weren't for Deftblade Elite (to get rid of the Goblin Welder).

-Disenchant - I've always chosen Seals over cards like this, but now everyone that plays blue in my area plays 4 Stifles maindeck. It's a metagame call (as most decks/cards are). It gets rid of Food Chain (a lot of budget players around here), Mindslaver, Oath of Druids, Nevinnyral's Disk, forget it, a ton of things. The main cards to kill, though, are Null Rod and/or Damping Matrix.

-Empyrial Armor - Boosts your creatures with evasion for the win.

-Empyrial Plate - 4 more copies of Empyrial Armor, only this time you don't lose card advantage when your creatures dies. The new and improved Rancor (since my creatures have evasion).

-Enlightened Tutor - Fetches Land Tax, the centerpiece of the deck, or an Empyrial Armor/Plate for a killer creature. Also gets Zuran Orb if you are in need of life or less land.

-Land Tax - This card fills up your hand, acting as a recurring Giant Growth on your evasion creatures with Empyrial Armor/Plate. Besides that, there are so many Plains in the deck that it can thin it out for threat after threat.

-Orim's Chant - Some might say that I'm playing too many, but I just absolutely love this card. Most of the time your control opponent will let a small creature through, and this will ensure that the small creature becomes a big one with Empyrial Armor/Plate. Against Draw-7, it is perfect to cast in response to a spell when they have a ton of mana in their mana pool (most Draw-7 decks use Tendrils of Agony for the win, which is a sorcery and thus cannot be played in response). It gives you an extra turn against Food Chain Goblins, and helps against Tog. If you resolve an Orim's Chant in response to Cunning Wish, you win.

-Swords to Plowshares - Early removal for Wild Mongrels, Psychatogs, Goblin Welders, Metalworkers, Goblin Lackeys, and the like.

-Zuran Orb - This card is questionable. I would replace it with a fourth Land Tax if Land Tax weren't so redundant. Sword of Fire and Ice might also come in for it because it gives me a card, pumps up my creature, and lets me deal 2 direct damage (mongrel, welder, rootwalla, goblins, the opponent's head, etc.).

-Maze of Ith - Right now the main decks to beat are Tog, Dryad/Babycakes, Food Chain Goblins, and various Stompy builds (for me, anyway). This card buys me time (or straight up wins the game) for me against these decks.

-Black Lotus - Works really well with Land Tax, and it lets me get an early empyrial creature with Orim's Chant backup.

-Lotus Petal - One might suggest Chrome Mox or Mox Diamond over this card because of their synergy with Land Tax, but then, you have to remember that the reason for Land Tax is to keep the handsize high. An early Chrome Mox or Mox Diamond lessens the power of an empyrial card. Since Empyrial Armor essentially costs four mana, this helps my curve out by playing a 2cc creature on the second turn and the plate on the third with ease. In the same way, you can play a Soltari Foot Soldier or Deftblade Elite on turn 1 and on turn 2 play Empyrial Armor. Without this, the mox, and the Black Lotus, the mana curve would be really stunted at 2cc.

-Mox Pearl - replacing a Plains for Land Tax reasons.

The sideboard is completely up to you, but here is mine with explanations:

2 Disenchant - More Null Rod/Damping Matrix/Trinisphere/Sphere of Resistence/Food Chain/etc. hate.

2 Empyrial Armor - Sided in for 2 Plates against Null Rod.

2 Maze of Ith - Anti-Tog. Brought in along with Morningtide and Sacred Ground (against their strips).

4 Morningtide - Anti-Tog. Remember, when playing against 4 Stifles maindeck, a first-turn Tormod's Crypt doesn't do much good, and removing your graveyard from the game has no drawback whatsoever. The fact that it's a sorcery hurts a little, but not as much as the vulnerability to Stifle. You can still do a significant amount of damage to a Tog's tempo when you remove their library from the game, especially when it's backed up with an Orim's Chant. Also hurts Dragon decks after a Buried Alive if they don't go off on the same turn (again, Orim's Chant helps here).

3 Sacred Ground - Strip Mine/Wasteland hate against Maze of Ith.

2 Swords to Plowshares - trying to figure out a way to bring this in against Tog, but I can't at the moment (Game 2 sideboard vs. Tog: -4 Deftblade Elite, -2 Disenchant, -2 Empyrial Armor, -1 Zuran Orb, +2 Maze of Ith, +4 Morningtide, +3 Sacred Ground). Still, this card helps against Welder and other problematic early plays (particularly Goblin Lackey and Wild Mongrel).

Why you should play the deck: No aggro deck can race against this deck because you are playing Swords to Plowshares, Maze of Iths, Zuran Orb, and Orim's Chants. Combo decks are hurt by Orim's Chant disruption (and further by the sideboard), and control decks can't handle the early pressure. You never really even give them anything good to Mana Drain. The deck quickly kills Goblin Lackeys, Goblin Welders, Basking Rootwallas, and Fish's creatures with your Deftblade Elites.

Dragon decks and draw-7 decks hit the format, and then Quirion Dryad decks and Fish decks hit the format because of the hate they had against combo, and Tog and Babycakes decks are played because they're just solid. I think this is the deck to hate the most recent four. Quirion Dryad/Babycakes fat doesn't compare to Empyrial fat, and this deck still hates on Tog, combo, and aggro.

Weaknesses: Pernicious Deed. I'm either going to be playing Spectral Lynx with black mana sources or Flooded Strands/Tundras with Stifles in the sideboard if Pernicious Deed keeps wasting me like it does. Fortunately, with this deck, the only creature that isn't a threat is the Deftblade Elite (still, his maindeck inclusion is necessary in my environment). This way, they have to play Deed once you get a creature with Empyrial Plate/Armor on the board, or they will lose.

Thanks for looking.
Barry

[psyburat]

Just because a deck manages to beat a big deck in the metagame doesn't mean it's going to do well against the rest of the metagame.  Within the past few months or major tournaments, WW has only made Top 8 once, and it was a complete fluke.  Do not run WW in this environment.  It is too weak and can best be categorized to be the same level as SUIBlack.

[Jacob Orlove]

-Deftblade Elite - Originally I played 4 Icatian Javelineers to kill Goblin Welders. Later I splashed red for Soltari Guerillas and Lightning Bolts (plus Fire/Ice) in the sideboard. This way it's just so much easier, and he can also take out key Fish creatures (ie - Grim Lavamancer in particular), and he also acts as a mini-Fog when he's blocking. Pumped up with Empyrial Plate/Armor, he's even better.

They can just tap the welder before blockers are declared, after provoke untaps it.

[policehq]

Just because a deck manages to beat a big deck in the metagame doesn't mean it's going to do well against the rest of the metagame.  

It manages to beat THE big deck of the environment as well as any aggro deck, and it has good disruption against combo decks. Dragon loses to it post-sideboard (and sometimes pre-sideboard), Dryad loses to it, Fro/Babycakes loses to it, Welder trick-decks lose to it.

@Jacob Orlove: They can tap it if there are legal targets, yes, but still Deftblade Elite is too good to pass up. Still, I may work in up to 3 Sword of Fire and Ice to make sure Goblin Welders die.

Barry

[Hi-Val]

Anyone seen Steelshaper's Gift from Fifth Dawn? It basically reads "look for target Skullclamp". I'd seriously add the clamp to your deck with its tutor for some much-needed draw.

In all ways, Crypt is better than Morningtide. Crypt stops Dragon and Hulk, Morningtide does not. I also highly reccommend Serenity on the sideboard as a way to deal with Slaver and friends.

Looking at this, I do think that it is very resistant to being Slaved as well. And I think it was JP who said that WW can be a decent deck in the proper metagame. Work on it, test it, come up with some good additions, win some tournaments and show those naysayers!

[policehq]

In all ways, Crypt is better than Morningtide. Crypt stops Dragon and Hulk, Morningtide does not. I also highly reccommend Serenity on the sideboard as a way to deal with Slaver and friends.

Unfortunately, everyone that is playing Hulk in my area has 4 maindeck Stifles. That is why I switched over to Disenchants and Morningtides instead of Seal of Cleansing (tutor-able) and Tormod's Crypt (also tutor-able, free, and works on their turn).

At the right time, Morningtide and Orim's Chant work perfectly well against Hulk and Dragon. Having 3 Sacred Ground (essentially 4 with Enlightened Tutor) and 4 Maze of Ith is what kills Hulk though, post-sideboard.

Swords to Plowshares stops dragon. [/weak argument] However, Morningtide works as well if they do not go off on the same turn. Unfortunately Dragon players around here have Pernicious Deed for Tormod's Crypt and Duress for Swords to Plowshares or bounce. I really don't know how to sideboard against Dragon at the moment. Only testing against more of the field (besides aggro decks, Gro, Tog, and tendrils) and time will tell.

Within the past few months or major tournaments, WW has only made Top 8 once, and it was a complete fluke.

Could you please show me where you found that decklist or information?

Barry

EDIT: Regarding Serenity, I love the card, but I'm already REALLY vulnerable to a Chalice of the Void with 2 counters. Aside from that, Stifle can counter the triggered ability. I need help with 1cc or 2cc+ answers to artifacts. Altar's Light actually seems moderately playable because of Goblin Welder. Any thoughts on that?

[AngryPheldagrif]

Warning! The following post contains brutal honesty.

Here it is point by point:

Having 3 Sacred Ground (essentially 4 with Enlightened Tutor) and 4 Maze of Ith is what kills Hulk though, post-sideboard.

Remember, you have nothing that Cunning Wish cannot destroy. This is not an auto win against 'Tog.

Altar's Light actually seems moderately playable because of Goblin Welder. Any thoughts on that?

Yes I do. Don't run bad removal.

Anyone seen Steelshaper's Gift from Fifth Dawn? It basically reads "look for target Skullclamp". I'd seriously add the clamp to your deck with its tutor for some much-needed draw.

WW with Clamp still remains to be proven in T1. Cards are nice but can you really afford to lose you vital creatures?

It manages to beat THE big deck of the environment as well as any aggro deck, and it has good disruption against combo decks. Dragon loses to it post-sideboard (and sometimes pre-sideboard), Dryad loses to it, Fro/Babycakes loses to it, Welder trick-decks lose to it.

I really wish people would stop saying things like this. There is no single BIG deck in the environment, you pack little effective disruption (Orim's Chant will only help you temporarily and other than that you have 2-4 cards and thats it), Dryad would wreck you pre-board (you have 4 cards against it, 2 of which are Waste-able and 2 of which are counterable), I don't even remember what the hell Fro/Babycakes is, and Welder+w/e would massacre you with a half-way decent hand.

90% of your matchups depend on either your sideboard or your pitance of removal. In no way am I saying your deck is terrible, but to say that your deck beats all the good decks without listing playtesting results is just arrogant. If you're going to make a claim like that, show some serious tournament results. Until then, keep testing. I remember the last time someone posted a EBAish pile of crap saying that it could beat all the major decks because he played removal. It wasn't pretty. At all.

But anyways, enter some tournaments. Write some reports. Repost. Until then, for the love of god don't post 'my deck wins, yo!!1'

[policehq]

My updated decklist:

4 Deftblade Elite
4 Mystic Crusader
4 Soltari Foot Soldier
4 Soltari Priest
4 Spectral Lynx

2 Abolish
2 Empyrial Armor
4 Empyrial Plate
1 Enlightened Tutor
3 Land Tax
4 Orim's Chant
2 Swords to Plowshares
1 Zuran Orb

2 Maze of Ith

1 Black Lotus
1 Lotus Petal
1 Mox Jet
1 Mox Pearl
10 Plains
4 Scrubland
1 Swamp

Sideboard:
2 Abolish
2 Empyrial Armor
2 Maze of Ith
4 Morningtide
3 Sacred Ground
2 Swords to Plowshares

Responses to specifics:

Remember, you have nothing that Cunning Wish cannot destroy. This is not an auto win against 'Tog.

You have to look at it from different angles, though. If they are using Cunning Wish to destroy my methods of preventing their win condition, they are not using Cunning Wish for their win condition (Berserk). Psychatog has to have trample, or they will not get any attack through. With Empyrial Plate out, 12 of my creatures are threats to Tog (attacking for 9-11 per turn). That means they have to counter each of those, and any other creatures that I play against Tog will be able to kill him (or at least prevent him from a big swing later in the game). So besides the 12 creatures, they have 4 Morningtide, 3 Sacred Ground, 4 Swords to Plowshares, and 4 Maze of Ith to deal with. I have tested against Tog, and I only get good results in matches. I am entering a tournament tomorrow, though, and I will post results from it as well.

The deck has more Dryad hate than it did even before, but in its original design, Dryad does not grow as fast as a white weenie with empyrial protection. Dryads and Werebears usually end up chump-blocking or attacking for less while my shadow creatures go through unseen. Now, though, I have a regenerating Spectral Lynx in their way as well.

My statements about Goblin Welder might be questionable, I admit, since Deftblade Elite isn't the cure-all that I once thought it was (if they have an artifact out and in the graveyard). Still, however, I have tested against Gro and Tog, as well as Stompy, Fish, and Mono-R with good results. I can't remember if Apprentice is sideboard-friendly or not, but if someone wants to help me further along and test with me, I'm more than willing to play the deck against anything.

Is Paladin-en-Vec strictly better than Mystic Crusader? I haven't decided yet, but the two are interchangeable. The pro-black helps more against Tog by providing a blocker when he isn't Berserked and an attacker that cannot be blocked.

But anyways, enter some tournaments. Write some reports. Repost. Until then, for the love of god don't post 'my deck wins, yo!!1'

Exaggerations like this look just as bad as mine. Belittling and stereotyping isn't the way to encourage or teach a new player.

Anyone seen Steelshaper's Gift from Fifth Dawn? It basically reads "look for target Skullclamp". I'd seriously add the clamp to your deck with its tutor for some much-needed draw.

Skullclamp is not a good method of draw in this deck. I don't want to lose the creatures I have on board because they are such big threats when given the right enchantment/equipment. Instead I'm trying so hard to work a Sol Ring, Sword of Fire and Ice, and Demonic Tutor in here. The sword will give me draw and get rid of Goblin Welder as planned earlier; otherwise it essentially gives +4 power to an attacker. Once Steelshaper's Gift is tournament-legal, this deck could easily run just on the swords without the Land Tax engine, splashing another color or two for problems it currently has.

Barry

[spankweasel]

WW has always been my favorite Type 1 deck.  I eventually got my hands on some power and abandoned it for more consitant decks.

One of the things that I noticed about this thread is that the orignal poster is downright terrified of Goblin Welder.  One suggestion I have for you is to use Damping Matrix.  This would allow you to get rid of (in my opinion) substandard choices like Deftblade Elite.  I understand that equipment like Empyrial Plate no longer work, but you could always use the orignal instead.  Cursed Totem works well too, and may be an idea if you want to use the Plates.

Since you are running 4 MD Orim's Chants, I would also give serious consideration to using Armageddon.  It simply wins games.  A late game Chant-Armageddon will horribly maim any control deck, and will cripple most combo decks.  (much of their multi-color mana comes from cards like City of Brass, and Glimmervoid).  I understand that Armageddon is a huge Drain target, but if it's not countered, there's not much a control player can do.

Since Stifle is so abundant in your meta, I would not run any Strip effects, but losing to a first turn Library is not a lot of fun.

If Stompy is big in your area, you may want to try using Exalted Angels.  An Angel with a plate on her is all kinds of fun.

Based on the prior posts, I would recommend something like this:

4 Savannah Lions - 2/1 for W is good
4 Soltari Priest - Shadow
4 Soltari Monk - Shadow
4 Silver Knight - Helps with Fish / Gay/r / FCG
4 Leonine Skyhunter - Evasion
2 Exalted Angel - Aggro hoser

2 Abolish
4 Emp. Plate
1 Enlightened Tutor - good in this deck
3 Land Tax - engine
3 Orim's Chant - Time walk?
3 StP - Removal
2 Armageddon - Alternate win condition
2 Cursed Totem - Helps with welders, togs, Memnarch, etc.

1 Black Lotus
1 Mox Pearl
16 Plains

SB:
Dust to Dust - Fun against Slaver
Gilded LIght - Tendrils doesn't work anymore - neither does Ambassador Laq.
More StP
More Angels
Maze of Ith?
Empryial Armor?


Spank

[Colossus]

Heh, if tog is the ONLY deck you're worried about, stock Confessor. . . .they only get half the graveyard to pump him with.  Course tog is never the only deck you're worried about,a nd confessor is not really playable in virtually any other circumstance, but he was part of a riduclous combo deck I used to have, which sadly never worked out (combo came to-gether way too slowly, but when it worked, it was a thing of beauty.)

If you end up running clamps and empyrial plate, then Auriok Glaivemaster could become a very good choice in the deck.  If you want to run the empyrial stuff, then Skullclamp is an even better choice because it will put cards back in your hand.

[Phoenix]

You play 2 Empyrial Armor & 4 Empyrial Plate; isn't a good idea having also 4 land taxes or at least some skullclamps?

[policehq]

You play 2 Empyrial Armor & 4 Empyrial Plate; isn't a good idea having also 4 land taxes or at least some skullclamps?

I think 6 cards that are dependent on creatures are enough when I'm playing only 20 creatures. I've considered dropping the Empyrial Armor and including more black (replacing Land Taxes with Tithe to get Scrublands) to support tutors and the Spectral Lynx regeneration ability. Since this is a new deck concept, everything has to be tested. I'm also trying to work in the Armageddon(s) and Null Rods.

Barry