[Single Card Discussion] Anti Oath Tech - Karakas

[yespuhyren]

I was glancing through trade binders at yesterday's Type 1 Tournament, and I saw Karakas.  Now I knew that the card existed, but I had completely forgotten about it.  My thoughts were, hey, why not trade for it, its a good casual card, though it has no merit in Type 1.

Then I realized...hey...this effect ISN'T bad at all.

Against Oath, it can bounce the Spirit of the Night and Akroma that are generally maindecked now, and unless they are playing stifle (which oath does not, to my knowledge) then it is uncounterable bouncing.  Although it DOES tap for white mana, which isn't the color for most decks, I still believe it merits an inclusion

for all of you who don't know what it does, here's what the card does

TAP: Add W to your mana pool
Tap: Return target Legend to it's owners hand

The good thing is that unlike Maze of Ith, it
a) Taps for mana
b) Returns the creature to their hand, because if they oath up another fattie you will still be getting beatings from at least one of them.  IF you return it to their hands, the odds are they will not be able to recast them and you should have no problem winning.

So far I'm running 2 in my STAX deck, and it seems to be working great.  Just wanted to share in case other players needed an answer to Oath

[Covetous]

This is an interesting idea, but doesn't solve the problem that Maze of Ith has--it's a land used as hate against a deck with up to 5 strip effects.  True, you would have 3-4 Crucibles in Stax, but that doesn't solve the issue of your opponent stripping your Karakas before their fatty hits play.  Plus, Karakas doesn't do anything about Pristine or Platinum Angel.  In Stax, I would probably be more interested in using Spawning Pit as anti-Oath tech due to its synergy with the general deck strategy, unlike an off-color land which doesn't deal with all of your opponent's threats.

[cssamerican]

The best use of Karakas is a singleton in WW. Because it taps for (W) and because the deck runs 4 Weathered Wayfarer. This makes it more of a might as well kinda card. But this is the only deck that I can think of that can run the card with maximum effectiveness versus Oath while minimizing all the drawbacks.

[Gabethebabe]

Decks running white have better and less narrow cards. Think e.g. Aura Blast, Seal of Cleansing, Ray of Revelation

Also Oath, lets be honest, I haven´t seen it make a lot of good results lately.

[That0neguy]

eeeeeeeeeeeewwwww white.

No but seriously it deos have the same problem as Maze of ith (however oath ussually only runs 3 strips) It might be able to slow them down enough to lock them but im not sure i really want to rely on it.  It also has the drawback of taking up a ussually probably basic land slot.  Either that or it messes up your mana.  The only advantage I see to it is if they Oath up a creture then you drop the karkas to bounce it then they will oath the other creture and swing for 6 anyways.

I could see it goining either way but most likley just a SB card.

[M.Solymossy]

I actually see this being somewhat strong in theiry

[NastyNate]

Island of Wak-Wak can be used to similar effect, and still stops pristine angel too. Ultimately though you really just want to stop oath of druids from resolving or activating, rather than look for a solution to an Akroma or Spirit of the night that has already hit the table. Seal of Cleansing and Swords to Plowshares are still superior; they are very functional outside of the Oath match-up, as well.

[Akuma]

While not the most optimal anti-Oath card, Karakas should prove to be more annoying for the Oath player than the other 'land' solutions since sending a legendary creature back to the players hand is more of a nuisance than having to wait until they find a Wasteland for the lands that just stall.

[yespuhyren]

Island of Wak Wak is the same problem as Maze...neither of them tap for mana.  Though it doesn't HELP the mana in your deck, it at least taps for mana, and in a deck with very few colored spells, like the version of stax I run, it works great.

The other main difference is it DOES oath up a second creature, but if you return both creatures to their hands they will have to wait to discard both of them, oath, then shuffle the blessing back in, then REoath the next turn.  All in all it works very well as long as your mana isn't too badly offset

[Hi-Val]

You can only bounce legendary creatures : (

[goobafish]

Interesting card. Definately worthy of a sb spot, never maindeck. I doubt oath will side in pristine if it dosent see that you have any targeted removal (especially in a deck like workshop variants. With most oath decks only running 1 strip and 2 wastes, it could potentially be difficult for them to disrupt this card. Especially because the ability can be reused and reused. This card is probably most viable in a deck like U/W fish, that has major problems with oath, not only does it provide colored mana, il also destroys oath and is uncounterable.

Just my 2 cents...

[Smmenen]

Its good tech against oath.  Strong.

[LotusHead]

Many decks use Spawning Pits or Goblin Bombardment to hose Oath decks (at least URB decks). Today, while playing Oath (with Salvagers), my opponent dropped a Genju (the blue one that flies), and this put me on a clock to find my dang Orchards.

The various Genjus plus Spawning Pit could be the next new thing in an Oath heavy environment, and at 1 mana, may easily slip in under the radar.

[Yawgmoths_Dummy]

Smmenen wrote:

Its good tech against oath. Strong.

It's good tech against MD Oath, pre SB.

It does nothing to Platinum or Pristine.
It does nothing to DCS.

I think I'd rather have tap target creature vs. off color mana and bounce Legend ability.

[Gabethebabe]

Good anti-oath tech is tech that prevents that opponent activates Oath, either by making sure that Oath doesn´t land on the table or that it just doesn´t trigger.

Karakas doesn´t do any of those. Therefore it is mediocre at most.

[Malhavoc]

If my opponent see my karakas in play (and untapped) her will never oath a creature. He will wait for a wastelands instead. This means that (apart from gaining time) the only real usefulness for karakas is playing it after I've been attacked once. Then I could bounce the first creature. But then again, before oathing again, he would wait for a wasteland. In the end, I don't think you'll bounce creatures with Karakas very often. It could however be a bit useful to gain tempo. But what if they side in a non-legend creature? In the end, a card like spawning pit is a lot better, particularly thinking about the fact that oath decks have more possibilities to destroy lands rather than artifacts; despite of course the fact that a lans can't be countered.

Another very good tech (but not for every deck) is ray of revelation.

[Razvan]

If my opponent see my karakas in play (and untapped) her will never oath a creature. He will wait for a wastelands instead. This means that (apart from gaining time) the only real usefulness for karakas is playing it after I've been attacked once.

Incidentally, to narrow it down, Yespuhyren said he plays it in Stax. Against Stax, waiting is never the correct play, as it will doom you. Also, wastelands won't work, because Stax CAN reoccur lands, you cannot. If you play a wasteland with a Karakas in play, and the Stax player has a wasteland as well, he can just force your play, and the get Karakas back... and with Tangle Wires and Smokestacks and the such... he can even afford to get hit for a turn.

[Dr Evil]

i like this tech, i used to play orchards in non oath decks but that did not turn out very well...

especialy good in the presideboarding game.

[stevecny]

Oath also uses brainstorm so if there creatue was returned to there hand thay whould simply have to brainstorm and oath again and the maindeck is all haste

[yespuhyren]

Although that is true, that is basically giving STAX a guaranteed free turn, as you will most likely be tapping/saccing to smokestack or tangle wire, and with or without trinisphere you probably can't play many spells.  Giving Stax a free turn midgame is potentially gamebreaking in any case.

Another thing that people aren't looking at is one main fact.  There are 2 main types of oath, some with black some with up to 12 or 14 counterspells.  Anyone who claims it is bad tech because you don't stop the oath from hitting the table or activation, has to realize that you have a good chance of it being discarded or countered.  Neither of those types of cards affects karakas, and if they don't have a brainstorm they might as well just pack it in.

People have also said it has no effect on prisine angel, platinum angel, or iridescent angel.  Yes, this is 100% true.  Now you have to think HOW AFRAID IS STAX OF THOSE CREATURES??

Sure, they are big and can smack you, but none have haste, all will take at least 2, 3, or 4 turns to kill you.  With stax you should be able to control the game before you die, with tangle wires and smokestacks to stablize.  

IF they reside to the plan with darksteel colossus, just use your welder.  Even if it only works once or twice, their losing one or two oath turns can give you enough time to lock them.

All this is from personal experience, by the way, as I've been testing karakas in stax on workstation for about 2 weeks now