Some Questions probably no one can answer yet

[Smmenen]

First, what is the painting/prize for the Vintage and Legacy tournaments and which foil promos will be given away to top 8?

Second, what will be the bye point cutoff be for Grand Prix Philly and will they be using Eternal ratings FOR SURE - or are people just guessing? 

I ask becuase my Eternal rating is now 1952.  I also noticed that the cutoff for normal grand prix's is like 2000 for 3 byes - but there are like 100 people with 2000+ rating in constructed and more for limited.  There are like less than 10 people with an Eternal rating of 2000+  It seems like that cut off might be too high.

[CF]

For the Norwegian vintage nationals top8 is getting foil Gemstone Mines. The artwork here is Jester's Cap - although I don't know if it is the Ice One or the 9th one (probably the latter)

I would be surprised if the ratings bye cutoffs were much higher than 1700-1800-1900.

--
Chris

[rvs]

Well, in asian GPs don't they use 1750-1850-1950 for byes? I wouldn't be surprised to see the same thing happen with Legacy events (obv the Eternal Rating).

Why not bother #mtgjudge Steve?

[Smmenen]

Will they be using Eternal rating for sure?  What makes us think that they will? 

[CHA1N5]

The GenCon Vintage prize is Ancestral this year:

link

"Magic: The Gathering 2005 Vintage Championship" - compete in the third annual Vintage Championship tournament. Winner receives an original piece of Vintage artwork, Ancestral Recall, as reinterpreted by Magic artist Mark Poole.

[Komatteru]

Will they be using Eternal rating for sure?  What makes us think that they will? 

See, it wouldn't surprise me at all that for the first few GPs, they'll be using Constructed Rating simply because the pro players and other super competitive people don't necessarily have an Eternal rating that reflects their skill -- it is quite possible some of them have played in under 5 sanctioned Eternal events.  The GP will give such players a chance to build an Eternal Rating, so I can see them using it after more players have had a chance to play some Eternal events.

[Green Knight]

I can not wait to see Mark's rendition of Ancestral! Is it confirmed that the top 8 will get a foil promo card? I have not heard of this up until now, and I know they haven't done this in the last two championships.
Thanks for the info Kevin.
Also regarding the Legacy Grand Prix when is this and is it only in Philly?

[Mykeatog]

Green Knight - There is also one in Europe on schedule. Expect them to become part of the yearly rotation, but not as often as the other formats.

Steve - I haven't heard anything about this event yet, expect the prize payout to be similar to that of a Constructed Grand Prix. Promo's likely won't factor into the actual pay-out at all, though that doesn't mean they won't give them out. It appears that Wizards has gone the way of Upper Deck in giving limited promo's to people who do well in events.

[Smmenen]

Will they be using Eternal rating for sure?  What makes us think that they will? 

See, it wouldn't surprise me at all that for the first few GPs, they'll be using Constructed Rating simply because the pro players and other super competitive people don't necessarily have an Eternal rating that reflects their skill -- it is quite possible some of them have played in under 5 sanctioned Eternal events.  The GP will give such players a chance to build an Eternal Rating, so I can see them using it after more players have had a chance to play some Eternal events.

Can someone comment on this?  I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high. 

I'm almost certain that they are going to give away hot promo foils for the top 8.  I just hope its something other than the Gemstone Mines. 

[CF]

I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high. 

*chuckle* Just play, Stephen. Maybe you possibly do horribly and thus miss one bye in some event.. big friggin deal. Magic is about enjoying the game. If you were just at the threshold for a worlds/PT ratings invite I'd understand it, but a "possible bye"...  please.

--
Chris

[Dozer]

Here is WotC's bye page for GP's.

Rating-based byes are based on the DCI ratings issued at least six weeks prior to the first Saturday of the Qualifier season in which the Grand Prix tournament is held. They are issued based on the ratings category that corresponds with the format of the Grand Prix tournament, either Constructed, Limited, or three-person Team Limited.

Eternal ratings are not mentioned, but since they say that the ratings category has to correspond, I'll take it as granted that they will use Eternal ratings. The argument that Pro players don't have an Eternal rating does not count, since byes also are awarded for Pro Points (7 pts = 1 bye, 14 = 2 byes, 28 = 3 byes). I expect them to use the standard 1800 - 1900 - 2000 cutoff for 1, 2 or 3 byes respectively, since they want to promote Legacy and this gives TOs and players more incentive for holding and playing Legacy tournaments. On the other hand, a lower rating cut is a very likely possibility, since there are at the time of writing only 21 players in Europe and 70 players in North America with an Eternal rating over 1900.

Steve, I can fully understand you. I am trying to get my Eternal rating up to 1800 at least, too. If I were at 1950, I'd definitely play at Gencon. You are unlikely to lose 50 points, and you might get substantially closer to 2000. If you assume a lower rating cut, you should still play because even if you just break even, you are still likely in for three byes.

Dozer

[JACO]

Can someone comment on this?  I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high.

Based on the link that provides information about Grand Prix byes, the Grand Prix byes will be awarded as following for the two Legacy Grand Prix events (in the USA and Europe):
1 round bye - 1800 points
2 round bye - 1900 points
3 round bye - 2000 points

Your Eternal (Legacy + Vintage) rating is currently 1952, which is good enough to get you a 2 round bye, if they use Eternal rating to award byes. Your Constructed rating is currently 1757, which is not good enough to get you any byes, if they use Constructed rating to award byes.

If you think you are at least as good as the competition at the upcoming Type 1 events at GenCon (or Eternal rated events elsewhere), then it makes sense to play. The K values for those tournaments are 24K for the smaller tournaments, and 48K for the Vintage Championship, so you could easily get over 2000 if you finish with a decent record in a couple of the tournaments. I think that alone should be incentive enough to get you to play. IF the DCI is going to use Eternal rating for the Legacy Grand Prixs, then you could easily improve your current 2 round bye status to 3 round bye status by playing and doing fairly well at the Vintage GenCon events. You basically have 52 points to gamble with, and I would think that you could do well enough to pick up the remaining 48 points needed to make it to the next level, especially if you do well in the 48K Vintage Championship on Saturday.

[kirdape3]

Steve should be playing, since unless he's dumb enough to 0-(more than 2) the 48k tournament he won't lose a ridiculous amount of points.

As far as ratings go, I honestly think that if they use 1800-1900-2000 Eternal as the ratings cutoffs then it gives a huge advantage to pros who have the requisite pro points.  The difference between a 3-bye and a 0-bye metagame is absolutely enormous in Constructed.  With very few (less than 10 total) having 2000+ Eternal ratings, that means that every non-GPT winner has to slog through completely random decks for the first couple of rounds, with horrible tiebreakers.

[kl0wn]

I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high.

Apparently you 0-6ed the last event that used your testicular fortitude rating.

[Smmenen]

Can someone comment on this?  I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high.

Based on the link that provides information about Grand Prix byes, the Grand Prix byes will be awarded as following for the two Legacy Grand Prix events (in the USA and Europe):
1 round bye - 1800 points
2 round bye - 1900 points
3 round bye - 2000 points

Your Eternal (Legacy + Vintage) rating is currently 1952, which is good enough to get you a 2 round bye, if they use Eternal rating to award byes. Your Constructed rating is currently 1757, which is not good enough to get you any byes, if they use Constructed rating to award byes.

If you think you are at least as good as the competition at the upcoming Type 1 events at GenCon (or Eternal rated events elsewhere), then it makes sense to play. The K values for those tournaments are 24K for the smaller tournaments, and 48K for the Vintage Championship, so you could easily get over 2000 if you finish with a decent record in a couple of the tournaments. I think that alone should be incentive enough to get you to play. IF the DCI is going to use Eternal rating for the Legacy Grand Prixs, then you could easily improve your current 2 round bye status to 3 round bye status by playing and doing fairly well at the Vintage GenCon events. You basically have 52 points to gamble with, and I would think that you could do well enough to pick up the remaining 48 points needed to make it to the next level, especially if you do well in the 48K Vintage Championship on Saturday.

One thing I noticed when I was doing my research is that the asian grand prix's use the cut off or 1950 for 3 byes.  I compared the constructed and limited ratings to Eternal and there are three or four pages of people who have 2000+ byes for Limited and Constructed - which makes alot of sense to raise the cut off to 2000 for 3 byes.  Is you have like 100+ people in the world who can quaify for three byes, then your cut off should reflect the number of people in that range you expect to show up.

However, there are about 10 people with an eternal rating of 2000+.  A cutoff 2000 with 3 byes might mean that no one can take advantage of it.  Correllating the formats would suggest that maybe 1950 or even 1900 might be a proportionate cutoff for the Legacy grand prix's 3 byes if they use Eternal. 

I was definately planning on playing in the Vintage champs since I have two byes and for other obvious reasons.  The question for me is whether it is worth it to also play in the Vintage side events and the Legacy Champs.  I want to play in the Vintage side events with more fun, non-optimal decks like Long or whatnot.  And I'd like to try legacy with no serious experience in it at all.  If the eternal rating means nothing, then I can go hog wild.  If it does, I'd have to balance the risks. 

[Komatteru]

non-optimal decks like Long

Ouch. 

[Smmenen]

non-optimal decks like Long

Ouch. 

Fear not Jdizzle - I could be wrong!

[CF]

I need to know this to figure out whether I will be playing in Gencon events that could risk my eternal rating now that it is so high.

Apparently you 0-6ed the last event that used your testicular fortitude rating.

One of the funniest things I've ever read at tmd. Good job.

--
Chris

[JACO]

One thing I noticed when I was doing my research is that the asian grand prix's use the cut off or 1950 for 3 byes.  I compared the constructed and limited ratings to Eternal and there are three or four pages of people who have 2000+ byes for Limited and Constructed - which makes alot of sense to raise the cut off to 2000 for 3 byes.  Is you have like 100+ people in the world who can quaify for three byes, then your cut off should reflect the number of people in that range you expect to show up.

However, there are about 10 people with an eternal rating of 2000+.  A cutoff 2000 with 3 byes might mean that no one can take advantage of it.  Correllating the formats would suggest that maybe 1950 or even 1900 might be a proportionate cutoff for the Legacy grand prix's 3 byes if they use Eternal. 

I was definately planning on playing in the Vintage champs since I have two byes and for other obvious reasons.  The question for me is whether it is worth it to also play in the Vintage side events and the Legacy Champs.  I want to play in the Vintage side events with more fun, non-optimal decks like Long or whatnot.  And I'd like to try legacy with no serious experience in it at all.  If the eternal rating means nothing, then I can go hog wild.  If it does, I'd have to balance the risks. 

This is not an Asian Grand Prix, so the cutoff will not change just because this is a Legacy event. All of your questions have been answered on the Wizards' website today, as the information for GP Philly has been released. Byes WILL be awarded based on Constructed rating, and not based on Eternal rating.

"Tournament Byes (Byes are not cumulative throughout the season or year)
Byes will be given to players in the Grand Prix based on the following criteria:

Third-Round Byes
Players with a Players Club level of 3 or higher
DCI players with a sufficently high Constructed rating. Rating level is TBD. Byes do not pass down under any circumstances. Byes are based on DCI Constructed ratings published on September 7, 2005.

Second-Round Byes
Players with a Players Club level of 2
DCI players with a sufficently high Constructed rating. Rating level is TBD. Byes do not pass down under any circumstances. Byes are based on DCI Constructed ratings published on September 7, 2005.

First-Round Byes
Players with a Players Club level of 1
DCI players with a sufficently high Constructed rating. Rating level is TBD. Byes do not pass down under any circumstances. Byes are based on DCI Constructed ratings published on September 7, 2005."

So, unless you get your Constructed rating up to 1800+ from 1757 between now and September 7, 2005, you will have nothing to worry about when you play at GenCon, as you will have no byes for the Grand Prix.

[Smmenen]

Seeing as I haven't played Constructed in like, two years and don't plan on doing so for the foreseeable future I think its a moot point.  Thank you though for the info.

I guess if I want byes I'll have to win a GPT. 

[Komatteru]

Seeing as I haven't played Constructed in like, two years and don't plan on doing so for the foreseeable future I think its a moot point.  Thank you though for the info.

Aah! I caught you playing in extended PTQ in January or so.

Also, I like it when I guess right.  I don't know why, but it makes me feel like I won something.  Maybe I should go on a gameshow or something and win money for guessing randomly like the people who won $$ on Millionaire...

[Smmenen]

Thats right I did !  I was undefeated in the first five rounds 4-0-1 and then lost to Michael - Teen Titans - Pennagar and then lost to game 3 desire for 11 for crap = I am not in top 8. 

[Clown of Tresserhorn]

Oh man, savage. I didn't know my 1800+ constructed rating would pay off. I'm def. going to the legacy GP with 1 bye. Come on people, a high constructed rating is not hard to achieve. Shit, I gained like 80 points at regionals alone.

I haven't really kept up, so I'll ask here. Where is the GP? and will there be Legacy GPTs?

[forests failed you]

It sucks that Grand Prix Legacy events won't be using Eternal Rating.  What is the point of having a savage 1945 rating if you don't even get byes for Legacy events?