Ruling Confirmation requested Triggers, Dovescape vs. Chalice of the Void

[gotinput]

A UW fish player has leaked that that may be bringing Dovescape to a vintage event. 

If i have chalice in play for 2, and dovescape is in play on my opponents side of the table. 

Here is how I believe it plays out.

He plays a jotun grunt. an echoing truth.

APNAP trigger his dovescape, then triggers chalice.

Chalice would counter the spell.  Dovescape's counter trigger would fizzle. 

Dovescape: Whenever a player plays a noncreature spell, counter that spell. That player puts X 1/1 white and blue Bird creature tokens with flying into play, where X is the spell's converted mana cost.

Being countered doesn't appear to be requirement for the creatures.  I believe it use Last Known Information and give him the creatures anyway.

Edit: fixed non-creature part of question.  Sorry it was late.

[Harlequin]

Being countered doesn't appear to be requirement for the creatures.  I believe it use Last Known Information and give him the creatures anyway.

This is correct.

Most commonly, when people talk about an ability fizzling they are refering to "Countered upon resolution, because all targets no longer exsist"  Now dovescape doesn't target, therefor it won't 'fizzle' in that sense.

Also as you elluded to, it only has 1 complete trigger; and the event that causes the trigger is simply 'playing a non-creature spell.' So the entire trigger resolves as much as it can.   Also if you play somehting that is uncounterable like Urza's Rage, you would get Birds in addition to the spell resolving.


As a side note:  --IF-- dovescape consisted of 2 triggers, then it wouldn't work {but remember this is not true}
So sometihng like:
When a non-creature spell is played, counter it.
When dovescape coutners a spell, make some birds.

[lordmayhem]

Dovescape wouldn't counter his Jotun Grunt, so he wouldn't get any Bird tokens.

[Anusien]

Dovescape wouldn't counter his Jotun Grunt, so he wouldn't get any Bird tokens.

This is incorrect.

Dovescape: Whenever a player plays a noncreature spell, counter that spell. That player puts X 1/1 white and blue Bird creature tokens with flying into play, where X is the spell's converted mana cost.

Dovescape simply has a triggered ability that says "Do X, Do Y".  In this case, you can't do X because Chalice of the Void already did, but you do as much as you can, which is Y.

If you're replying to an existing thread where someone else has given an answer; it's not enough to just give an ansewr.  Explain why you think this is please.

[Lunk]

I believe the point Lordmayhem was getting at was that Dovescape wouldn't trigger at all when Jotun Grunt was played; Dovescape specifies that it triggers on noncreature spells, and Jotun Grunt is, in fact, a creature.

However, if you simply changed the example from Jotun Grunt to a noncreature spell with a CMC of 2, Harlequin's answer holds true.

[Anusien]

Good point.  Still, enumerating that more clearly would be useful as a general rule.

[lordmayhem]

My apologies. What I meant to say was that Dovescape wouldn't trigger in the first place since Jotun Grunt is a creature and Dovescape triggers on noncreature spells.